Originally posted by thehoneycomb
reply to post by Wrabbit2000
Hi wrabbit, this is of course my opinion. OWS was not truly a grass roots movement, that was sort of the point I was trying to get at. Though their
numbers have dwindled, I am sure they are back in the planning stages at the current moment. I dont think this is the last we'll see of the occupy
I appreciate the thoughtful reply to what I wrote. I'd like to address a couple points you raise from the perspective of being in the middle of some
of it from Occupy's side of things. First, I can only say with absolute certainty what I saw and learned as a part of my St Louis Camp. I saw and was
watching message traffic and the start of national networking and communications between the camps..but it was just so fledgling at that point and
never did properly take hold how I think it could and should have.
In that, you find one of many examples of where I say Occupy WAS Grass roots. They couldn't even get effective communications gear. We were using
FMRS Radios *I* supplied the camp and it would have been screaming for Safety and media people without them. Umm.. If Soros was writing checks, St
Louis damn sure didn't make HIS list..and we could have used anything, regardless of who it came from. At the time.... it ALL helped.
The reason I say it was not a true grass roots movement, and neither was Egypt for that matter, is that it required months, if not years of
planning beforehand for political purposes.
Honeycomb... I'll tell ya. I became aware of Occupy before it even had that name and it was just 'a movement' being formed among Anonymous and
groups like the People's Liberation Front. This was all visible if you were in the right parts of the net in June, July and August....and Occupy
wouldn't come to exist as something anyone publicly new until September. I don't know where this Canadian firm everyone talks about fits
in....because there were no civilized business folk among those I read planning the rise of Occupy to start with the occupation of Lower Manhattan
(They wisely abridged that gawdy plan to just be one park...LOL).
I feel like I was right there watching this from the word go..and even *I* still can't explain in solid terms...just what happened. I can absolutely
tell you *I* was paid by no one. *I* took nothing from anyone and had no 'guidance', I witnessed the horror of the Site 2 raid in Boston on October
11th. That and a HARD vow of NOT AGAIN had me in camp with a couple thousand dollars to help things along and all the energy I could bring inside a
That is how MOST of Occupy built, as I saw it personally. Individuals who just said NO MORE...and saw this as a possible route to get it done.
In the case of Egypt and similar in other countries, the end result was that of Hosnei Mubarak being ousted from power by, it was organized in
advanced by left leaning groups and think tanks like code pink using social media.
True..and so? I knew who I was with in Occupy and it couldn't be missed that I had Communists and Black Bloc Anarchists among the camp I was living
in. I called every last one a friend too. IF we'd gotten anywhere...THEN we could have sorted out those larger differences. Just GETTING that far
would make any alliance of necessity worth it.
Case and point, from day one a very large percentage of the boots on the ground were labor unions. It would be alot easier to organize a movement for
a Union boss to circulate emails down the chain of command. If it were are true grass roots movement, the unions would not have not even showed up,
yet in the case of OWS, they were present from day one.
The Unions as I saw it happen absolutely were trying to control Occupy and DID succeed in some places. They failed in others. The Republicans also
tried to curry influence and control early. Ask Geraldo how that worked out.
So did the Dems..and they TOO got rejected. OH that pissed them off
so bad I think a couple almost BURST when they got back into private settings. Occupy was everyone's 'cause' of the moment to co-opt and *EVERYONE*
tried that I watched happen. Eventually, yeah... OWS Primary fell to the cash..but as noted, they lasted longer as TRUE Grass Roots citizens than TPM
did, for what it's worth.
A true grassroots movement, would be a lot harder to organize, and even harder to break apart.
I think it's precisely because it was true grass roots for MOST of the camps and people...that it was so easy to break up. A well organized, funded
and planned Movement would never have been spread out and broken up so easily and quickly. Thats what it looks like when Citizens even try and resist.
It's suppressed, Whatever that takes.