Oppositional defiant disorder [ODD] -- Now This Is Some Nonsense

Originally posted by Advantage

Originally posted by tothetenthpower
reply to post by Aliensun

 

But you'd believe a psychologist telling you it was something entirely different right?

We always try and find answers to our problems. In our quest for having an answer, we often just take whatever explanation is the most reasonable, or the most convenient.

He has a disorder, therefore, mystery solved, no longer needs treatment or to figure it out. Just say " OH HE"S ODD, or ADHD, can't blame him!'.

Most of these diagnoses are a cop out for personal responsibility and growing the hell up.



Some people just don't, period. They don't have a disorder, they are just unwilling to make changes within themselves.

~Tenth

Want to hear something interesting?? My daughter had a severe fluke reaction to a particular immunization and was hospitalized several times. Went from a normal baby to somehting seriously wrong. It WAS tracked to the immunization and VAERS were filed on it.. and she was sent to a pediatric neurologist to diagnose her. She has a form of autism with serious processing issues. The funny part is ( long story short) when its THEIR fault and can be proven, they sure as hell didnt send her to a psychiatrist to diagnose a medical issue.. it was a neurologist. MOST kids are diagnosed as having aspergers or autism spectrum disorders by a psych. How can this be ( rhetorical Q)

I also suspect immunizations. May I ask how you can Prove it?

Just sayin

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Originally posted by moniesisfun
reply to post by Advantage

 

They should have her DNA sequenced to find out which rare genetic component caused this severe reaction.

To make it easier, and best help out others, compare her DNA to others who were diagnosed with "aspergers" or "autistic spectrum disorder", who also had the same immunization.

In the future, we should have people's DNA sequenced ahead of immunization, in order to make sure certain susceptible individuals aren't screwed up.

Then you could file a class action lawsuit against...heck, the manufacture of the vaccine, and the psychiatric organization who erroneously label someone with a permanent disorder without knowing the true cause.

At some point pseudo science must be realized as such.

edit on 8-10-2012 by moniesisfun because: (no reason given)

And admit that every drug they release isnt the best thing since manna from heaven for everyone? You must be joking BTW, you cant sue vaccine companies. Most folks who try to fill out a VAERS report will have it kicked back to them as not applicable. I just had the help of a friend who happened to be the Dr I was working with at a hospital I was employed at to even get the report accepted. You can report an adverse reaction all you want... but very very very few are accepted by BOTH the CDC and FDA. Something they dont tell you.

Originally posted by tinker9917

Originally posted by Advantage

Originally posted by tothetenthpower
reply to post by Aliensun

 

But you'd believe a psychologist telling you it was something entirely different right?

We always try and find answers to our problems. In our quest for having an answer, we often just take whatever explanation is the most reasonable, or the most convenient.

He has a disorder, therefore, mystery solved, no longer needs treatment or to figure it out. Just say " OH HE"S ODD, or ADHD, can't blame him!'.

Most of these diagnoses are a cop out for personal responsibility and growing the hell up.



Some people just don't, period. They don't have a disorder, they are just unwilling to make changes within themselves.

~Tenth

Want to hear something interesting?? My daughter had a severe fluke reaction to a particular immunization and was hospitalized several times. Went from a normal baby to somehting seriously wrong. It WAS tracked to the immunization and VAERS were filed on it.. and she was sent to a pediatric neurologist to diagnose her. She has a form of autism with serious processing issues. The funny part is ( long story short) when its THEIR fault and can be proven, they sure as hell didnt send her to a psychiatrist to diagnose a medical issue.. it was a neurologist. MOST kids are diagnosed as having aspergers or autism spectrum disorders by a psych. How can this be ( rhetorical Q)

I also suspect immunizations. May I ask how you can Prove it?

You may not be able to. EVER. You have to have the entire sequence of events, the Dr testimony, AND the medical records you submit must suit the CDC and FDA. In my case, it was in her 2nd hospitalization till reacting with severe febrile seizures, loss of consciousness intermittently, atypical seizures, and a host of other things to even have anyone say.. oh this started a few hrs after her last immunization?? Maybe its the immunization??

IF your insurance co will go along with it and you want to help your kid and not just sue a place you cant sue anyway... get with a neurologist and prepare to spend the next 12-18 months or more of your life fighting and begging and forcing... and sometimes losing. Then the next 17 yrs ( in my case) working constantly to give yoru kid what they need to live a life after you are no longer capable of caring for them.

Drugs DO NOT cure this or treat it adequately. It is hard hard work with behavior mods, trying out a bazillion teaching methods ( on your own as the pub schools arent going to) in conjunction with an education specialist, ETC ETC ETC... and MAYBE medications. There is NO silver bullet to this and the medical community is committing a crime against humanity for claiming so.


