Top neurosurgeon 'spent six days in heaven' during a coma

reply to post by CaptainBeno


Yet his body persists, meaning it wasn't removed from the equation, meaning some physical aspect of himself was causing this phenomena, meaning he didn't die, meaning he's still alive, meaning he's not a likely candidate for heaven as he wasn't a spirit for any moment of his dream.

Can we see pink clouds and soaring translucent beings in our dreams? Yes, we can only see them in the dreamworld. Has one ever seen pink clouds and soaring translucent beings outside of the dreamworld? No, there are no cases of this phenomena outside of the dream world. Was the man experiencing the dreamworld or the real world? He was unconscious and without his senses, of course it was merely a dream.

How much is he charging for the book?

Originally posted by detachedindividual
It's hard to explain, I don't believe in God, I don't believe in Heaven in the traditional sense, and I know the scientific explanations of lack of oxygen and so on

I've heard a few people say this, and I fail to understand it. How can an existence after this physical one be possible if there is no intelligence behind it? Now I'm not talking any kind of BS religion here, I just mean some general universal architect. Call me ignorant, but I only see two possibilities:

The universe was a total chance occurrence. All life and anything else in the universe that exists is a complete accident and we are just complex organisms that cease to function altogether upon death.

-or-

The more spiritual minded people are correct. We have a consciousness that has the ability to separate from the physical body upon death and it will continue elsewhere.

Now I just don't understand how the latter (existence after death) could be possible if there wasn't some kind of intelligence behind it, because if there was no "architect" and the universe was just random chance, that would imply that we are just complex organisms that happened to evolve over millions of years. Fair enough, but why would we have consciousness that transcends physical death if there was nothing that intended it to be that way? Consciousness that survives physical death (if it is true) sure does seem like something that would have to be deliberately organized. No living creature would just happen to evolve a "soul" over time.

Anyways, I don't follow any religions, so I'm not trying to push ideas of some particular deity on you. I'm not criticizing you or anything either. This just has me genuinely curious.

I'm speechless. A rarity for me.

S+F

Originally posted by jtap66
So, why is this "place" automatically Heaven?

Was he shown conclusively that it was a Christian God running the show?

That word doesn't necessarily have to imply the Christian "reward system".

I think more people are using that word now as a general term for existence beyond physical death. Keep in mind that this guy said he doesn't belong to any religion. So no, he isn't Christian.

reply to post by nixie_nox


Its funny how people think, Just because he is man of science does not make him perfect, esp some like him who fell so fast soon as he saw "vision" and its really disappointing he is a man who studied brain functions.

It is very surprising what people assume about people of science, some of my co-workers are absolute religious nutcases but have masters in genetics.. i'm starting to wonder if they even studied properly, or just crammed stuff to pass the test in denial then just say "god did it" after they got their doctorate.

However, arguing with someone like that is interesting because they know Anti-Theistic approach and logic unlike, pastorized religious folks.

reply to post by CaptainBeno


I just want to say that I think it's cool you referenced the Orb.

Cheers!

Originally posted by sgspecial19
I get chills from reading the article; he is absolutely right consciousness does exist outside the body. When I meditate, I leave my physical senses behind and reach a state of consciousness where I am no longer limited to my body. The environment around me IS me, and there is a feeling of all knowing.

Actually, this is because the part of your brain's neocortex responsible for determining where you end and the rest of the world begins goes night-night during deep meditation. It leaves one feels deeply connected to the air surrounding them. I've experienced this during meditation, and it's extremely powerful.

I'd like to present to you a good analogy/ theory / fun thought that could help demonstrate how life could actually be for, and why we would even want to live in a world so chaotic as our own.

I call it, the Minecraft Duality

Let's say you've heard or googled a indie game called Minecraft, and you had the option to play as a god ( with all materials you could want, infinite health an food, and ability to fly), Or as a human, start with nothing and have to eat and limited life and need to gather food and materials to survive.

1st off both options would mean you live /play completely different than each other, with only general concepts that may inter mingle.

