Is love really just the worship of a material object

Is love when it boiled down really just the worship of a material object. That object could be inorganic or organic. IIf so then isnt love just an obsession. Isnt an obsession just a form of maddness. Are the only sane ones the ones who dont hold possessions of the heart?

reply to post by AthlonSavage


As far as I have seen, yes. You are 100% correct, and it tears me apart.

reply to post by Renegade2283


Thats the first time in my life someone said i was 100% correct. Mabey im not as stupid as i think i am.

Reconsider tearing youself apart. I had an experience where i was in love with a woman. I explained it to another woman who analzyed my reasonig. You made me see that i had made in my own mind this woman as a object of obession. Then i started to think well who is at fault here. And when pulled back the curtain yes I found myself. Therefore theres no point tearing youself to bits as you are the culprit that is punishing youself.

Yup, but people will still claim that it is the "opposite" of materialism. Loving another human IS materialism. Loving a spirit IS materialism. Loving LOVE itself is materialism as it is an emotion - or if you don't think so - it is still an "energy" (less physical - but STILL physical)

Just because it is a "thing" that is more loose/free on higher levels (less dense than physical bodies), that does not make it isn't a "thing".

Originally posted by AthlonSavage
Is love, when it's boiled down, really just the worship of a material object ?

No.

I love a woman for who she is, not what she is.

Yes, she's beautiful and successful and those are attractions. But I love her for who she is inside. All the little things you can't see that make her what she is. Those little things you can't touch. You can only feel. And this is the only way I can love her right now and the only way I ever have loved her. Will it be the only way I will ever love her? Time will tell.

We've never had sex, yet I love her. Go figure. It wouldn't matter if I never saw her again, because I feel very fortunate, lucky even, to have even had the chance of knowing her as much as I do. I know little of her past or present personal life. I only know what I have seen of her in another "social arena", but what I have seen I love, because I can connect with her in many ways. She connects with me as well. Ways that I've never connected with anyone before and probably never will again. Very personal ways. Personal in the sense that there are things about people that are gender neutral. Men and women alike have certain characteristics that don't define a persons sexual identity. It defines their overall identity. And our identities, in this regard, are very similar. So much so that you can't ignore it. I guess you could say that I love her on a "privately personal" level, not on a "personally social" level. Same with her. Just goes to figure because neither one of us have ever been social animals. It's evident in the way she carries herself, and it's evident in the way I used to live. Not very well to be precise. At least she had the sense enough not to try to fake it.

Therefor, in my experience, love is not just the worship of a material object. Love is deeper then that. Much deeper, which is why many people never have the opportunity to see it or feel it. And as odd as this might sound, that type of love isn't predicated on the other person giving it back on the same level. Even if they don't feel the way you do, that doesn't change the fact that you see something in another person that has a profound effect on you. Profound on an emotional level.

reply to post by AthlonSavage


Of course your not stupid, nobody is to start. Tabula Rasa, which means blank slate. I believe all people have an equal potential at intelligence, it is just that experiences you have and how you see others deal with those experiences, that make you you who you are. like whether you are intelligent or not. Aside from disabilities that impair you, though disabilities mean your are not a "blank slate" anymore.

Anyways, yes love is an obsession. However, even with me knowing that, I still will never be able to shake the feeling. Its like one of those weird situations were you understand why you made a mental decision, but you still do it anyway.

reply to post by arpgme


I have to tend to agree with you, i have only recently been enlightend by someone else on this. She didnt say it directly to me but she led me to the point where i could see it. Oh i was a bad guy for tryiing to love a material thing.

reply to post by InTheShadows


I use to think exactly like you only until recently. I think you should hold onto this belief as long as you can and forever if possible because once its broken you will never be able to get back to the way your thinking now.

I think the majority of the time love is like that.... it is lust. I have to say I am guilty of lust even when I thought I could love someone and tried to, maybe I did but maybe I found out they were not the person I thought they were.

I know many people who have claimed to love me have not, and it was just lust because they have been happy and even possessive in the relationship, they would often be abusive in some way or inconsiderate on many levels and very disrespectful. I know most of their disrespect stems from me not being a high flyer and often hanging out where the underdogs roam but this means nothing to me and the opinions of who I am, but to them it was weakness so they would use it as a way to disrespect, to control, to be a bossy chauvinist and what have you. Love doesn't exploit weakness for it's own gain. It accepts the person inside. I know if I had not been attractive then many of them wouldn't have given me the time of day.... so yes, most cases I have seen is simply objectifying.

I love someone... someone who is not with me and this is incredibly frustrating for me because I know I may never have the rewards of having their physical companionship... but that's not going to make it go away.

Most of the time... yes, that is all that it is and a person should be aware of this at all times yet strive for something more.... strive for that lasting connection between yourself and another because it will help you analyze how you objectify others or how they might objectify you.... so that you can perhaps stop feeling that way in many different forms. The government, society, life... we are all being objectified and it really tears at our potential.

