Chinese hackers have control of US power grid

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posted on Sep, 29 2012 @ 03:32 AM
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Originally posted by SplitInfinity
reply to post by HermitShip
 

The Chinese Hackers are responsible for many incursions into the U.S. GRID...but only because we allow them to. It works like this...we let them hack our systems to an extent to see just how far or capable they are. We might even allow access for a time...but it is all for the purpose of gauging an adversary.


This isn't Wargames dude you gotta lay off the pipe, you can't just play sh!t and giggles like this, primary once an exploit has been triggered it can crash machines completely can you imagine the software that handles the flying logistics for all jets in the air at the same time going "blue screen" on them??? Or the software for the armament system of the drones going ape sh!t and start to spit missiles??? Once the attacker has poked a hole the damage is done, from there it can take less than a minute to run a privilege escalation attack and fire a root kit installation in most case those are all automated so it can be done a.s.a.p while you clean your tracks and check if someone noticed you got in...



The U.S. Military Cyber Division has a MASSIVE BUDGET. Some estimate that over 70% of that budget is Covert thus it is much larger than the Huge Public Budget disclosed.


Its called "security by obscurity" the principle is to scare people in believe "since its the army its unhackable" and it works on feeble minds no insults intended... They get hacked on a daily basis just as any other country, banks and what not but do you really think they'll go on the news saying "Hey folks guess what... you know the 100billion budget we've been using from your taxes for our nation's security??? Welllll it wasn't worth # cuz the Chinese pwned our asses last night" Seriously what do you think would happen???



If you think for a SECOND the U.S. Military would not have the capability to BURN any Hack or Tag the Hack and insert a TOMBSTONE VIRUS on any Hacking Adversary...then you are delusional. The INTERNET WAS CREATED BY THE U.S. MILITARY! It has ways and lanes and Back Doors that NO ONE KNOWS ABOUT!


Now you are realllyyyyy far fetching... Primary YOU are seriously delusional and have no clue of the subject you are talking about... first you can't "BURN" or "TAG" a hacking attack WTH are you talking about man? Second... How in the world do you want to "insert" a virus in a hacking attack... Do you have any knowledge what so ever in networking and/or programming? Its a rhetorical question btw...

The internet wasn't created by the US Army the pretty much sponsored the scientist that did, though it would be possible to "backdoor" a protocol wake up TCP/IP is open source MILLIONS of people dissect it on a daily basis to create programs that communicate with themselves or the outside world... do you seriously think that if TCP/ip was backdoored it wouldn't of been found DECADES ago? What are you on? I want some of that stuff dude seriously...

PS: Even if they have friggen technology thats 300 years ago of its time the internet itself still run on TCP/ipv4 which is dating back the damn 70's... you know like... when carburators were still the sh!t... Does the words "non-compatibility" ring any bells? I hope it does cuz seriously man... seriously...
edit on 29-9-2012 by _R4t_ because: (no reason given)




posted on Sep, 29 2012 @ 04:23 AM
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reply to post by _R4t_
 

YES...I am aware of the constant hacking of U.S. Military systems as well as Civilian Power Grids and even Nuclear Reactors. I am not even much of a Computer guy...but the people I work for on occasion are very much so.

The U.S. Military has TENS OF THOUSANDS of networked systems and many of these have been hacked. But I also know this...the U.S. Cyber Division has the ability to tag as well as infect in coming Hacks. This is not dome on various non-critical systems but they have a CHURN EM AND BURN EM Networked Super Computing Hack Destroyer System which tracks all hacks as well as is infecting Tagged Hacks with a Dormant Virus that is not only just lines of code but has actually been integrated with Commercial, Personal and Internet Servers for over 2 Decades.

The concept was to continue to place a form of Virus that works with the actual Multitude of Personal Computers, Commercial Servers, Internet mainframes so in the event of a Full Blown all out Cyber Attack as a precursor to WAR...our adversaries believing that they had an undetected line of Hacking our systems from a variety of Thousands of Networked PC's and Mainframes...we could activate the Dormant Viral Encoding which uses the Hackers own code to rewrite and become our Network.

Ask yourself this...a SUPER POWER with Systems such as ECHELON and EPSILON....under SIGINT as well as other Programs that are supposedly getting ready to integrate the Whispered QUANTUM COMPUTER that has been developed even though those who have worked on it do not fully understand it. Yet...even though the U.S. Military and NSA has these capabilities...you actually think that they are not prepared for an actual Cyber Attack?

