Help ATS with a contribution via PayPal:
learn more

Turkish F16s intercept Syrian civilian flight from Moscow to Damascus

page: 4
11
<< 1  2  3   >>

log in

join

posted on Oct, 11 2012 @ 02:22 PM
link   
1. As Turkey's President had explained and rightfully under international laws to check flights over their own sovereign terroritory - CIVILIAN flights are not authorised to carry even knives as cargo, and YET, that Syrian passenger jet from Russia, was cleared by Russian customs to carry more than knives. MILITARY WAR equipment AND ammunitions bound for the regimes forces!

Putin and his rubber stamping parliment HAD VIOLATED international aviation rules, and MOST CRITICALLY, HAD placed the trusting international civilians onboard the jet who knew not the cargo in DANGER.

How long had this been carrying on till it had been discovered by the diligent Turkish forces today since the civil war and slaughtering of humankind by the humanSlayer Assad began 2 years ago?!

Facts remain - the evidences are clear of Putin's hypocrisy to his citizens, to UN, to mankind, and to the civilian passengers on board that dangerous flight. No words can describe the horror he had committed to defend his pet humanslayer Assad.


2. Russia holds an IMPORTANT seat upon the highly respected Security Council with veto powers. It is a seat of GREAT RESPONSIBILITY to mankind. It is the hope of all mankind to be free and protected, and thus the S.C, to provide that hope.

Overtime, the SC had lost its respect by mankind, by its continued failure to protect human rights due to the veto powers of those exclusive members. At times, the veto was wisely used, to ensure ALL rights are protected and not just the minority.

But more recently, it had been ABUSED by Russia and China in the face of outright and clear slaughter of fellow humans in Syria, hampering all efforts to end the conflict. It IS because of them, and now ESPACIALLY Putin that had created the rift and distrust in the UNSC by mankind.

With this case of CLEAR and EVIDENT taking sides of HumanSlayer Assad, despite their forked tongued mealy mouth hypocrisy of NOT taking sides and seeking for 'peaceful solutions' and YET arming their favoured side, it goes to show HOW MUCH the world community and russians had been dupe by the mongrel Putin.

Either the great russian people, long suffered and slaughtered under dictatorship, run Putin and his bunch of pariah dogs out of office, OR MANKIND BOOT Russia out of the UNSC for his failure to act in concert to save humans from wild beasts in Syria!

If the spirit of FDR, the originator of the UN Charter, who had courageously led a fearful nation of amercians trying to avoid war and yet saw their loved ones brutally slaughted in Pearl Habour, and had led free humans worldwide suffering and crying under Hitler and the alien-like Imperial Japanese Army to success, have to return, so...be...it!

MANKIND WILL NOT BE BULLIED BY MONGREL PUTIN & HUMANSLAYING TYRANTS!!! Our forefathers had paid great sacrifices for our freedom we have today and IT IS up to us to pass it on to the innocent next generations!










edit on 11-10-2012 by SeekerofTruth101 because: (no reason given)




posted on Oct, 11 2012 @ 02:40 PM
link   

Originally posted by stumason
If the Turks had specific intelligence sanctions against Syria were being circumvented on an aircraft traversing their airspace, they not only have the right, but an obligation to investigate.

There won't be a war with Russia over this, or anything to do with Syria for that matter. Neither the Russians (or the Chinese for that matter) have the capability (or even the desire) to take on the West


Unless you can quote me sources for your intelligence I'm going to be a bit skeptical.
I'm looking for a specific CHINFO document that I used to get while in the Navy that detailed the Russians ambitious arms build up. Regardless, I think you are underestimating the Russians here.

They are not the same country they were two decades ago. While the global 08 crisis hit them pretty hard their economy is on the up swing and defence spending is on the rise (as well as China's). Source

Also, Russia has stated numerous times that they will defend Iran if we move against them. Iran is an ally of Syria. By proxy, the Russians could definitely get involved if we moved against Iran or Syria.
If we moved against Syria, we would spitting distance from Iran on multiple fronts. This would only further aggrivate the Russians. From what I've seen so far China looks to be backing out of the Iran / Middle East geopolitical area for the time being - so the only threat would be the Russians.

I just wouldn't be so bold as to say Russia is a non player here.



posted on Oct, 11 2012 @ 03:01 PM
link   
reply to post by zeeon
 


The resurgence of Russia is not due to Putin, but its discovery and exploitation of its newfound wealth - oil and corruption.

While the rich gets richer along with the minority middle classes, the majority which are russian peasants remain as they had been under Tsar Peter and Stalin, and today, under the megalomanic Putin.

They failed to realize that oil has dropped in value recently, and much more in years to come even with or without wars, as mankind are beginning to glean themselves off fossilized fuels and into clean energy such as cheap solar engergies of today.

What then will happen to Russia and nations that depend on oil wealth? Worse with corruption? The leaders will be hung. At least the oil producers of the past - such as the Middle Eastern states such as Saudi Arabia, Bahrain, Qartar, etc, had shifted towards diversification of other industries for economic progress, but states such as Russia, Venuzuela and Iran are living in piped dreams.

