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Some advice?

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posted on Oct, 4 2012 @ 03:10 PM
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I really dont even know how to broach this subject so Ill just start with this..
My son has a friend, hes over here pretty much everyday and night, (playing wow all night) hes a good kid and very smart., has a job and is going to college etc...
My daughter also has a friend that is over here every night (till 8 or 9 the weekdays) and stays here all night on weekends.
I really like both of them, I treat my daughters friend like my own daughter.
She is a beautiful girl, blond hair and blue eyes and very sweet, I love her to death.
Ok so, here is the problem... I just found out that my sons friend and my daughters friend are having "relations" and she apparently lost her virginity to him last Thursday.
Now comes my dilemma, he is 18 and she is 15. Its only a 3 year difference and Texas law is somewhat vague on the matter.
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The age of consent in Texas is 17 (Texas Penal Code Section 21.11 ). However, "...It is an affirmative defense to prosecution under this section that the actor...was not more than three years older than the victim and of the opposite sex...(and) did not use duress, force, or a threat against the victim at the time of the offence" and is not a registered sex offender Section 21.11 (b) , Section 22.011 (e) .

As I said, I think of her as a daughter, so I am kind of protective about her but at the same time, he is a very responsible and good kid and I figured, if shes with him, at least I know he will treat her well, as apposed to someone that I dont know that may hurt her.
I talked to my son about it and he claims that he knew that they were together but said that he didnt know that they were having sex.
I've always tried to make sure that when I go to bed, that they go to their respective rooms but I cannot control what happens when Im asleep.
From what I have heard though, this happened somewhere else and not under my roof.
I am not sure If I should bring it up to the kid or just let my son let him know that I know whats up.
The law that I quoted above is really kind of vague but I do know that it goes by birthdays, to the day.
As I said, I like both of these kids and my son has assured me that nothing happens between them while they are here.
Should I let them continue coming over here?




posted on Oct, 4 2012 @ 03:13 PM
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reply to post by Juggernog
 


Do something to STOP the behavior, or possibly become the accomplice if you continue to allow it to take place in your home!!!!

Nothing to be a nice guy about my friend!
edit on 4-10-2012 by seeker1963 because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 4 2012 @ 03:18 PM
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Tell them the situation from an adults perspective, they'll appreciate that.

Just let them no that nothing is to occur under your roof.



posted on Oct, 4 2012 @ 03:20 PM
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reply to post by Juggernog
 


One of the time.. not both at the same time. By letting them both at the same time you allow things to happen



posted on Oct, 4 2012 @ 03:20 PM
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Now that you know, if you allow it to continue under your roof you can be an accessory after the fact to statutory rape.

That being said, I would suggest going to the two kids involved sitting them down and talking to them like adults, they are doing an adult thing, so might as well try that first.

Also get the girls parents involved if possible, there is a chance a level headed adult response might actually work out for everyone involved.



posted on Oct, 4 2012 @ 03:22 PM
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Hand your daughter and son a pack of condoms to pass along to them and to tell them NOT IN YOUR HOUSE!
Really 15 and 18, not a big deal.....Okay flame away folks if you want, but when I was 16 my parents let my boyfriend who was 19 move in with us.....Girls are much more mature anyway........good luck



posted on Oct, 4 2012 @ 03:23 PM
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reply to post by Sinny
 


Yea but do I talk to them both about it or just the male? I really dont have a problem with the age difference but Ill need to get their birthdays to make sure that its within the law but no they will not sleep together in this household.



posted on Oct, 4 2012 @ 03:39 PM
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reply to post by Juggernog
 


Talk to the male first hes an adult.

Than depending on his response consider going to the girls parents, with him if need be.



posted on Oct, 4 2012 @ 03:43 PM
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reply to post by Juggernog
 


Now that you've posted on a PUBLIC forum you MUST do something!
I'd suggest check out the girls parents, if they are level headed and wont freak and start demanding the boy be castrated then go see them. Else ONLY ONE AT A TIME UNDER YOUR ROOF.

