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17-Year-Old Kills His Mother and Sister, Calls 911 to Turn Himself In

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posted on Oct, 11 2012 @ 04:13 PM
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Originally posted by Lucid Lunacy
reply to post by abeverage
 



Video Games, Media, Violent Television


If only he had stuck to romance and comedies instead of action and horror genre eh? ...

How many more zombie flicks do I have to watch until I start craving brains?


No worries you wont be craving brains, nope not at all, but if you see someone chewing on someone else's face you might be more tempted to whip out the smart phone and get it all for Youtube.

Besides I could think of several so called comedies like The Hangover that would push a person over edge long before dawn of the dead.




posted on Oct, 11 2012 @ 04:45 PM
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reply to post by Juggernog
 



I am almost 100% sure that he was on some type of anti-depressant


Where are you pulling that absolute certainty from?



posted on Oct, 11 2012 @ 05:18 PM
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After listening to this entire thing, the single one thing that stuck out to me was that he used to go to High School and now he is home schooled. He is only 17, his birthday in May, so he is junior now. So he probably went to high school at least his freshman 9th grade year.That made me think he left high school for a reason. If he was bullied or picked on that could explain so much.

Just throwing that theory out there.I would bet my dogs floppy ears that there is more to this story.



posted on Oct, 11 2012 @ 05:33 PM
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reply to post by k21968
 



.That made me think he left high school for a reason. If he was bullied or picked on that could explain so much.


Possibly. I left High School my Freshmen year. Took the California High School Proficiency exam and enrolled in college the following semester. I wasn't bullied... just thought HS was lame
Of course he could have left because of bullying, but sometimes it takes a bit of HS before you discover better alternatives.



posted on Oct, 11 2012 @ 09:35 PM
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Originally posted by Observationalist
reply to post by Majestic Lumen
 


Reminds me of how James Holmes was compliant, and how he turned himself in after he was able to commit such an incredible atrocity.

This is sadly becoming a trend in our society.

yes and there have been so many others.
The boy who killed his Father and his Father's friend, said he loved his Dad and he had no reason. There is a HUGE list of these cases, in fact one in our own town, the son of someone we know. he committed murder of someone he clearly loved and then sat down and ate breakfast in the boys house.

These are not normal mental illnesses in which the perpetrator protects themselves from consequences and often they were known as good people..and kids before the crimes.



posted on Oct, 12 2012 @ 11:17 AM
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reply to post by k21968
 


I agree that there is a lot more to unfold on this one. Also, didn't they say the Sister was also being homeschooled? What's the deal there? And the Mom was involved at the school for yrs too? What gives with that School is what's bouncin' round my head.
Yah, A LOT more to come here...... Syx.



posted on Oct, 16 2012 @ 07:39 PM
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reply to post by relocator
 


So then instead of trying to figure out the problem with the kid we should just lock him up and throw away the key? I'm not defending him but maybe trying to offer some reason as to why he was so calm. I've dealt with sociopaths AND psychopaths before as well as people in complete shock. Note that they are THREE different things and he may have some sociopath tendency but that doesn't make him a totally uncontrollable robotic murderer that you make him out to be. He realized and FELT that it was wrong to kill someone and even at its most basic level the fact that realized this proves that he was able to empathize in some manner or another. ALSO, he didn't say he's planned things out, but he said he's contemplated killing people for the way they act. That could have been merely nothing more than someone pissed him off/was rude to him and he envisioned something rotten. Until they find a diary of some sort or something that puts him in the psychopath genre I'm going to say that it's possible he has some sociopath tendency but doesn't seem irreparable. He does however need some extensive counseling and possibly some medication for a while until he can truly understand the level of atrocity he committed.

Again, don't get me wrong I'm not defending this kid. What he did was wrong regardless of my opinion on his mental state. Everyone deserves a little bit of analyzing before just writing them off.

