It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Obama Defends 'Death Panels' During Debate ?

page: 1
8

log in

join
share:

posted on Oct, 4 2012 @ 11:39 AM
link   
Obama Defends 'Death Panels' During Debate

Obama defended his Independent Payment Advisory Board (IPAB).

Those are the people who many see as the "Death Panel".

Maybe so maybe not.

What I wonder about is WHO is advising the Panel ??
Lobbyists ? ..
NWO people ? ..
U.N. Agenda 21 influences ? ..
Marxists ? ..
Corporatists ? ..


During Tuesday’s presidential debate, Mitt Romney said the Independent Payment Advisory Board (IPAB), also known as a “death panel,” was one of the reasons he would repeal Obamacare. And President Barack Obama continued to defend his controversial death panels.

“It puts in place an unelected board that's going to tell people, ultimately, what kind of treatments they can have,” Romney said. “I don't like that idea.”

“It — when Governor Romney talks about this board, for example — unelected board that we've created — what this is, is a group of health care experts, doctors, et cetera, to figure out how can we reduce the cost of care in the system overall, “ Obama said.

Obama continued to say death panels would make “the cost of care more effective.”...


I also fear that an "advisory board" could easily become politically influenced and corrupted


edit on Oct-04-2012 by xuenchen because:





posted on Oct, 4 2012 @ 11:42 AM
link   
I don't remember either candidate using the term "death panel" last night.


 
Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com
 



posted on Oct, 4 2012 @ 11:43 AM
link   

Those are the people who many see as the "Death Panel".


Correction, Sara Palin sees them as "Death Panels".

Rising Healthcare costs are an issue, this is a fact.

Who better to come up with ways to reduce healthcare costs than doctors and healthcare professionals?

And please note, that is all they do is come up with ways to reduce costs to the patient, not costs to the insurance or costs to the providers.


It's a shame that Sara Palin's "Death Panels" are still an issue for some people. Makes me ashamed of my country.



posted on Oct, 4 2012 @ 11:44 AM
link   
I'd love to just see one REAL question to throw him or a loop.

OBAMA APPOINTS MONSANTO'S VICE PRESIDENT AS SENIOR ADVISOR TO THE COMMISSIONER AT THE FDA

Like what is your relation to Monsanto and what is your stance of genetic modification of plants and animals for corporate profit, on patenting those modifications and allowing them to destructively compete with non-modified organisms?



posted on Oct, 4 2012 @ 11:52 AM
link   
reply to post by xuenchen
 


This just out the other day.....


Starting today, Medicare will start fining hospitals that have too many patients readmitted within 30 days of discharge because of complications.

The penalties are part of a broader push under President Barack Obama's health care law to improve quality while also trying to save taxpayers money.


SOURCE

Notice how the MSM is spinning this as a good thing for the patient.........................sigh

Why does the hospital usually send the patient home? Because the insurance folks tell them they are done paying, therefore the hospital sends them home!

Why are the hospitals being fined versus the insurance companies?

This kind of insanity is going to cause one big mess in the care people will or WILL NOT get from the hospitals...



posted on Oct, 4 2012 @ 12:01 PM
link   
End of life care is an issue that most people don't want to address.

!00% of the people alive today, will die. I'd like a say in process unless I get killed in an accident.

I don't want to linger in a hospital for months when there is no chance for a recovery.
I don't want to be repeatedly resuscitated just to exist.

However, if my doctor says that I've got 6 months to live, I'd most likely get a second and/or a third opinion.

I will not spend the last 6 months of my life stuck in a hospital just so they can continue to bill my insurance company.

I do want honest opinions by my doctors and I want the information necessary to make informed choices.

I don't think that precious resources should be used to keep me barely alive when others could use those resources and recover and lead a productive life.



posted on Oct, 4 2012 @ 12:05 PM
link   
reply to post by seeker1963
 



Why does the hospital usually send the patient home? Because the insurance folks tell them they are done paying, therefore the hospital sends them home!