Remember, your on a public forum, and they KNOW your IP and therefore your home adress



posted on Oct, 4 2012 @ 03:46 PM
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Originally posted by Juggernog
I really dont even know how to broach this subject so Ill just start with this..
My son has a friend, hes over here pretty much everyday and night, (playing wow all night) hes a good kid and very smart., has a job and is going to college etc...
My daughter also has a friend that is over here every night (till 8 or 9 the weekdays) and stays here all night on weekends.
I really like both of them, I treat my daughters friend like my own daughter.
She is a beautiful girl, blond hair and blue eyes and very sweet, I love her to death.
Ok so, here is the problem... I just found out that my sons friend and my daughters friend are having "relations" and she apparently lost her virginity to him last Thursday.
Now comes my dilemma, he is 18 and she is 15. Its only a 3 year difference and Texas law is somewhat vague on the matter.
link

The age of consent in Texas is 17 (Texas Penal Code Section 21.11 ). However, "...It is an affirmative defense to prosecution under this section that the actor...was not more than three years older than the victim and of the opposite sex...(and) did not use duress, force, or a threat against the victim at the time of the offence" and is not a registered sex offender Section 21.11 (b) , Section 22.011 (e) .

As I said, I think of her as a daughter, so I am kind of protective about her but at the same time, he is a very responsible and good kid and I figured, if shes with him, at least I know he will treat her well, as apposed to someone that I dont know that may hurt her.
I talked to my son about it and he claims that he knew that they were together but said that he didnt know that they were having sex.
I've always tried to make sure that when I go to bed, that they go to their respective rooms but I cannot control what happens when Im asleep.
From what I have heard though, this happened somewhere else and not under my roof.
I am not sure If I should bring it up to the kid or just let my son let him know that I know whats up.
The law that I quoted above is really kind of vague but I do know that it goes by birthdays, to the day.
As I said, I like both of these kids and my son has assured me that nothing happens between them while they are here.
Should I let them continue coming over here?


Here's my opinion, such as it is. According to the quote you posted the very first line gives you your answer. In your State the legal age of consent is 17. The rest, in this case, is inconsequential. As I see what you quoted at 17 their partner can not be more than 3 years older. She is 15. She is not of the age of consent and therefore can not legally give it. Therefore this is a case of statutory rape.

As for what do you do? Switch places with her parents, wouldn't you want to know what your daughter is doing sexually at her age? Being a Father of 2 Girls and a Boy, I know I do. I think you should have already been on the phone with her parents, if not face to face. First this shows them that you do indeed care and second it releases you of legal responsibility if they find out you knew from someone else. Let them decide what the next move is and for sure abide by their decision. In some states, under separate statutes, parental consent can be given to younger people than the legal age of consent of the child.(edit to add: I just looked it up and Texas has no parental consent laws. They consider it as, the parent does not have the right to consent to breaking the law)

I realize you are close to these two but right is right and wrong is wrong. Do you not punish your children if they do something wrong? It is a case of hard love here. It is not a matter of emotion, it is a matter of law and legal responsibility. Communication is key here, so do just that, but be sure to include her parents. He is of legal age so his parents are a non issue. It may hurt you childrens feelings and that would be unfortunate, but they will eventually understand that you were protecting them and your daughters friend. It may mean that they can not be at your home together especially over night so time may have to be arranged but this will have to come based on what her parents have to say.

This is my opinion such as it is.

Agarta

Edit to add: After reading your post below this one switch parents to guardian in regards to her.
edit on 4-10-2012 by Agarta because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 4 2012 @ 03:46 PM
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reply to post by benrl
 


Ive considered the going to the guardian route but, since it seems to be legal (according to Texas law) I dont want to get the girl in trouble.
btw, her moms in prison and her dad is in the Philippines, she lives with her alcoholic aunt, shes been through a lot but still seems very mature and well balanced.
edit on 4-10-2012 by Juggernog because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 4 2012 @ 03:49 PM
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There is a reason they both like staying over at your home so much of the time. One being, they can do things there, they'd never get away with in their own homes. Sweet or not, they need to not be together at your home. Remember being a teen? Once a bridge is crossed, it's very difficult to uncross it.

