Evolution Now Dead. 30 Papers Suggest DNA is Encoded Intelligently , page 21

reply to post by Barcs

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My points all still stand. What you have said proves absolutely nothing and you are just regurgitating the same exact thing you already said. You didn't respond to anything I said, and you are making things up again. I'm not wasting my time. This has already been discussed to death. Personal choice? They don't choose to be hungry. They get hungry and then eat what they can eat at the time. I can't believe you having so much difficulty with one of the most basic concepts in the history of planet earth.

We have already established they eat based on what is available but what hasn't been established is why they have specific choices when there are more choices that don't appear to be personal choice.

If you were right there would be evidence of it in the listings of diets about animals. They would say they just eat what ever, but they don't, they eat specific food and your ignorant to the truth. If you were right, cows would eat dogs, and lions would eat trees and bears would eat rocks, but your not, because they don't. They have an order, and order that has direction, and that direction is strong enough to remove personal differences when they are available. This order is only possible through the idea of intelligence, something intelligent has programmed them, before they were born, with knowing what their food is suppose to be.

If I'm wrong then you are basically making the claim that while humans need labratorys and test equipment to identify what food is needed for a species, animals just have it built in. Ya right.

reply to post by Barcs

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Understanding what is going on does take a little insight, and you probabaly lack that which is why your not seeing it.

Here is a better example for you, maybe you will understand it if its put this way.

Lets say an animal normaly eats strawberrys, in fact we will claim that strawberrys are this species target food, or at least one of them. Now lets say for whatever reason strawberrys go extinct, and the next thing in line that this species has to eat is dirt and rocks. So this species resorts to eating dirt and rocks.

Why is it that if strawberrys were re introduced into the species diet, he would eat them instead of the rocks and dirt? He already made a decision to accept the rocks and dirt as food. Now you could argue that its obviously because strawberrys taste better but here is where you have failed. He had never tasted rocks before so how did he come to the personal decision without testing the choices? There is only one reason, because he was directed to the strawberrys to begin with.

Now the same hold true when you examine the species as a whole, they all make the same food choices based on enviroment, but even still, there is an order or a directive. There is never a personal testing phase if target food is present from the get go. They have a food thats working they stick with it might be the mentality but then why don't they stick to the rocks after the strawberrys are re introduced?

If testing food or choosing food by random choice were a reality like you say they are, each wiki that talks about diet would mention this so called testing or random phase of eating, they NEVER do, but what they do talk about is a clear concise diet that is consistant through a species as a WHOLE.

The "WHOLE" concept is important to realize because it's proof positive that there is direction in the choosing of food. It's also proof that decision is not determined by each individual within a species, because they all make the same choices, its the puriest example of Target food.

Take the same example and try to apply it to humans, We don't all eat the same foods, and in fact we have by far the largest menu of anything else on this planet, including some food we made for ourselves thorugh process. It's evident that we are not following target food, the fact that we don't stick to just a few food items and the fact that we are eating from everything in every food group is a sign of desperation. This is what happens when a species is searching for it's target food. In our case it's not here, just like the bible claims.

If you want confusion, just ignore the bible. Then you might start believing in things like evolution.

reply to post by itsthetooth

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Why you insist on making such a fool of yourself beats me. Eats dirt and rocks? Jeeze you can’t come up with a better example than that?

Tell me why for the last few days I have watched a Grey Squirrel in my garden eating worms when we all know squirrels eat nuts and before you say it, there are plenty of nuts available of all types. A glut of apples, pears and cherries. So why worms?

Please explain.

reply to post by colin42

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Why you insist on making such a fool of yourself beats me. Eats dirt and rocks? Jeeze you can’t come up with a better example than that?

Tell me why for the last few days I have watched a Grey Squirrel in my garden eating worms when we all know squirrels eat nuts and before you say it, there are plenty of nuts available of all types. A glut of apples, pears and cherries. So why worms?

Your a fool Colin...