In my experiences with how the Military works...it can be downright STUPID at certain levels and BEYOND BRILLIANT at other levels. Also...to think that they would not prepare for a Massive Hack on Multiple Levels is beyond stupid. Split Infinity



posted on Sep, 29 2012 @ 07:02 AM
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According to KrebsOnSecurity.com, the company does not think that the intruders got any information that would enable them to gain access to a customer system or that any of the compromised computers have been connected to a customer system

Joe Stewart, director of malware research at Dell SecureWorks said the Web site and malware names cited in the Telvent report map back to a Chinese hacking team known as the “Comment Group.” Comment Group has been involved in sophisticated attacks to harvest intellectual property and trade secrets from energy companies, patent law firms and investment banks.


Doesn't sound like 'having control' of the US grid.

Fear to drum up business for security, the business of the future.



posted on Sep, 29 2012 @ 08:41 AM
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Any organization can be hacked. I don't care who or what you are.... Many people on this website seem to think that banks control the world. Well guess what? They are prime targets in cyber warfare right now. And many of them have been hacked....

New wave of cyber attacks against banking


Hell, even the CIA has been hacked....not just once but numerous times. I feel bad for that team.... I bet that made for a bitch of a morning.

Ano n brings down CIA

Hackers have even managed to get into closed network systems. That's the whole point of Stuxnet and the damage done to Iran. If it is a network, closed or otherwise, its vulnerable to cyber warfare.
edit on 29-9-2012 by CIAGypsy because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 29 2012 @ 11:39 AM
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Doesn't sound like 'having control' of the US grid.

Fear to drum up business for security, the business of the future.


You are spot on, I mean... you can really trust that those companies will defend you against Flame if you buy their product for $69+ dollars every year. Flame was nothing really special at all if you break it down, the media distorted it to become this magical piece of malware that can do anything, anywhere at anytime and YOU are vulnerable so you better buy our software. Symantec, Kaspersky and the other main companies in the anti-malware game are drumming up fear by this whole ordeal in order to buy their products.

edit on 29-9-2012 by Laxpla because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 29 2012 @ 12:24 PM
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Originally posted by OccamAssassin
reply to post by adjensen
 



Why critical computers that control things like air traffic control or the power grid are on networks that are connected to the Internet boggles the mind.


The systems are (generally) not connected to the internet. Usually the hackers connect directly to the systems via their internal networks. In the old days....a dialer would be set up to systematically call a range of phone numbers until a computer was found.....then the type of system and potential entry points can be identified.

The military works the same. Critical systems only run on dedicated networks.

Can you imagine the ramifications if a hacker were able to take control of a drone?


Can you imagine the ramifications of Big Brother would take control of the drones? oh sorry... it's already there.

So okay, then... Skynet? But of course, all the military's systems are in the right hands, controlled by the most accountable and morally well-founded leaders the military establishment can afford, so the Beast they are creating simply cannot turn against us!



posted on Sep, 29 2012 @ 01:15 PM
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The article is misleading. Hackers never have control of any power grid. The people in charge of the company have the control. That is how they got in in the first place, even from the rest of the population. They can grab the moneys from the cities in bills and taxes but they can't get the hackers? That's nonsensical.

I don't believe the Comment Group has it. I think it's a distraction from a real familiar threat. It's a ploy to take one's biggest enemy and say "they did it" in any weak situation, setting up someone who is incompetent to do such an act. Even should the Comment Group break in, the industrial facts, they are well known in all nations, because the energy companies in charge of the cities, mostly international companies. Big conglomos. How secretive can it be, from the power station, to the generator things, to the power lines, to the houses?

It's another trick to for hackers to pretend to be Chinese when they aren't. Or for someone on the inside of our very own nation (cough, 9/11), to set up someone for an elaborate insurance fraud in the energy sector, preparing for destruction and finding the right country to pin it on.

Devon Energy just finished a deal with Sumitomo Corporation, a Japanese company, $1.4 billion dollars. The headquarters is in Oklahoma City, a big building, the biggest in the city. Ed dames the remote viewer had mentioned that there would be an attempted terrorist attack close to there. I still fall for those predictions and agree it's a possibility, unless we all decide to change Ed Dames' mind.

