Another SS soldier trial

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posted on Sep, 23 2012 @ 08:34 AM
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Germany continues to try to track down and put on trial ANYONE that was involved in the war crimes during WWII (as they should). It strikes me as a little odd with the timing of this one, and there is another oddity with the case as well.

news.yahoo.com...

The key points:

1) He doesn't go with the usual "following orders" defense. Instead he says he was stationed outside the camp and had no dealings with the workings of the camp. Of course he would say that. Who in their right mind would admit to participating in a war crime.

2) He says he was a conscript into the war effort. His refusal woul would have led to his execution. Does self-preservation work as a legal defense?

3)He was born to an American mother. He is a natural born American citizen. I know that many Americans served in the German army during the war. Is this going to help him fight his removal from the country?

4) The timing of this just stinks to me. Doesn't someone find a nazi in America everytime our ties with Israel get strained? Was he really a war criminal or is he a sacrificial lamb?

I fully believe he should be tried and evidence should be presented. There can't be many of these men left (mrmbers of the German army). Although he he is an admitted member of the Waffen SS, he should still have a public trial.

Edit - I put it in the political news because it seems to me that this exact same thing happens every time our relationship with Israel goes sour. If it belongs somewhere else (or doesn't belong at all), Mods please move it or delete as you see fit.
edit on 23-9-2012 by 200Plus because: (no reason given)




posted on Sep, 23 2012 @ 08:45 AM
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He should be tried and if convicted executed. Members of the US wing of the waffen ss(ie dhs, tsa, etc...) should take note. If you commit these types of crimes, you will eventually pay. Even local cops and other agency members should take note. "Just doing my job" is not an adequate defense. Whether or not it is the only job you can get, evil is still evil.



posted on Sep, 23 2012 @ 08:49 AM
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Certainly. He is guilty, according to the laws imposed on him.

I have a hard time however, reconciling these things.

They let go paedophiles who have ruined lives and if they are over a certain age, if they are prominent in todays society. Yet if they're guilty of complicit involvement of the murder of countless people, age tends to factor in.

If you ask me, being involved in the death of people en masse, is worse than hurting children. While it's not an obvious correlation, it's denied countless lives of existence.

Horrible on any account, and no matter which way you look at it. And god have mercy on those who actively hide or deny reality. how can sanity prevail in such an absurd reality.

edit on 23-9-2012 by winofiend because: added bits



posted on Sep, 23 2012 @ 08:54 AM
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In no way should he be tried for this he was a minor during his time there and had nothing to do with the killing. This is nothing but a witchhunt and this crap needs to come to a end. If they really want to go after people that enabled the killing why not go after the Zionist bankers that bankrolled Hitler or go after the people that owned American companies that shipped chemical supplies to Germany during the war.



posted on Sep, 23 2012 @ 08:56 AM
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I FULLY agree that he should be tried. I want to make it very clear that I am not trying to lessen anything that was done during the war. There should never be a limitation on the prosecution of war criminals.

My reasoning behind posting this was to try to get a more educated (than myself) viewpoint on his defense. Specfically:

1) How does his American citizenship play a role?
2) How does the fact that he was drafted play a role?

Perhaps neither of these points play any part in this at all. I really do not know, but I am sure someone here can explain it to me.



posted on Sep, 23 2012 @ 09:03 AM
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Originally posted by buster2010
In no way should he be tried for this he was a minor during his time there and had nothing to do with the killing. This is nothing but a witchhunt and this crap needs to come to a end. If they really want to go after people that enabled the killing why not go after the Zionist bankers that bankrolled Hitler or go after the people that owned American companies that shipped chemical supplies to Germany during the war.



So . I want to get it correct, but:

A man can be guilty of being complicit in mass murder, but because it's a long time ago, we'll blame jews and banks.

Is that it?

Or base our actions on targeting an image.. or a fictitious entity, and there we should lay all our blame, and place all our energy?

God some people are dead set out there...



posted on Sep, 23 2012 @ 09:40 AM
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It is going to be interesting to see how long this thread will be allowed to live, given that I actually started a thread only yesterday, about a poorly known side and unknown, yet fully verifiable, fact about Nazi Germany and what Hitler actually believed, and exactly why the Jewish population was persecuted.
The thread, however was deleted, referring to the "We don't like Hitler here-thread", which was truly odd, as the thread was hardly Pro, but in fact neutral.


So I will follow this thread with interest.



posted on Sep, 23 2012 @ 09:55 AM
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Originally posted by buster2010
In no way should he be tried for this he was a minor during his time there and had nothing to do with the killing. This is nothing but a witchhunt and this crap needs to come to a end. If they really want to go after people that enabled the killing why not go after the Zionist bankers that bankrolled Hitler or go after the people that owned American companies that shipped chemical supplies to Germany during the war.