Squirrel wiki

Squirrels' diets consist primarily of a wide variety of plants, including nuts, seeds, conifer cones, fruits, fungi and green vegetation. However, some squirrels also consume meat, especially when faced with hunger.[6] Squirrels have been known to eat insects, eggs, small birds, young snakes and smaller rodents. Indeed, some tropical species have shifted almost entirely to a diet of insects.

As you can see, wiki is now confirming what I have been saying all along, when this species is faced with hunger, they have been known to eat from an alternate list.

But please by all means go ahead and ignore everything I have been saying and continue to not believe in what wiki is presenting.

reply to post by itsthetooth

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Your a fool Colin...

There is only one fool here and that is firmly your crown.

As you can see, wiki is now confirming what I have been saying all along, when this species is faced with hunger, they have been known to eat from an alternate list.

How does the wiki link you quote from confirm what you have been saying?

Squirrels' diets consist primarily of a wide variety of plants, including nuts, seeds, conifer cones, fruits, fungi and green vegetation. However, some squirrels also consume meat, especially when faced with hunger.[6] Squirrels have been known to eat insects, eggs, small birds, young snakes and smaller rodents. Indeed, some tropical species have shifted almost entirely to a diet of insects.

How does that confirm anything you fantasise about? This backs up everything everyone has been telling you.

Beside that what part of the list of food types is the target food of the squirrel?

Answer my original question of why the squirrel is in my garden eating worms when there is an abundance of nuts, seeds, fruit and leaves.

Try to not make an even bigger fool of yourself and answer the question asked.

reply to post by colin42

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How does the wiki link you quote from confirm what you have been saying?
Squirrels' diets consist primarily of a wide variety of plants, including nuts, seeds, conifer cones, fruits, fungi and green vegetation. However, some squirrels also consume meat, especially when faced with hunger.[6] Squirrels have been known to eat insects, eggs, small birds, young snakes and smaller rodents. Indeed, some tropical species have shifted almost entirely to a diet of insects.
How does that confirm anything you fantasise about? This backs up everything everyone has been telling you.

I have been indicating that a species will venture off his list of target food only when he is starving, and what do you know, wiki is giving an alternate list that they eat when they are starving.

Beside that what part of the list of food types is the target food of the squirrel?

Answer my original question of why the squirrel is in my garden eating worms when there is an abundance of nuts, seeds, fruit and leaves.

Try to not make an even bigger fool of yourself and answer the question asked.

The only reasons I can think of that might explain why YOUR squirrel is not eating nuts and fruits seeds and leaves, could be because of several reasons. Some I can think of might be that all of those are out of season and not fresh to his liking at this time.

The original items may not be target food to begin with, and you can figure this out as well. Is he eating one type of fruit or many, you have to also consider what is and whats not available. Same thing with leaves, is he eating one type or many and does he again have a choice.

Because of one specific thing you share, I would venture to say these aren't his target food. The reason is because his normal diet according to wiki doesn't contain meat or insects, yet when he gets hungry, thats what he eats. This is usually the second phase of absent target food, the first phase is the species will venture over to multiple other items that are in the same food group. The second phase, he will add additional food groups. If MR. squirrel ever does make it to the next phase, this is dire starvation, eating rocks and dirt.

Because he has expanded his menu to insects, I seriously doubt if that will ever happen, he will always have a good supply of insects. The other thing you have to realize is that there are many things that could be preventing him from eating the phase one items in his diet. It could be that a new predator is hanging around and he can't get close to those things he used to eat. It's even possible that he is in a hoarding stage and trying to stock up, and doesn't think any of his phase one food is storage material. A worm can't be stored for later, he would have to eat it on the spot, but the other items can be stored, so its possible he is smart enough to know this. There could also be competition with other squirrels around not making it easy for him to hoard for the winter.

reply to post by itsthetooth

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I have been indicating that a species will venture off his list of target food only when he is starving, and what do you know, wiki is giving an alternate list that they eat when they are starving.

My observation of the squirrel in my garden calls your statement above into question. It in fact makes your claim nonsense.

The only reasons I can think of that might explain why YOUR squirrel is not eating nuts and fruits seeds and leaves, could be because of several reasons. Some I can think of might be that all of those are out of season and not fresh to his liking at this time.

