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Your right to resell your own stuff is in peril .. Kirtsaeng v. John Wiley & Sons

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posted on Oct, 8 2012 @ 12:38 AM
this is an argument, in reality, over whether or not you own something you
buy or not, now the copyright BS always bugged me anyway but this
is taking it to the next level, complete insanity, also realistically
its just not enforceable.

they really do actually want to maintain ownership of things these days
don't they? where does that end i wonder?
no more car ownership, only lease, no more tv that's yours to do with
as you please, im tired of things like this, if you sell it to me i believe
you lose all rights to say what i can and cant do with it as its
no longer yours, if they wanna keep it then well they can but
i sure as H E double hockey sticks will not buy.

i will let my money do the talking here and avoid any company that
participates in this like the plague, time to do some consumer research.
i already have a few blacklisted products because those companies
believed they could dictate what we can and can not do with our purchases.

posted on Oct, 8 2012 @ 12:59 AM
There is a kind of circularity about this situation. We are frequently told that "free" trade is the strategy that we in the industrialized west should be following. We are told that "protectionism" in the form of trade tariffs imposed to protect local industries is bad. We get capitalists telling us that they don't feel obligated to support the North American worker's absurd salary and benefit demands. We are told that it is in all of our interests for business to seek labor at the cheapest rate. We are told that it is OK for business to export labor overseas and to put our workers out of work, in the name of profit.

Isn't this latest development in the courts just another example of the double standard of free trade.

There is no "free trade" in labor. I can't go to Europe to work or to the United States, "freely" to get a job.

And now it appears, if this passes, that I won't be able to go overseas to obtain a product at a better rate than I can get it in America, or import it into the US for resale at a better rate than the company that originally exported the manufacturing jobs that made the product overseas and put my friends out of work.

Let's have truly free trade or let's have tariff protection for our industries and social/economic norms. We don't want free trade hypocrisy, capitalist corporate welfare bums and the snakes and ladders loophole games that are currently played in the economic sphere.

I know economic issues are complicated and probably beyond my competence to get lathered up about, but the optics of this measure are not good.
edit on 8-10-2012 by ipsedixit because: (no reason given)

posted on Oct, 8 2012 @ 01:16 AM
Most people buy used because they cannot afford new. A little common sense goes a long way.

I honestly believe that it would hurt sales because people do not have the luxury to buy everything new. It would piss me off enough to where I wouldn't buy anything from those greedy bastards.

I already quit smoking and turned off my cable and internet.

What's next make my own clothes and soap.

Screw big business.

posted on Oct, 8 2012 @ 01:43 AM
The next step in depriving you of making money off of stuff you own. Like at flea markets and yard sales. You buy something at retail, pay taxes on it and it just sits in your garage until you decide to sell it. The return you get from that is a few pennies on the dollar. But overall across the country all these little sales deprive the corporations of millions. Thats the ultimate goal. Shutting down all private sales.

That way when you are done with something you have to throw it away and it never winds up in the hands of anyone else who may get use of it. If they want one of those they have to buy it new from WalMart (and pay tax).

posted on Oct, 8 2012 @ 01:49 AM
Seems a lot like I did something to someone I don't even know and will never even know what it was I did.
But what ever it was I did, to whom ever it is I don't know ? I must have done it up real nice, cause it's 100% obvious that it p st them the hell off to no end save my own. Somebody somewhere wants me dead for some reason.

I do get that much.

SnfFOP !
edit on 8-10-2012 by randyvs because: (no reason given)

posted on Oct, 8 2012 @ 01:50 AM
reply to post by intrptr

Like a drug deal.

Hey man, do ,you have some DVD,s. No not crack man, something g to watch. Come to think if it man,do you have a DVD player to go with it? Come on man, I need the whole package.

The whole idea is absurd and it will never be truly enforced. Hell even cops buy some things used.

What a serious waste of the courts time.

We are truly hitting the bottom.

posted on Oct, 8 2012 @ 01:58 AM
This is being posted everywhere and is incredibly sensationalist and misleading.

First, it's dealing with copyright law, so only things that are copyrighted are affected. This is a very small subset of consumer goods. What is copyrighted? Most simply, original creative works written down or recorded. Books, movies, music, media in general.

Secondly, it deals only with a small subset of copyrighted goods. It deals only with goods which are first sold abroad whose copyright holder is based in the USA.

This is a decision that will have almost no effect on the average person, regardless of how it turns out.

posted on Oct, 8 2012 @ 02:13 AM
reply to post by RottenBeauty

That sounds all well and good, but we all know it is flat out wrong.

Once legal president has been set, then it is fair game for all, also copyrighted materials entail a lot of things, we all obviously have, as we are on computers right now.

This will effect, cds, movies, books, video games, computer software, television shows, sporting events...etc

If I buy a world cup video I can sell it if I want ( or maybe not now), if I buy a video game I can sell it if I want ( purhaps not), if I buy a book I can sell it if I want ( well I used to be able to), if I buy a computer I can sell it if I want( well not for much longer it seems, since it runs on software that is copyrighted) get the point.

This is the first time the law has been "interpreted" this way, the supremes will do as their corporate masters tell them, and all hell will break loose.

Yet all these corps. Can sell my personal information at will, and pay me a dime for it? I guess that is because they own me also, making all my info their copyrighted property also.

posted on Oct, 8 2012 @ 02:19 AM
reply to post by liejunkie01

The whole idea is absurd and it will never be truly enforced. Hell even cops buy some things used.

I hear you. I do have a bunch of experience selling stuff at flea markets. Where I live if you sell at more than two a year you need a resellers permit. Thats okay, but adds up in paperwork and "mistakes" totaling what you sell that you must pay tax on.