EDITED TO ADD:
I have spoken in several areas on this... I have a lot of folks come to me and say they are convinced that their kid is *insert diagnosis here* due to vaccines. I say, what makes you think its vaccines? "becuase vaccines are bad and have blah blah blah in them". No mention of the immediate horrid effect they would have noticed. No mention of any link to the vaccine.. just that it HAS to be the vaccine. Oh.. thanks for playing... NEXT! No, vaccines on the whole arent bad. They were a brilliant medical miracle. Manufcturing and greed have made them decidedly dangerous and deadly to SOME children. There are a percentage of children who die from medications every year.. and they are never pulled off of the market becuase the percentage doesnt outweigh the good. You sacrifice the one for many.. many of dollars most of the time. Some of the ingredients in certain ones are terrible.. but even less common is the true adverse reaction to a vaccine and it is immediate.. it may happen to one of your kids but not the next. The kid has to be predisposed to it IMO. People say the vaccine their kid got at 5 all of a sudden manifested itself at 16... sorry.... It doesnt work that way. Just wanting to save folks some time and money.. cause youre going to pay through the nose helping your kid and its FOR THE REST OF YOUR LIFE sometimes.. in the event its NOT vaccine related. These disorders are many.. and they are misdiagnosed all the time. Dont go off looking for zebras.. start with the inception of the issue.. and do a real investigation into what the contributing factors are. THEN you can tell if you should go to a neurologist, psychiatrist, or whatever.

Originally posted by METACOMET
Just sayin

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SERIOUSLY? Those threads are 2 to 4 yrs old, depending on which one. Lots of new info and new members.

Sorry, but my son and I need help with current info, not four year old info!

Originally posted by tothetenthpower
I'm insulted. Apparently psychiatrists think that simply because children question authority, that they have a neurological disorder.
Source

Opositional defiant disorder (ODD) is a diagnosis described by the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM) as an ongoing pattern of anger guided disobedience, hostilely defiant behavior toward authority figures which goes beyond the bounds of normal childhood behavior. People may appear very stubborn and often angry. A diagnosis of ODD cannot be given if the child presents with conduct disorder (CD).[1]

So...I mean, a disorder? An actual disorder? Let's look at the symptoms.

Signs and symptomsSome signs and symptoms that must be perpetuated for longer than 6 months and must be considered beyond normal child behavior to fit the diagnosis are:[5][6]

The child must exhibit 4 out of the 8 signs and symptoms listed below in order to meet the DSM-IV-TR diagnostic threshold for oppositional defiant disorder[7]

Actively refuses to comply with majority's requests or consensus-supported rules[8]
Performs actions to deliberately annoy others[8]
Angry and resentful of others[6]
Argues often[6]
Blames others for his or her own mistakes
Has few or no friends or has lost friends
Causes constant trouble at school
Spiteful or seeks revenge
Touchy or easily annoyed
Generally, these patterns of behavior will lead to problems at school and other social venues.[6]

This is atually probably one of the most nonsensical things I've ever read. Why is that we strive to 'diagnose' every little thing? Is it possible your child is just a dick? Or he's smarter than your average bear?

Is it possible that children recognize that un-questioning faith and obedience is a bad thing to have?!

I'm at a loss for words at how idiotic this whole concept is..

Somebody please enlighten me as to nature of this 'disorder' and why we've wasted countless hours attempting to figure out what is wrong with children, when there apparently isn't anything wrong, other than they have a problem with authority.

~Tenth

edit on 10/8/2012 by tothetenthpower because: (no reason given)

Thank you for showing me your misguidedness, hopefully today I will educate because this lack of understanding is insulting. Ive had experience with this illness/mental disorder, my little sister had it.
If you think they are just diagnosing children with this for a couple of moments of questioning authority?

no way man.

My sister is only 14 now, when she was in primary school, it started happening, stealing, lying, she stole a bunch of 5c coins from a charity coin trail at her school.... 5c coins! Its all done for attention, a big game show to them. When she would lie it would be so obvious, it would be to the point where my parents would have caught her lie out with evidence and she would still deny it.

When she was 13 she was caught wagging and hanging around 18 yr olds, you would warn her and she would say ok yeah. I know and be really genuine about it and just go do it again.

This is only one straw of hay in a stack.

Docs ended up accusing my mother and father of being unfit to take care of her considering all the police knocks at the door,

This is where it gets worse... my mother... torn and distraught after being called an unfit mother at wits end with this girl she has tried over and over again to reason with only to have it spat in her face again gets a call from the people who took her away telling my mother that she was too out of control for the care they put her in....

Now I dont even know where my little sister is because of this damn misunderstood disorder.

Hear some stories of people who have actually experienced it before making an opinion next time.
NAMAS- JERK

APA DSM 5 out in May 2013. Those interested should take some time to peruse the changes, additions, etc. Interesting stuff.

Important to remember - though just about anyone can find something in there that you would fit into (I self-diagnosed for Caffeine Induced Disorder) one should bear in mind that the totality of a person's physical, mental, social and emotional being (as well as history and all other factors) are taken into account before a psych diagnosis/disorder is rendered. It's not as abused as many here would like to argue (though it can be) no doubt.

P.s. quick link: Proposed Revisions on the tool bar.

reply to post by Advantage


Forgive me, I often think we live on planet Brando. Sometimes this world is a bit too much to bare, and I shut it out for BrandoWorld instead.

