Iran Haters: NOW what....? What crime do you charge Ahmedinejad with?

Not only that, but also Israel was never led under a fanatic religious leadership.

Really? So...you don't think that Israel has been run by a bunch of religious kooks exploiting religion as an excuse to kill, maim, oppress and torture innocent civilians every single day of it's illegal existence?

....or do you have some type of alternative definition of "religious fanatic" that I am not aware of?

Adding to the mix the fact that Iran is a theocracy that has stated numerous times it's desire to wipe the Israelis off the map, and it's only logical to try and prevent it.

You say this as though Israel wasn't a theocracy who already did wipe Palestine off the map.

You, ofcourse, who wishes to see Israel burn to the ground, have no problems with an Iranian nuke.

Well...at least we can agree on something.

Also, whether they said Israel should be wiped off or Zionist regime or whatever - that doesn't matter squat when you're building and aiming a nuclear weapon at that area. People use the idiotic excuse of "oh he didn't say that", as if the nuclear payload has a way to distinct between and Israeli and a Zionist, or as if they are going to launch a small one at the Knesset alone.

Oh...I don't believe Iran for a second that they don't fully intend to build a nuclear weapon...but you're missing the point.
I want Iran to have nuclear weapons...I think it would make the world a much safer place. Quite simply, anybody who has nukes simply doesn't get invaded. Respect for sovereign borders is PARAMOUNT to stability in the Middle East. If Iran and even a couple of other Middle Eastern countries have their hands on some nukes...then I guess everyone will just have to behave. Israel and the US included.

Originally posted by SeekerofTruth101

It is one thing for a human to love a country of his birth, the land of his ancestors, and QUITE another to claim he loves the rulers of the land. Rulers come and go, with their totalitarianism, but the land is forever.

I do not suppose you can clear this up a little?
Are you saying that I might hate the leaders, laws, policies, government, infrastructure of my country but I might stay there because the grass and dirt there brings back memories of before I was born?

reply to post by Iwinder

Yes it does and if you have the time ask Iraq/ Afghanistan/and many other countries. The USA has been in perpetual war for as long as most people can remember.

They are the aggressor in the world and seem to do what they please.

The USA does not storm embassies, they level a country then build the biggest embassy in the world to make the point we are here to stay......(Iraq)

Regards, iwinder

First, let me remind you of the thread title here:

Iran Haters: NOW what....? What crime do you charge Ahmedinejad with?

If you look at my initial post, you will see that I stated that Ahmedinejad was never prosecuted/punished for his war crime(s) conducted in 1979 in hostage taking.

Second, my other post was in reference to why Iran should be denied nuclear weapons.

As "BAD" as the U.S. may be on recent war fronts, and I concede with you that in hindsight Iraq was a BIG mistake--at least the U.S. is not covertly conducting activities like storming hosted embassies, burning others' flags, etc. on US soil with state-sponsored media to show it off like a trophy.

In other words, the US is at least a nation of many religions, cultures, backgrounds where individuals are free to express their opinions but in most cases, it is not one of *hatred* like the degree of Ahmedinejad and the Extremists.

US is more a nation of more tolerance/caution than Iran. How can you argue against that?

Originally posted by My.mind.is.mine
There is no "you" because I never made any mention of Russia..

Russia is the only interval for this to go WW3. If Russia does not intervene, this conflict will mostly revolve around Israel - Iran - USA (and even that's at a question mark).

However, allow me to grant YOU a dose of reality...

You sir, propagate a preemptive strike on the PEOPLE of Iran (let's not forget they ARE people), because of the OFF chance that Iran MAY BE developing nukes,

When people like me consider the fact that a religious nation insists it's making effort into creating nuclear reactors for peaceful purposes but does the complete opposite by creating nuclear weapons - the people who are in charge of it (from Engineer to Ayatollah) are all legitimate soldiers. An attack on Iran is going to be an attack on it's nuclear facilities, not civilian populations as it would serve no purpose what-so-ever.

and MAY attack Israel, DESPITE the fact that Iran canNOT atack Israel, as it's against the prophecy that Ahmedinejad is trying to fulfill....