If I dwell on it long enough, and use my imagination to concoct a theory, I find that it's not actually China, but AlQaida that comes through Europe and Canada, using terrorist cells in the USA, provoking big countries like PRC and USA to war. I remote view the past, along the street by the Dell building in Oklahoma City, seeing a terrorist with a video camera -- he looks like he's from the South China Sea, Cambodia... he rode on the back of AlQaida, from a ship towards South America, up through the Mexico border, into Texas, one of three places all foreigners truly recognize as American (the other two are New York and Hollywood). It's a joint venture for them too? He videos the tall building, with Dell building in front of the tower from his angle, then sneaks the video camera under his jacket. I see other intelligence agents watching. They watch, but why don't they arrest? Did they secretly invite him, trying to cement his motives in true crime? Or are they secretly hoping this videographer gets hit by a bus?

I see... there is a Muslim man, they gave him a fake passport in Europe, is it London? They sent him to Texas, puts him on display. When this stuff goes down they know who to blame, it's him, even though he's a pawn. He's trafficked, sponsored by European bandits.

See it ain't all China. It's the whole world messing with the little guy who can't afford solar panels or an electric generator, or a zero point energy device for his or her home.
edit on 29-9-2012 by Sandalphon because: the the



posted on Sep, 29 2012 @ 02:57 PM
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I doubt this can be possible!

Why would they want to do that?

ether way, if they have the control of the power grid there is nothing i can do about it


Also i use candles, torches and solar panels in my house



posted on Sep, 29 2012 @ 03:19 PM
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To whom said "can u imagine the ramification of someonw hacking a drone" its already been done using stuff u can find at your lical walmart pretty much...

digitaljournal.com...



posted on Sep, 29 2012 @ 03:42 PM
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reply to post by CIAGypsy
 


This doesn't surprise me in the slightest.

I once saw an episode of that program where Stephen Fry was in the USA, and he was talking to some government or university tech specialist, and the guy basically said that they were constantly under attack from state-sponsored hackers hammering to get in, trying to find any way they could to sneak through.

I think it was compared to a movie scene, like hoards of an enemy army constantly smashing at the gates to the castle, climbing the walls, swarming to get in.

The major problem - as I see it - is that even though a system can be closed, when it's that big there is always a weakness. It could all be on a secure internal system, but over billions of cables and thousands of machines there will be a connection to an outside entry somewhere.

I used to work in a secure office where it was totally isolated from the outside physically, but with fifty machines in the room all it would have taken would be for a cleaner or office assistant to plug the wrong cable into the wrong socket and the system would have been open to attack. When you scale that up to thousands of machines, the chances of there being an entry rise dramatically.

Still, we all know that the first move in any war involving China would probably be a cyber attack to shut down the economic system and services.



posted on Sep, 29 2012 @ 03:55 PM
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For those who might be interested, the debate that vkey08 suggested on page one of this thread, prompted by the OP's post, has begun in the ATS Debate Forum: www.abovetopsecret.com...



posted on Sep, 29 2012 @ 04:02 PM
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reply to post by adjensen
 


Your thread has apparently been deleted. In response to that thread, but also in relation to this topic here, the United States is too reliant on external stimuli, of which technology is only one category. It is one branch of the Tree of External Stimuli.

To that end, it is beneficial to lose power. However, it must be noted that all of our means of survival have been plugged into the power grid as well - which means it's not just our pleasures, but our sustenance that suffers as well.



posted on Sep, 29 2012 @ 04:37 PM
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Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by adjensen
 


Your thread has apparently been deleted. In response to that thread, but also in relation to this topic here, the United States is too reliant on external stimuli, of which technology is only one category. It is one branch of the Tree of External Stimuli.

To that end, it is beneficial to lose power. However, it must be noted that all of our means of survival have been plugged into the power grid as well - which means it's not just our pleasures, but our sustenance that suffers as well.


No, the thread is there, it just can't be responded to by anyone other than the other person in the debate. Thanks for the feedback, though -- I'm just getting warmed up in the debate



posted on Sep, 29 2012 @ 04:38 PM
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Originally posted by OccamAssassin
reply to post by adjensen
 



Why critical computers that control things like air traffic control or the power grid are on networks that are connected to the Internet boggles the mind.

The systems are (generally) not connected to the internet. Usually the hackers connect directly to the systems via their internal networks. In the old days....a dialer would be set up to systematically call a range of phone numbers until a computer was found.....then the type of system and potential entry points can be identified.

The military works the same. Critical systems only run on dedicated networks.

Can you imagine the ramifications if a hacker were able to take control of a drone?


Greetings:


In the old days....a dialer would be set up to systematically call a range of phone numbers until a computer was found.....then the type of system and potential entry points can be identified.