You know, where things actually make sense and all...then there comes times where I imagine myself typing in my head to awesome people, with information exchanges between us two where there could actually be things done and people get well within our capabilities...

I must apologize for sometimes not being able to tell the difference between fantasy and reality....oh noes, I must have psychosis!!

I must be in need of a bunch of pills, ASAP.

Originally posted by moniesisfun
reply to post by Advantage

 

Forgive me, I often think we live on planet Brando. Sometimes this world is a bit too much to bare, and I shut it out for BrandoWorld instead.

You know, where things actually make sense and all...then there comes times where I imagine myself typing in my head to awesome people, with information exchanges between us two where there could actually be things done and people get well within our capabilities...

I must apologize for sometimes not being able to tell the difference between fantasy and reality....oh noes, I must have psychosis!!

I must be in need of a bunch of pills, ASAP.

..... care to share your pills?? I think I have a rage disorder now.
Seriously though, Ive been beating this dead and decaying horse for almost 18 yrs now. Get things done?? Heck.. get someone to listen! This whole thing happened at one of the top 10 pediatric hospitals in the country. Her 2nd hospitalization.. second.The first they told me it was just a virus and a fever.. as if seizures and not being able to wake or hold your kid without it screaming was just a virus. ALso.. medical records are a funny thing. Read yours recently?

Tell you what.. you want to pay for the genetic studies?? Ill let you have studies on my kid and the 2 of my cousins who had the same thing happen done.. then we can be all cozy. Ins wont pay for it by ANY means and out of your pocket.. hold on.. let me catch my breath from laughter... I mayu hyperventilate if we start talking about getting a Dr to actually do the studies without worrying about his liabilities. Oh an by the way, my kid is 1/2 NDN and my cousins are rez babies.. who cares about us and our genetic issues.

reply to post by tothetenthpower


Sorry, I did not mean to imply improper discipline. I have been through the same with my oldest daughter. There is an age... where the testing of authority resides.

The average child will respond in finally knowing that the adult is in charge.

The ODD child will not, and fight back even harder, getting "even", and "not giving in". And not just with parents, but with the school, and the police, and everyone else, I have found out.

I have an eternal ODD to psychiatry and the way they function.
They know more than they let on and practise that which they tell you does not exist=fact!

ODD baby, my way!

Thank God for ODD or we really would all be drones!
question question question and for goodness sake do not always take NO for an answer!
Find your own.

I embrace my ODD

Oh an by the way, my kid is 1/2 NDN and my cousins are rez babies.. who cares about us and our genetic issues.

reply to post by Advantage


Sorry, but what is NDN and rez? Not being sarcastic, just brainless tonite?

You know, personally speaking here, I don't deny the 'symptoms' of ODD as people are describing them. For some who couple this with other conditions from Birth, I'd ask if misdiagnosis or a lazy truck-loading was done to just cover everything and move on from the diagnostic phase.

Outside of those unusual cases though, it isn't the symptoms I think anyone argues here. Things done to get attention...defiance to authority...active resistance to conformity....self feeding illusions (Like God, to ahem..some ways of thinking..)

It may include outbursts and violent behavior too?

Okay, I don't have a PhD in anything but I recall these kids simply being called troublemakers when I was in school. I mean, we were a simple minded lot back in the 70's I guess... All these illnesses and who knew? How many MORE illnesses will the Pysch Profession in 20 years have discovered we've actually been suffering a long time?

Look, some kids are honest to God ill. No question...but I know I'm not alone in saying enough and ENOUGH with every single variance from straight conformity being stopped, analyzed and poked until a name and a drug can be assigned.

In a world like this, Einstein would have been so doped he wouldn't have been CAPABLE of choosing more than one set of clothes to wear the same every day. It wouldn't have been hyper-intelligence with that weird smart-logic they have. Artists like Picasso would likely still have painted....but what does that look like on 60mg of this and 10mg of that with counseling appointments x times a month? Let's not even go with some CRAZY moron like Galileo suggesting delusions like spherical planets. Now there was a total candidate for medication in his day.

reply to post by tothetenthpower


Yep.

I don't have to spank my children, but If they need it, I would. My oldest, 14, I have never had to raise my hand, to her behind. Why? Because she understands what respect is. Each child is different, and individual of one another. I commend you, for thinking outside the box.

reply to post by tinker9917


Native American.

Living on Reservation.

Second thought, bad post


EDIT



Try again:

Alcoholism gene in my family. It's apparent.

Alcoholism gene in Native American genes (?) (asking, just from what I've read, not accusing)

If so, maybe a connection with what immunizations do with this same gene? Just grasping, looking for answers right now...or heavy metal poisoning?


My 2 youngest children are part native american. so please don't think of this as an attack

Simply my take, mind you......but perhaps one in a hundred diagnoses will be correct but the other 99 will be just kids getting power tripped on by some asshole

Hey I think I have that! Does this mean I can get a disability check now?

reply to post by Awen24


A swift hand to the behind can and does work wonders

reply to post by tothetenthpower


In the old days these types of people were classified as "Gluttons For Punishment"