Is the Religion of Islam intolerant?

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posted on Sep, 24 2012 @ 03:21 AM
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Islam reigns in authoritative systems, much in the manner of a theocracy, and theocracies as we know do not share the same ideology of a free society as democratic nations do. So intrinsically, Islam's ultimate purpose is to garner control not only through society, but within the political system as well. This for example can be verified by how muslim groups in England have pushed for the legalization of Sharia law as an alternative to the current court system, which would mandate a change in legislation under the objective of overriding any existing laws that would obstruct the ruling of Sharia courts.

Growing use of Sharia courts by UK Muslims




posted on Sep, 24 2012 @ 03:35 AM
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reply to post by sk0rpi0n
 

Well, you've certainly confused this simple-minded old man.

The people who try and portray Islam as a hostile and violent religion are either ignorant of the rules of war in Islam.... or willingly deny it. These Islamic rules of war protected women, children and non-combatants and also called for the dignified treatment of prisoners of war.
Don't the rules of war only apply if you're at war? So why bother to mention them, if Islam is not at war with the West? And if Islam is at war with the West, perhaps we can dispense with some fooling around and get serious?



posted on Sep, 24 2012 @ 04:22 AM
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reply to post by charles1952
 




Don't the rules of war only apply if you're at war? So why bother to mention them, if Islam is not at war with the West? And if Islam is at war with the West, perhaps we can dispense with some fooling around and get serious?


I brought up the rules of war to show that Islam does NOT teach its followers to randomly kill infidels, as propagated by christian fundamentalists. The parts about Islamic rules of war is conveniently omitted whenever they rail against Islam. I guess its hard to have propaganda that Islam teaches merciless violence, if you also bring up the good things.

I cant imagine anybody say "Islam teaches violence....but it also has some rather commendable rules of war and teaches followers to treat their prisoners with dignity". It wouldn't work that way, don't you think ?



posted on Sep, 24 2012 @ 07:21 AM
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reply to post by neoholographic
 


To know is islam intolerant or not, one should learn about islam, not learn about muslim. The problem is it is not easy to learn, like most of the religions. Mostly these days we use logic as leader but not wisdom, and learn from one side only not from the other side, spiritual side that what most religions is about.

Talking about muslim will become a complex subject, because there are loads of sectarian within. Most muslim i believe still tolerance, but the problem is there are some muslim who are not tolerant, and radical. Not many of them but they are loud and easy to notice with their movement.

I can understand completely if non muslim think we are barbaric and intolerant, because some muslim really believe that, and these days they spread their teaching sporadically intense everywhere, and really worrying. Plus from people who hate islam whatever their reason, keep repeating Quran or hadith that taken out of context or weak, even wrong give them radical more fuel to spread their teaching. They used these websites for recomendation of their teaching to new student, saying even non muslim acknowledged the law, and i have seen that a lot because i debat them now and them,dont want these wrong understanding spread even more.

Meanwhile if i talk to non muslim about the truth of islam, sometimes and often they call me a liar, just covering it, and some repeating those teaching and make the radical more happy with more fuel material available on the net. Thats why i avoid to comment about this if i think it might be like i am afraid of.

Easily to think, if islam or muslim in general are intolerant and violent, i think war is inevitable since so long, and will already loads of massacre everywhere (if following the radical teaching cuz somehow they forgot to put the sharia law about justice court and system and requirement for capital punishment ).
Sometimes i just lost a hope about peace when seeing these kind of people in every believe or disbelieved. Why cant we just live along together and make life even better.

Peace



posted on Sep, 24 2012 @ 07:39 AM
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Originally posted by neoholographic
I'm asking because I don't know much about the Qur'an.

Is this just a case of misreading scripture like the Catholics and the Crusades? Or, is intolerance inherent in the Qur'an?

For instance, Jesus never forced anyone to follow him, so there wasn't any justification for the Crusades in Scripture. The rich man didn't follow Jesus and he didn't get struck by lightening or beheaded because he didn't follow Christ. Paul would preach the Gospel and some would follow and some wouldn't.

Is there intolerance in the Qur'an for those who are not Muslim or are the extremist doing what Catholics did in the Crusades and their using the religion as a reason to shed blood.


Muslims can be very tolerant of other religions and have been for centuries as seen in this video www.youtube.com... Islam: The Untold Story.