I would talk to both of them, separately, as the adult, and home owner. What if the girl gets pregnant. It's not your job to play planned parenthood for these kids. It is your job to set boundaries in your home. Good Luck!

Des




edit on 4-10-2012 by Destinyone because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 4 2012 @ 03:54 PM
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To be honest?

I'd rather have my kids having sex under my own roof where I know it's safe than anywhere else. As for the age of consent?

I certainly would not put up with being liable for statutory rape charges though.

I wish they'd stop treating teenagers like criminals for having sex. Anyway, I have an unpopular opinion, so I'll keep it to myself.

In any case, I agree with talking to them like adults and explaining that you are liable for their actions. Even if they stay together, all she needs to do is tell her parents, or get upset and file a complaint. She'll ruin his life and yours in one fell swoop.

~Tenth



posted on Oct, 4 2012 @ 04:00 PM
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The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.

reply to post by Juggernog
 

I'm a layman in terms of law. Whatever I say from here on is just general observations.

I feel that this is a tricky one in some ways, because the guy is 18 and legally an adult, so in spite of the "less than three years" wording there could be an issue because of the "did not use duress, force, or a threat against the victim at the time of the offence" section.

What I'm saying is that even though they might have a happy relationship now, what's to say might happen in the future -- either soon or perhaps much later? If the girl ever decides to claim that she was placed under duress, forced or threatened then the guy is going to have a huge problem to defend himself. If there are charges then he's an adult and will be dealt with as one.

I'm not saying she would ever make such a claim, but she might under some circumstances. We all know that such things happen. And in any case, does he want that kind of risk hanging over his head?

Also, the fact that they are using your home as a meeting place could possibly have implications for you if anything goes sour later. Again, it's not my field but it makes plain sense that some degree of culpability might be looked at.

Finally, and as you mentioned yourself, that "less than three years" wording is probably to be taken quite literally. If he's even three years and one day older than she is, then he cannot use that defense and could be charged, even if she is quite happy with him and wouldn't want such a thing to happen. This could also have implications for her own future, since she is a minor and some kind of family services agencies could get involved to see if her own parent/s are fit to provide for her care.

So the very first thing you need to do is find out exactly how old they both are. That then helps to determine what you decide to do about it.

EDIT: just saw your post about her parents and how she is under the guardianship of an aunt. This makes things even more of a mess I think.

I can only suggest you tread very warily indeed.

Mike

As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.



edit on 4/10/12 by JustMike because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 4 2012 @ 04:02 PM
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Originally posted by Juggernog
reply to post by benrl
 


Ive considered the going to the guardian route but, since it seems to be legal (according to Texas law) I dont want to get the girl in trouble.
btw, her moms in prison and her dad is in the Philippines, she lives with her alcoholic aunt, shes been through a lot but still seems very mature and well balanced.
edit on 4-10-2012 by Juggernog because: (no reason given)


Than go to the boy, he is an adult, make sure he act responsibly in the matter.



posted on Oct, 4 2012 @ 04:10 PM
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Originally posted by Juggernog
reply to post by benrl
 


Ive considered the going to the guardian route but, since it seems to be legal (according to Texas law) I dont want to get the girl in trouble.
btw, her moms in prison and her dad is in the Philippines, she lives with her alcoholic aunt, shes been through a lot but still seems very mature and well balanced.
edit on 4-10-2012 by Juggernog because: (no reason given)


The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.

I feel the need to say that it's not the girl who'll be in trouble -- unless she gets pregnant or picks up an std. From what I've gleaned on the legal side, she'd be considered the victim and it's the boy (young man) and anyone who aided and abetted him or who had knowledge of the case but took no action, that could be in trouble. However that is not a legal opinion, just an observation.