Against what prophecy? The one that says they cannot be the aggressor? Hmm.. I was sure I've heard Iran accuses Israel and the US more than once about their prior aggressions towards them, whether it was the CIA funded rebellions in their country, or the American drone, or the Mossad operatives that killed the nuclear scientists, or the Israeli viruses that were used against the facilities... And the list of accusations goes on and on and on (to even stealing rain and using spy dolphins/birds).

That's the reality. You advocate murder, out of fear of MAYBE murder, which realistically, considering the script Iran is tryna follow - won't happen...

I advocate for the destruction of Iran's nuclear ambitions. If by any chance these facilities will be empty of people once they are struck, it's all the merrier from my point of view. I'm also a big supporter of covert war (viruses) against these facilities, as long as nobody truly innocent gets hurt. And when I mean truly innocent, scientists who work in order to achieve nuclear weapons for their religious regime are not innocent.

Originally posted by DOLCOTT
Forget all your silly notions of peace and love and which is worse. The bottom line is that the Islamists have a religous obligation to conqueor the world and convert or kill eevry nonmuslim. What part of this do you not understand.

The part where my Christian bible says the same things about Christians and I live in a country where one segment of the ruling class claims to be of a Christian nation and just happens to constantly export death.

For those saying Israel is not led by a fanatic theocratic faction....

reply to post by IsraeliGuy

reply to post by watchesfromwall


My understanding is that the evidence against Ahmedinejad is spurious at best (for example, the guy in the picture that has been widely circulated looks nothing like him). I seem to recall there are some grey areas as to his involvement but an accurate Police description would be "wish to eliminate him from our enquiries" rather than "suspect being questionned".

Originally posted by michaelbrux
Iran played a part in the creation of the Zionist regime to cover up its own past crimes.

you wouldn't understand so we'll have to sit back and watch this play out.

when no war occurs...all their crap will begin seeping from every hole in their decrepit body.

you are right, but which Iran are you talking about?

The Iran under the Shah who was a puppet to the west? the same Shah who shook hands with Saddam Hussein?

or pre 1979 revolution Iran? When the Shah was deposed by a popular uprise?

Originally posted by My.mind.is.mine

Rabbis may say whatever they wish, the fact stays that they are in no way a part of the government that responsible for decision making, neither are they advisors of any kind. In case of a war, to the Israeli government, a Rabbi's opinion will matter less than a financial advisor's. And that's a fact.

To compare Israel with Iran in terms of religion in the leadership is hilarious. Iran is based upon a religious regime of Ayatollahs and government official that publicly speak for prophecies to come true, and Imams that are supposed to arrive.

Iran is religious by it's core while Israel simply isn't. These are facts.

Also, there's a big difference between going on a publicity tour for spiritual guidance to a Rabbi (accompanied by Cameras), and having a 'Great Ayatollah' that rules over the country along with his slightly less great Ayatollahs.

Originally posted by IsraeliGuy

Originally posted by My.mind.is.mine

Rabbis may say whatever they wish, the fact stays that they are in no way a part of the government that responsible for decision making, neither are they advisors of any kind. In case of a war, to the Israeli government, a Rabbi's opinion will matter less than a financial advisor's. And that's a fact.

To compare Israel with Iran in terms of religion in the leadership is hilarious. Iran is based upon a religious regime of Ayatollahs and government official that publicly speak for prophecies to come true, and Imams that are supposed to arrive.

Iran is religious by it's core while Israel simply isn't. These are facts.

Really....? Or are you just in denial about who Bibi answers to..?

Can't you see through it all? Now all of a sudden Israel is dead set on going to war with what happens to be another nation with an opposing prophecy...... Right after Bibi was instructed to hasten the coming of the messiah........ come on man...

It's not that Iran is, and Israel isn't.

It's that Iran has the balls to be upfront about it and Israel doesn't.

Originally posted by My.mind.is.mine
It's that Iran has the balls to be upfront about it and Israel doesn't.

No, it's the fact that Israel has no Rabbi in the circle of decision making in the government while Iran's decision makers are consisted of religious fanatics.

You can't even tell the difference between a televised trip to a Rabbi in order to gain some guidance (and to earn some votes in the religious sect, more precisely), and a regime that is composed out of religious people in various ranks? And you're telling me to wake up? Lol.

Originally posted by IsraeliGuy

Originally posted by My.mind.is.mine
It's that Iran has the balls to be upfront about it and Israel doesn't.