Why are the hospitals being fined versus the insurance companies?


First off, this is Medicare, not private insurance.

And no, hospitals don't send them home because of that, you obviously don't work in the healthcare industry. There is one big number hospitals are concerned about (at least in the business offices) and that is throughput. The more throughput, the more money. Hospitals make the most money on patients in the first few days of their visit. Hospitals actually have it calculated to what the desired lenght of stay is for each type of patient based on their problems or diagnosis. So Hospitals will push people who have been there longer to be discharged so they can open the bed for a fresh paying customer (yes, patients are customers).

Plus, Medicare pays lower than most other insurances, so there is an added incentive to get the Medicare patients out of the beds faster.

So yes, the hospitals should be fined because they shouldn't be sending the patient home until they have correctly diagnosed the patients issue and putting them on the correct treatment that will prevent them from having to be re-admitted to the hospital. In short, they should be doing their job correctly instead of having profit drive their decisions.



posted on Oct, 4 2012 @ 12:06 PM
link   
First of all,
Romney brought his "Bait"
last night from his Bait and Switch
after elected plan.

You know as well (or better) as anyone
that there is NO death panel.
You're just trying to repeat the term as much as possible .



posted on Oct, 4 2012 @ 12:06 PM
link   
reply to post by Wildbob77
 



I don't think that precious resources should be used to keep me barely alive when others could use those resources and recover and lead a productive life.


How about if you can't make your own decisions ?

You would trust a politically influenced "Panel" to decide your fate ?

Have you signed your waiver papers ahead of time yet ?

Thanks but no thanks !!

I guess money is the deciding factor after all.



posted on Oct, 4 2012 @ 12:20 PM
link   
reply to post by HostileApostle
 



First off, this is Medicare, not private insurance.

And no, hospitals don't send them home because of that, you obviously don't work in the healthcare industry. There is one big number hospitals are concerned about (at least in the business offices) and that is throughput. The more throughput, the more money. Hospitals make the most money on patients in the first few days of their visit. Hospitals actually have it calculated to what the desired lenght of stay is for each type of patient based on their problems or diagnosis. So Hospitals will push people who have been there longer to be discharged so they can open the bed for a fresh paying customer (yes, patients are customers).


Well done!


You brought up a point that a failed to think about!


Plus, Medicare pays lower than most other insurances, so there is an added incentive to get the Medicare patients out of the beds faster.


Again, correct. However the payments disbursed under the affordable healthcare act is in fact going to drop these payments even lower!!! Who is at fault for that, the hospitals?


So yes, the hospitals should be fined because they shouldn't be sending the patient home until they have correctly diagnosed the patients issue and putting them on the correct treatment that will prevent them from having to be re-admitted to the hospital. In short, they should be doing their job correctly instead of having profit drive their decisions.


Agreed! If in fact that is the case, I see no reason they shouldn't be fined!
But you fail to see the hypocracy in the details!
BAD HOSPITAL!!!! For sending patients home early..............But GOOD GOVERNMENT for having some paid off government officials making life and death decisions?????????
I really hope you don't have some elderly loved ones that are denied life supporting treatments because some government shill decided their life isn't worth spending the money on for saving!!!! Unfortunately you will defend your POTUS up until something like this happens to someone in your life........



posted on Oct, 4 2012 @ 12:38 PM
link   
OP, i didn't listen to the debates (can't stomach Obama's lisp) so i won't say if "death panels" were specifically defended or not.

however, i cannot understand why anyone thinks these "death panels" are a new thing.
insurance companies (all of them) have been operating with/under the advisement of death panels since they were first sold to soldiers in a warzone with hazard death exemptions.

for those who don't know the history of said insurances, perhaps it is you who should do some research.
how ethical was it to sell and collect on insurance that would negate paying out if the insured died via hazardous activities (in a warzone ??????)

