How can Buddhism be classed as a religion?

Is Buddhism even a religion???

The buddha was a man who lived his life to his ideals and said he had perfected his life. he had many followers and taught others what he knew to try let them live a happy life as he did. he logged all his thoughts and ideals in a book that he believes will help others attain true happiness in life.

Buddha never claimed to be God and did not ask to be worshipped

Is following the buddha's teaching following a religion??

I dont think so i believe that the buddha was just a man who perfected his life and wanted to show others how to attain true happiness as he did.

What do you think?

****

I opine:

Whatever 'driving force' guides your life/living
and the principle focus of your life is immersing
yourself in the practices of increasing those
disciplines needed by the driving force to
sustain 'itself', or become Dogma...then it's character is Religious


...a Religion does not have-to-be acertain Faith or Philosophy
...a Religion can be....Science.....or Finance/Money....or Music....or Gambling

....a lotta things can be a religion.....communism...capitalism....environmentalism....most every 'ism'


ooops....i;m ramblein

[edit on 17-10-2004 by St Udio]

Buddhism is a religion because people believe in it. Buddist, if I rember correctly, dont worship god. They have more of a personal relationship with how they live thier life. Here is an excellent link that should answer all your questions about buddhism.

www.buddhanet.net...

Its even in PDF.

Hope this helps you.

[edit on 10/17/04 by Kidfinger]

Interesting question JoeyC...

Buddhism, in its intended state, should not be classed as a religion. Buddha himself said that people should not worship him as a deity or anything more than just a spiritual teacher. However, with that being said comes the nature of human error in logic...he tells people not to worship him, so what is the first thing they do? Worship him.

I follow the teachings of Buddha to an extent, but I would never call myself a "Buddhist" because I do not believe that is what he ever wanted. Also, in the original Buddhist religion (not sure about the present?) people were actually able to believe in any deity they wanted. For instance, one could be a Buddhist and also believe in Jesus and the Christian God, or Mohammad and Allah, etc.

PS- Here is a little tidbit of information that many people do not know...Buddha was born in INDIA. I believe he was born somewhere just south of the India/Nepal border (possibly Kashmir?). I don't know if any of you know that, but its an interesting little fact.

Kid,
With you're train of thought, that means anything is a religion.

Originally posted by JoeyC
Is Buddhism even a religion???

The buddha was a man who lived his life to his ideals and said he had perfected his life. he had many followers and taught others what he knew to try let them live a happy life as he did. he logged all his thoughts and ideals in a book that he believes will help others attain true happiness in life.

Buddha never claimed to be God and did not ask to be worshipped

Is following the buddha's teaching following a religion??

I dont think so i believe that the buddha was just a man who perfected his life and wanted to show others how to attain true happiness as he did.

What do you think?

The same can be said of the person known as Jesus. He lived his life to higher Ideals, He had many followers, and taught them what he knew so that they might live better lives.

He never claimed to be God (son of ..maybe) and, he didn't ask to be worshipped..

Now, He didn't write down his beliefs and teachings (and this is where it got screwed up) others did it for him..Loooong after his demise. Put their own spin into it and "poof" you have a major religion. Most of which goes completely against the supposed teachings of said person..

So, Yes, if Christianity can be called a Religion; then so Buddism should be also.....

Siddartha simply did it a bit better and documented his own thoughts and beliefs instead of relying on word of mouth to distort them.


Also, the term "Buddha" is not and was not the persons name... It is more a descriptive word or title. Like "Christ" or "Messiah" not names just descriptive titles..

[edit on 19-10-2004 by thethrall_nb]

Siddhartha Guatama was a Brahman Hindu, like Jesus was a hebrew, Confusious was an administrator, none set out to be worshiped as gods...

There is only one god, only one true religion and as many pathways as the stars...

Classifying money, music etc as religion is probably far fetched as it blurres the already imperfect definition.