I'll give you an example. Last week a British schoolteacher ran off to France with his pupil. She's 15, he's 30. There was a Europe-wide arrest warrant out for him for child abduction, as she was taken away without her parents' consent. He was found in France and arrested and extradition proceedings taken to return him to England to faces charges that could see him locked away for a very long stretch. The girl was returned to her family and is being treated as the innocent victim.

Not the same thing as the case you're pondering but a telling reminder of how things are often seen by the law.

Mike

As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.



posted on Oct, 4 2012 @ 04:17 PM
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I'm going to go the unpopular route and tell you to stay out of it.Your only responsibility is to make sure it doesn't happen in your home.Like someone else suggested,don't let them both stay there all night,at the same time.We were all teenagers once,so we all know what we did when mom and dad were in bed.Personally,if it were me,I'd sit the male down and explain to him that he is breaking the law.If he is as a good a kid as you say,maybe explaining to him that it could ruin his future it may get through to him to wait till she's of legal age..Let's be real here,15 year old girls can and will be spiteful if they get hurt when it comes to boys.I don't think 3 years is a big deal at all.But if they are breaking the law its not worth it for this kid to lose his future.Good luck with whatever way you choose to go with this



ETA: Just a quick personal story.I was in a similar situation when I was 19,she was 16.Her father nicely approached me and asked me to please wait until she was 18 because he didn't think she was ready for a real relationship.Emotionally wise,not sexually.We weren't having sex at that point.He stated if I could do that for him then he would fully support us being together.I respected his wishes and we did get together when she was 18.We were together 5 years.So my point is maybe just talking to the kid will work.It's worth a try.
edit on 4-10-2012 by nightstalker78 because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 4 2012 @ 04:35 PM
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reply to post by benrl
 





Now that you know, if you allow it to continue under your roof you can be an accessory after the fact to statutory rape


I am aware of these laws but if you would please look at my OP and read the external post I made, then you would see how the law in Texas is pretty vague.
I personally dont have a problem, with their age. If she was 13 or so, then yea but she is 15, very mature and very "grown up"
When I was in HS, it was nothing for seniors to date freshmen and nobody said a thing about it.
Now days, people always seem to scream "pedophile" even if the kids are 2 years apart, (18-16)



posted on Oct, 4 2012 @ 04:40 PM
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reply to post by nightstalker78
 


Night, I believe your advice is probably the best here. However, I couldnt just stay out of it, I had to get my son involved, since its his friend.
I did tell him to guarantee that it doesnt happen here.
I laid out some restrictions and let him know that if they were violated, then neither would ever be allowed here again.
Thats pretty harsh to because I really love both of these kids.


I'm going to go the unpopular route and tell you to stay out of it.Your only responsibility is to make sure it doesn't happen in your home.Like someone else suggested,don't let them both stay there all night,at the same time.We were all teenagers once,so we all know what we did when mom and dad were in bed.Personally,if it were me,I'd sit the male down and explain to him that he is breaking the law.If he is as a good a kid as you say,maybe explaining to him that it could ruin his future it may get through to him to wait till she's of legal age..Let's be real here,15 year old girls can and will be spiteful if they get hurt when it comes to boys.I don't think 3 years is a big deal at all.But if they are breaking the law its not worth it for this kid to lose his future.Good luck with whatever way you choose to go with this



posted on Oct, 4 2012 @ 05:30 PM
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I don't think a 15 year old girl is completely capable of consenting. She doesn't know emotionally what could happen to her and she may not be capable of saying no because of pressures, subtle or not. I think what he is doing is wrong. I think you should talk to him and explain to him her vulnerablity and ask him to leave her alone. Or better, get your husband to do it. I understand they're not doing it under your roof, but you should do something because you're the girl's adult friend and you know she's in trouble.



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