I believe in that chance.

What just about everyone wants is to be loved. How can entities long for something so badly and it be incapable of existing? I believe my missing pieces have to be around here somewhere. They must be. They've left a hole in me of a certain shape and fashion and therefore they must be around here somewhere.

reply to post by NotAnAspie


Its not always lust i was in love with a woman who wasnt a model of the atypical ones i had been interested in, e.g. usually the blonde volutuous types etc
i was attracted to her because i saw someone who was everything. Mind, Spirit, and attractive to me. She represented a level of depth i had never experienced or seen from a woman before.

Originally posted by AthlonSavage
reply to post by NotAnAspie

 

Its not always lust i was in love with a woman who wasnt a model of the atypical ones i had been interested in, e.g. usually the blonde volutuous types etc
i was attracted to her because i saw someone who was everything. Mind, Spirit, and attractive to me. She represented a level of depth i had never experienced or seen from a woman before.

edit on 29-9-2012 by AthlonSavage because: (no reason given)

I didn't say always... i said the majority of the time... in case you misunderstood.

I had to add that while I do think love is an obsession, it is not necessarily materialistic. For example my love is for an idea, someone who doesn't actually exist. So, how is that materialistic?

Why does the world have to deal such a cruel hand.

reply to post by NotAnAspie


Lust is definitely an obession that is common between men and woman. Still lust for a womans intellectual or her spirituality or any other materials aspects she owns is also lust. Doesnt doesnt need to just be physical infatuation so i guess i have to say you were right first time off its all lust masking and pretending to be love at least between men and woman objects.

Originally posted by Renegade2283
I had to add that while I do think love is an obsession, it is not necessarily materialistic. For example my love is for an idea, someone who doesn't actually exist. So, how is that materialistic?

Why does the world have to deal such a cruel hand.

edit on 29-9-2012 by Renegade2283 because: (no reason given)

an idea doesn't have feelings.

why would you have the feelings of care and protectiveness and respect for something that hasn't even experienced pain?

reply to post by Renegade2283


A possessive idea can be formed around anything material or non material. Its possible even for a possessive idea to be formed around another idea. And obsessive possession is a form of lust. These relevations have only recently been enlightened on me.

reply to post by NotAnAspie


That doesn't negate the fact that its still real and will never go away. Personally I blame TV(don't ask). Trust me, I know its real because I can literally feel it in my heart. Didn't believe love was real until I felt that.

reply to post by AthlonSavage


But I dont want to own it. In no way do I want possession. Just presence

reply to post by Renegade2283


Love is a real feeling. The enlightening part it that it is a real emotion but the motive behind is the self. The self yearns for sometthing that is missing. Thats why when it sees that missing part it forms an obsession around it.

And obsession doesnt necessary mean one wants to constitute ownership. for example a person may be obsessed with sleeping with a sexy prostitute. Does that mean they want ownship of that person, no they just want to fulfil a fantasy or quick gratification. Love without ownership can be just as obsessive as the opposite where ownership wanted.

Originally posted by AthlonSavage
reply to post by NotAnAspie

 

Lust is definitely an obession that is common between men and woman. Still lust for a womans intellectual or her spirituality or any other materials aspects she owns is also lust. Doesnt doesnt need to just be physical infatuation so i guess i have to say you were right first time off its all lust masking and pretending to be love at least between men and woman objects.

again, I didn't say it was all lust.

sure, intellect and all that can be attractive and lustful but let's say the attractive, intellectual, spiritual person was a real buttmunch. now what?

honestly, I think it's like a home... and you take god given resources and you build it, not just a house... but a home and where ever you go, whatever you do... you will set your little belongings out in an accessible place even if it's in your cardboard box... even if it's just where you lay your head. You find yourself a place to lay it for your own well being, your own self respect but also for you're potential to serve good that keeps from giving up.

maybe it's something that is always there... somewhere, and it was a part of you all along... that other person but it's real value is what you make of it. You have to find them, you have to open your eyes and you have to make effort and you have to build it... and if the wind comes and tears it down, you mend it and you maintain it. Maybe it's not just a squirmy spasm in the chest area... or the realization "I'm in love" maybe it's much more than that and is somewhat beyond our full understanding and therefore not only must we acknowledge that love is possible, but we must also acknowledge where it is not supposed to exist... because if you tell yourself that the wrong thing is love, you will definitely stop believing in it.

if you lust for someone and you think you love them but you don't treat them with all the things that we describe as love, which is much more complex than lust... then you will begin believing it is just lust as well. You will realize that you just love certain things about that person but you will not want to admit it so you will start thinking that love isn't real. I think it's a two way street and is extremely complex.

reply to post by AthlonSavage


I see. Hearing that is depressing but true. Sometimes I wish I could forget it all. The ol' "ignorance is bliss". But somehow I always convince myself not to give up. If any of that makes any sense,