If you disagree with the above statement then you don't care how the case turns out and trying to figure out why this happened which means it's doomed to occur again. But then again, you don't care so what does it matter?



posted on Oct, 16 2012 @ 07:43 PM
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reply to post by relocator
 


Relocator my previous response was meant for Chaotic. Not sure how I clicked on yours. Sorry.



posted on Oct, 18 2012 @ 04:14 AM
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reply to post by Lucid Lunacy
 


Your posts are full of misinformation. Sudafed tablets that conatain DXM also contain acetaminophen. Someone that took enough of these tablets to achieve a high dose DXM experience would also be OD'ing on the very hepatotoxic acetaminophen. He'd have much more than the police to worry about... Aside from that, like PCP, DXM is a dissociative anesthetic at high doses, but its effects before an anesthetic dose do not resemble those of PCP, whatsoever. Not even a little. A person on a high enough dose of DXM (I have to facepalm as I type this...) that would allow the mindset for person to kill his family would also prohibit the person from walking, let alone loading and aiming a gun. He said he used a revolver, and, with the number of shots he said he fired, he probably had to reload it once for it to still be loaded when he left it on the kitchen counter. Even on a medium-high dose a person's speech becomes EXTREMELY slurred (think very, very, drunk), and motor function is severely inhibited. This kid's speech was not slurred whatsoever; on the contrary, he was articulate and to the point. Your DXM theory fails on two fronts: First, the drugs he took that might have contained DXM also contain another drug that would have killed him had he taken enough to achieve a high dose DXM experience. He is still alive. Second, the effects of DXM are absolutely nothing like you say, and the ACTUAL effects would have prevented him from being able to pull off these murders and the 30 minute conversation with 911 dispatch that followed.

Now, lets move on to the allergy medication. Things like benadryl (maybe Zyrtec, not sure) are anticholinergics. These drugs do cause hallucinations at very high doses, but these kinds of high doses do not happen by accident; nobody accidentally takes half a bottle of benadryl. The thing with very high dose anticholinergics, unlike psychedelics (like DXM), is that the person experiencing the hallucinations is not aware that he is hallucinating. While this scenario may present circumstances in which someone could kill, it would also prohibit someone from knowingly and calmly calling 911 and explaining with clarity the event only minutes after it happened. Your allergy medication hypothesis fails, too.

Personally, I feel that I heard the words of a psychopath who temporarily lost control for whatever reason. He realized his mistake and took 10 minutes to regain his composure before calculatingly calling 911.I also feel that he was attempting to manipulate the dispatcher, as well as those who might be hearing the conversation, but, being only 17, he underestimated the knowledge and experience of those with whom he was dealing... I'm sure he probably did succeed in garnering pity from some who heard the conversation, but it won't matter. Unfortunately for him, he lives in a a very conservative area of a very conservative state. His lawyer(s) will plead insanity in one form or another, but it will fall on unsympathetic ears. Psychopathy is not insanity. This kid is gonna burn...



posted on Oct, 18 2012 @ 10:12 AM
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I heard about this yesterday (10/17/2012) on a talk radio show. The "host" was discussing it with some psychologist. The boy said his mother and sister made him feel "smothered". The psychologist was going on about how it's getting to be a trend that children have become "disassociated" because babies need lots of attention during their first year and if they don't get it, they become emotionally unaffected by events around them. (I personally think that is a shot in the dark, pardon the pun, on behalf of the psychologist.) Listening to the kid, it sounds like he IS on something. The radio show made it sound like he was taking to the 911 operator who started asking him (fairly calmly herself) why he killed his mother and sister. And, as you know, he described it in a rather "other person/onlooker" mode. He does seem to realize at that point that he did something he will regret but it's unsure why he will regret it. Is he just "parroting" someone?? He only "feels" he will regret it because maybe his mother said that as he was murdering her?? Scary stuff nowadays. When there is literally NO ONE in the public light who is a worthwhile mentor, kids follow the weirdest ones in an effort to be special. So SAD.



posted on Oct, 18 2012 @ 06:30 PM
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reply to post by forwhatitsworth2u
 



Your posts are full of misinformation.

Well Let's check



Sudafed tablets that conatain DXM also contain acetaminophen

You should have attempted to varify some of the things you said before you called me out as spreading disinfo.

Here is the product page for Sudafed. Click around, notice the range of products.

I found one really quick that shows you were incorrect. Here is one that contains DXM an no Acetaminophen.

www.sudafed.com...


Someone that took enough of these tablets to achieve a high dose DXM experience would also be OD'ing on the very hepatotoxic acetaminophen. He'd have much more than the police to worry about...


