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Why It Matters: SOCIAL SECURITY

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posted on Sep, 30 2012 @ 01:25 PM
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I was just browsing the Associated Press feed and this article showed up. Since this is such a very divisive and important issue, I thought I would share.


WHY IT MATTERS: SOCIAL SECURITY



The issue:

Unless Congress acts, the trust funds that support Social Security will run out of money in 2033, according to the trustees who oversee the retirement and disability program. At that point, Social Security would collect only enough tax revenue each year to pay about 75 percent of benefits. That benefit cut wouldn't sit well with the millions of older Americans who rely on Social Security for most of their income.

Why it matters:

For millions of retired and disabled workers, Social Security is pretty much all they have to live on, even though monthly benefits are barely enough to keep them out of poverty. Monthly payments average $1,237 for retired workers and $1,111 for disabled workers. Most older Americans rely on Social Security for a majority of their income; many rely on it for 90 percent or more, according to the Social Security Administration.

In 1960, there were 4.9 workers for each person getting benefits. Today, there are about 2.8 workers for each beneficiary, and that ratio will drop to 1.9 workers by 2035.

Fixing Social Security won't be easy. All the options carry political risks because they have the potential to affect nearly every U.S. family while angering powerful interest groups. Liberal advocates and some Democrats oppose all benefit cuts; conservative activists and some Republicans say tax increases are out of the question.

But Social Security is easier to fix than Medicare or Medicaid, the other two big government benefit programs. Unlike Medicare and Medicaid, policymakers don't have to figure out how to tame the rising costs of health care to fix Social Security.

Social Security's problems seem far off. After all, the program has enough money to pay full benefits for 20 more years. But the program's financial problems get harder to fix with each passing year. The sooner Congress acts, the more subtle the changes can be because they can be phased in slowly.


Source

This certainly is an issue that matters to most of us - one way or the other. Some feel that Social Security is a very necessary and valid program. Others feel that it's basically a free ride for the lazy. Still others say that they don't have any opinion other than that they should not have to pay for any of it.

My feeling is that a society that abandons its old, defenseless, sick, and disabled... well it doesn't merit being called a society at all.

~Heff
edit on 9/30/12 by Hefficide because: (no reason given)




posted on Sep, 30 2012 @ 01:30 PM
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reply to post by Hefficide
 


What amazes me Heff, is that the media NEVER mentions all of the IOUs that are sitting in the fund that was stolen and will never be payed back!!!

The other issue is the FED holding down interest on specific bonds. I will look for the article, but it basically was saying that because the FED is depressing the interest rates on one specific kind of bond, the one that is used for the SS fund, it is losing money instead of earning interest!!! I will look for it and post to the link when I find it unless someone else has it handy..............

Edit: Okay found one article that explains it somewhat........


Every year, Social Security rolls over its maturing long-term Treasury bond holdings, picking up new ones to replace the ones that are expiring. Because of exceptionally low interest rates, Social Security is earning less interest on its new bonds than it did on its old ones.


Source


edit on 30-9-2012 by seeker1963 because: adding info and link...



posted on Sep, 30 2012 @ 01:32 PM
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Good thread bringing this to light AND fixing SS is the best thing to.do.

It is like any other.problem when you ignore it that problem just gets.worse.and worse.

We are being told 20 somethings will not have SS it will not be around.
Who to believe and why should they be paying into a ponzi scheme that
will be bust in 40 years.

Privatize it and tie it to the stock market does not sound like a.good idea
our SS MONEY should not be gambled like that.



posted on Sep, 30 2012 @ 01:36 PM
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But the fix shouldn't be to merely keep raising the retirement age. I get tired of all these quick fixes. The program can be saved but Congress has to learn how to keep its hands off off the money that is reserved for this sole purpose.



posted on Sep, 30 2012 @ 01:36 PM
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The thing I find a bit strange behind the ideology of wanting to do away with a social safety net, is that it would probably result in the death of millions of Americans, more than have died in any armed conflicts. Maybe charities and the churches would step in? But still your gonna see a lot of destitution.



posted on Sep, 30 2012 @ 01:39 PM
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Personally I truly believe that if we simply policed Congress, banned lobbying, instated term limits, and set up some sort of proactive citizens watchgroup that had reasonable access - to insure that pork belly shenanigans were kept from being the norm? Social Security would magically no longer be a problem. Heck that giant debt we have might even start shrinking at a rather fast rate.

