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Actual question, not trolling: Why do Christians support a Jewish-run Israel?

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posted on Sep, 25 2012 @ 12:31 PM
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Why is it that so many Christians and conservatives support a Jewish-run Israel, basically being 100% behind wiping out Islam? Do they not think that Israel will then turn against Christians? If they can't play well with one religion, they won't be able to play well with any religion.




posted on Sep, 25 2012 @ 12:35 PM
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I am a Christian..

..But probably one of those few who will not advocate the current State of Israel today.

Because I don't think they are the 'Lost Sheep of the House of Israel'

"By their fruits, you shall know them"

They hardly look like lost sheep, but rather, ravening wolves!!

Jesus taught the sheep, lost or found will hunger for the 'Bread of Life' who is Jesus. The wolves on the other hand, lost or not, will hunger for the things of the flesh - money, wealth, pride of life, power, respect etc...

If you're a Christian and you support the current State of Israel, you don't understand your Bible!
edit on 25-9-2012 by ahnggk because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 25 2012 @ 12:37 PM
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the alternative would be a muslim Israel
do you think that would be any better?
jews are simply the lesser of 2 evils



posted on Sep, 25 2012 @ 12:38 PM
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Because Moses and Isa were prophets for jews.

Even though Jews killed Isa , but those Zionists could find some reason to unite and stand against the truth.

They believe that they are selected people and all prophets are supposed to be Jews.

If you read the history of Islam , you will find out how they started wars on Muhammad as soon as they new he is the prophet.



posted on Sep, 25 2012 @ 12:49 PM
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reply to post by cetaphobic
 


Because they are stupid and think they are doing gods work.



posted on Sep, 25 2012 @ 12:52 PM
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reply to post by ahnggk
 


Broad statement, the Jew's are God's chosen plain and simple. You do not need to be a theologian to figure that out. We as gentiles were grafted into the family by the death of Christ. You may not agree with their politics however if you lived under the threats Israel does, you might better understand their aggressive behavior. If rockets and bombers came over the Rio Grande, Texans would not tolerate it.



posted on Sep, 25 2012 @ 12:59 PM
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Originally posted by cetaphobic
Why is it that so many Christians and conservatives support a Jewish-run Israel, basically being 100% behind wiping out Islam? Do they not think that Israel will then turn against Christians? If they can't play well with one religion, they won't be able to play well with any religion.


I don't think that your question is framed very well. Israel is the Jewish nation. If it were run by Muslims, for example, it wouldn't Israel...so your question is a bit oddly framed. However, I think what you're probably trying to ask is do you believe in Israel in its current form, support that is, and in this I think you would find a lot of Christians who do not offer such support. To that end, you'll also find a lot of Jews in Israel who do not support Zionism.

You really need to do some more research before delving into this. Look into Ashkenazic Jews, what Zionist are actually trying to achieve, the resistance of those agendas amongst Rabbi populations in Israel, etc. Additionally, if you read the Bible, Old Testament in particular, God is pissed at Israel...pissed! So your statement; "being 100% behind wiping out Islam" is really rather ignorant and probably not really worthy of ATS or serious discussion.



posted on Sep, 25 2012 @ 01:19 PM
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reply to post by cetaphobic
 




Why is it that so many Christians and conservatives support a Jewish-run Israel, basically being 100% behind wiping out Islam? Do they not think that Israel will then turn against Christians? If they can't play well with one religion, they won't be able to play well with any religion.


Because most christians make the mistake of thinking the modern day state of Israel founded by secularists/atheists is a restored biblical Israel.



posted on Sep, 25 2012 @ 01:26 PM
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Originally posted by cetaphobic
Why is it that so many Christians and conservatives support a Jewish-run Israel, basically being 100% behind wiping out Islam? Do they not think that Israel will then turn against Christians? If they can't play well with one religion, they won't be able to play well with any religion.


Weird questions.
There are more than 1.6 billion muslims in the world,(23% of the world population) and around 13 millions jews (0.2% of the world population). Who is supposed to be "wiping out" who again?

Are you aware that christianism basically is judaism upgraded? Frankly, I never understood christians who are against jewish. Are you implying that christians should not support jewish religion, or that is somehow their decision about other religions' right to exist?

Israel IS the name of jewish people. (Israel is the name given to Jacob after his fight with the Angel of God. Jacob's descendants came to be known as the Israelites, eventually forming the tribes of Israel and ultimately the kingdom of Israel, from whence the name of modern day Israel.) There can't be any other kind of Israel but jewish.

Are you aware of any event in history where jewish people "turned around" against other religions, or any conquest wars started by jewish?

On a second thought, I think you are trolling.
edit on 25-9-2012 by WhiteHat because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 25 2012 @ 01:40 PM
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reply to post by WhiteHat
 




Are you aware that christianism basically is judaism upgraded?


Only in the minds of those so called "messianic jews".... basically Christians in jewish costumes... who the jews rally against.

Most Jews are opposed to the idea of Christianity being an upgraded form of Judaism.