Actually, and unless I am misunderstanding you, the very reason why the Jewish population was persecuted during Nazi Germany, was because Hitler believed that a ancient elite of Stringpullers was controllling the West, specifically Europe, from behind the curtains, and that these stringpullers were Zionistic.


He also claimed that one of the strongest tools with wich these stringpullers worked to achieve their agenda, were International Finance and Economy, in order to "tie" the nations together economically and make them financially dependent on each other. Something that would be a necessary step for the new world order and its one World Government that these powers aimed for, he believed.
He was also adamant that the economical crise of the beginning of the 1900's was artificial and was intentionally engineered, and claimed that financial and economical crises was one of "their" tools to further break up the nations and weaken them economically.
This was also the reason why, when Hitler later was in power, a movie-documentary about the Rothschilds, their history and their banking business, were made, and why the Rothschilds were considered part of the conspiracy, which was also the reason why their assets were dismantled by the Nazis.



As for exactly why "Right-extremists" as they are called in the Media are persecuted to te extreme in Europe these days and the Governments in Europe are even organizing police squads numbering in the thousands(As happened in Germany just recently) to burst their organisations, people would be surprised to know the real reason for this, and it is not, because of Nazi Germany, only indirectly, but because Anti-Internationalism is a severe threat for the agenda that the current poiticians strive for.
edit on 23-9-2012 by Nightchild because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 23 2012 @ 09:55 AM
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They are doing this because their last 'nazi murderer' died of old age so they need fresh (fresh-ish) blood. Hahaha.

Israel supreme court dismissed charges against Demjanjuk, Israel! So even the jewish state has little interest in these ridiculous circus trials.



posted on Sep, 23 2012 @ 12:40 PM
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Originally posted by winofiend

Originally posted by buster2010
In no way should he be tried for this he was a minor during his time there and had nothing to do with the killing. This is nothing but a witchhunt and this crap needs to come to a end. If they really want to go after people that enabled the killing why not go after the Zionist bankers that bankrolled Hitler or go after the people that owned American companies that shipped chemical supplies to Germany during the war.



So . I want to get it correct, but:

A man can be guilty of being complicit in mass murder, but because it's a long time ago, we'll blame jews and banks.

Is that it?

Or base our actions on targeting an image.. or a fictitious entity, and there we should lay all our blame, and place all our energy?

God some people are dead set out there...


He was just a guard on the outer parameter he had nothing to do with the killings. If Hitler had no money then he wouldn't have had the finances to run the war or even start it. Did you ever stop to think if the Jews hadn't started a global economic boycott of German goods then the war may not of even started?



posted on Sep, 23 2012 @ 12:48 PM
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reply to post by Nightchild
 





Actually, and unless I am misunderstanding you, the very reason why the Jewish population was persecuted during Nazi Germany, was because Hitler believed that a ancient elite of Stringpullers was controllling the West, specifically Europe, from behind the curtains, and that these stringpullers were Zionistic.


You didn't know Hitler was a strong supporter of Zionism? Many of his generals and admirals were Zionist as well as two full divisions were Zionist Jews. The Zionist bankers bankrolled both sides of the war because war is the most profitable business on the planet. The Jewish population were persecuted because of the boycott.

The Zionist War on Nazi Germany


The Daily Express (London) published an article on March 24, 1933 announcing that the Jews had already launched their boycott against Germany and described a forthcoming "holy war". The Express urged Jews everywhere to boycott German goods and demonstrate against German economic interests. The Express said that Germany was "now confronted with an international boycott of its trade, its finances, and its industry....In London, New York, Paris and Warsaw, Jewish businessmen are united to go on an economic crusade." The article went on, "worldwide preparations are being made to organize protest demonstrations." On March 27, 1933 the planned protest at Madison Square Garden was attended by 40,000 protestors (New York Daily News headlines: "40,000 Roar Protest Here Against Hitler"). Similar rallies and protest marches were also held in other cities. The intensity of the Jewish campaign against Germany was such that the Hitler government vowed that if the campaign did not stop there would be a one-day boycott in Germany of Jewish-owned stores. Hitler's March 28, 1933 speech ordering a boycott against Jewish stores and goods was in direct response to the declaration of war on Germany by the worldwide Jewish leadership. That same spring of 1933 there began a period of private cooperation between the German government and the Zionist movement in Germany and worldwide to increase the flow of German-Jewish immigrants and capital to Palestine.
edit on 23-9-2012 by buster2010 because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 23 2012 @ 01:03 PM
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From reading the article, it sounds to me like a wrong place wrong time scenario.