Maybe it's just me though....

~Heff



posted on Sep, 30 2012 @ 01:39 PM
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I really cannot believe how many people still believe the "trust fund" LIE. There is no money in the trust fund. It was raided long ago. Both parties raided it, all politicians are guilty. Either way, there is no money there to pay benefits. To make matters even worse, bammy cut the employee share of payments into SS. SS is broke, bankrupt, kaput. Just like the rest of the country. We can either address the problem now or leave it for our kids and their kids. I expect we will do the latter.



posted on Sep, 30 2012 @ 01:40 PM
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reply to post by Hefficide
 


Social Security was supposed to supplement retirement. Not be it.

With the reliance of Social security, we now have the government basically determining;
How you'll live
Where you'll live
What you'll do
What you eat
What you drink
What you wear
Will determine what you buy
Where you'll buy it

edit on 30-9-2012 by beezzer because: w



posted on Sep, 30 2012 @ 01:40 PM
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My feeling is that a society that abandons its old, defenseless, sick, and disabled... well it doesn't merit being called a society at all. as you said,but this is a gradual thing that doesnt hapen over night.we are well on our way and its not only to them 3 groups you mentioned.



posted on Sep, 30 2012 @ 01:41 PM
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reply to post by woodwardjnr
 


But still your gonna see a lot of destitution.


The term that the international banksters like us to use currently, is...austerity.

Like in Greece.



posted on Sep, 30 2012 @ 01:44 PM
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For those interested, a direct link to the Social Security Act and Compilation of Laws.

I am currently reading through them now.

~Heff



posted on Sep, 30 2012 @ 01:44 PM
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I foresee a lot of seniors and many from other age groups kicking the bucket soon. The average age will drop to fifty years old. Too much messing with food chemistry and we are making the bacteria too strong. People are either getting too fat or have little fat, both being very dangerous.



posted on Sep, 30 2012 @ 01:53 PM
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Originally posted by Hefficide


My feeling is that a society that abandons its old, defenseless, sick, and disabled... well it doesn't merit being called a society at all.



Well thanks for that.

Growing up in a society/era where you are promised this government based retirement fund - - - is kind of debilitating.

Being almost 66 - - I'm about to receive mine.

I would have preferred growing up in a society/era - - - that promoted personal responsibility for your future time when you could not fully take care of yourself.

In my years of experience - - - I see - - - dependence on anyone for your needs - - besides yourself as a falsehood.

I had great ambition and dreams. It's unfortunate for me that an undetected/unknown birth defect was majorly instrumental in keeping me from accomplishing my goals. It is what it is.

However - - back on topic. Humans being told they will be taken care of by the government - - - is debilitating.

THAT WHICH IS NOT EARNED - - HAS NO VALUE.

But the reality is: we were promised this. Promises must be kept.



posted on Sep, 30 2012 @ 01:54 PM
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reply to post by beezzer
 


Originally posted by beezzer

Social Security was supposed to supplement retirement. Not be it.


Agreed


Originally posted by beezzer

With the reliance of Social security, we now have the government basically determining;
How you'll live
Where you'll live
What you'll do
What you eat
What you drink
What you wear
Will determine what you buy
Where you'll buy it


I agree with you. With a caveat. It's not Congress who wants to control this stuff, it's big business. It's the people who own Congress. At this point in the game we have a mercenary legislature. And they are their masters loyal lap dogs.

~Heff



posted on Sep, 30 2012 @ 01:56 PM
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Originally posted by Hefficide
reply to post by beezzer
 


Originally posted by beezzer

Social Security was supposed to supplement retirement. Not be it.