Then there is the Jihad factor. Not all Muslims use Jihad all the time. These days mostly the Extremist factions support an ongoing Jihad. A Jihad is when they use the teachings of the Quran to go forth and make converts of other nations for Allah.



posted on Sep, 24 2012 @ 11:32 AM
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Originally posted by Spooky1

Originally posted by neoholographic
I'm asking because I don't know much about the Qur'an.



All what you say is truely sad , your hatred towards islam not only blinds you to your errors but exposes your weak research.

I say again, do not take versus out of context, this is a primary NO BRAINER.
Also, you are cursing the prophet muhammed, and speaking the most vile things about him, as a rapist, killer, sick etc....
If you want to give the OP a true , coherent and well written reply i suggest you be neutral , stating facts, proven facts, without any emotional involvement as the OP never asked how we felt.

The message of jesus was NOT of PEACE and LOVE. any christian who has read a few pages of the bible would know and tell you it has the goriest , bloodiest, sickest and most perverted messages to humanity.
Let me show you a few examples:

-If a man lies with a male as with a women, both of them shall be put to death for their abominable deed; they have forfeited their lives.Leviticus 20:13 NAB
In Islam they are whipped by choice, not necessarily murdered or stoned.

-A man or a woman who acts as a medium or fortuneteller shall be put to death by stoning; they have no one but themselves to blame for their death. (Leviticus 20:27 NAB)

-Whoever strikes his father or mother shall be put to death. (Exodus 21:15)
Really? islam would never ask you to do this.

- If one curses his father or mother, his lamp will go out at the coming of darkness. (Proverbs 20:20 NAB)
- All who curse their father or mother must be put to death. They are guilty of a capital offense. (Leviticus 20:9 NLT)

- If a man commits adultery with another man's wife, both the man and the woman must be put to death. (Leviticus 20:10 NLT)

-Whoever sacrifices to any god, except the Lord alone, shall be doomed. (Exodus 22:19 NAB)

-Kill Nonbelievers (children included)
They entered into a covenant to seek the Lord, the God of their fathers, with all their heart and soul; and everyone who would not seek the Lord, the God of Israel, was to be put to death, whether small or great, whether man or woman. (2 Chronicles 15:12-13 NAB)

-Kill the Entire Town if One Person Worships Another God
Suppose you hear in one of the towns the LORD your God is giving you that some worthless rabble among you have led their fellow citizens astray by encouraging them to worship foreign gods. In such cases, you must examine the facts carefully. If you find it is true and can prove that such a detestable act has occurred among you, you must attack that town and completely destroy all its inhabitants, as well as all the livestock. Then you must pile all the plunder in the middle of the street and burn it. Put the entire town to the torch as a burnt offering to the LORD your God. That town must remain a ruin forever; it may never be rebuilt. Keep none of the plunder that has been set apart for destruction. Then the LORD will turn from his fierce anger and be merciful to you. He will have compassion on you and make you a great nation, just as he solemnly promised your ancestors. "The LORD your God will be merciful only if you obey him and keep all the commands I am giving you today, doing what is pleasing to him." (Deuteronomy 13:13-19 NLT)

-From there Elisha went up to Bethel. While he was on his way, some small boys came out of the city and jeered at him. "Go up baldhead," they shouted, "go up baldhead!" The prophet turned and saw them, and he cursed them in the name of the Lord. Then two shebears came out of the woods and tore forty two of the children to pieces. (2 Kings 2:23-24 NAB)



-Make ready to slaughter his sons for the guilt of their fathers; Lest they rise and posses the earth, and fill the breadth of the world with tyrants. (Isaiah 14:21 NAB)

-If even then you remain hostile toward me and refuse to obey, I will inflict you with seven more disasters for your sins. I will release wild animals that will kill your children and destroy your cattle, so your numbers will dwindle and your roads will be deserted. (Leviticus 26:21-22 NLT)

-Ezekiel 9:5-7 NLT
-etc etc etc etc

Message of peace and love eh?

the quran is much more tolerant than the bible, but of course you try to hide this so as not to feel ashamed of all the hate and murder the bible calls for.

When you talk about a few things out of context rememebr that in every religion there are extremists who shame and dishonour religion.