do you have any idea how many THOUSANDS of families were duped way back then ??
do you have any idea how many families paid and paid and paid some more, only to be told that their benefits were not available due to the "circumstances" of the death ?

death is the name of the insurance game ... it has NOTHING to do with health, life, care or expense.
successful insurance companies collect until death, then subsequently weasel out of paying benefits on as many cases as possible.
that is the underlying success of insurance companies.



posted on Oct, 4 2012 @ 12:40 PM
link   
reply to post by seeker1963
 



But GOOD GOVERNMENT for having some paid off government officials making life and death decisions


Well again, this is not happening. This is what your local crazy Alaskan Sara Palin said was happening, and it has been debunked by every major news outlet and every fact checker out there.

If you want to hitch your wagon to Palin, be my guest. But I don't participate in that crazy train.

If you still believe this is what that board does, there is literally nothing that wil convince you otherwise. You are in the bubble and have made your decision despite what the facts are telling you.

I have elderly loved ones on Medicare, and they get better treatment than most on private insurance do. Yes, that evil government providing them with excellent care. And to make it worse, the evil government is now looking into ways to keep costs down further for all Americans by asking some of the top experts in healthcare to come up with some ideas on how to bring down costs to the patient. Yes, evil things going on here.

I'm sorry, but I just can't buy into Palin's paranoia and fear mongering. And it's a shame her idiotic rhetoric is still around.



posted on Oct, 4 2012 @ 02:24 PM
link   
reply to post by HostileApostle
 



I have elderly loved ones on Medicare, and they get better treatment than most on private insurance do. Yes, that evil government providing them with excellent care. And to make it worse, the evil government is now looking into ways to keep costs down further for all Americans by asking some of the top experts in healthcare to come up with some ideas on how to bring down costs to the patient. Yes, evil things going on here.

I'm sorry, but I just can't buy into Palin's paranoia and fear mongering. And it's a shame her idiotic rhetoric is still around.


Ya, know, who even said, I liked or even believed Sarah Palin??? I have parents in their 80's and let me tell you something, "You are being VERY disengenuous by saying that the elderly on Medicare get better treatment than those on private insurance!!! Do your parents choose medication over food? Mine do!"!

BTW, you really remind me of a certain someone who went by the name Outkast! Is this you?



posted on Oct, 4 2012 @ 02:48 PM
link   


I have elderly loved ones on Medicare, and they get better treatment than most on private insurance do.


That is a damn falsehood no government insurance programs comes close to private healthcare.

NONE!

Sure as hell does not have dental among other things.

Seems Obama is not the only defending the indefensible.



posted on Oct, 4 2012 @ 02:58 PM
link   
Yeah thats a laughable idea.

Private insurance is of course a better option in terms of what you get.

The thing is, because private insurance is profit driven, the patient is often times screwed.
This is why the ACA addressed pre existing conditions and such.
Insurance companies are there to make money, not help people. Helping people is merely the result of services rendered for profit.

While Medicare is not profit driven, it does not cover anywhere near the amount of a good private plan.

I for one would love for profit to be taken out of medicine altogether and have a single payer system like all the other leading nations.

To profit from illness is not only immoral, but it creates a situation that we have too much of here in the US. Treating the symptom and not the illness.

There's no money to be made in curing people, so let us keep them coming back. Let us snicker at alternative medicines and continue to irradiate Cancer patients.


 
Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com
 



posted on Oct, 4 2012 @ 03:11 PM
link   

Originally posted by seeker1963

Starting today, Medicare will start fining hospitals that have too many patients readmitted within 30 days of discharge because of complications.

The penalties are part of a broader push under President Barack Obama's health care law to improve quality while also trying to save taxpayers money.



Unintended consequence will be that now instead of telling the patient "If you start feeling pain or you have a fever come back immediately." they will say "You should be absolutely fine. If you feel any pain or have a fever its common do not worry and absolutely DO NOT come back. You need 30 days to assess the success of the surgery."



new topics

top topics



 
8

log in

join