However, while I don't think Buddhism is close to the "mainstream" Judaeo-Christian religions, even on the surface there are many similarities that allow us to roughly think about it as such. For example, there are congregations (sangha), places of organized meditation (temples), and there is even a hierarchy of priests. While Buddha himself wouldn't be thrilled with such development, maybe he wouldn't mind too much either.

After all, everything is Void.


[edit on 25-10-2004 by Aelita]

Originally posted by Aelita


After all, everything is Void.

The word "Void" is actually a somewhat misleading translation.

Buddhism is not nihilstic as you seem to be implying.





Peace

Originally posted by Tamahu

Originally posted by Aelita


After all, everything is Void.

The word "Void" is actually a somewhat misleading translation.

Buddhism is not nihilstic as you seem to be implying.





Peace

Any word is a misleading translation of a concept

Feel free to substitute "void" for "shunya", "kun" etc

And I can't help, after all the hours of re-reading Dhammapada, thinking that yes, Buddhism is (slightly) nihilistic

Originally posted by JoeyC

Buddha never claimed to be God and did not ask to be worshipped

Neither did Mohammed.

Now, my opinion on the matter will without a doubt be slanted, seeing as I believe ALL religions are one in the same, just interpretations of faith. Buddhism is another set of values. Just because it is not in the trinity of majority religion (Judaism, Islam, Christianity) does not mean it is not a religion.

Religion, to me, is a structured dogma of beliefs compiled into tradition. religion and faith are not the same. but hey, thats just me

Only a small percentage of Buddhists believe that Siddhartha (Budddha) was more than just an enlightened man, or a deity. Buddha isn't really classified as a religion, as much as it is a Philosophy.

Originally posted by Guinpi
Only a small percentage of Buddhists believe that Siddhartha (Budddha) was more than just an enlightened man, or a deity.

I respectfully disagree. Many laypeople actually consider the Buddha as a supernatiral entity to which prayers and offerings are made. I observed this when traveling in SE Asia.

It wasn't a small percentage... It was a majority.

Originally posted by Aelita

Any word is a misleading translation of a concept

And herein lies the problem.

Feel free to substitute "void" for "shunya", "kun" etc

As far as English goes; "Emptiness" may be a better word for this concept.

Although, I do like the term "Illuminating Void" when referring to the state of penetrating this "Emptiness".


The Science of Meditation

"A lot has been said about the Illuminating Void. We will, of course, be able to experience it, and in this emptiness we will discover the Laws of Nature. We can see these laws not in the way we normally see them, but the way they really are. In this physical world we can see figures from outside, but can we see them as they really are within, or from the sides, etc.? In the Illuminating Void we can know the Truth as it really is and not the way it appears to us. We can experience the Truth of an ant, a world, a sun, a comet, etc.

The Essence submerged in the Illuminating Void perceives with its spatial sense everything that was, is, and will be. Her radiations will reach the personality and the mind. It is interesting to know that while the Essence is submerged in the Illuminating Void, it experiences Reality. The emotional and motor centers will integrate with the intellectual center, and the receptive mind will capture the information received by the Essence, for that reason the information is accumulated in the intellectual center; thus, we do not lose it when the Essence comes out of the Illuminating Void and penetrates the personality.

It has been said that to obtain Emptiness we need a suction pump. We have that pump in the spine in the channels Ida and Pingala used by the Creative Energy to reach the brain. Also it has been said that we need a dynamo; we have one in our brain and willpower. It is obvious that we also need a generator. Fortunately this is the Procreative Organs (the sexual organs and willpower).

Having the system and elements, we can reach the Luminous Emptiness; the pump, the dynamo and the generator are the elements we need to reach the Illuminating Void in our meditations. Only through the Illuminating Void can we know Reality, but it is necessary that the Essence penetrates the Absolute Emptiness.

In the old texts, they talk a lot about the Holy Okidanokh: Omnipresent, Omnipenetrating, and Omniscient. He comes from the Sacred Absolute Sun. How can we know truly the Holy Okidanokh if we cannot penetrate the Luminous Emptiness? It is well known that the Holy Okidanokh is within the Illuminating Void; it is one with the Great Emptiness.