You , are one of those people as your dark hate is clearly shown that you cannot have a constructive argument, therefore, what you THINK of ISLAM is irrelevant.



posted on Sep, 24 2012 @ 11:43 AM
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reply to post by glen200376
 


I did not notice i posted three times, maybe it was an internet connection glitch.That does happen.
It was an honest mistake .
But it is good it happened, it showed your true colors by calling me brainwashed.
Really?
i feel sorry for you.Look before you jump.



posted on Sep, 24 2012 @ 11:47 AM
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reply to post by sk0rpi0n
 



Thanks for the above, couldn't have said it better!



posted on Sep, 24 2012 @ 12:15 PM
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Originally posted by rhazer

Originally posted by Spooky1

Originally posted by neoholographic
I'm asking because I don't know much about the Qur'an.



The message of jesus was NOT of PEACE and LOVE. any christian who has read a few pages of the bible would know and tell you it has the goriest , bloodiest, sickest and most perverted messages to humanity.
Let me show you a few examples:

-If a man lies with a male as with a women, both of them shall be put to death for their abominable deed; they have forfeited their lives.Leviticus 20:13 NAB
In Islam they are whipped by choice, not necessarily murdered or stoned.

-A man or a woman who acts as a medium or fortuneteller shall be put to death by stoning; they have no one but themselves to blame for their death. (Leviticus 20:27 NAB)

-Whoever strikes his father or mother shall be put to death. (Exodus 21:15)
Really? islam would never ask you to do this.

- If one curses his father or mother, his lamp will go out at the coming of darkness. (Proverbs 20:20 NAB)
- All who curse their father or mother must be put to death. They are guilty of a capital offense. (Leviticus 20:9 NLT)

- If a man commits adultery with another man's wife, both the man and the woman must be put to death. (Leviticus 20:10 NLT)

-Whoever sacrifices to any god, except the Lord alone, shall be doomed. (Exodus 22:19 NAB)

-Kill Nonbelievers (children included)
They entered into a covenant to seek the Lord, the God of their fathers, with all their heart and soul; and everyone who would not seek the Lord, the God of Israel, was to be put to death, whether small or great, whether man or woman. (2 Chronicles 15:12-13 NAB)

-Kill the Entire Town if One Person Worships Another God
Suppose you hear in one of the towns the LORD your God is giving you that some worthless rabble among you have led their fellow citizens astray by encouraging them to worship foreign gods. In such cases, you must examine the facts carefully. If you find it is true and can prove that such a detestable act has occurred among you, you must attack that town and completely destroy all its inhabitants, as well as all the livestock. Then you must pile all the plunder in the middle of the street and burn it. Put the entire town to the torch as a burnt offering to the LORD your God. That town must remain a ruin forever; it may never be rebuilt. Keep none of the plunder that has been set apart for destruction. Then the LORD will turn from his fierce anger and be merciful to you. He will have compassion on you and make you a great nation, just as he solemnly promised your ancestors. "The LORD your God will be merciful only if you obey him and keep all the commands I am giving you today, doing what is pleasing to him." (Deuteronomy 13:13-19 NLT)

-From there Elisha went up to Bethel. While he was on his way, some small boys came out of the city and jeered at him. "Go up baldhead," they shouted, "go up baldhead!" The prophet turned and saw them, and he cursed them in the name of the Lord. Then two shebears came out of the woods and tore forty two of the children to pieces. (2 Kings 2:23-24 NAB)



-Make ready to slaughter his sons for the guilt of their fathers; Lest they rise and posses the earth, and fill the breadth of the world with tyrants. (Isaiah 14:21 NAB)

-If even then you remain hostile toward me and refuse to obey, I will inflict you with seven more disasters for your sins. I will release wild animals that will kill your children and destroy your cattle, so your numbers will dwindle and your roads will be deserted. (Leviticus 26:21-22 NLT)

-Ezekiel 9:5-7 NLT
-etc etc etc etc



This post is way.. out there. The writer starts by talking about Jesus's teachings and what Christians believe - but then, every verse cited is from the Old Testament. This is not an example of Jesus's teachings or what Christians believe, this is an example of what the Hebrew people believed.

Don't you Muslims know that Christians don't follow Hebrew teachings? The Christians didn't do any of these things - the Jews did.