Let's think critically about this. If kids were not able to consume enough DXM without dying from acetaminophen, why do many people claim otherwise all over the web?? Why is it Sudafed has this link right on their page about people getting high on DXM??

(directly from their site) stopmedicineabuse.org...

Let's take a look at another one of their products.

www.drugs.com...

250mg Acetamophin, 10mg DXM

Max Acetamophin dose is 4000mg:

www.npr.org...

Recreational DXM dose ranges from 100-300mg.

So with that product at the starting recreational dose of DXM you are at a little more than half the Acetaminophen max (2500).

It's obviously not health for the liver.. Again, many people dose on DXM (even the products that contain acetaminophen). If this always lead to death people on drug forums would not be discussing its recreational use.


Aside from that, like PCP, DXM is a dissociative anesthetic at high doses, but its effects before an anesthetic dose do not resemble those of PCP, whatsoever. Not even a little.


Where did I claim otherwise?

In fact I was quite clear the dose needed to be high.


A person on a high enough dose of DXM (I have to facepalm as I type this...) that would allow the mindset for person to kill his family would also prohibit the person from walking, let alone loading and aiming a gun.


So you're saying if someone takes a high enough dose of DXM to experience the dissociative effects they would be unable to load a gun i.e basic motor function gone.

All I can say is you clearly are not researched. I don't believe I can post links directly to the kinds of forums that would show inaccurate you are, but I welcome you to look.

That said, I offered my idea the high would be more of a catalyst then a cause (dude was a little crazy to begin with). That's debatable though....dissociate effects can really cause a disconnect from reality.


Even on a medium-high dose a person's speech becomes EXTREMELY slurred (think very, very, drunk), and motor function is severely inhibited.


Last time I experienced someone at a high DXM dose (person took about 275mg) this person thought his cat was the creator of the Universe, but was able to tell me about it and smoke a cigarette with me. One needs to keep in mind this all depends on whether it was DXM alone or if it was DXM with an assortment of other chemicals. Once again, some research on your part would quickly give you a more truthful look at the recreational experiences of high dosage of isolated DXM, or the affects of coupling that the various other chemicals often present.

Which did the one in the OP take. Don't know.

Also, I was speaking generally about DXM too. There other companies that sell DXM isolated in gelcaps.


Your DXM theory fails on two fronts: First, the drugs he took that might have contained DXM also contain another drug that would have killed him had he taken enough to achieve a high dose DXM experience.

Incorrect.


Second, the effects of DXM are absolutely nothing like you say

You're contradicting yourself. You already said high dose DXM is a dissociative. Which is what I said.


Now, lets move on to the allergy medication. Things like benadryl (maybe Zyrtec, not sure) are anticholinergics. These drugs do cause hallucinations at very high doses, but these kinds of high doses do not happen by accident; nobody accidentally takes half a bottle of benadryl.


Where did I say purposeful or accidental? I was merely responding to someone with the info anti-histamine can cause hallucinations. Which is well known. I experienced it myself accidently. Half a bottle!?? It doesn't take half a bottle. No where close to that....

The amount could also change depending on other chemicals present (such as DXM).


Your allergy medication hypothesis fails, too.


My hypothesis was that it could have been a dissociative dose of DXM.
edit on 18-10-2012 by Lucid Lunacy because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 18 2012 @ 06:48 PM
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Originally posted by SpearMint
He's clearly a sociopath/psychopath, it's very sad.


Well, I just finished listening to the whole recording. I'm a thirty year old man who rarely cries, but this one did it for me. Please don't be so quick to slap a label on this kid. He was obviously in a tremendous amount of pain for a very long time. He was very respectful to the lady on the phone, and did exactly as she said, giving away all the correct information, and turning him self in like a good young man.

Yes, this guy was obviously disturbed, but WHY.

I had a friend who committed suicide at age 17. He reminds me of this kid. Huge heart, but he has no outlet for it. Society is hardening up by the day... it's a dog eat dog world out there... and some people can't bare it. My friend shot himself in the chest in our school bathroom. I went to the funeral and fell to my knees flipped out... I tell ya, it's not right, but it roots from something much deeper.