The term "judeo-christian" is the biggest oxymoron you can come across... the reason?
Simple. Jesus and Judaism are absolutely incompatible.

If you have any doubts, go up to a Jew (preferably a Rabbi) and ask him where Jesus, the messiah stands in Judaism.




edit on 25-9-2012 by sk0rpi0n because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 25 2012 @ 01:55 PM
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reply to post by sk0rpi0n
 

It doesn't matter what the jewish people think. Look at the facts, read the holy books. They are the same. The root of christianity is judaism. They worship the same god, aren't they? The only difference is that the christians got their Messiah, while the jewish are still waiting for him.
edit on 25-9-2012 by WhiteHat because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 25 2012 @ 02:33 PM
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Originally posted by cetaphobic
Why is it that so many Christians and conservatives support a Jewish-run Israel, basically being 100% behind wiping out Islam? Do they not think that Israel will then turn against Christians? If they can't play well with one religion, they won't be able to play well with any religion.


I don't condone much of what Israel does because the biblical Israel was a theocracy not a democracy, neither is God democratic, nor is he a republican or democrat. It is our duty to minister to them about their Messiah until we are removed so in that respect we try to protect them from Islam which is dedicated to destroying them or according to their book "the day of resurrection will not come". We minister to them so that when that day comes when they are put to flight they will know who to call on because they have denied him for 2000 years. I have no doubt there are powerful jews who think they are using us towards their own ends but they are following a script that was laid down at the beginning of this mess. So to is Islam playing the part it was scripted for long ago. There are numerous prophecies speaking of that day when they will be redeemed.

An all jewish Israel is only possible under Yeshua (Jesus), all are adopted into the House of Israel in him, therefore it is impossible to have an "all jewish state" without Messiah being involved. I am all for them embracing Yeshua but the day of their redemption is not yet, it draws near but not yet.



posted on Sep, 25 2012 @ 02:35 PM
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Originally posted by cetaphobic
Why is it that so many Christians and conservatives support a Jewish-run Israel, basically being 100% behind wiping out Islam? Do they not think that Israel will then turn against Christians? If they can't play well with one religion, they won't be able to play well with any religion.


As a Christian, I have a divine mandate to bless Abraham's descendents through Jacob of the covenant. When God ordained their territory by their borders, I have to accept God's decision. I can't say it is unfair, the children of the covenant is forever as long as this planet is here.

As a Christian, I accept that as never having been of Israel by the flesh, I have been grafted in and become a part of Israel by the new covenant, but that new covenant is for those who come to God through Jesus Christ. The old covenant still stands as long as this planet is here and as long as God rules. Many times Israel might break their end of the covenant, but God does not. So God determines His end of the covenant and it will always stand from His end.

If the gifts and calling are without repentance, then God cannot say to the Christian "I repent for the old covenant, I will nullify it". God does not work that way. It was His covenant offered upon Mt. Sinai, and at that moment when Joshua said "You may serve the gods of your fathers before the flood, as for me and my house, we will serve the Lord" and the Hebrew nation agreed with it, then they are still of the covenant as long as they keep the statutes given to them. They do, so therefore, the covenant is still in place, God is still their God and no matter what the Christian might want to say, Israel remains the apple of His eye.

That is why I support it.
edit on 9/25/2012 by WarminIndy because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 25 2012 @ 02:45 PM
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Originally posted by WhiteHat
reply to post by sk0rpi0n
 

It doesn't matter what the jewish people think. Look at the facts, read the holy books. They are the same. The root of christianity is judaism. They worship the same god, aren't they? The only difference is that the christians got their Messiah, while the jewish are still waiting for him.
edit on 25-9-2012 by WhiteHat because: (no reason given)


Well, to us he is the same God, to them we are idolaters because we believe Jesus is the physical manifestation of God but we get this idea from their own scriptures in the hebrew bible (our old testament) and our new testament and from the teachings the apostles of Jesus left us. We are the same people, but we split 2000 years ago over Yeshua, the one we call Jesus Christ. It is prophecied that the 2 flocks shall become 1 in John 10, it has already begun as more and more orthodox jews begin to see we are telling the truth. It's a small start but it has started.
edit on 25-9-2012 by lonewolf19792000 because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 25 2012 @ 02:48 PM
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Originally posted by sk0rpi0n
reply to post by WhiteHat
 




Are you aware that christianism basically is judaism upgraded?


Only in the minds of those so called "messianic jews".... basically Christians in jewish costumes... who the jews rally against.

Most Jews are opposed to the idea of Christianity being an upgraded form of Judaism.

The term "judeo-christian" is the biggest oxymoron you can come across... the reason?
Simple. Jesus and Judaism are absolutely incompatible.