When you are in ecstasy, you surpass personality; when you are inside of the Luminous Void and experience the Reality of the Holy Okidanokh, you are one with the leaves, the water... you live everything that exists, the only thing you need is courage so you do not lose the ecstasy, because when one feels that one is diluted in everything and feels that one is everything, one experiences the fear of annihilation.

One thinks: �Where am I? Why am I everywhere?� Reasoning comes and one can lose the ecstasy returning to the trap again, enclosed again by the personality; but if one has courage, one does not lose his ecstasy.

At this moment, one is like a drop that is submerged in the ocean, but one has to realize that the ocean is submerged in the drop as well. You will feel you are a bird flying, a deep forest, a petal of a flower, the children who play with a butterfly, an elephant, etc. This situation brings terror and you can fail in your meditation.

It is indeed in the Sacred Absolute Sun where one comes to know the final Truth. In the Sacred Absolute Sun there is no time. There, the time factor has no existence. There, the universe is all One and the phenomena of nature takes place beyond time.

In the Sacred Absolute Sun we can live in an instant eternity. There, one lives beyond good and evil, transformed into radiant creatures.

Therefore, once one has experienced Truth, he cannot be like those whose lives are based on creed, no; there, one experiences the urgent necessity of working in the Intimate Self-Realization of one�s Being here and now.

It is one thing to experience or to truly live the Illuminating Void and another is to acheive Intimate Self-Realization. Because of this we need to know how to meditate, to learn to meditate; it is urgent to understand meditation.

I hope that you listeners will understand this, that you will practice meditation so one day you will be able to liberate the Essence and experience the Truth by yourselves. The one who is able to liberate the Essence and to enter the Illuminating Void will be distinct; he will no longer be like the others. For this you need a special course; such persons will be different, ready to fight up to the maximum with their only purpose being to realize here and now the Illuminating Void within.

In the Orient, when a disciple reaches these marvellous experiences by experiencing the Truth and comes to tell his Guru, the Guru strikes him hard with his hands; it is clear that if the disciple has not ordered his mind, then he will react against the Guru. Will he not?

However, these disciples are already well trained. Gurus do this to equilibrate the values and to test the disciple, to see how he is progressing in the elimination of his defects.

I hope that all of you have understood deeply what the Science of Meditation really is; I hope that you will practice intensively in your homes and in places of meditation.

Question: Master, how can we control the fear when we feel that we are in the Illuminating Void?

V.M. Samael Aun Weor: It is necessary to fight fear, forcing it to disintegration, until it is converted to cosmic dust. For that reason we have given you specific techniques for disintegrating your defects, using the spear and with the help of your Divine Mother. Of this, we have spoken amply in my book, �The Mystery of the Golden Blossom.�

The Science of Meditation

And I can't help, after all the hours of re-reading Dhammapada, thinking that yes, Buddhism is (slightly) nihilistic

That is why it would be better to utilize the right hemisphere of the brain instead of the left for such things; or better yet, the Consciousness or Essence, as opposed to the intellect.

The intellect by itself can't grasp or understand such truths.




Peace

Maybe it is just combining things, but most of my classes where we touched upon the topic of Buddhism we came to this conclusion:

The form where Budda is seen as a god is a religion.

The form where he is an example and teacher of philosophies is a philosophy.

Both are perfectly valid approaches, so Buddhism is both a religion and philosophy.

The two have been giving the nicknames roughly equivilent to "large raft" and "small raft" because of the number of followers. I can not remember the non-english words at this moment, but I know that the large raft was the philosophical form. That in itself should speak for the philosophy being more dominant overall.


I also couldn't help but notice how much the original post seemed to be describing Jesus just as well as Budda

Every nation, era, etc. has had it's Avatar and Messiah.

It's too bad that people become fanatical about them; but we would still be worse off without these prophets.

They are a blessing from the Most High.



PEACE