I have now explained twice that there is an abundance of nuts, apples berries so they are clearly in season

Because of one specific thing you share, I would venture to say these aren't his target food. The reason is because his normal diet according to wiki doesn't contain meat or insects, yet when he gets hungry, thats what he eats.

The Squirrel is not hungry as there is loads of food available. The explanation for the squirrel eating worms is a real life observation that shows your fantasy target food to be the babbling of childish ignorance.

Because of one specific thing you share, I would venture to say these aren't his target food. The reason is because his normal diet according to wiki doesn't contain meat or insects, yet when he gets hungry, that what he eats.

Again his actions are not from hunger, they are in fact to prevent hunger (hint)

Because he has expanded his menu to insects, I seriously doubt if that will ever happen, he will always have a good supply of insects. The other thing you have to realize is that there are many things that could be preventing him from eating the phase one items in his diet. It could be that a new predator is hanging around and he can't get close to those things he used to eat.

Phase one diets more made up terms to fill the gaps. There are no more predators than usual and no competion to all the nuts, berries and seeds in the area so that wont work as a reason either.

It's even possible that he is in a hoarding stage and trying to stock up, and doesn't think any of his phase one food is storage material. A worm can't be stored for later, he would have to eat it on the spot, but the other items can be stored, so its possible he is smart enough to know this. There could also be competition with other squirrels around not making it easy for him to hoard for the winter.

Let's put you out of your misery

The Squirrel is stockpiling food for the winter. There are loads of nuts and seeds around for him to collect and eat but winter is coming and the Squirrel has to balance building his stocks of food that will enable it to survive the winter and the time it spends getting the energy to gather nuts and lay down a layer of fat that will also enable it to survive the winter.

It has rained for a week in my area and worms are coming to the surface meaning the Squirrel has found a rich source of protein that would otherwise be under the ground. The squirrel is making use of an abundant opportunity food and illustrates what you have been told and shown many times but refuse to understand.

Claiming the Squirrel has 'gone off its target diet' or now your new phase one diet is complete nonsense as usual and your 'because of starvation' bunk is on the top of the nonsense list you base your understanding on.

reply to post by colin42

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I have now explained twice that there is an abundance of nuts, apples berries so they are clearly in season

I have berrys all over my lot as well but they are rotted, and not fresh.

The Squirrel is not hungry as there is loads of food available. The explanation for the squirrel eating worms is a real life observation that shows your fantasy target food to be the babbling of childish ignorance.

Not at all, I would say there is obviously a very good reason for it. Your also challenging what wiki is saying by making the claim that you are. Are you trying to say that wiki is wrong AGAIN?

Again his actions are not from hunger, they are in fact to prevent hunger (hint)

You would be wrong according to wiki and the idea of target food.

Phase one diets more made up terms to fill the gaps. There are no more predators than usual and no competion to all the nuts, berries and seeds in the area so that wont work as a reason either.

You don't know that, there could be a predator hiding somewhere that you can't see.

It has rained for a week in my area and worms are coming to the surface meaning the Squirrel has found a rich source of protein that would otherwise be under the ground. The squirrel is making use of an abundant opportunity food and illustrates what you have been told and shown many times but refuse to understand.

Of course rain makes all of his normal food wet, which is another reason he might not be harvesting, and turning to worms as the rain does make them come up as well. Either way, I'm taking the word of wiki over yours, eating insects is only when they are hungry. Just because you don't think he is hungry, doesn't mean he isn't. Just because you see what you think could or should be food, doesn't mean that he agrees with you. There are to many reasons why he might be staying away from that stock at this time.