Agreed


Originally posted by beezzer

With the reliance of Social security, we now have the government basically determining;
How you'll live
Where you'll live
What you'll do
What you eat
What you drink
What you wear
Will determine what you buy
Where you'll buy it


I agree with you. With a caveat. It's not Congress who wants to control this stuff, it's big business. It's the people who own Congress. At this point in the game we have a mercenary legislature. And they are their masters loyal lap dogs.

~Heff



Does it matter so much who controls it if you don't need to rely on it?



posted on Sep, 30 2012 @ 01:59 PM
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Originally posted by jam321
But the fix shouldn't be to merely keep raising the retirement age. I get tired of all these quick fixes. The program can be saved but Congress has to learn how to keep its hands off off the money that is reserved for this sole purpose.


What did Clinton fix by requiring the wealthy to pay taxes on it? Or something like that.

Sorry - - - 4 year old Aspie not allowing me time for research.



posted on Sep, 30 2012 @ 02:01 PM
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Originally posted by Hefficide

Personally I truly believe that if we simply policed Congress, banned lobbying, instated term limits, and set up some sort of proactive citizens watchgroup that had reasonable access - to insure that pork belly shenanigans were kept from being the norm? Social Security would magically no longer be a problem. Heck that giant debt we have might even start shrinking at a rather fast rate.

Maybe it's just me though....

~Heff
We could and should do all of that. It will not fix our problems now though. Tough choices need to be made now. My two cents? 1) END THE FED! 2) Repudiate all debts. We tried bailing out the bankers and corporations, that didn't work. Let's bite the bullet and do a big reset now. 3) Resume the gold standard, or some other type of backing so money has actual value. 4) Return to Constitutional Governance. 5) Fire all current politicians at every level of government and institute term limits at all levels of government. 6) Ban all lobbying.
7) Change the laws regarding corporations so that they are not "people", and open all corporate officers to civil and criminal liability for any and all actions the corporations take. 8) Limit bank size to no more than one billion dollars equivalent in assets, and coverage to state level. Require assets to equal at least 50% of loan amounts. The loans made could not be considered assets. 9) End the income tax and replace it with the Fair Tax(fairtax.org). 10) Require a balanced Budget. Require each and every government agency to begin each fiscal year with a zero balance and make them justify every penny that they request. 11) End PUBLIC UNIONS, I am by no means referring to private unions at private businesses. I refer solely to unionized government workers. 12) Pay all Senators and Representatives at a rate equal to the average pay in their state or $10/hour which ever is less. 13) No lawyer shall be permitted in Congress in either house. Lawyers making laws is a big part of what got us here.
I could write a whole manifesto, but these actions would be a good start.



posted on Sep, 30 2012 @ 02:01 PM
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reply to post by Annee
 


I see it somewhat differently. It's not like it's charity, at least in regard to retirement benefits. It's insurance. Literally. You pay in, and you get back out when your time to do so comes. Afflack does it, and makes a mint. Every insurance company does it, and ends up making money hand over fist as well.

But leave it to the American government to screw up a proven system...

As for disability, survivors benefits, SSI... slightly different situation. But retirement? Those who pay should get what they pay for.

When people discuss this issue they never seem to mention the percentage of people who pay in, die before retirement age, and never see a single cent of it? Where does that money go?

This issue gets so distorted by politicos and pundits. It's spun like taffy, leaving us to all try and figure it out.

~Heff



posted on Sep, 30 2012 @ 02:04 PM
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reply to post by beezzer
 


This illusion that everybody who ends up poor deserved it is so pervasive. You do realize that a single battle with an issue like heart disease, or cancer, can wipe out even the wisest persons life savings in a very short time. Those people need what they paid into - and they didn't lollygag around waiting for a hand out.

~Heff



posted on Sep, 30 2012 @ 02:04 PM
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reply to post by beezzer
 


It needs to be tamper-proof.
Remember that BS lock-box from years ago


Older Americans do rely on it.
You cannot change systems mid-stream if it means hanging those 55 and older out to dry.
I'd hate to tell you how many years I paid into the system





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