A long time ago I learned that the original interpretation of a ruler was one who imposes reality over a people. This holds true today. Our ruling class is comprised of certain psychological deviations...and they inflict their views onto the rest of us. Those who are most different from this standard are most prone to break down. They are most likely to have their "shadow" take over.

Both my friend, and this guy, did what they felt they must do. It doesn't have to seem rational to you, it most certainly is at a deep level. It's a message, conscious or not. Are we listening? Will we ever? I don't know.

It's tragic. Please be kind to a stranger today. Be kind to your neighbor. Be kind to a family member that's been ticking you off for whatever reason. You may just save a life or two.
edit on 18-10-2012 by moniesisfun because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 18 2012 @ 11:25 PM
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reply to post by Lucid Lunacy
 



Actually, you should do a quick double-check of your sources. You are STILL spreading misinformation. I really don't even know where to start... I really wish you would post your website sources, because if they're credible sources for the affects of DXM and other psychedelics, I've most likely been a member for years. Please post them up. FTR, you'll find warnings about DXM abuse on nearly every website that sells products containing the drug. It DOES NOT mean that their products are suitable for the abuse of DXM.

Now...

CHILDREN'S Sudafed is the ONLY DXM containing Sudafed product without acetaminophen. This is NOT what he would be taking, right? All TABLETS that contain DXM contain enough tylenol (325 mg), that if taken for even a LIGHT, THRESHOLD dose of DXM, would mean consuming over 3 grams of tylenol. Again, this is a threshold dose (100 mgs) for even a first time user. Enough tabs to get a high dose DXM experience could mean 7-9 times that, but much less than that should do the trick. 7-8 grams of tylenol in one sitting is likely lethal. More than that and see ya. Do the math. Re-check your sources. Let's not forget about the several other active ingredients in these tablets... Using Sudafed for even a medium DXM dose is death. Even if you ignore all this, this would still be a very expensive, inconvenient-to-purchase method of obtaining a very cheap and easy to obtain drug. It simply does not make sense.

Seriously, recheck your sources and redo the math.

Let's ignore logic and pretend he was taking Children's Sudafed, though...

The only reason for him to buy Children's would be to intentionally get high. Dumb way to do it because it also contains PE (bad), and price wise because there are much cheaper and more potent products available. Also remember that products whose main ingredient is DXM are often kept behind the counter (like pseudo-ephedrine products) and require you to be 18 to buy, and then only let you purchase limited quantities at a time. Perhaps he had his mom or older friend hit up all the pharmacies in town to buy his Children's Sudafed for him. Sure, you could score enough at one pharmacy for 1/8 the price by buying syrup, but maybe he's partial to Sudafed. It could happen.

Let's continue to ignore logic and keep pretending he was taking Children's Sudafed, though.

Keep reading.

I believe you are confusing the word 'dissociative', as in mental disorders with 'dissociative' drugs (basically blocking the brain from inputs from the body and other parts of the brain). Two different things. As I said before, a high enough dose of DXM that would leave you in a mindstate that could cause you to kill, would also render your body unable to do so. Your "friend" on a what you called a heavy dose of DXM (really it's a light to medium dose depending on weight and tolerance if the amount you gave was accurate) who thought his cat was the ruler of the universe, do you remember the way he was talking? The way he walked? Medium-high doses of DXM leaves your motor functions like those of someone who is very drunk... It affects speech the same way. High doses leave you unable to walk or speak. Point being that if DXM had anything to do with these murders it would have been very obvious that he was intoxicated when talking to the 911 operator, still ignoring that such a dose would leave him unable to commit the acts in the first place. DXM had nothing to do with this.

I'll say it again so that there is no misunderstanding. A high enough dose of DXM that would leave you in a mindstate that you could kill because of its affects would render your body unable to perform the task. Period. Also, enough Sudafed Tablets taken to achieve this dose would almost certainly kill you. It was not DXM, and it certainly was not Sudafed.