Claiming the Squirrel has 'gone off its target diet' or now your new phase one diet is complete nonsense as usual and your 'because of starvation' bunk is on the top of the nonsense list you base your understanding on

So you are disagreeing with wiki. It's in plain english in case you missed it, they don't eat insects unless they are hungry. I can think of a dozen reasons why he might be hungry with all this other food around. It's even possible that he has already eaten the best of the stock and doesn't care for whats left, or its not up to par.

squirrel wiki

Squirrels cannot digest cellulose, so must rely on foods rich in protein, carbohydrates, and fats. In temperate regions, early spring is the hardest time of year for squirrels, because buried nuts begin to sprout and are no longer available for the squirrel to eat, and new food sources have not become available yet. During these times, squirrels rely heavily on the buds of trees. Squirrels' diets consist primarily of a wide variety of plants, including nuts, seeds, conifer cones, fruits, fungi and green vegetation. However, some squirrels also consume meat, especially when faced with hunger.[6] Squirrels have been known to eat insects, eggs, small birds, young snakes and smaller rodents. Indeed, some tropical species have shifted almost entirely to a diet of insects

Read it again and see for yourself. The squirrel obviously is starting with a phase one diet which means he is not eating target food to begin with. When this phase one diet is out of season, he shifts over to insects and some animals, which is the definition of phase 2.

Sorry that the phases confused you, I only made them up to help you understand knowing how hard that is sometimes, but as you can see according to wiki its the real deal.

reply to post by itsthetooth

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As usual you totally ignore the points my reply to you raised and as usual replied with complete and utter nonsense and claims from ignorance that would make a child blush.

As conversations with you are always at this level of boring banality I have just realised that I have some paint to go watch dry.

reply to post by colin42

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I will take that as you not having a valid reply to ignoring wiki's claims on diet that compliment the idea of Target Food.

Originally posted by itsthetooth
reply to post by colin42

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I will take that as you not having a valid reply to ignoring wiki's claims on diet that compliment the idea of Target Food.

Your usual childish response I see.

If you had addressed the points I made and not what you decided I made. If you had addressed the example I gave then you could claim that childish drivel above but you didn’t.

You chose your usual avoidance to maintain your baseless fantasy which is all I need to see to know you are fully aware that your nonsense is just that but your total fear of the world due to your ignorance results in your oh so usual denial.

I expect your will whine on in reply but don’t expect any further from me as I have wasted too much time on you and your ignorance already

reply to post by colin42

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Your usual childish response I see.

If you had addressed the points I made and not what you decided I made. If you had addressed the example I gave then you could claim that childish drivel above but you didn’t.

You chose your usual avoidance to maintain your baseless fantasy which is all I need to see to know you are fully aware that your nonsense is just that but your total fear of the world due to your ignorance results in your oh so usual denial.

I expect your will whine on in reply but don’t expect any further from me as I have wasted too much time on you and your ignorance already

Each of your points were quoted and addressed, its just another classic case of you not being happy with the answers. The truth is the truth and you need to accept it for what it is.

Originally posted by itsthetooth
reply to post by HappyBunny

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It's not NECESSARY for human consumption. It's just safer. People got along just fine for 10,000 years without it. In fact, it was much safer than drinking the water. Wealthy people rarely drank water. They drank milk or beer or ale.

So what are saying in regards to all of the people that have died and gotten sick from drinking raw milk? What are saying in regards to Loui pastour and everything that realized and invented for us?

Your trying to say that all these people and the CDC are wrong and your right. Thats a pretty bold statement, have you informed anyone about this?

Of course not. People do still drink raw milk, but you do so at your own risk.

In the olden days, it was STILL safer to drink milk than the water and in some places that's probably still true.

Originally posted by itsthetooth
reply to post by Barcs
what hasn't been established is why they have specific choices when there are more choices that don't appear to be personal choice.

What do you mean by specific choices that don't appear to be personal choices? Please explain this deeper and give some examples.

If you were right there would be evidence of it in the listings of diets about animals. They would say they just eat what ever, but they don't, they eat specific food and your ignorant to the truth. If you were right, cows would eat dogs, and lions would eat trees and bears would eat rocks, but your not, because they don't.

Do rocks taste good? Do they provide energy and nutrition to anybody that eats them? Stop being so dishonest and saying "if that were true". That's 100% false and you know it. I already explained this. Rocks do not provide nutrition and energy. They do not taste good. They would damage the teeth of any creature that attempted to eat it. Animals remember that, they aren't stupid. Taste matters, energy matters, nutrition matters, memory matters, mother teaching child matters. You absolutely cannot deny that. Animals are not mindless drones.