You are forced online in most servers to play as a human ( Survival mode ) with or without basic of the basics. Sometimes not even that, it's just like life, yes a graphical rendition, but a general concept at the very least. And can be a time sync for obvious reasons, and non obvious reasons. But many at some point and time, play as a developer ( creative mode ) and has access to all the materials and such, they play and it's on average not that long suprisingly, most normally go back to playing survival as it's called, where they can die, loose all their items, and get robbed / griefed.

As a God, you'd eventually get bored, it happens, and it's mostly due to lack of feelings and experiences that happen when you value the specific time and materials you have, and without those feelings / experience it's boring having the ability to do anything, without the concept of time, people to interact and such, not lonely, just boring, predictable, and unchallengeable, non engaging, nothing would require more than a mere thought, to me that sounds fun for a day or two, but I'm adventurous at heart, and have an attention issue. Heaven sounds wonderful an all, but I'd honestly ask to come back. Do it again, an again, an again, maybe somewhere else, or as something else, or just the same with slight differences.

But really, if you think about being a god, as we define it, I say not only would you be screaming to endure life for a day on earth, but you'd sacrifice all you knew, and all you could have to live a lifetime of not knowing, and challenge.

Think about it..

What makes this guy any different than anyone else in a coma? So he lost his higher brain functions, and basically dreamed for six days so how is that considered a NDE?

Interesting

A few points from reading through responses to the people who deem it nessasary to label ppl as religious nuts.

Other people have had nde and experienced hell

Why would this guy need money from a book since he is a surgeon

He was brain dead how could he dream?

He believes in science and reasoning yet he is making these claims?

How many of you still celebrate Christmas since you don't believe in religious stuff and labeling ppl religious nuts?

Originally posted by alienreality

Originally posted by Agit8dChop
He's a neurosurgeon, which means he studies extensively the mind and its affects and coma's and so forth.
Id say he's studied it so much it was the first thing his brain thought of when it went into default!
Heaven?... its a mental thing. His mind just went to its own interpretation of heaven!

Guess you failed to actually read the full linked content..

Because he was being constantly monitored during the coma and there was zero brain activity.. His cortex was completely shut down..
His mind was doing absolutely nothing..

A slightly different but more accurate interpretation: The tools used by modern medicine failed to measure brain activity.

See how that's different?

Will they be able to measure that activity in ten or twenty years? Maybe.

reply to post by luciddream


I am starting to agree with the others about the convenience of the book deal.

From South Park:

Stan Marsh: You don't even know anything about Christianity!
Eric Cartman: I know enough to exploit it.

Guy sees a dream, thinks it really happened. This is news now?

Originally posted by Escobar7575
Interesting

Why would this guy need money from a book since he is a surgeon

It is not always about money. Also, you don't know what his spending habits are like. I have met broke, rich people.

He was brain dead how could he dream?

All they said is that his cortex was shut down, no further information. It doesn't mean the rest of the brain wasn't working.

He believes in science and reasoning yet he is making these claims?

Who knows.

How many of you still celebrate Christmas since you don't believe in religious stuff and labeling ppl religious nuts?

I celebrate it as a national holiday.

When dreams and meditative states can sometimes be 'more real' than reality itself, such discoveries are things that must be made personally.

No amount of proof will prove what you can experience for yourself. Just like UFOs.

I would sooner beleive Alice went to Wonderland than this guy went to "Heaven"

If you honestly think your dead family members spend eternity looking down at you from some magical place in the clouds then you are gullable, daft and completely clueless.

Your religion makes you blind, an excuse to be ignorant to the less tantilising reality.

Pretty neat, I'm interested in what else he saw or did there...
Guess it'll be in the book.

Originally posted by nixie_nox

Originally posted by Escobar7575
Interesting

Why would this guy need money from a book since he is a surgeon

I celebrate it as a national holiday.

He is a neurosurgeon I am pretty sure he knows what the facts are behind this then any of us.

I really don't care who or what ppl believe that's their prerogative but the labeling of everyone who believes in a higher being a religious nut while celebrating Christmas just confuses me ...makes no sense

It's important that you don't say "heaven" because it has heavy Christian connotations and this experience heavily contradicts that notion. This is more of a "Holy crap, I am and always was a part of the all being" type thing.