Back to the diphenhydramine. Pretty much the same argument. A dose high enough to allow a mindstate that could cause him to kill would also have left him without the wherewithal to call 911, let alone have a calm, coherent conversation for nearly half an hour. Remember, high dose anticholinergics leave you completely separated from reality. And, yes, the doses are intentional, and, yes, could be half a bottle's worth. Right now, at this very moment, I'm looking at a generic Benadryl bottle that once contained 20 pills at 25mg Diphenhydramine each. Half a bottle would be 250 mg Diph, which is a pretty common recreational dose. This can be considered a high dose for some people depending on weight and tolerance, but for most this is not a separate-you-from-reality dose. However, based on his half-hour conversation with police, he wasn't nearing even this dose. Which means that he wasn't using it intentionally to get high. Which means he would have been nowhere near a recreational dose. Which means it was not a contributing factor.

See how that works?



posted on Oct, 19 2012 @ 12:42 AM
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reply to post by Lucid Lunacy
 


Your logic fails when you (intentionally?) confuse a threshold dose with one that could cause you to kill. You're basically comparing a 2 beer buzz with a handle-of-tequila 12 hr. bender. Same drug, vastly different affects. Your logic also fails in your belief that you can accidentally achieve these doses. I know, I know, you never said it wasn't intentional, but ---Scratch that. It just fails. Let's use some of those "critical thinking" skills... You contend that he was intoxicated and it contributed to the murders. Intoxicated people aren't clear and coherent (especially on dissociatives). He was clear and coherent in the recording, therefore he was not intoxicated. If not intoxicated, then drugs had nothing to do with the murders. This is simple.

You are also (ignorantly?) ignoring the fact that DXM is a DISSOCIATIVE ANESTHETIC, and doses high enough to mind-# you that bad leave your body unable to act upon the mind-#edupedness... When the body is no longer communicating properly with the brain, the body does not work properly. This is precisely what a dissociative anesthetic does (and the point...lol). Rest assured that any "source" you can find where people "safely" got high off of acetaminophen containing tablets, the kids involved only took enough to get little more than light-headed giggles. Don't believe me? Read about the MANY Coricidin deaths. These poor kids bought the wrong type/box of Coricidin, and died for it. These were basically the same thing as acetaminophen containg Sudafed tablets, but the DXM content was more than doubled, and in some products tripled. Even with the higher concentration of DXM the acetaminophen still got them. Please stop saying that these pills are ok to dabble with.

Let me be crystal clear in case anyone else reading your posts gets any stupid ideas. Using DXM products that contain acetaminophen, even for a light, threshold dose, can be EXTREMELY harmful. Any more than that and they are downright deadly. This person would have you believe that it's possible to so intoxicated on these kinds of OTC drugs that you could kill, yet still survive the a'phen OD, but he is simply wrong. Using these drugs to get THAT high is almost certain death, kiddos. If it has acetaminophen, phenylephrine, or any drug other than DXM, and you're considering using it to get high, STAY AWAY from it. They are harmful at best, and deadly at worst.



posted on Oct, 19 2012 @ 12:47 AM
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reply to post by forwhatitsworth2u
 



I really wish you would post your website sources,

I did post some. Others I would reference would be against the T & C to post. I posted one that showed you were wrong about Sudafed not having a product containing DXM w/o Acetaminophen. Instead of acknowledging you were wrong you chose to spin and argue. I posted one about the max dose for Acetaminophen which showed one could reach recreational dose with Sudafed w/o reaching max Acetaminophen dose.


because if they're credible sources for the affects of DXM and other psychedelics, I've most likely been a member for years.

Credible sources would be consensus from communities of people that use it recreationally (and of course official medical bodies). I referenced 3 of the biggest most well known sites for recreational drugs. As to not ruffle feathers you will just have to find out, or assume you have memberships there. That's where I got my math.

I just looked at the sites. In the stickied threads on DXM on these sites most people were saying 300mg is a high dose for the average person, and 100mg is typically the threshold. This has many co-factors obviously which is why average is given. Considering the biggest one (besides tolerance) is weight, that should be considered for the OP, a fairly skinny teen.


FTR, you'll find warnings about DXM abuse on nearly every website that sells products containing the drug.

Because their products are used recreationally. I know. Point?


It DOES NOT mean that their products are suitable for the abuse of DXM.

When did I mention ideal or suitable?? I am not advocating the drug! I am speaking objectively about its recreational use(abuse).


CHILDREN'S Sudafed is the ONLY DXM containing Sudafed product without acetaminophen. This is NOT what he would be taking, right?