If I'm wrong then you are basically making the claim that while humans need labratorys and test equipment to identify what food is needed for a species, animals just have it built in. Ya right.

What a load of crap. First, yes, you are wrong. Second I'm not making that claim, you are. The claim is wrong because humans have only had that knowledge for a few hundred years, while we have roamed the planet for hundreds of thousands. Somehow we survived. That knowledge and science (which you seem to hate) helps make things more convenient for us, but it is not a NEED. Animals don't have it built in and neither do humans. Humans ARE animals. I know it hurts your ego, but it's true. Taste matters, energy matters, nutrition matters, memory matters, mother teaching child matters. You absolutely cannot deny that. Funny the same exact factors apply to most animals. Surprise! Humans are animals. Your criteria make no sense at all. You are just rambling and can't back anything up.

reply to post by itsthetooth

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I love posts like this where you debunk yourself. Nothing further is needed.

reply to post by Barcs

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What do you mean by specific choices that don't appear to be personal choices? Please explain this deeper and give some examples.

Well your talking about two totally different choices here, first of all.
The first is referrng to the fact that a specific food has already been targeted back when the species was created. There doesn't seem to be any other explanation as evolutionists claim evolution to have no intelligence.
The second is referrng to the idea of a species supposedly making a personal selection of food, which is also false based on the fact that they all choose the same foods as a species whole, and they never experiment to find that food, and they also never pick things like rocks and dirt to eat. They obviously had a prior notion of what to eat.

Do rocks taste good? Do they provide energy and nutrition to anybody that eats them? Stop being so dishonest and saying "if that were true". That's 100% false and you know it. I already explained this. Rocks do not provide nutrition and energy. They do not taste good. They would damage the teeth of any creature that attempted to eat it. Animals remember that, they aren't stupid. Taste matters, energy matters, nutrition matters, memory matters, mother teaching child matters. You absolutely cannot deny that. Animals are not mindless drones.

If taste matters then please explain why they all choose the same taste? Does that realy sound like its a personal choice?

What a load of crap. First, yes, you are wrong. Second I'm not making that claim, you are. The claim is wrong because humans have only had that knowledge for a few hundred years, while we have roamed the planet for hundreds of thousands. Somehow we survived.

Then the fact would remain that we simply werent as healthy back then.

That knowledge and science (which you seem to hate) helps make things more convenient for us,

Here is where your misunderstanding the magnatuide of things. That science pointed out to us that we weren't getting the nutrients that our bodys actually need, I hardly call that convenience.

but it is not a NEED. Animals don't have it built in and neither do humans. Humans ARE animals. I know it hurts your ego, but it's true. Taste matters, energy matters, nutrition matters, memory matters, mother teaching child matters.

There are actually people that eat rocks, but they are suffering from a nutrition imbalance which causes them to act in that way.
Taste matters of course, but its not the primary decider, energy matters but not all animals are smart enough to remember feeling more energy from specific foods, nutrition matters, but you have still failed to explain to me how animals guage nutrition, not all animals are taught what they are suppose to eat, so your all wrong again. Not to mention there is still this made up idea that a species actually tries eating different things to determine what is good for them.

You absolutely cannot deny that. Funny the same exact factors apply to most animals. Surprise! Humans are animals. Your criteria make no sense at all. You are just rambling and can't back anything up.

Everything has already been observed that I'm talking about, based on quick diet checks online. There are even three phases of hunger that have been observed as well. First you have target food, this is the food that was intended for a species to eat and will provide the best nutrition to that species and limit his need for a large variety of other foods. Phase one is where target food is no longer in the picuture for what ever reason, and the species is eating just about everything within that same food group. Phase two is where the species steps into an additional food group. Phase three is starvation, rocks and dirt.

The wiki on squirrels clearly states that he is a herbivore but when hes hungry will start eating insects and rodents and snakes. Wiki just confirmed phase two of a squirrels diet.

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