Convicting a man for guarding a gate, rather than saying no and being executed is a bit harsh.



posted on Sep, 23 2012 @ 01:58 PM
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Originally posted by buster2010

You didn't know Hitler was a strong supporter of Zionism? Many of his generals and admirals were Zionist as well as two full divisions were Zionist Jews. The Zionist bankers bankrolled both sides of the war because war is the most profitable business on the planet. The Jewish population were persecuted because of the boycott.

The Zionist War on Nazi Germany


The Daily Express (London) published an article on March 24, 1933 announcing that the Jews had already launched their boycott against Germany and described a forthcoming "holy war". The Express urged Jews everywhere to boycott German goods and demonstrate against German economic interests. The Express said that Germany was "now confronted with an international boycott of its trade, its finances, and its industry....In London, New York, Paris and Warsaw, Jewish businessmen are united to go on an economic crusade." The article went on, "worldwide preparations are being made to organize protest demonstrations." On March 27, 1933 the planned protest at Madison Square Garden was attended by 40,000 protestors (New York Daily News headlines: "40,000 Roar Protest Here Against Hitler"). Similar rallies and protest marches were also held in other cities. The intensity of the Jewish campaign against Germany was such that the Hitler government vowed that if the campaign did not stop there would be a one-day boycott in Germany of Jewish-owned stores. Hitler's March 28, 1933 speech ordering a boycott against Jewish stores and goods was in direct response to the declaration of war on Germany by the worldwide Jewish leadership. That same spring of 1933 there began a period of private cooperation between the German government and the Zionist movement in Germany and worldwide to increase the flow of German-Jewish immigrants and capital to Palestine.
edit on 23-9-2012 by buster2010 because: (no reason given)



Seems that whoever interpreted the bolded part of the article as meaning that the Nazis aswell as Hitler were supporters of Zionism, have never read the actual sorces from that era that fgives further info on this supposed "co-operation". And, have forgotten their medication.

If that person would have, he/she would have learned that, although the original News items about Jews boycotting German goods are genuine, and there indeed were a suggestion later on made within the Nazi Elite to indeed deport the Jewish population to the then Palestina, Hitler was actually against this as he meant that it would only serve to fulfill the Jewish prophecy of the return to and creation of the State of Israel, something that he believed also was part of the Zionist plan.
Ironically, their ancient prohecy was fulfilled anyway between 1947-48, when they drove out the Palestinian population from the land, and then sat up the State of Israel under their own rule, and some Jewish officials indeed openly admitted that they "benefitted" from the persecution in Germany to build up the Palestinian State.
So far, so correct.

However, the bolded text of yours also goes on;

Growing anti-Semitism in Germany and by the German government in response to the boycott played into the hands of the Zionist leaders. Prior to the escalation of anti-Semitism as a result of the boycott the majority of German Jews had little sympathy for the Zionist cause of promoting the immigration of world Jewry to Palestine. Making the situation in Germany as uncomfortable for the Jews as possible, in cooperation with German National Socialism, was part of the Zionist plan to achieve their goal of populating Palestine with a Jewish majority.

“For all intents and purposes, the National Socialist government was the best thing to happen to Zionism in its history, for it “proved” to many Jews that Europeans were irredeemably anti-Jewish and that Palestine was the only answer: Zionism came to represent the overwhelming mjaority of Jews solely by trickery and cooperation with Adolf Hitler.


So aside from purposely mixing facts with unverified claims and make the assertion that the Nazi elite and on top of it, Hitler, were in actual cahoots with Zionists, are, for a fact, completely unsupported, and if yet some people willingly choose to interpret this as actual proof for that outlandish claim( Those that even take the above speculation about the meaning of the original article about the Jewish boycott, serious, that is)then they are ofcourse fully free to do so, but they have no, and I mean no, proof or even supporting indirect evidence for this assertion whatsoever.

Oh and here you can read the full article on the boycott in its original, by the way: www.biblestudysite.com...

As for the Generals being Zionists: Please link verified Proof from verified soiurces for this, if you would be so kind.
And as for the "Zionist" divisions as you prefer to call them, you are thinking of the Soldiers within the German army of up to around 150 000 males with Jewish acenstry, that, however, both Himmler aswell as Goebbels were vehemently against and wanted out when they eventually learned about them, although those that only had more distinct Jewish ancestry, were accepted(Others were less lucky): www.kansaspress.ku.edu...

These Soldiers did not consider themself Jewish and least of all Zionistic, so whoever told you that they were Zionistic, fed you a deliberate lie.


Sorry to be harsh, but you guys really need to be more thorough with your "research" and start to investigate actual and original sources back from the days instead of second hand interpretations made by tinfoil-hats that weren't even alive then.
edit on 23-9-2012 by Nightchild because: (no reason given)





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