You make it sound like it's an impossibility. At my house (a very large family) adults take 'childrens' and children/teen sometimes takes 'adult'. Sometimes for more or less than normal dosage, or sometimes simply convianence. Many times all you need to do is cut the dose of an 'adult' bottle and it's equiv to the 'child' conterpart, and vice versa. The pharmacists give these instructions themselves.

So no I don't think it's this absurd notion that an adult would take "CHILDRENS sudafed". Maybe that's what his mom bought for the family, and they were all out of the big boy Sudafed.

But I never said he took Children's Sudafed! That was your twisting response to me showing you there was a Sudafed product like that, when you said there wasn't. Now you're focusing on it. Weird considering I am saying people can use Sudafed W/ Acetaminophen and reach DXM 'high' dose.

I am not going to address the rest of your math. We will have to agree to disagree. We have very different numbers. I strongly feel you are way off. You just said 700-900mg DXM...

100-300mg is a typical dose range, threshold to high dose respectively. The max recommended Tylenol dosage is 4grams. I am not going to redo the math, I can add.


Also remember that products whose main ingredient is DXM are often kept behind the counter (like pseudo-ephedrine products) and require you to be 18 to buy

Must change by State. I just confirmed what I mentioned before. At my local supermarket on the shelf is DXM only gel caps (Robotussin).


I believe you are confusing the word 'dissociative'

DXM is also used recreationally. When exceeding label-specified maximum dosages, dextromethorphan acts as a dissociative hallucinogen.


Back to the diphenhydramine. Pretty much the same argument. A dose high enough to allow a mindstate that could cause him to kill would also have left him without the wherewithal to call 911


I made this clear in my last post. I was not hypothesizing allergy meds as cause. Read don't spin. I was responding to someones comments on allergy meds making people tired at high dose. That's it.
edit on 19-10-2012 by Lucid Lunacy because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 19 2012 @ 12:50 AM
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reply to post by forwhatitsworth2u
 



Your logic also fails in your belief that you can accidentally achieve these doses. I know, I know, you never said it wasn't intentional, but ---Scratch that.


Indeed scratch that. I never said it. So don't put words in my mouth.

In one breath you make fun of my 'logic' and in the other breath admit it wasn't my logic


I really don't have interest in arguing with you....especially if you're going to do this.

I hypothesized DXM as a potential cause/catalyst. I never said if it was accidental or recreational.


Please stop saying that these pills are ok to dabble with.


WHAT????


When the hell did I say that!

Everything I said was in response to the hypothesis of the teen in the OP taking Sudafed that's it

YOU were saying I was giving disinfo. I responded. That does not mean I am freaking advocating the drug! Ugh.

I am not advocating anymore than you are! This conversation is over. You are ridiculous...
edit on 19-10-2012 by Lucid Lunacy because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 19 2012 @ 02:38 AM
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reply to post by Lucid Lunacy
 



Let's think critically about this. If kids were not able to consume enough DXM without dying from acetaminophen, why do many people claim otherwise all over the web??


You said it right there. I just hope some idiot didn't stop reading right there. Let me be clear. Every. Single. Known. Death. from DXM abuse is from eating tabs containing acetaminophen. Saying what I quoted against an argument saying that the use tylenol-laden pills is dangerous is an open door for the uninformed to think it's ok. Aterall, people claim that it's ok all over the web. It must be ok, right?. Get it? Please, Please, Please stop putting bull# like this on the web. Do you understand? #, dude. Getting high from Sudafed is suicide.

The smallest dose of tylenol you can get in a DXM containing Sudafed Tab is 325 mg. Max dose of DXM is 12.5 mg. Threshold dose of DXM from Sudafed equals 2.6 g of tylenol. For what you call a strong dose would be nearly 8g, and likely death.

When I was talking about the website warnings, I wasn't saying that you were claiming that they were suitable for abuse, I was simply saying that a warning doesn't mean that they're suitable for abuse, or that they're abused. Nearly all sellers of DXM containing products have the warning. Doesn't mean that kids use them, or that they're suitable. That's all I was saying. Please don't quote me out of context.

Erowid is known to be VERY conservative in their dosage recommendations. Safety reasons. Most information websites get their info from Erowid. If you want to see what dosages people are actually using, read the experience reports.