Even worse is now that many states around the world had discovered hydrocarbons - oil, gas and its byproducts nearby such as seas and underground with improvements in science and tech to cheaply scoop them up, to use cheaply or sold cheaply. The days of $100 per barrel will be over soon.

What then Russian leaders and their boot licking minorities bloodsuckers whom are today dependent on oil wealth? Be booted out, or launch a conquest upon the world to seize territories the way Hitler did? May they learn the lesson of Hitler and how he ended up eventually, and may they not share the same fate, more so for the majority innocent russians who got nothing throughout for centuries but had continually been only lied to, misused and abused.
edit on 11-10-2012 by SeekerofTruth101 because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 11 2012 @ 04:16 PM
link   

Originally posted by buster2010
Russia has a naval base in Syria so it makes no sense that Russia would be moving weapons and such by plane when they can just ship it in. Turkey shouldn't have forced that plane down without having any hard proof of what was on board.


I normally agree with you on a lot of other topics, but the fact of the matter is that under international law any nation has the right to control the traffic in their airspace. Any country suspecting that a plane is carrying weapons illegally has a DUTY to investigate.

How do you assume they would have gained evidence without actually investigating the cargo?

Also, I believe that although Russia has a naval base in Syria, there are laws restricting the transfer of weapons through that base. Just as the UK halted the transport of helicopters through its waters.



posted on Oct, 11 2012 @ 04:22 PM
link   

Originally posted by zeeon

Originally posted by stumason
If the Turks had specific intelligence sanctions against Syria were being circumvented on an aircraft traversing their airspace, they not only have the right, but an obligation to investigate.

There won't be a war with Russia over this, or anything to do with Syria for that matter. Neither the Russians (or the Chinese for that matter) have the capability (or even the desire) to take on the West


Unless you can quote me sources for your intelligence I'm going to be a bit skeptical.
I'm looking for a specific CHINFO document that I used to get while in the Navy that detailed the Russians ambitious arms build up. Regardless, I think you are underestimating the Russians here.

They are not the same country they were two decades ago. While the global 08 crisis hit them pretty hard their economy is on the up swing and defence spending is on the rise (as well as China's). Source

Also, Russia has stated numerous times that they will defend Iran if we move against them. Iran is an ally of Syria. By proxy, the Russians could definitely get involved if we moved against Iran or Syria.
If we moved against Syria, we would spitting distance from Iran on multiple fronts. This would only further aggrivate the Russians. From what I've seen so far China looks to be backing out of the Iran / Middle East geopolitical area for the time being - so the only threat would be the Russians.

I just wouldn't be so bold as to say Russia is a non player here.


I will, Russia is a non player.


Furthermore, speaking of sceptical, the Soviet military of 2 decades ago was a serious adversary.

The Russian Federation was forced to halt almost all procurement spending which gutted their military in the mid 1990's, in the last decade they have made an attempt to modernise into a smaller, more technologically capable force that has been hit and miss.

Russian military spending has increased in the last few years, it couldn't get much lower and sustain a viable force of any size. Russian spending is still only roughly 10% of U.S. spending which, coincidently, maintained a large piece of its cold war military.

The U.S. military enjoys unchallenged dominance in both technology and numbers. Russia may blow some hot air but at the end of the day what are they going to do?

Short of a nuclear exchange, which is not going to happen in the current world climate over Syria, Russia has no choice but to suck it up.

You cant get involved if you cant get there first and Russia currently has no ability to project and secure power.



posted on Oct, 11 2012 @ 04:58 PM
link   

Originally posted by Drunkenparrot
I will, Russia is a non player.


Furthermore, speaking of sceptical, the Soviet military of 2 decades ago was a serious adversary.

The Russian Federation was forced to halt almost all procurement spending which gutted their military in the mid 1990's, in the last decade they have made an attempt to modernise into a smaller, more technologically capable force that has been hit and miss.

Russian military spending has increased in the last few years, it couldn't get much lower and sustain a viable force of any size. Russian spending is still only roughly 10% of U.S. spending which, coincidently, maintained a large piece of its cold war military.

The U.S. military enjoys unchallenged dominance in both technology and numbers. Russia may blow some hot air but at the end of the day what are they going to do?

Short of a nuclear exchange, which is not going to happen in the current world climate over Syria, Russia has no choice but to suck it up.

You cant get involved if you cant get there first and Russia currently has no ability to project and secure power.


I'm not debating end strength between countries. Of course the United States Military might is vastly superior in all respects.

What i'm suggesting is that
1. War = Profit.
Getting involved in a proxy war with Russia only helps Russia. I thought I made that point in my last post by illustrating the alliances with Iran and Syria. I wasn't conjecturing on all out war - rather that a proxy war with Russia would only benefit Russia and that their economic situation supports such a conclusion.

2. That Russia would have vested interest if we moved against Syria or Iran. And that interest would be to supply weapons by proxy to Syria / Iran. This is relevant to the OP due to Turkey (a now staunch enemy of Syria) stopping that passenger jet looking for arms. This scenario only helps bolster the Russian economy (as I said before War = Profit) while not having to directly engage the United States / NATO allies.