Then the items you can sell are restricted. There is the entrance fee. The gas to get there. The items that are stolen from under your nose. Accidents. People jipping you by paying a dollar for something that was worth a lot more. People opening things new in the wrap because??? Little kids stepping on stuff or playing with it while their parents watch. Getting rained out. Simultaneous events like fairs and festivals that draw buyers away. Flat tires from the junk scattered on the ground. Food and drink. Off pay day weekends. Competition. Picking the wrong items to bring / wrong load.

Only occasionally does it all come together and you make a few hundred by noon on a Sunday. You still got to pick up all that stuff you didn't sell and pack it back to the storage bin and pay rent on it until you can get to another market. Lot of work. And the government wants a piece of that too?

There are a ton of things that are illegal to sell. The cops that walk the place all day (in uniform and undercover) know every one. People get popped all the time. If you don't have a permit you can't get in. If you sell some DVD's that are fleshy they will bust you or at least confiscate them and make you leave.

posted on Oct, 8 2012 @ 02:39 AM
Look on the bright side; if the Supreme Court upholds this case jobs will have to return to the US.

That’s being challenged now for products that are made abroad, and if the Supreme Court upholds an appellate court ruling, it would mean that the copyright holders of anything you own that has been made in China, Japan or Europe, for example, would have to give you permission to sell it.

posted on Oct, 8 2012 @ 02:47 AM
It will never happen. If you can't figure out why you're already in trouble, never mind the rumour.

posted on Oct, 8 2012 @ 03:32 AM
If you're buying new iPhones and DVD's, clearly you don't really have any problems.

Just another reason to throw you into prison one day.


posted on Oct, 8 2012 @ 03:42 AM
reply to post by liejunkie01

I was going to post basically the same thing. It seems that this will only serve to stunt economic and technological growth.

If I have an Iphone 5 and Iphone 6 comes out, I'm not going to buy it if I can't sell my old Iphone. Why pay for 2 devices for the luxury of having a couple of extra features?

That being the case, why should Apple invest in the next generation of devices unless it's a quantum leap over the existing device, making the development costs to Apple exponentially higher? I just can't see how this will do anything but hurt them in the long run.

They better think hard before supporting something like this.
edit on 10/8/2012 by AntiNWO because: (no reason given)

posted on Oct, 8 2012 @ 03:56 AM
I am an Ebay Powerseller and Amazon Seller...

I deal in antiques, antiquarian books, vintage goods, vintage & antique prints, retail items for resale on EBAY.

I deal in used books, DVD's, CD's. software on AMAZON..

If this decision gets any traction people like me will be sunk. Years of hard work and following strict regulations has made online seller like me already stressed out. We jump through so many hoops, especially here in California. It's as if the Federal Government HATES us and WANTS us to fail.

At every corner there is a court case similar to this but this would be the most extreme case we've ever seen and it will touch almost every facet of our already weak economy.

We cannot let the Supremes decide in favor of Wiley & Sons. Wiley & Sons has decided to take a "scorched Earth" policy on this issue and might ending cracking the entire economy to get revenge on ONE EBAY SELLER and will end up punishing all of us.

We must all fight this very extreme use of copyright law.

edit on 8-10-2012 by PaxVeritas because: (no reason given)

posted on Oct, 8 2012 @ 04:28 AM
reply to post by MidnightTide

Do people really realise what they will miss when cashless becomes the norm, probably not. no mor cash in hand building jobs, no more off the grid 'illegal' parties, no more party prescriptions, or consummable garden products ahem. Not good

posted on Oct, 8 2012 @ 04:47 AM
People need to look at this story calmly, for a moment.
Firstly, it is not an attempt to "pass a new law", but someeone's attempt to get a new court ruling on existing law.
Secondly, as far as I can see, this is civil law, not criminal law. If this case sets a precedent, what it does is give somebody the chance to sue you. That isn't going to happen with your family antiques, because the makers of your family antiques are not in a position to sue.

posted on Oct, 8 2012 @ 05:04 AM
I hope they keep pushing us Americans. Maybe someday we'll actually be smart enough to do something about it.

You know what's funny about all of this? WHO brought the business over-seas? US! WE let them make our products overseas because it's cheaper. So it's almost as if we were setting up for this bill. Because now over 1/2 of our products are made in China and now we'll have to ASK them if I could sell it.

We put the business over there and now we make a rule where anything actually put over there needs to be cleared for sale first.


Just one more liberty we won't have by time I'm dead and gone.

posted on Oct, 8 2012 @ 05:25 AM
They will have to shout down Ebay and all on line shops.
shut all librarys too. film hire shops.

we would just have to start a barter or some kind of cash system to sell to each other.

Oh! they are stopping That Now!!!
They Dont let you sell Milk or foods in US...

posted on Oct, 8 2012 @ 05:27 AM
Won’t happen. If it did, it won’t be obeyed; "If a law is unjust, a man is not only right to disobey it, he is obligated to do so” - Thomas Jefferson. Aren’t you purchasing the rights to a particular product when you buy it? This is like me building you a house than saying; “You can’t sell this house without my permission because I built it and I own the rights to it, even though you’ve paid for it”. Illogical.

posted on Oct, 8 2012 @ 06:19 AM
in canada they tried to pass a bill --- i don't know if they did or not,
that says if your selling anything second hand,you have to have the original owners manual for that product.
if its old furniture,you have to prove the materials used in its construction were obtained legally!
so if you have a garage sale and your trying to sell an 'almost new' childs carseat,you have to have
the paperwork on installation,and safe use.
if you have an antique cabinet to sell,you have to have proof that it wasnt made with rare endangered wood!
god forbid you have an ivory pipe for sale or your in big trouble!!!!
again,i don't know if this bill got passed or not,but i think it would be really hard to enforce.

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