Born again... and again?

reply to post by Deetermined


Thank you! That was a coherent and intelligible answer....
thank you, Dee. (Not saying I agree, just, "thanks for stating it clearly from your point of view")....

Brightest blessings.

I have to go sleep now.......
g'nite.

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
reply to post by Deetermined

 

Jesus said you must be as little children to get into heaven, Paul responds with a big **** you by saying he threw childish things away. Do you take the word of Paul over Jesus'?

My point was: What is your point? You said that Paul never said that salvation was free which I debunked, so your "point" is not valid. Seems like you're arguing with yourself here.

Here's what I said in my previous post...

"Not true. Paul never told anyone that the "free gift" of salvation was a free pass devoid of any behavioral requirement. He gave them plenty of instruction on keeping God's commandments."

Here's what I said about Paul grew up and put away childish things...

"Not true. Paul used the following verse after 1 Corinthians 13:11 to confirm what Jesus taught.

1 Corinthians 13:11-12

11 When I was a child, I spoke and thought and reasoned as a child. But when I grew up, I put away childish things.

12 Now we see things imperfectly, like puzzling reflections in a mirror, but then we will see everything with perfect clarity. All that I know now is partial and incomplete, but then I will know everything completely, just as God now knows me completely.

He says that everything he knows as "a man" is partial and incomplete, when he used the words "all that I know now". He's basically stating that having God and the Holy Spirit is the only thing that allows him to see things completely for what they really are.

reply to post by wildtimes


Thank you, too.

I have to turn in as well.

I guess we'll have to wait until tomorrow to read Jhill's take on the creation of souls.

Looking forward to it, Jhill!

reply to post by Deetermined


So Paul does say it's free but it's really not? I'm confused at your answer here. Paul clearly says that it is a free gift. Your whole point was that Paul never said it was free, but he did and now you are backtracking.

He said that his knowledge was partial and incomplete and that he didn't see clearly at that moment, as he was writing the letter. Wasn't the whole reason he wrote those letters because he got the holy spirit?

If he had the holy spirit (which helps you see) then why did he say he didn't see clearly at a time after getting it?

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
reply to post by Deetermined

 

So Paul does say it's free but it's really not? I'm confused at your answer here. Paul clearly says that it is a free gift. Your whole point was that Paul never said it was free, but he did and now you are backtracking.

It's considered a "free gift" because people aren't judged any more solely by their works, keeping up with Mosaic laws or animal sacrifices as atonement for sins. Now all one has to do is ask for it. Once you ask for the Holy Spirit to enter your life (with all of the sincerity of your heart), the Holy Spirit will automatically lead you to want to continue in keeping up works, having faith, and being repentant of sins. This is where the "free gift" comes in. I don't know how to explain it more than that.

He said that his knowledge was partial and incomplete and that he didn't see clearly at that moment, as he was writing the letter. Wasn't the whole reason he wrote those letters because he got the holy spirit?

If he had the holy spirit (which helps you see) then why did he say he didn't see clearly at a time after getting it?

He said when he became a "man" he didn't see clearly, and he didn't. He used to persecute Christians. It was only after he received the Holy Spirit that he was able to see clearly and return to a childlike state. Let's face it, no matter how much we want to look at something through a child's eyes, it's almost impossible as an adult due to our adult experiences. If we were able to look at everything through a child's eyes, and hear it through a child's ears, we wouldn't question what we read or the people around us.

Edit to add: Receiving the Holy Spirit doesn't make one perfect for the rest of their life. Our free will still allows us the make poor choices if we choose to override the Holy Spirit. When we choose to do this, we end up facing the consequences, but the Holy Spirit always convicts us to do better and to repent for those sins. Sometimes, it's not always immediate. Sometimes our stubbornness and selfishness can keep us in our sins, but God usually pulls a doozy to bring us back. This is why I say that history has a tendency to repeat itself too.. If you ever notice that you're faced with the same agonizing challenge time after time, it's usually because you keep making the wrong choice in overcoming that one particular challenge.

reply to post by jhill76

No, I never stated this. Once you are in that suspended state, their is no decision making, you must wait until judgement.

What happens at the time of judgement?

