Curving light waves

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posted on Sep, 21 2012 @ 09:02 PM
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Hi there,

Just wondering if science (or alternate science) recognises that light, in wave form, curves when emanating from a moving position.

An example of this would be to shine a laser pointer from the moon to Earth. The light travels around 356000km in 1.282 seconds. The moon orbits at 1023m/s so it travels 1.31km in the time the laser beam takes to reach Earth. The beam also spreads to around 100m diameter.

So if we were talking about particles this would produce an effect similar to shooting a machine gun from a car ie. the trail of bullets would appear to curve but each bullet actually goes straight. The curve is only apparent if you draw a line between each bullet.

But I’m not talking about particles, I’m talking about waves. A light wave goes from alpha to omega. From its source- the moon in this example, to its destination, Earth. As long as the source of the light is left on and nothing cuts it, a light wave is oscillating from start to finish.

Returning to the moon laser, the curve is evident from the moon being about 1km from where it was turned on when the beam reaches Earth. A light wave travels from alpha to omega so the light wave curves.




posted on Sep, 21 2012 @ 09:06 PM
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so i guess i am not understanding what the point of your post is.....



posted on Sep, 21 2012 @ 09:14 PM
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Something like this? Light Bends by Itself or thisWavelike Behaviors of Light
edit on 21-9-2012 by TheLonewolf because: added link


good post by the way OP, we need way more threads like this..All the doom and gloom gets real old
edit on 21-9-2012 by TheLonewolf because: given credit where credit is due



posted on Sep, 21 2012 @ 09:14 PM
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reply to post by Malakyzek
 


I'm saying light curves when in wave form.



posted on Sep, 21 2012 @ 09:22 PM
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reply to post by primalfractal
 


Depends on what you mean by 'Move'

Light will always go straight, unless it is near a black hole. Then is doesn't 'Curve' (it is pulled, along with its source)

The source of the light is pulled into the black hole along with the light... Not really bending anything though the illusion is strong.
edit on 9/21/2012 by truthinfact because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 21 2012 @ 09:24 PM
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reply to post by TheLonewolf
 


Yes, related to wavelike behaviors of light.



posted on Sep, 21 2012 @ 09:25 PM
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reply to post by truthinfact
 


Thats an interesting way of looking at it, nice



posted on Sep, 21 2012 @ 09:29 PM
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reply to post by truthinfact
 


i thought the gravity from large objects besides black holes can curve light as well im pretty sure i saw a thread on that a few months ago



posted on Sep, 21 2012 @ 09:32 PM
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Originally posted by truthinfact
reply to post by primalfractal
 


Light will always go straight, unless it is near a black hole.


I agree, when in particle form. As a wave light can curve, like I showed in the OP. Can you see a flaw in my initial arguement?



posted on Sep, 21 2012 @ 09:34 PM
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Originally posted by truthinfact
reply to post by primalfractal
 


Depends on what you mean by 'Move'

Light will always go straight, unless it is near a black hole. Then is doesn't 'Curve' (it is pulled, along with its source)

The source of the light is pulled into the black hole along with the light... Not really bending anything though the illusion is strong.
edit on 9/21/2012 by truthinfact because: (no reason given)


You are correct about light traveling straight..It's the very "fabric" of space that bends near the event horizon of the black hole causing the illusion of bending light.



posted on Sep, 21 2012 @ 09:37 PM
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reply to post by primalfractal
 


Your OP is a very good analogy, and a good way to ponder the question you have.



A star is constantly pushing out and also pullling in energy and light (gravity), however the equation is NOT 100% balanced so some energy is ejected (hence SUNLIGHT)(HEAT), however most of the energy remains stably in its constant reaction.


I am not sure of anything short of a black whole or star (which are actually similar, in their opposition) that can effect a major light emitting source.



posted on Sep, 21 2012 @ 09:38 PM
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However though in the next 10 years the understanding of gravity and light will change dramatically. As we face our own mortality through genetic manipulation, maybe we will meet those who understand time in a different way than our current understanding



posted on Sep, 21 2012 @ 09:42 PM
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reply to post by DocHolidaze
 


Neutron stars do some very wild stuff to light and the laws of physics as well



posted on Sep, 21 2012 @ 09:47 PM
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Originally posted by truthinfact
reply to post by primalfractal
 


Your OP is a very good analogy, and a good way to ponder the question you have.



