'Jesus Not Allowed': Anti-Faith Sentiment Sweeps US

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posted on Oct, 1 2012 @ 04:42 PM
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Originally posted by GoldenRuled
20 yrs ago, things were just the opposite. The beetles lost most of the country in fans because of 1 derogatory remark they made about Jesus. It is just amazing how this country is going with the wisdom of DC guiding us whether we like it or not to a prosperity we already had. Bring on the persecution!

***Angela Hildenbrand faced the very real possibility of going to jail for her faith. The trouble began when a federal judge ruled that no one at her Texas high school could pray or even use words like "prayer" or "amen" during the 2011 graduation ceremonies.

As class valedictorian, Hildenbrand felt God deserved the praise, even if it meant jail for her.***
CBN News
edit on 29-9-2012 by GoldenRuled because: (no reason given)


Yes...and she faces that punishment because she directly went AGAINST THE CONSTITUTION!


The government guarantees freedom from religion...so bringing it into the PUBLIC SCHOOL SYSTEM funded by GOVERNMENT FUNDS is wrong.

Easiest case in history




posted on Oct, 1 2012 @ 04:45 PM
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Allowing any right to be taken away, whether you agree with it or not opens up the probability of a right you enjoy to be taken away. Be careful what you ask for. You might get it.



posted on Oct, 1 2012 @ 04:55 PM
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Originally posted by jimmiec
Allowing any right to be taken away, whether you agree with it or not opens up the probability of a right you enjoy to be taken away. Be careful what you ask for. You might get it.


They aren't taking away a right...the right was never there in the first place. The government guarantees freedom from religion, and no one's stopping you from following your belief, go to church that isn't publicly funded.

If freedom from religion is a base right (!!) guaranteed by the constitution, why do I as an atheist or "insert random religion" have to be subject to Christianity in a publicly funded place like a school? THEY are taking away MY RIGHT of freedom from religion.

How would you feel if people prayed from the Quran at school? What about native Indian rituals being performed at school? Sound good?
edit on 1-10-2012 by MrXYZ because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 1 2012 @ 04:59 PM
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reply to post by MrXYZ
 


The constitution in no place guarantees "freedom from religion", you just made that up. What the Bill of Rights does guarantee is the free exercise of religion, commonly called the "free exercise clause".


edit on 1-10-2012 by NOTurTypical because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 1 2012 @ 05:03 PM
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reply to post by GoldenRuled
 


First off they didnt make a derogotory remark about Jesus. John Lennon said they were more popular than Jesus. That affected them for about 15 minutes and then it was business as usual. The Beatles were still filling the seats in the concert halls after John said that .



posted on Oct, 1 2012 @ 05:06 PM
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Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by MrXYZ
 


The constitution in no place guarantees "freedom from religion", you just made that up. What the Bill of Rights does guarantee is the free exercise of religion, commonly called the "free exercise clause".


edit on 1-10-2012 by NOTurTypical because: (no reason given)


WRONG





Two clauses in the First Amendment guarantee freedom of religion. The establishment clause prohibits the government from passing legislation to establish an official religion or preferring one religion over another. It enforces the "separation of church and state."


You might wanna read the constitution again


But yeah, the bill of rights guarantees the same thing too...

Either way, using public funds to promote a religion is against the law. You might not like it, but your only alternative is to move to a theocracy.
edit on 1-10-2012 by MrXYZ because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 1 2012 @ 05:10 PM
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reply to post by MrXYZ
 


And congress made no law requiring religion, the school didn't require religion, and you provided nothing from the Bill of Rights that guarantees "freedom from religion", which was your assertion. You only have the establishment clause and the free exercise clause. That's it. And the school violated the girls free exercise of her religion, which she has a constitutional right to as a citizen.

What public funds to promote religion? As far as I know the school wasn't requiring the girl to say anything, she chose to of her own volition, which is her free exercise right.

edit on 1-10-2012 by NOTurTypical because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 1 2012 @ 05:11 PM
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reply to post by MrXYZ
 


A student expressing their beliefs isn't the same as a government/state employee doing so while on the job. And, actually, you do have to put up with sometimes being around others who might express beliefs you disagree with. That's life. Putting up with it is called tolerance (the real definition of tolerance, btw and not the acceptance of everything others believe/do version).

Congress didn't establish a religion and tax you for it. You're still allowed to not believe in anything- and others are allowed to believe in things.

edit on 1-10-2012 by LeSigh because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 1 2012 @ 05:12 PM
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reply to post by MrXYZ
 


Well your Athiest, Why would Christianity bother you any more than say, me not liking fat women? Ok so i am offended by fat women!! Ban Obesity! If your so caught up in being an Atheist then you just made it a religion. I don't like your religion. Ban it! You have a right to believe whatever you want. Guess what? So does everybody else! You take away their right to believe whatever they want, you take away YOUR right to believe whatever you want. It's not rocket science.



posted on Oct, 1 2012 @ 05:13 PM
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Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by MrXYZ
 


And congress made no law requiring religion, the school didn't require religion, and you provided nothing from the Bill of Rights that guarantees "freedom from religion", which was your assertion. You only have the establishment clause and the free exercise clause. That's it. And the school violated the girls free exercise of her religion, which she has a constitutional right to as a citizen.