The one that our friend JD/Captain Crunch worked with was called "Charlie" and would identify a range of 'invisible' numbers that were portals to most anything - in the old days.

We had 'meeting halls' in the back door of 'sophisticated' systems at Fortune 500 companies - just for fun - nothing ever malicious.


Can you imagine the ramifications if a hacker were able to take control of a drone?

Can you imagine the ramifications if a hacker were able to take control of a cooling systems computer at a nuclear power plant?

Say, Indian Point.

tfw



posted on Sep, 29 2012 @ 05:31 PM
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How come remote viewers never tell of actual events before they happen? Are they evil or just not actually seeing a reality.



posted on Sep, 29 2012 @ 07:39 PM
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Originally posted by _R4t_
To whom said "can u imagine the ramification of someonw hacking a drone" its already been done using stuff u can find at your lical walmart pretty much...

digitaljournal.com...


No it hasn't.

www.secretprojects.co.uk...



posted on Sep, 29 2012 @ 08:04 PM
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Originally posted by Laxpla

Originally posted by _R4t_
To whom said "can u imagine the ramification of someonw hacking a drone" its already been done using stuff u can find at your lical walmart pretty much...

digitaljournal.com...


No it hasn't.

www.secretprojects.co.uk...


Yes it was and you dont have much understanding oh RF wave propagation neither does the people in this forum, they are confusing jamming with spoofing and seem to believe it cant work if the signal doesnt come from orbit which is a clueless assumption...

1-an antenna has no clue where rhe signal come from it just pickup signal.
2- they debate that there's no such thing as ground gps, thats uneducated ranting, the signal coming from the groung is a spoofed/mimicked signal that immitate the one from orbit however since its coming from closer it overpowers the one from orbit causing the drone to be fooled into believing the spoofed signal is the "right" one.
3-implying the signal as to come from orbit is stupid what would happen if the drone fly upside down or makes a 90 degree turn. It stops getting or processing the signal?
4-Even if such thing was true that it would on,t pickup signal from orbit, it would be a child game to bypass this counter mesure by bouncing the RF on the atmosphere which is a comon practice for a. Radio operator to allow them to communicate further... Ever wondered why am radio ops go nuts when theres nothern lights

5-Yes it was hacked, the drone was fooled into hooking to the false mimicked gps signal and the dude pretty much remote controlled it has he wished...

Same technique could be applied to the armament system although encrypted i'm sure is not impossible...

Anything that can be put together can be taken appart...
Anything thats encrypted can be decrypted...
Anything thats remote controlled can be remote controlled...

Its just a matter of gaining enough knowledge about the technology used to find a way to force it to behave as desired...

I've been in electronic, computers and coding since im 9 years old im now 30 its pretty much all i know... my dad detain one of the highest radio am license in canada and is an electronic enginner, since i'm 11 i've been obsess with computer security so i have a vast background in technology and i can confirm you everything said by that dude in the article jives and is technologically accurate...

Same type of attack in computer hacking where you spoof the packet source coming from a machine to make another machine believe its coming from one it trust to exploit the network trust relationship between the machines to have it leak more information it should or gain unauthorised access...



posted on Sep, 29 2012 @ 08:10 PM
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reply to post by CIAGypsy
 





Hell, even the CIA has been hacked....not just once but numerous times. I feel bad for that team.... I bet that made for a bitch of a morning.


You shouldn't feel bad for them. They are not on your team. But you already know that.....



posted on Sep, 29 2012 @ 09:23 PM
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reply to post by ObjectZero
 


Would that not give them a huge tactical advantage though? Knowing precisely where the weak spots are in the grid so a few well placed explosives can knock out massive sections of the grid.

Think back to 2003.



posted on Sep, 29 2012 @ 09:37 PM
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reply to post by _R4t_
 


Thanks for correcting me, I was basing my information off that forum and some tidbits I picked up along the way. I was inferring about the RQ-170 and Iran's original claim of "hacking" it. I was always under the impression that in order to mimic the controller input signals is to access the sat-com antenna which means you need proper signal coding, wavelength, and protocols, the "access" transmitter has to be above the antenna to be in the proper position. If it was so cut and dry I would suppose Iran would be able to do it again for another propaganda trophy.

Your background, Very cool, you're similar to my friend who is into computer security. He maintains a site called infiltrated.net, and a lot of information about the Flame malware, China and everything in between and could pertain to this thread a lot. Something you might enjoy reading as its up your ally!



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