3. Russia does indeed still have the power to project. They still have quite a few active SSBN's and Fast Attack sub's as well as destroyers that can pummel a target offshore. They don't have to engage - but rather can sit off the coast to simply threaten.

4. Contrary to popular belief - the biggest force isn't always the best. This is evidenced by the reduction in fleet force sizes in our own US Navy. Do you know how big, slow and cumbersome a Carrier Strike Group is? I know from 13 years of experience. Sure - we pack a TON of firepower - and Carriers are quite literally very fast (I've personally been on one that out ran the rest of the Strike Group). However Carriers without their strike group are quite vulnerable. The Navy realized the drawbacks of a CSG and has since pumped hundres of millions into ships like the Littoral Combat Ship (LCS).

Basically what I'm saying is that a lean, multi-functional military can be more deadly than a large, slow hard hitting military. Our own Military has begun to realize this. So don't count out countries just because their military isn't the same size as ours.



posted on Oct, 11 2012 @ 05:16 PM
link   
It's a violation of the convention on international civil aviation,it's an act of war..Under international law!!
After landing the passengers were roughed up and forced to sign papers:
tv.globalresearch.ca...
www.presstv.com...
www.presstv.com...
Turkey has essentially declared war on Syria
edit on 11-10-2012 by all2human because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 11 2012 @ 07:10 PM
link   
reply to post by zeeon
 


Sorry to disagree with your views, but today's Russia is no match for US in military terms. Other than UN vetos and some arms shipments or some intelligence, Russia cannot help its allies in any significant ways. Militarily speaking, nukes are the only holding card that Russia has against the west today.

On the otherhand China with budget 1/7th to that of US can be a formidable foe in coming 5-10 years. A single dollar goes much farther in China in terms of buying value so we can easily reduce the 1/7th figure to 1/5th or 1/4th. Russia and China combined can give a very hard fight to US and NATO. It won't be like sanctioned hit Iraq or Libya where USAF is doing its job and its Army is watching cable television and waiting for 'go ahead' orders.



posted on Oct, 11 2012 @ 07:16 PM
link   
reply to post by victor7
 


Inflation and social mobility will take care of China, in 5 - 10 years they will have all the same problems as the West.



posted on Oct, 11 2012 @ 07:56 PM
link   
Russia's options in the developing situations in the region are essentially summed up by this video.




posted on Oct, 11 2012 @ 09:42 PM
link   
reply to post by michael1983l
 


growing economies can be hit with inflations but do not forget that Chinese are among the top savers in the world and Chinese treasury is easily sitting on $2Trillion of cash. Most importantly, China is not tackling $16T of debt and economic stagnant growth. However, technologically US is far ahead, so not many points to be afraid of regarding China making offensive gameplans.



posted on Oct, 12 2012 @ 12:26 AM
link   
While America and her broke Nato allies have been expending weapons and treasure in a bid to control the Middle East, all the other nations have been building their technology and reserves. Russia and China have vetoed the continued subjugation of Middle Eastern nations by the West and have shown un bending support to the next in line "victims" of western domination.

The notion that these countries are just pussies or not involved is good denialism. History has shown to never underestimate the enemy. David and Goliath stories abound. The first rule of war is there are no rules. War plans never go according to plan. Blah Blah.

According to the warmongers on here, every thing is under control and sure and proceeding according to plan.


Just my opinion. What some call anti-american is really free speech. War is Terrorism.



posted on Oct, 15 2012 @ 03:26 PM
link   
reply to post by SeekerofTruth101
 


huff-puff, i love how often you trot 'mankind out - i guess that already makes you a globalist, doesn't it? wonder why that doesn't surprise me much?


just a question, how quickly would we have seen close up shots of these eevil smuggled weapons systems if there was anything substantial on the plane? i'd wager that time would have been counted in minutes rather than hours, but even now, days later we've only gotten fed some ambiguous and slightly goofy spin which we've already been accustomed to in the F-4 fighter plane shoot down, assuredly far away from the Syrian coast and deep in it'l waters, albeit without any clarification regarding the damage that forced it down. i'd still wager it was AAA shells, which they couldn't possibly admit since it would prove a) they're lying through their teeth without remorse or shame and b) they're violating their neighbors' airspace for reasons that will be bleedingly obvious to anyone who can put 2+2 together.


Of course i'm going to trust them now. Maybe they'll even scrounge up a few SA-7s and RPGs weeks later, when they've had enough time to purchase the required amount on the black market.



PS: don't get me wrong, the original story might well be true, but it would paint the russkies in a very bad light, unless there's some convoluted 'logic' behind it, which is still dumb, just in a different way, i only have zero information i'd even remotely trust and i have even less reason to believe the turkish version of events, not by a long shot.

if people are drooling over this, well let's just say i hope they'll one day fly on a plane that will be forced down on some military airbase, their a** interned for a day or two (& beaten just a little, maybe left standing at MG point in the sun for a couple of hours or both... ) and all their belongings snatched at gunpoint, maybe they'll appreciate the humor.
edit on 2012.10.15 by Long Lance because: got it wrong, poster wrote 'mankind' rather than 'humanity'[





new topics

top topics



 
11
<< 1  2  3   >>

log in

join