If you have any doubts, go up to a Jew (preferably a Rabbi) and ask him where Jesus, the messiah stands in Judaism.




edit on 25-9-2012 by sk0rpi0n because: (no reason given)


My best friend is Jewish. We have religious discussions all the time and she does believe that Christianity is out of Judaism, that to her, Jesus was a Jewish rabbi. I have had many discussions with other Jewish people and they all accept that Jesus was Jewish. They just don't accept Him as the Messiah, but that does not mean they never will. Of course they will, because the Bible declares it will happen. People need to have a little more faith in God's promises.



posted on Sep, 25 2012 @ 02:53 PM
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Originally posted by cetaphobic

Why is it that so many Christians and conservatives support a Jewish-run Israel, basically being 100% behind wiping out Islam? Do they not think that Israel will then turn against Christians? If they can't play well with one religion, they won't be able to play well with any religion.


We support Israel for many reasons.

It's not about wiping out Islam. It's about keeping the Muslims from wiping out Judaism in Israel.

The Bible says the land belongs to the Jews.

The Muslims believe that the land belongs to the Muslims and that there is no room for Judaism in the Middle East.

They want everyone in the Middle East to be Muslim so they can create their own "Muslim State" and form their own government.

It's been an ongoing battle for thousands of years.

Here's one reason why Christians are specifically supportive of Israel in general...

Genesis 12:1-3 (regarding the Jews and Israel)

1 Now the Lord had said unto Abram, Get thee out of thy country, and from thy kindred, and from thy father's house, unto a land that I will shew thee:

2 And I will make of thee a great nation, and I will bless thee, and make thy name great; and thou shalt be a blessing:

3 And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed.

As well as...

Zechariah 12

3 And in that day will I make Jerusalem a burdensome stone for all people: all that burden themselves with it shall be cut in pieces, though all the people of the earth be gathered together against it.

9 And it shall come to pass in that day, that I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem.



posted on Sep, 25 2012 @ 02:55 PM
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Originally posted by lonewolf19792000

Originally posted by WhiteHat
reply to post by sk0rpi0n
 

It doesn't matter what the jewish people think. Look at the facts, read the holy books. They are the same. The root of christianity is judaism. They worship the same god, aren't they? The only difference is that the christians got their Messiah, while the jewish are still waiting for him.
edit on 25-9-2012 by WhiteHat because: (no reason given)


Well, to us he is the same God, to them we are idolaters because we believe Jesus is the physical manifestation of God but we get this idea from their own scriptures in the hebrew bible (our old testament) and our new testament and from the teachings the apostles of Jesus left us. We are the same people, but we split 2000 years ago over Yeshua, the one we call Jesus Christ. It is prophecied that the 2 flocks shall become 1 in John 10, it has already begun as more and more orthodox jews begin to see we are telling the truth. It's a small start but it has started.
edit on 25-9-2012 by lonewolf19792000 because: (no reason given)


If God said it will happen, then it will happen. But it will only happen according to His time. It is just as wrong for Christians to not believe the prophecies regarding Israel, that God has determined a future for them. So they don't yet, God still knows they will, and that is the beauty of God's word. What God determines, God will make it happen.

It will only happen when the time of the gentiles are fulfilled, as the Bible says. To construct a new theology to get around that is wrong. That is why Replacement Theology is wrong, because it attempts to circumvent the promises made by God.

God promised the dispersal of the Jews, and it happened. God promised they would reject the Messiah the first time, and it happened. God promised they would come home, and it happened. Therefore. as God promised they would turn to the Messiah the second time, it will happen.



posted on Sep, 25 2012 @ 05:01 PM
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reply to post by WarminIndy
 



It will only happen when the time of the gentiles are fulfilled, as the Bible says. To construct a new theology to get around that is wrong. That is why Replacement Theology is wrong, because it attempts to circumvent the promises made by God.


I didn't say i believed in replacement theory but the truth is the jews there now are still in apostacy until they acknowledge their offense Hosea 5:15 and then Zechariah 12:10 happens when they recieve the spirit of grace and supplication.



posted on Sep, 25 2012 @ 08:35 PM
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Originally posted by lonewolf19792000
reply to post by WarminIndy
 



It will only happen when the time of the gentiles are fulfilled, as the Bible says. To construct a new theology to get around that is wrong. That is why Replacement Theology is wrong, because it attempts to circumvent the promises made by God.


I didn't say i believed in replacement theory but the truth is the jews there now are still in apostacy until they acknowledge their offense Hosea 5:15 and then Zechariah 12:10 happens when they recieve the spirit of grace and supplication.


I know you don't believe in it, some people on here that we have both talked to do believe in it. That is why I said that. And yes, even though they are still in it, God will redeem them in His time. You and I both agree that we believe the Bible.



posted on Sep, 25 2012 @ 09:57 PM
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reply to post by WhiteHat
 




It doesn't matter what the jewish people think. Look at the facts, read the holy books. They are the same. The root of christianity is judaism. They worship the same god, aren't they?


You are right when you say the root of Christianity is Judaism.

However, when you say they worship the same God...
some Christians do, except they have attributed divinity to Jesus and consider him to be a part of God.
some Christians go one step further and state that Jesus is the God of the Old Testament, thereby removing themselves from God entirely.



The only difference is that the christians got their Messiah, while the jewish are still waiting for him.

This is correct.





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