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Originally posted by flice
If anything... the palestinians army is a liberating force, not a terrorist one. They are trying to defend the loss of land which you can CLEARLY see depicted by the maps posted in the original post.
-In 2006, Mahmoud Ahmedinajad sent a letter to G W Bush. In the letter, he brought up the question of Israel-
A regime has been established which does not show mercy even to kids, destroys houses while the occupants are still in them, announces beforehand its list and plans to assassinate Palestinian figures, and keeps thousands of Palestinians in prison. Such a phenomenon is unique – or at the very least extremely rare – in recent memory.
As many know, Israel was created not long after the end of world war two. The Nazis had forced the Jews from Europe and many thousands settled in Palestine. In 1948, the state of Israel was officially declared. Yet, it is important to understand that the Zionist movement had sought to create a homeland for the Jews in Palestine well before WW2.
We only have to look at the ever decreasing size of the Palestinians land to see that the Zionists continue to steal land without any regard for how many Palestinians lose their homes and livelihoods.
As the 2006 letter to Bush mentions, thousands were killed in the violence that resulted in this take over, millions have been made refugees to make way for the Zionists.
It’s not as though things have gotten better either, the region has been in constant strife since 1948 as the surrounding nations do not believe Israel is a legitimate state and disagree with the treatment of those who neighbour Israel.
In 2006, 3 Israeli soldiers were killed and two taken by Hezbollah forces. Since the attacks were launched from Lebanon, the Israeli government launched a prolonged air strike campaign against Lebanon.
It is worth pointing out at this time that the reason Israel had and still has such an overwhelming military advantage is because the west funds the Israeli military, sending billions of dollars every year to buy war planes and weapons.
So because the Jews suffered the Holocaust, that entitles the Zionists to create a state of Israel in Palestine, take away the land of the people living there and treat them like sub human scum?
.
Why on Earth does our tax money pay for this? It was the Nazi’s who forced the Jews from Europe, so why didn’t Europe give up some land to be a homeland for the Jews?
This is not a thread against Jews.
Originally posted by TXRabbit
I have some questions relating back to the creation of the country of Israel, and it's designation of a "State for the Jewish people to call home"
WHY?
Why should 1 particular group of people get a piece of land "given" to them via treaty and declaration? Are there not other groups of people, indigenous or not, as worthy based on religions or regional discrimination as the Jews to get a country of their own?
I guess in a nutshell, the question is- why was 1 single group of people given so much while others are ignored?
The Arabs were the instigators of the 1947 war. They did not accept the UN partition plan.Seven Arab states declared war on the young state, intent on driving the jews into the sea. There were not millions of Arabs living in Mandatory Palestine and they were not more indigeneous than the Palestinian Jews.
Most of Palestine was very thinly populated in the 19th century. Most of the settlements are not built on Arab owned land.
Millions? There were not more than a few hundred thousands Arabs and a few hundred thousand Jews in the whole of Palestine till 1948.
Yeah. Right. Get rid of the Jews and there will be peace in the middle east!
Israel was not founded with US or west funding. US did not support Israel till after 1967. typical American supporting the winner side. many countries get US funds including Saudi Arabia and Egypt. US only does what serves its own interests. Israel has an advantage over its enemies because of the better quality, education and westernization of its population.
Another strawman argument. Zionism began long before the holocaust. Was not in any way an anti Arab movement. A large influx of Arab immigrants into the Mandate of Palestine-Eretz Yisrael entered after the economic conditions improved tremendously due to the zionist setlement. So who are the invaders?
Because 1. Israel will prosper with or without US tax support.2. the Jews are the only claimers of the Land of Israel in 2000 yrs.3. Europe is not their homeland.
Of course.Just 1/3rd of Jews.
Originally posted by Nite_wing
Originally posted by flice
If anything... the palestinians army is a liberating force, not a terrorist one. They are trying to defend the loss of land which you can CLEARLY see depicted by the maps posted in the original post.
My understanding is that a liberating force does not strap themselves with suicide vests and blow up buses full of innocent women and children. Sorry if I am misunderstanding your definition.
Originally posted by popcornmafia
Oh, yes real logical..
Iran should have a nuke so they can defend themselves while
blowing israel off the map..
I think logic tells me they are developing weapons to kill people..
Logic fails as soon as ahmadnijihadi opens his mouth.
The Arabs were the instigators of the 1947 war. They did not accept the UN partition plan.Seven Arab states declared war on the young state, intent on driving the jews into the sea.
There were not millions of Arabs living in Mandatory Palestine and they were not more indigeneous than the Palestinian Jews.
Originally posted by buster2010
Originally posted by DarknStormy
Originally posted by OccamsRazor04
reply to post by mideast
Here's a popular pro-Palestinian line of logic. Who lived there in the past is not relevant, only who is there now. If we look at the past Jews certainly have history on the land. If we look in the present, they have a claim there too. So you should avoid that line of reasoning. Instead let's work with what we have. That can only be done when Palestinians choose peace over terror.
great point
Really not that great of a point when it is Israel that is committing the most acts of terror.
Originally posted by Nite_wing
Originally posted by flice
If anything... the palestinians army is a liberating force, not a terrorist one. They are trying to defend the loss of land which you can CLEARLY see depicted by the maps posted in the original post.
My understanding is that a liberating force does not strap themselves with suicide vests and blow up buses full of innocent women and children. Sorry if I am misunderstanding your definition.