You would need to go into the New Testament to find examples of Jesus's teachings and what Christians believe, and I assure you, you won't find those things above in the New Testament.. The word Testament means covenant. It refers to a contract between the people and God. The Jews, did those things under the old covenant with God (the Old Testament). Jesus brought a new covenant ( the New Testament) with vastly different rules as to how Christians should act.

This isn't the first time I've seen this behavior in this thread. Stop confusing Christians and Jesus with what happened in the Old Testament.
edit on 24-9-2012 by JohnPhoenix because: sp



posted on Sep, 24 2012 @ 01:41 PM
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Thanks for the responses.

A couple of questions.

1. Did Muhammad really marry and sleep with 6 and 9 year old girls?

2. Did Muhammad kill and torture non-Muslims that didn't pay him a tax?



posted on Sep, 24 2012 @ 01:50 PM
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The Quran contains at least 109 verses that call Muslims to war with nonbelievers for the sake of Islamic rule. Some are quite graphic, with commands to chop off heads and fingers and kill infidels wherever they may be hiding. Muslims who do not join the fight are called 'hypocrites' and warned that Allah will send them to Hell if they do not join the slaughter. Unlike nearly all of the Old Testament verses of violence, the verses of violence in the Quran are mostly open-ended, meaning that they are not restrained by the historical context of the surrounding text. They are part of the eternal, unchanging word of Allah, and just as relevant or subjective as anything else in the Quran.

www.thereligionofpeace.com...

www.abovetopsecret.com...



posted on Sep, 24 2012 @ 02:05 PM
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In refering to the Crusades, in this context, I just assumed you were refering to the Inquisition.
During the Inquisition, the christian religion was truly becoming intolerant.

Something to remember is that the early Christians were putting emphasis on the Old Testament- which is filled with descriptions of a God who is jealous, vindictive, petty, unjust and blood thirsty. Later attention turned more to the New Testament and the message of Christ and being a lamb.

In both the Bible and the Koran, there is expressions of both aggressivity and passivity, hostility and love, and rligious leaders just put emphasis on and call attention to which ever serves their goals in the moment.

edit on 24-9-2012 by Bluesma because: (no reason given)
edit on 24-9-2012 by Bluesma because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 24 2012 @ 02:16 PM
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Originally posted by Bluesma
In refering to the Crusades, in this context, I just assumed you were refering to the Inquisition.
During the Inquisition, the christian religion was truly becoming intolerant.

Something to remember is that the early Christians were putting emphasis on the Old Testament- which is filled with descriptions of a God who is jealous, vindictive, petty, unjust and blood thirsty. Later attention turned more to the New Testament and the message of Christ and being a lamb.

In both the Bible and the Koran, there is expressions of both aggressivity and passivity, hostility and love, and rligious leaders just put emphasis on and call attention to which ever serves their goals in the moment.

edit on 24-9-2012 by Bluesma because: (no reason given)
edit on 24-9-2012 by Bluesma because: (no reason given)


I think you mean Catholicism was becoming intolerant, Christians were the one's being tortured and murdered in the Inquisitions. Mostly for teaching common folk to read and giving them Bibles in their native language. Or for wanting to be baptized again after believing in Christ.

edit on 24-9-2012 by NOTurTypical because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 24 2012 @ 02:42 PM
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Originally posted by NOTurTypical

I think you mean Catholicism was becoming intolerant,


Hahaha.. well I guess that depends which branch is talking!
In countries which are mostly Catholic, they correct me- Christians refers to Catholics, any other branch is non-christian- it falls under Protestantism/

I, being part of neither, will not make that distinction. They are all worshipping the same book, and all believe that Jesus Christ was God incarnated.



posted on Sep, 24 2012 @ 02:54 PM
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Originally posted by Bluesma

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

I think you mean Catholicism was becoming intolerant,


Hahaha.. well I guess that depends which branch is talking!
In countries which are mostly Catholic, they correct me- Christians refers to Catholics, any other branch is non-christian- it falls under Protestantism/

I, being part of neither, will not make that distinction. They are all worshipping the same book, and all believe that Jesus Christ was God incarnated.


There quite a bit more difference than the two you mentioned, and Protestants don't worship a book, we worship a person, Jesus Christ. I can't speak for Roman Catholics, but I don't believe they worship a book either. But as far as the rest of your post goes I would say the same thing I did previously that you deleted in your reply.



posted on Sep, 24 2012 @ 03:36 PM
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Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by Bluesma

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

I think you mean Catholicism was becoming intolerant,


Hahaha.. well I guess that depends which branch is talking!
In countries which are mostly Catholic, they correct me- Christians refers to Catholics, any other branch is non-christian- it falls under Protestantism/

I, being part of neither, will not make that distinction. They are all worshipping the same book, and all believe that Jesus Christ was God incarnated.