The "skinny teen" is 6'3. He's not a light weight. Please don't imply that he was, especially since you have no idea what he weighs. Having said that, there are VERY few 6'3 lightweights, so I feel ok saying he wasn't.

You have ignored the crux of my argument, and refuse to acknowledge the fact that the kid was clear and coherent on the recording. Read my last post again. He was not intoxicated on DXM, otherwise it would have been evident in the recording. Your hypothesis is wrong, it's absurd, and it's been buried, which is really all I said in the first place. You've little to no experience with the drug, and it really seems that you're basing your info off a 10 o'clock-scare-parents-with-a-new-drug news report. Lemme guess... You've got kids? Did a little reading a while back? Yeah...You actually know nothing about what you speak. You even brought up "dissociative" again, when it's clear you have ZERO idea what the term means as it pertains to medications/drugs.

Do the internet a favor. Please don't post about drugs of which you know nothing about claiming that they contributed to murder. Your post can show up in search results and can help to spread more myths and lies. Also, please don't mention in the same searchable post that people claim all over the web that they get high on tablets containing acetaminophen without ill affects. Seriously.

One more edit: Let the record show that you're actually hypothesizing that these murders were caused by Children's Sudafed without a single shred of supporting evidence.

And you call me ridiculous...
edit on 19-10-2012 by forwhatitsworth2u because: (no reason given)
edit on 19-10-2012 by forwhatitsworth2u because: (no reason given)
edit on 19-10-2012 by forwhatitsworth2u because: Clarification



posted on Oct, 19 2012 @ 03:08 AM
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Let's think critically about this. If kids were not able to consume enough DXM without dying from acetaminophen, why do many people claim otherwise all over the web??

You said it right there.



You said it right there.


That IN NO WAY implies I am advocating people should consume DXM with Tylenol OR DXM!!!

Again, this was purely in context to the hypothesis the teen in the OP was affected by DXM. That's it.

What I said stands. I was merely making the point that teens abuse DXM (even with acetaminophen) to get high. You are claiming they can't (when coupled with Tylenol) because they would die. I am not "doing the math" or researching for you. I am simply refuting it, based on observable evidence. Observable evidence plenty available on the web. Hopefully readers have sharp enough reading comprehension to infer my intent and the context. Sorry you are not.

I am not partaking in further dialogue. I would simply be repeating myself. And no doubt would get the same asinine, character assassination responses from you.


Do you understand? #, dude. Getting high from Sudafed is suicide.


Yet people do it.

Oh look I just suggested everyone on ATS takes the drug



Let the record show that you're actually hypothesizing that these murders were caused by Children's Sudafed without a single shred of supporting evidence.


Let the record show hypothesizing is what everyone is doing in this thread. Why it's an issue that I would throw out a theory, and call it that... is beyond me. Then again you're a little off in my book to begin with. Hostile and arguing for the sake of argument.


And you call me ridiculous.

It has since evolved.


Do the internet a favor.

Do ATS a favor.

Get off your high horse. Be civil. Stop breaking the T & C.
edit on 19-10-2012 by Lucid Lunacy because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 19 2012 @ 03:13 AM
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Where did I say it was purposeful or accidental?


That's why I said you never said it wasn't intentional. As for the logic fail, as your previous posts suggest, I felt it futile to explain. I started to explain, but didn't see the point. That was the "Scratch that". I was not misquoting you or quoting you out of context. That's your territory.

If you don't understand why your dxm hypothesis can't be true by now, then what do I say?

Let's test your hypthesis. Go to Walgreen's. Get an 8 oz. bottle of Robitussin Max Strength Cough. Swig it at once! Drive home. Wait 2 hrs. Throw on some digeridoo music. Wait another hour. Look at yourself in the mirror. Try to spell your own name on a piece of paper. Look at the paper in the morning. Come back here and argue with me about how you can load a revolver on strong dose DXM.
edit on 19-10-2012 by forwhatitsworth2u because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 19 2012 @ 03:15 AM
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reply to post by forwhatitsworth2u
 



Let's test your hypthesis. Go to Walgreen's. Get an 8 oz. bottle of Robitussin Max Strength Cough. Swig it at once! Drive home. Wait 2 hrs.


And I am the one being accused of advocating its use.......






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