Originally posted by FissionSurplus
Good post, OP. Oh, there are some who are claiming anti-semitism (as if the Ashkenazi jews were actually semites, LOL), and want to blame the Palestinians for fighting back, but there is a reason there is a large "anti-Israel" contingent on ATS.
Most of us see through the lies which are perpetrated by psychopathic governments, the world over.
Seriously, I would love to see Israel cut off from Uncle Sugar's teat, so whatever it does, it does on its own, with its own money and its own military. However, since Israel gets 1/5 of our foreign aid budget (more if you count grants and low-interest loans), then I think we as Americans have a say in what they do.
As a taxpayer, I want them to stop the creeping development which they have used over the past 40 years to steal land which was not meant to be theirs. I want them to stop bullying and victimizing the Palestinian people, because what they are doing amounts to terrorism and genocide. Lastly, I want AIPAC and all the bastard lobbyists for Israel's interests out of our halls of government, and for us to stop funding a terrorist state.
Yeah, I said it. I went there. Israel will be the downfall of the United States, by their continually dragging us into wars overseas. When Nutty-yahoo went before our congress and got a multitude of standing ovations for his war-mongering rhetoric, I knew they were going to destroy us all.
Israel is nobody's friend, not even their own.
Americans are good people. They have no aggressions against us and they like us as we like them. They must know I don't hate them. I love them.… I hear it is a complex society inside. Many Americans don't know about the outside world. The majority have no concern and no information about other people. They could not even find Africa on a map. I think Americans are good, but America will be taken over and destroyed from the inside by the Zionist lobby. The Americans do not see this. They are getting decadent. Zionists will use this to destroy them.
Originally posted by Wonderer2012
To be honest, I don't even reply to the ones who call it anti semitic, the argument just doesn't stand up to logic.
I can say without absolute certainty my thread was not against Jewish people- I stated in my OP that the Jewish people are victims in this as much as anyone else.
It is the forces behind the agenda to set up Israel in Palestine and creat tension and conflict, as we have seen since 1948- they are to blame for this and the Jewish people are caught up in it as well.
In regards to your points, here's a quote from Gaddaffi in 1986, this man was way ahead of everyone else-
Americans are good people. They have no aggressions against us and they like us as we like them. They must know I don't hate them. I love them.… I hear it is a complex society inside. Many Americans don't know about the outside world. The majority have no concern and no information about other people. They could not even find Africa on a map. I think Americans are good, but America will be taken over and destroyed from the inside by the Zionist lobby. The Americans do not see this. They are getting decadent. Zionists will use this to destroy them.
The average American probably doesn't even know they send billions of dollars to Israel each year. Theu probably only ever heard 'Zion' in the Matrix as well
Originally posted by SeekerofTruth101
Originally posted by Wonderer2012
To be honest, I don't even reply to the ones who call it anti semitic, the argument just doesn't stand up to logic.
I can say without absolute certainty my thread was not against Jewish people- I stated in my OP that the Jewish people are victims in this as much as anyone else.
It is the forces behind the agenda to set up Israel in Palestine and creat tension and conflict, as we have seen since 1948- they are to blame for this and the Jewish people are caught up in it as well.
In regards to your points, here's a quote from Gaddaffi in 1986, this man was way ahead of everyone else-
Americans are good people. They have no aggressions against us and they like us as we like them. They must know I don't hate them. I love them.… I hear it is a complex society inside. Many Americans don't know about the outside world. The majority have no concern and no information about other people. They could not even find Africa on a map. I think Americans are good, but America will be taken over and destroyed from the inside by the Zionist lobby. The Americans do not see this. They are getting decadent. Zionists will use this to destroy them.
The average American probably doesn't even know they send billions of dollars to Israel each year. Theu probably only ever heard 'Zion' in the Matrix as well
The issue is Zionism.
Anti-semites are often trying to cover their hatred of jews under the cover of 'hating' on zionist.
In TRUTH, WHO are the zionists? What are their names. Who are the ones alive now. And WHAT EVIDENCE is there that these so called 'zionists' are creating strife?
Let's cut the BS. It's all PURE hatred of jews, that's all, under another brand name.
Zionism may had been active in the past, from the dispora jews from 18th century Russia harkening to an ancient past after facing discrimination from Europeans for centuries, driven by protectionistic idealogies.
It is only a society of like minded individuals to return back to their roots and suffer no more discrimination.
Same with ALL kinds of societies around the world after the age of Englightenment in the 17th Century. Same with arabs with their different sects. Same with USA with its founding fathers. Same with England's parliamentarians. Same with the France's revolution. Same with Karl Marx, etc.
Today, in the west, such societies with original beliefs no longer exist, or no longer exist in whole, espacially in DEMOCRATIC states. None can survive the scrutiniy to end selfishness or domination. Even Tyrannically ruled commie russia and china's core believers are dead or dying soon.
So who are the zionists in Israel? The PM? Just because muslims hate him with unfounded beliefs? The rabbis, who are only religious leaders and have no say in the secular democratic govt of Israel? The rich bas*ards of the world, when most of them do not even share the same jewish beliefs or traditions?
So, the insignificant nobody me say again - WHO ARE THE ZIONISTS, THEIR NAMES, & THEIR WRONGDOINGS???
Cut the BS. The free world are not fools anymore to anti-semiticism when it appears, even under another guise. Do end the fork tongues speeches. Go right ahead, if the hatred for jews rules, and attempts made to threaten or slaughter the jews once again, AND see what will happen next.edit on 4-10-2012 by SeekerofTruth101 because: (no reason given)