There quite a bit more difference than the two you mentioned, and Protestants don't worship a book, we worship a person, Jesus Christ. I can't speak for Roman Catholics, but I don't believe they worship a book either. But as far as the rest of your post goes I would say the same thing I did previously that you deleted in your reply.


You have the right to say what you want and if you somehow found it insulting that I didn't quote it, I apologize. I just had nothing to say to it!
I have already been through the wringer by the Catholics here for having included non-Catholics as Christians, and y'all can go on about details in your interpretations, but yes, they adhere to the same Holy Bible, and worship the Christ , and all that the Protestants believe about this Christ also comes from that same Bible!

So the religion went through some evolutuons and changes through time, that is expected. I would note also that the Catholic branch is not the same today as it was at the time of the Crusades or the Inquisition either.

I understand, that just as the Muslims prefer to make distinctions between their various branches, Christians feel similarly. But In this context, speaking of the long term evolution of a religion, that isn't logical. There is a common thread that continues even through these evolutions- it is the same scripture. That was my point.

edit on 24-9-2012 by Bluesma because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 24 2012 @ 04:00 PM
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reply to post by Bluesma
 


No I wasn't offended, I was just saying my response to your previous was the same as before. I also wanted to point out that the persecution from the Catholics was the worst in the history of the world. More Christians were killed in one day than were during 300 years of persecution by the Caesars.



posted on Sep, 24 2012 @ 04:05 PM
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post removed for serious violation of ATS Terms & Conditions



posted on Sep, 24 2012 @ 04:18 PM
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reply to post by WakeUpNowSnap
 


Your link is 404.



posted on Sep, 24 2012 @ 04:24 PM
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Originally posted by rhazer



All what you say is truely sad , your hatred towards islam not only blinds you to your errors but exposes your weak research.

I say again, do not take versus out of context, this is a primary NO BRAINER.
Also, you are cursing the prophet muhammed, and speaking the most vile things about him, as a rapist, killer, sick etc....
If you want to give the OP a true , coherent and well written reply i suggest you be neutral , stating facts, proven facts, without any emotional involvement as the OP never asked how we felt.

The message of jesus was NOT of PEACE and LOVE. any christian who has read a few pages of the bible would know and tell you it has the goriest , bloodiest, sickest and most perverted messages to humanity.
Let me show you a few examples:



You , are one of those people as your dark hate is clearly shown that you cannot have a constructive argument, therefore, what you THINK of ISLAM is irrelevant.


LIES.
The teachings of Jesus are those of loving thy neighbor.
The old testament does not represent the teachings of Jesus.
The Teaching of Jesus is solely in the gospels of Jesus and No other book.
You will fool no one with that sick argument.
You might as well blame Jesus for everything that came after him as well.

www.citizenwarrior.com...

22. The Koran counsels the use of deceit when dealing with infidels. Mohammad instructed one of his followers to lie if he had to (in order to assassinate one of Mohammad's enemies). The principle was clear: If it helps Islam, it's okay to deceive non-Muslims.

This principle has served Islamic goals very well through history. And it serves those goals today. You can watch on the DVD, Obsession: Radical Islam's War Against the West, real-life examples of Islamic leaders saying one thing in English for the western press, and saying something entirely different to their own followers in Arabic a few days later.

Deceiving the enemy is always useful in war, and Islam is at war with the non-Islamic world until the whole world follows Shari'a law. All non-Muslims living in non-Islamic states are enemies. So deceiving westerners is acceptable. Even encouraged if it can forward the goals of the spread of Islam.

And so we have the strange phenomenon covered by Steven Emerson in Terrorists Among Us, where organizations in America were ostensibly raising money for orphans, but really giving the money to terrorists. They deceived good-hearted western infidels into giving money to organizations that were actively killing western infidels. As it says in the Koran, "War is deceit." This meme gives Islam a tremendous advantage over memeplexes that encourage indiscriminate truthfulness.


Islam has been on a war of conquest for about 1400 years.



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