The mere FACT that the government can't promote religion in general means that freedom FROM religion is guaranteed at publicly funded places...like schools. If government money's involved, religion has no place. And that doesn't just include Christianity, it means ALL religions.\

I take it you never took a law class?



posted on Oct, 1 2012 @ 05:14 PM
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Let's see where the constitution guarantees "freedom from religion".



posted on Oct, 1 2012 @ 05:15 PM
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Originally posted by jimmiec
reply to post by MrXYZ
 


Well your Athiest, Why would Christianity bother you any more than say, me not liking fat women? Ok so i am offended by fat women!! Ban Obesity! If your so caught up in being an Atheist then you just made it a religion. I don't like your religion. Ban it! You have a right to believe whatever you want. Guess what? So does everybody else! You take away their right to believe whatever they want, you take away YOUR right to believe whatever you want. It's not rocket science.


Nobody's stopping you from believing


But how would you feel if schools promoted Islam? Or atheism? That ok? Because if you want religion in school, that's what should happen. Have Muslim prayer classes too...and Buddhist ones.

It's really simple: If government funds are involved (federal AND state level), it can't be used to promote religion. Having prayers in schools is a promotion of religion.

Again, legally this is the easiest case in the world



posted on Oct, 1 2012 @ 05:16 PM
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I always thought that separation of Church and state meant that we would not have an official state sponsored religion. Separation of Church and State.

I live near the whole cheerleader-football-poster thing. I don't see anything wrong with it. I don't know why people are so upset. They got lots of publicity because those opposing it got all mad. Funny how you an mention God and people get their panties in a wad.

Meanwhile in New York, they are giving out the morning after pill in school without parental consent.

Back in 1976, my youth pastor told me "Dave, soon in this country, Christians will be persecuted". At the time I thought he'd gone off his rocker. I don't think that so much any more. Duane, wherever you are, you were right.



posted on Oct, 1 2012 @ 05:16 PM
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Originally posted by MrXYZ

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by MrXYZ
 


And congress made no law requiring religion, the school didn't require religion, and you provided nothing from the Bill of Rights that guarantees "freedom from religion", which was your assertion. You only have the establishment clause and the free exercise clause. That's it. And the school violated the girls free exercise of her religion, which she has a constitutional right to as a citizen.


The mere FACT that the government can't promote religion in general means that freedom FROM religion is guaranteed at publicly funded places...like schools. If government money's involved, religion has no place. And that doesn't just include Christianity, it means ALL religions.\

I take it you never took a law class?


Absolutely false, you might want to check the SCOTUS rulings on free exercise. The only thing that a public school cannot do is endorse a particular religion. That has nothing to do with the girl's free exercise of her own volition.



posted on Oct, 1 2012 @ 05:16 PM
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Originally posted by NOTurTypical
Let's see where the constitution guarantees "freedom from religion".


It doesn't allow the promotion of ANY religion...by its very definition that's freedom of religion. Sorry you don't like the fact that the US isn't a theocracy



posted on Oct, 1 2012 @ 05:18 PM
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reply to post by MrXYZ
 


The government ISN'T promoting religion here. A student referenced her own beliefs. Huge difference. And students BY LAW are allowed to express their religious beliefs in public schools. They can pray, read their holy books, and talk to others about their beliefs so long as they aren't disrupting classes or bullying others.



posted on Oct, 1 2012 @ 05:20 PM
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Originally posted by LeSigh
reply to post by MrXYZ
 


The government ISN'T promoting religion here. A student referenced her own beliefs. Huge difference. And students BY LAW are allowed to express their religious beliefs in public schools. They can pray, read their holy books, and talk to others about their beliefs so long as they aren't disrupting classes or bullying others.



It's a graduation ceremony...sponsored by the government. How on earth is that not the school allowing the promotion of a certain religion



posted on Oct, 1 2012 @ 05:22 PM
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Originally posted by MrXYZ

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
Let's see where the constitution guarantees "freedom from religion".


It doesn't allow the promotion of ANY religion...by its very definition that's freedom of religion. Sorry you don't like the fact that the US isn't a theocracy


Now, now, no moving of the goalposts. You said the constitution guarantees "freedom FROM religion". There is no such thing, you fabricated that.



posted on Oct, 1 2012 @ 05:24 PM
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Originally posted by MrXYZ

Originally posted by LeSigh
reply to post by MrXYZ
 


The government ISN'T promoting religion here. A student referenced her own beliefs. Huge difference. And students BY LAW are allowed to express their religious beliefs in public schools. They can pray, read their holy books, and talk to others about their beliefs so long as they aren't disrupting classes or bullying others.



It's a graduation ceremony...sponsored by the government. How on earth is that not the school allowing the promotion of a certain religion


Because the girl was speaking about her own personal beliefs. The girl was not a paid member of the faculty of the school/government.



posted on Oct, 1 2012 @ 05:26 PM
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She was chosen to be the valedictorian. That is a very high honor. She was the top student at her high school. She was a Christian and chose to honor her God publicly in her speech. I think that this was her right.

No ones ears burned off at the mention of God. I doubt that any harm was done to the atheists in the audience.

What harm was done?

In the US we have freedom of religion, not freedom from religion.

If this goes to trial, and I hope that it does, I think that the courts will look stupid.





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