No, it's the fact that Israel has no Rabbi in the circle of decision making in the government while Iran's decision makers are consisted of religious fanatics.

You can't even tell the difference between a televised trip to a Rabbi in order to gain some guidance (and to earn some votes in the religious sect, more precisely), and a regime that is composed out of religious people in various ranks? And you're telling me to wake up? Lol.

Right... his guidance was very simple..................................................

HASTEN THE COMING OF THE MESSIAH...... pshhhh

ETA: waiiitttt, why the hell didn't I notice your name before????? consider this a super biased debate..

Yup, when you're presented with undisputed facts and all you've got are baseless speculations, always aim for the user's name. Don't you think that if I tried to hide it I wouldn't choose this username? Haha.

Dude, do us both a favor and don't pretend you're not biased, dare I say of Islamic faith. We could both be civil about it and handle it in a debate - or we could stand around pointing at our usernames and laugh.

It's already clear to me which way you're going to take but it's worth a try.

Originally posted by IsraeliGuy
Yup, when you're presented with undisputed facts and all you've got are baseless speculations, always aim for the user's name.

Dude, do us both a favor and don't pretend you're not biased, dare I say of Islamic faith. We could both be civil about it and handle it in a debate - or we could stand around pointing at our usernames and laugh.

It's already clear to me which way you're going to take but it's worth a try.

The ONLY facts in our exchange was the video which IIII posted.. You presented NO facts at all.... don't kid yourself..

Originally posted by My.mind.is.mine
The ONLY facts in our exchange was the video which IIII posted.. You presented NO facts at all.... don't kid yourself..

Your video presents the fact that Bibi went to a Rabbi, accompanied with TV cameras in order to seek for some guidance. My word vs your word on it, and since I live in Israel I claim that it was a part of a voter campaign which is not too uncommon. Whether you accept it or not is not even relevant since you somehow see your video as a proof that Israel is as religious as Iran. Well:

Facts:
Israel
"Government Parliamentary democracy"

Iran
"Government Unitary state, Islamic republic"

You try and compare both countries' religiousness by showing a clip of Bibi meeting with a Rabbi, yet somehow it supposed to compete with the fact that the entire Iranian decision making circle is religious? Lmfao.

...Are you going to point at my user name again?

Also, correct me if I'm wrong, but did you just say that it is not a fact that Iran's government is religious? I mean, I did present it as a fact and you seem to discard it from some reason. It would be nice if you could explain how it is not a fact (but I'm afraid you'll prefer to write something with a big bold font and switch subject).

Originally posted by IsraeliGuy

Originally posted by My.mind.is.mine
The ONLY facts in our exchange was the video which IIII posted.. You presented NO facts at all.... don't kid yourself..

Your video presents the fact that Bibi went to a Rabbi, accompanied with TV cameras in order to seek for some guidance. My word vs your word on it, and since I live in Israel I claim that it was a part of a voter campaign which is not too uncommon. Whether you accept it or not is not even relevant since you somehow see your video as a proof that Israel is as religious as Iran. Well:

Facts:
Israel
"Government Parliamentary democracy"

Iran
"Government Unitary state, Islamic republic"


...Are you going to point at my user name again?

1) If Israel is not a Jewish state then now they have less than 0% right to the land that they're stealing. Leave ISRAEL to the Jews, so it can be a Jewish land then.. LOL

2) You skirted around the border, and came back to my point. Iran is an open Islamic republic, and the prophecy which they're trying to fulfill says they cannot attack first, and must be attacked.

3) Your basis for saying we should go ahead with it is they MIGHT say that the west has ALREADY attacked them in other ways.........

my God.... just terrible....

Just know, your country is arguably one of the most corrupt and questionable, from its origin to it's foreign policy... The under handed tactics and shady dealings don't help either..

Not to mention genocide..........

Originally posted by RizeorDie

Originally posted by michaelbrux
Iran played a part in the creation of the Zionist regime to cover up its own past crimes.

you wouldn't understand so we'll have to sit back and watch this play out.

when no war occurs...all their crap will begin seeping from every hole in their decrepit body.

you are right, but which Iran are you talking about?

