I have total respect for those who vote third party because they are making sure their voice is heard if you do not like the system you should take the time to let them know it. People are fighting and dying all over the world to have what you have and excuse the lack of a better phrase you are $h*t*ng all over your rights. I leave for Costa Rica next week and there it is law that everyone must vote I envy them in that respect. If you think there is a perfect political system out there that is working right now I would love to hear about it.

I needed to say that. out.

"There is nothing which I dread so much as a division of the republic into two great parties, each arranged under its leader, and concerting measures in opposition to each other. This, in my humble apprehension, is to be dreaded as the greatest political evil under our Constitution."

JOHN ADAMS, letter to Jonathan Jackson, Oct. 2, 1789


"However [political parties] may now and then answer popular ends, they are likely in the course of time and things, to become potent engines, by which cunning, ambitious, and unprincipled men will be enabled to subvert the power of the people and to usurp for themselves the reins of government, destroying afterwards the very engines which have lifted them to unjust dominion."

GEORGE WASHINGTON

Originally posted by Vaedur
Go ahead and see what happens, thats just fancyful dreaming and unrealistic. Its an excuse to not take action.

I'd bet my left arm there was a whole group of people who said the same thing in 1776 as well.

Do you really believe that every single person in the US wanted Revolution in 1776?

There were many people in 1776 who said the same things you are saying today. That it is unrealistic to break away from British rule. Yet it still happened. How do you explain this?

What makes you think I have not voted 3rd Party before?

I got some news for you, your not saying anything new. Your idea of voting 3rd party and continuing to do so has been done by some people for years. Where is the change? What has it accomplished?

Fact is, 3rd party Candidates are ignored. They have not reached the mainstream of voters and the way the media ignores them, the way they are not invited to debates, the way they are marginalized, they will continue to not reach the mainstream voters.

Our system is corrupt, our media is in bed with our politicians, our politicians are in bed with the big money. This problem has gotten way too big to be settled simply by voting 3rd Party and that is a fact. You call it unrealistic to imply that we dissolve Government, I say it is unrealistic to think that the 3-10% who will vote 3rd Party will be enough to get the job done.

Originally posted by Vaedur

Originally posted by OMsk3ptic
Yes, Im sure 3rd party candidates are immune to greed and coercion. If you vote 3rd party, then that party will just become a target for the same corruption.

I can not deny your logic there. But isnt it time we give someone else a chance. Wouldnt it make that statement we are fed up with the way things are? Im done pretending anything can be done without utalizing what realistic optins we have, and I cannot think of a better one then to end this Rep and Dem control BS. The more third parties in office the more we open it up to others.

We gave someone else a chance... they were called "Tea Party Candidates".. now what happened?

I will tell you what happened, the big money came along and they jumped in the mud with the rest of the pigs.

There is another way to change America other than a 3rd Party....which they'll never allow to win.


1 piece of paper. Articles of Surrender.

That one piece of paper would remove the crooks who've been robbing us and place someone else as a caretaker to run the show. It's the ONLY way to remove their power.

They've placed things into position that the people could NEVER rise up and physically replace them anymore. Articles of Surrender is the only thing now that'll work.

You just need some signatures and hand the piece of paper over to who you appoint to replace the crooks we have now. Get to typing.

A fourth and maybe a fifth party would be nice as well.
But getting rid of the republican and democratic party is paramount. These career politicians just have to go.

Originally posted by Vaedur
]That is pretty much how ii feel. Im trying to be realistic. 1776 & 2012 are different times. Americans would be whiped out trying revolution and the second ammendment would disappear.

Wiped out by who?

The US can't wipe out Afghanistan, a country of cave dwellers and goat herders. Iraq gave us one huge headache.. and they were outgunned as well.

The human spirit is an amazing thing, I would not dismiss it so easily.

That being said, revolution does not always mean armed. Iceland had a Revolution, replaced their Government, arrested the bankers, rewrote their Constitution and not a single shot was fired. Spain is certainly an interesting place to be right now as they are having a Revolution of their own, and no one is shooting each other in the streets.

I intend to vote for Gary Johnson myself, but let us be honest..... he won't win. He will get (if he is lucky) 10% of the vote. Meanwhile Congress will still be full of Democrats and Republicans, a Democrat or Republican will be in the White House, the sheep of this country who get their so called "news" from the MSM and will still be brainwashed and continue to vote for the Big 2 while they argue over abortion and gay marriage.

So just how long do you think it will take to effect any kind of real change voting third party and still losing in every election? Just what exactly is being accomplished with this strategy other than conceding elections every 4 years to Candidates from the Big 2 Parties?

Originally posted by MrWendal

Originally posted by Vaedur
]That is pretty much how ii feel. Im trying to be realistic. 1776 & 2012 are different times. Americans would be whiped out trying revolution and the second ammendment would disappear.

Wiped out by who?

The US can't wipe out Afghanistan, a country of cave dwellers and goat herders. Iraq gave us one huge headache.. and they were outgunned as well.

The human spirit is an amazing thing, I would not dismiss it so easily.

That being said, revolution does not always mean armed. Iceland had a Revolution, replaced their Government, arrested the bankers, rewrote their Constitution and not a single shot was fired. Spain is certainly an interesting place to be right now as they are having a Revolution of their own, and no one is shooting each other in the streets.

I intend to vote for Gary Johnson myself, but let us be honest..... he won't win. He will get (if he is lucky) 10% of the vote. Meanwhile Congress will still be full of Democrats and Republicans, a Democrat or Republican will be in the White House, the sheep of this country who get their so called "news" from the MSM and will still be brainwashed and continue to vote for the Big 2 while they argue over abortion and gay marriage.

So just how long do you think it will take to effect any kind of real change voting third party and still losing in every election? Just what exactly is being accomplished with this strategy other than conceding elections every 4 years to Candidates from the Big 2 Parties?

edit on 1-10-2012 by MrWendal because: (no reason given)

edit on 1-10-2012 by MrWendal because: (no reason given)

i think all of your points are valid and you are probably right. Except the social media youth are actually ready for a change. They can be reached. Most people under 30 wont vote, they know its a sham. Thats why 2016 is our best shot. They know who jesse v is. If we can get the ball rolling by all influencing someone else, maybe not this year, but in the future the goal of breaking the duopoly is obtainable. I might be wrong, but i honest believe this.

Regrettably, we've become conditioned to expect quick fixes for everything. The problems detaied in this thread (the Republican and Democratic domination of our political system) has been a slow, insidious process. It's our fault. We've been dumb, fat and lazy while they have systematically screwed us over. Shame on us. But finally --- maybe too late but who knows --- people are waking up. We owe it to ourselves, our neighbors and our children to at least START the process of taking back the country. Voting third party across the board is a prerequisite to any systematic change. This isn't going to be accomplished in one election. But we need to start the process before it's too late --- if it isn't already.