MASONICHIP- Masonic Child Identification Program

reply to post by k21968
Actually he answered concisely and correctly, but perhaps it didn't answer the question to your satisfaction. What is it that you don't feel was answered?

reply to post by no1smootha


Augustus did not. However the subsequent post did.

Ugh I am exhausted. I will retreat. White flag ...I am waving it. I surrender.

reply to post by k21968

No need to "retreat." You were asking questions and I hope we have been able to answer them. If not please let us know.

can't wait

shriners involved?

reply to post by jplaysguitar

This is a program ran by the Grand Lodge (Craft Masonry). Shriners are Masons, but not all Masons are Shriners.

Originally posted by k21968
reply to post by AugustusMasonicus

 

Well...since you offered...

Why are masons so secretive? I mean that alone causes us normal folk to be suspicious when you try to do something nice.

People assume we are keeping secrets because the don't know what goes on in our meetings. We tell people exactly what we do, but they don't believe us since the answers are boring. There must be some fantastic evil for it to be secret right?

Well, we are speculative masons fashioned after operative masons. Operative masons used secrecy to keep the "magic" they used to make perfect square angles and perfect circles away from the general public so they would always have work. They adopted secret handshakes and passwords so they could recognize each other in new towns. They eventually had meetings and in the 1700's some aristocrats decided to form a group based on that part of history. They formed speculative masonry. We as speculative masons adopted the symbolism and now use it to teach morality and brotherly love. The square reminds us to act upon the square in our life and business transactions. Treat people as you would like to be treated. The compass teaches us to circumscribe and keep our passions within due bounds of all mankind. There are many other symbols, each with their own meaning.

It is also the reason masons have their own forum in ATS. Maybe if whatever it is you do was made public, the public would shut up and go on. You realize that the masses are terrified of the unknown, right?

we have the right to privacy just as anyone else has that same right. Just because we aren't meeting with open doors, does not mean we are plotting evil things. I bet the board of directors at Nabisco is made up of reptilian overlords plotting world destruction with every fig newton. Well, you don't know what goes on in their meeting either.

My second burning question...what does that symbol stand for?

See above for the answer to that.

What exactly do you do in those meetings you have?? Why are there no women allowed? man I could do this all day..lol

I am seriously curious...and appreciate your willingness to squelch my curiosity.

Our meetings are business meetings where we discuss how to pay for things, what to pay for, who needs help, and how to help them. We discuss new members and decide on dates to meet for the new members rituals. Most meetings are not very exciting, but you get to meet with a bunch of really nice men who are all happy to see you. We share a good meal and some good conversation.

And it's a fraternity. No girls allowed. At least not in regular AFAM freemasonry.

Originally posted by AugustusMasonicus

Originally posted by k21968
Thank you! I am fairly new here so I could use all the help I can get. Thank yoU!!

I particpated in one of these programs in my home state. If you have any questions feel free to ask.

And frequently by my district here in Ontario. I've participated a number of times and unfortunately for the conspiracy-minded, there's nothing untoward or underhanded and the parents walk away with the entire package leaving behind one thing: a signed consent form for having participated.

It's one of those things that you hope is never ever required. But if there's an amber alert and the parents have an up-to-date ID kit of the child, it greatly facilitates getting the information out to the media. The faster the info's out, the more likely it is that the kid'll be found.

Personally, I hope that the only use all the packages that I've ever participated in producing get put to is as a reminder 10 or 20 years down the road of what John/Jane looked like back in the day and how much they've changed in the interim.

Fitz

If this program is willing to give you a kit or template to create your own identification pack on your own computer for your kids, great, that's no risk.

But if this program wants you to input your child's information into their personal computers so they can print out the information pack for you, AND they refuse to help unless you give them temporary access to this information, I would take a pass and make my own version based on their model, all without their direct help.

That's not to say I think anything nefarious is going on, I have no opinion of this program, I just strongly believe that trust should be earned and not blindly given, especially regarding children you have a duty to protect... and refusing to help without having access to sensitive information on other peoples children is not exactly a trust-building practice, not for me at least.

Oh, by the way, have you ever heard someone tell you not to trust them because they are not trying to help you? Me either, I've only heard the opposite.

reply to post by Erbal

In the program I run, we actually hand out packets to be made by the parents at their own convenience as well as packet we put together for the family. I have held back on us doing DNA swabs, but I put in a brochure on how the parents can do that and how to store it.

We don't use personal computers for inputting this information. Most CHIP packets are created on a computer purchased just for that purpose and only have that program on the laptop. The laptops I purchase for Idaho don't have WiFi capability.

We don't keep any of the inputted information. When I hit "Start Over" on my program it deletes all information. The paperwork that a parent/guardian fills out is given back to the parents/guardians with the CD and ID card. This is a voluntary program that requires us to input this data for an ID card and CD which can work directly with Amber Alert system.

Most of the time, my program tries to hold joint events with other agencies (ex: we did an event with a county's Crime Stopper's unit, a group similar to neighborhood watch). I know some CHIP committees have even worked with law enforcement agencies.

It's not like we're refusing out-rightly, it is us who is inputting the information on our equipment. No one is forcing her and we give assurance as to the security of the information. It's not like we say, "Give us your private information or leave!!"

reply to post by KSigMason


Hey, sounds great.
I'm just saying, if you eliminate the part were parents hand over sensitive information about their children to perfect strangers, especially perfect strangers with no law enforcement ties, or at least offer this option out in the open... I'm willing to bet that decision would create more trust so that even more parents will create this protection package for their children. But you guys are adults with functioning brains, I'm sure you know exactly what you are doing.

If that seems unreasonable to you, so be it. It's just my opinion and I'm a nobody.

reply to post by Erbal


The cool thing is people aren't forced to participate. It's a free service and those who want to get this information are able to do so at no cost to them.

If giving out pies really helped humanity, I would vote for us doing something like that, but unfortunately, if we did that, the first lady would put us in prison for making kids fat. So for now, I guess we will have to stick with the programs we already have in place.

When my children were young, (many moons ago) the local fire dept offered free fingerprint and photo id kit. Each child did the "real ink" fingerprint card and had their photos taken. The card and the photo were put in a little kit with a bio info sheet for the parent to fill out later and the whole kit given to the parent. I thought it was a great idea and did this with my children. With the amount of child abductions increasing, I think it's a great idea.

reply to post by Erbal

It's your opinion and your choice. We don't want to push this program on anybody, that is why it is a voluntary program.

I will say, your fears are not unreasonable. Many parents don't feel comfortable giving out private information to those they don't know. I understand and don't fault them at all.

Originally posted by KSigMason
reply to post by Erbal

 

It's your opinion and your choice. We don't want to push this program on anybody, that is why it is a voluntary program.

I will say, your fears are not unreasonable. Many parents don't feel comfortable giving out private information to those they don't know. I understand and don't fault them at all.

edit on 10-10-2012 by KSigMason because: (no reason given)

I understand you aren't pushing the program on anyone, and I understand you guys spend your time and money to offer this free service.

I'm just offering my unsolicited perspective and advice on what I think will allow you to reach an even larger audience so that you can help more families. To make the choice to not have an alternative that removes even a single stranger from having even temporary access to the child's information, to me, is to make the choice to limit the amount of people you can help.

But at the end of the day, I recognize what you guys are doing is still an infinite amount more than what I'm personally doing to help with the reality of missing children.