Originally posted by Deetermined
reply to post by jhill76

 

No, I never stated this. Once you are in that suspended state, their is no decision making, you must wait until judgement.

What happens at the time of judgement?

Your book is opened, and you are given a detailed account of what you did. Remember that old lady that asked you for a dollar, you are shown the next events that transpired, and how she died of starvation. That's just an example. Then what happens after that, I can not speak on, as judgement is left to Brother.

reply to post by jhill76


Any update on the creation of souls?

In the beginning there was nothing, there is still nothing. However, the word you use now and believe is the judgement that makes you believe there is something.
Nothing becomes a thing just by naming it.

That name is now believed - a thing is born out of nothing. From that one word a story gets written and the story is believed, a world is born.

There is no 'world'. There are just words appearing presently that decieve you into believing all sorts of things.

reply to post by jhill76


The time of judgement is now.
You are the judge. You believe the word you hear.

reply to post by Itisnowagain

There are just words appearing presently that decieve you into believing all sorts of things.

Including your words, so why should we believe any of them?

Sorry, but giving "nothing" a name doesn't make it something.

Your words are empty and hollow to me.

Why do you constantly speak of NOTHING? Why is NOTHING so important to you?

Originally posted by Deetermined
reply to post by Itisnowagain

 

There are just words appearing presently that decieve you into believing all sorts of things.

Including your words, so why should we believe any of them?

Sorry, but giving "nothing" a name doesn't make it something.

Your words are empty and hollow to me.

Why do you constantly speak of NOTHING? Why is NOTHING so important to you?

The conflict in life is 'things' against 'things'. You think you are a thing having to interact with things.
When you discover that you are not a thing, that you are in fact nothing - there can be no conflict.
The finding of nothing is resting in peace. Until the nothingness is known there will always be trouble (conflict).

reply to post by Deetermined


This life is hard for humans, they are looking for peace. God is what some humans look for, believing it will give them the peace they so desparately crave.
God is the nothingness. God is the non conceptual state.

Originally posted by Deetermined
reply to post by Itisnowagain

 

There are just words appearing presently that decieve you into believing all sorts of things.

Including your words, so why should we believe any of them?

Sorry, but giving "nothing" a name doesn't make it something.

Your words are empty and hollow to me.

Why do you constantly speak of NOTHING? Why is NOTHING so important to you?

From this post i know you do not know peace.

reply to post by Itisnowagain

From this post i know you do not know peace.

You know NOTHING, remember?

reply to post by Deetermined


I know peace of nothingness.

The man Jesus was conceived not of man but of God. Concieved. Conception, conceptulizing, wording.
This creation is non conceptual.

Man gives words (concepts) to the pure creation of God. The words decieve - the words are the mark of the beast. The words impress upon Gods creation (which is pure and wordless) and turn what you see into a lie. This is the judgement.

He who has ears -hear. He who has eyes - see.

God is the nothingness. The nothingness is primary - in the beginning was nothing. Out of this nothingness everything appears.
The thingness is the word. In the beginning was the word and the word was with God. The word appears in nothingness.

God is nothing, God is the background to all arising things.
The things are Satan, words, things appear and disappear.
But God (the nothingness) never disappears because without nothing things would have nowhere to appear.

The nothing is the know thing, It is what knows. Gnosis. Awareness.
Without an awareness of presently appearing existence, could any thing be said to exist?

Lift a rock and 'I' (awareness) am there.

The free gift of salvation is 'the present'.
This right here and right now will save you from all the madness that comes from believing words, save you from concepts and ideas that are not true.

This here and now prior to any label will bring you home to the father. This moment is Christ which is the way, the truth and the life. It is right here but the seeker in you seeks elsewhere.
There is no elsewhere. God said have no 'other' gods because God is this 'The Presence'. The gift is present but you look elsewhere.
There is no elsewhere. This is it. You will never know anything outside of now (presence) but thinking, wording deludes.
The belief that the answer is somewhere else is what divides you, splits you in two, you feel fragmented.
When the two become one the kingdom shall be revealed.

reply to post by Itisnowagain

Lift a rock and 'I' (awareness) am there.

Lord, I ask that you please release Itisnowagain from under that rock from which he/she has been living. Amen.