Thank you, I also like your reply, it reminds me of the famous Matrix quote
"Then you'll see, that it is not the spoon that bends, it is only yourself."


Originally posted by truthinfact
reply to post by primalfractal
 


The source of the light is pulled into the black hole along with the light... Not really bending anything though the illusion is strong.
edit on 9/21/2012 by truthinfact because: (no reason given)
edit on 21-9-2012 by primalfractal because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 21 2012 @ 09:47 PM
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Originally posted by truthinfact
However though in the next 10 years the understanding of gravity and light will change dramatically. As we face our own mortality through genetic manipulation, maybe we will meet those who understand time in a different way than our current understanding


You could not be more correct..We humans think we are so damned smart..Just imagine what we'll know tomorrow
edit on 21-9-2012 by TheLonewolf because: sp



posted on Sep, 21 2012 @ 10:13 PM
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Originally posted by TheLonewolf

Originally posted by truthinfact
reply to post by primalfractal
 


Depends on what you mean by 'Move'

Light will always go straight, unless it is near a black hole. Then is doesn't 'Curve' (it is pulled, along with its source)

The source of the light is pulled into the black hole along with the light... Not really bending anything though the illusion is strong.
edit on 9/21/2012 by truthinfact because: (no reason given)


You are correct about light traveling straight..It's the very "fabric" of space that bends near the event horizon of the black hole causing the illusion of bending light.


When combined with my idea this points to all of space being curved. This fits well with fractal theory and the Sierpiński triangle/flower of life - Link

The Sierpiński triangle, also called the Sierpiński gasket or the Sierpiński Sieve, is a fractal named after Wacław Sierpiński who described it in 1915. Originally constructed as a curve, this is one of the basic examples of self-similar sets,


edit on 21-9-2012 by primalfractal because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 21 2012 @ 10:28 PM
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What the OP seems to describe is wavefront behaviour. Wave-particle duality means that particles behave as waves, and particles, though the circumstances in which they exhibit each behaviour are usually completely different.

The curving is an artificial effect, the photons themselves travel straight in space-time and the example is exactly the same as the analogy of shooting a gun, a laser produces coherent photons, though it is not one single long beam, it is still lots of single photons. So the curve doesn't exist as a property of light, but of a property of geometry.
edit on 21-9-2012 by ErosA433 because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 21 2012 @ 10:37 PM
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reply to post by primalfractal
 


You just very well maybe on to something here..I've never heard of Sierpinski's triangle..very interesting stuff



posted on Sep, 21 2012 @ 10:53 PM
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reply to post by TheLonewolf
 


Thanks, I think I might be to. I argued it out with my dad who is a physics
phd, after a bit he couldn't point out anything wrong with the theory but still
disagreed lol.

The Sierpiński triangle is cool, I think it projects out into a 3d mobius coil.
Here is some more info on it Link


When you apply the Trinity to the Trinity you use a principle that is called Self-Reference. In modern mathematics this principle is called a Fractal and the theory associated with Fractals is called Chaos Theory. Fractals play a very important role in the new String Theories of the Universe.

It is possible to generate the many levels of the Universe out of one Fractal Pattern, the Trinity. In modern Physics one of the candidates for the Fractal Pattern of the Universe is the Sierpinski Triangel. This fractal pattern generates the well known Mystical Geometries and is based on Trinities.
edit on 21-9-2012 by primalfractal because: bad spella



posted on Sep, 21 2012 @ 11:17 PM
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reply to post by ErosA433
 


Yes I am explaining the wave part of the wave/particle duality.
The machine gun arguement only works when you think of light
as particles. This theory isn't describing light as particles so the
machine gun theory is not relavent.

Light is both a wave and a particle so in wave form this curve is not
only geometric but also a property of the light.






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