The Iran under the Shah who was a puppet to the west? the same Shah who shook hands with Saddam Hussein?

or pre 1979 revolution Iran? When the Shah was deposed by a popular uprise?

doesn't matter. and this is why I believe that it doesn't matter.

in my opinion, the Islamic Revolution in Iran was fake. probably so Iran can pretend to not have any connection to the creation of Israel. the Shah of Iran didn't flee Iran to escape justice, but to establish his family and nobility in America...the target of a war launched against the west long ago. the current government in Iran is probably some kind of Trust arrangement while their Shah adventures in the west...

to the extent that any of the iranian revolution was real...all that work was undone during the Iran/Iraq war of the 80s, when the current Supreme Leader, a member of the very same tribe as the last Shah, took power in 1988/89. Saddam Hussein invaded Iran as part of this whole scheme of a continuing war against western civilization.

So...when I'm looking at Netanyahoo cry wolf, I see it as just that...

Iran is who builds the Temples in Jerusalem and no one else...its their thing. Solomon, in retrospect, was an ally of the Persians and Darius the Persian finished the Second Temple. This being a fact, it is therefore impossible to reconcile the notion that Iran and Jewish Israel could possibly be enemies. Iran is the only people on earth that can fulfill the most critical component of Jewish Prophecy.

Israel was created with the intention of being an America trap.... had this been successful, Israel would have been wiped from the pages of time on 8 November 2005; right along with the 'real' America.

Since it wasn't successful, Israel will exist forever...just like Israeli's say they want.

and the super intelligent Persian/Iranian that was involved in its construction can be mocked by its presence until the stars burn out of the sky.

Originally posted by My.mind.is.mine
1) If Israel is not a Jewish state then now they have less than 0% right to the land that they're stealing. Leave ISRAEL to the Jews, so it can be a Jewish land then.. LOL

Unfortunately for you, you are not in charge of the terms in which Israel was to remain a state or not.

Anyhow.. I'm not surprised you can't tell the difference between these two phrases:

1. The state of Israel mostly belongs to the Jewish people.
2. The leadership in Israel is religious like Iran.

Not surprising at all.
Please refer back one post to see my presentation of solid facts for the Iranian leadership to be an Islamic republic (religious) and the Israeli one a Democratic (secular). The fact that the country is mostly Jewish does not and cannot contradict these facts.

2) You skirted around the border, and came back to my point. Iran is an open Islamic republic, and the prophecy which they're trying to fulfill says they cannot attack first, and must be attacked.

Actually I posted in accordance to you. If anyone went over the rails it's you buddy, I simply followed along.
Anyway, yes, Iran is an open Islamic republic and they say they cannot be the aggressor. But wait, they did claim several times that they were under direct and indirect attacks from both the US and Israel.
If they had nukes right now, they'd launch them with the explanation that they were attacked (like I said - scientists assassinations, drone, viruses, stealing rain, spy dolphins - all their claim if you must be reminded) first and therefore are not the aggressors.

3) Your basis for saying we should go ahead with it is they MIGHT say that the west has ALREADY attacked them in other ways.........

Might? They already have stated the west and Israel attacked them. The reason they have not attacked yet is because they have nothing to attack with - eg; no nuke yet.

Just know, your country is arguably one of the most corrupt and questionable, from its origin to it's foreign policy... The under handed tactics and shady dealings don't help either..

If you truly believe that a person's opinion on a conspiracy site about my country is going to make me feel any worse, you are sadly mistaken. Save your strength.

Originally posted by My.mind.is.mine

That's one thing that I find a bit confusing about the left, they support a country/countries that are everything they claim to be against:mis-treatment of women, lack of gay rights, theocratic rule, etc. IMHO, so many have such a blind hatred for the US and the West and the free market, that they are willing to turn a blind eye to such things as long as it is against the US. This is rather silly, as they have much more freedom in the US than they would in many of these places.

Please do not further taint this thread with that bull# "left & right" stuff... None of it actually exists it's just a way that close minded people can go head to head with close minded people to keep them occupied. And it works quite well too.

Its not a taint, it is a quite accurate description of certain viewpoints in our society. Many people who stand up for gay and women's rights give a pass/support regimes that are exactly the opposite of their stated belief system in defiance of any sort of logic. The reason that remains is that they dislike the US or Israel so much, that they are willing to support regimes that otherwise they would consider an anthema.