The identity of Jesus' wife is..

reply to post by NOTurTypical


So you're saying religion hasn't changed over time? How many years was it between the OT and NT? Something like 400 years? What makes you think that the pagan themes couldn't have been inserted after 300 years?

You even admitted you thought the pagans messed with the stories so why are you arguing with yourself? The reason they messed with the stories is because Rome allowed them to mess with it.

reply to post by 3NL1GHT3N3D1

The Caduceus (Kerykeion in Greek) is depicted as a winged staff with two snakes wrapped around it. It was once an ancient astrological symbol of commerce, healing and is associated with the Greek god Hermes. He was known as the messenger for the gods, a conduit for the dead and a protector of merchants and thieves.

The Caduceus and the Rod of Asclepius are often used interchangeably in Greek culture. The Rod of Asclepius symbolizes the healing arts by combining the serpent, and a figure-eight shape, a number which is important to Hermetic practitioners who use the astrology of the planets and stars to heal the sick.

www.squidoo.com...



Was the biblical story of Moses and the bronze healing snake hijacked from the mythology of Hermes? It wouldn't be the first time the Old Testament authors are caught hijacking another culture's mythology to make it their own history.

reply to post by 3NL1GHT3N3D1


Because the pagans began jacking with it over 300 years after the last NT book was written. In the first century the major enemy of Christians were the Jews, not Rome!

Theodosius I (Latin: Flavius Theodosius Augustus; [1] 11 January 347 – 17 January 395), also known as Theodosius the Great, was Roman Emperor from 379 to 395.

Here.


Every doctrine you attacked was already written by Christ's apostles loooooooooooooong before Rome gave a crap about Christianity.

reply to post by NOTurTypical


So staring at something because you don't want it to kill you isn't a form of begging for mercy or worshiping? I say worship because you love him so much for making you this way, imperfect, and you love him for judging you and sending others to hell to suffer forever.

I'm not slinging poo, I'm just saying what I believe the facts are. I'm entitled to my opinion just as you are entitled to yours. You saying that I'm slinging poo shows me that your defense mechanism kicking in.

reply to post by MeesterB


OH! SO, you think that there ARE other Gods??!! You think that in that Psalm, GOD is asking other Gods to be kind to the poor, and the weak? You don't think that this verse is appealing to mankind? WOW!

Who are these other gods and why is this in our Bible then?

reply to post by NOTurTypical

Paul was a Roman who never met Jesus, he even killed Jesus' followers, that is the start of the Roman interference right there. They then inserted pagan themes into the story as you agree.

The fact that you agree the story was hijacked by the Romans but yet still defend the hijackers is baffling.

reply to post by windword


You start by implying that "you are gods" refers to mankind... I answer that we are gods because mankind is created in God's image... you think I'm talking about other gods....
I don't follow.

reply to post by windword


Thanks for the insight.

I definitely think themes from other religions were stolen and put into the bible. What you just posted proves it in my opinion.

Interesting that the symbol was a sign for commerce, religion is all about commerce and making money. The connection to Hermes is interesting too because he was the protector of merchants (big business) and thieves (big banks).

Religion is created in order to keep us enslaved, if we're okay with bowing down to god then we'll be okay with slaving away 40 hours a week to make a measly paycheck. Business and religion are one in the same.

reply to post by MeesterB


We are created in gods image because we create this image that we live in. Gods image is life and without life there would be no image and we would not exist. Our sight and perception is the image and without us there is nothing to perceive an image that does not exist anymore.

We are the creators of the image and we are made in "his" image. As soon as we first open our eyes.

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
reply to post by NOTurTypical

Paul was a Roman who never met Jesus, he even killed Jesus' followers, that is the start of the Roman interference right there. They then inserted pagan themes into the story as you agree.

The fact that you agree the story was hijacked by the Romans but yet still defend the hijackers is baffling.

Paul was only a Roman citizen, he was a Jew of the tribe of Benjamin. And I never once said the story was hijacked by the Romans, in fact I've said numerous times that Rome's influence came 300 some years after Revelation was written. Several times now.

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

So staring at something because you don't want it to kill you isn't a form of begging for mercy or worshiping? I say worship because you love him so much for making you this way, imperfect, and you love him for judging you and sending others to hell to suffer forever.

I'm not slinging poo, I'm just saying what I believe the facts are. I'm entitled to my opinion just as you are entitled to yours. You saying that I'm slinging poo shows me that your defense mechanism kicking in.

They were bitten by real snakes, God had Moses set up the brazen snake after the people were bitten. The brazen snake was just a picture of Christ, nothing more, nothing less. I feel like I'm talking to someone who is only reading every 5th word I reply with.

reply to post by NOTurTypical


Weird how Herod was a Roman client king in Judea at the time of Jesus' birth. According to the bible and the Massacre of the Innocents, Rome was interested in Christianity before Jesus was even born. I mean you don't kill babies looking for someone if you're not interested in them.

reply to post by MeesterB


Oh, Okay. So then, you agree that we are all gods, as the Psalms and as quoted by Jesus?

It's a given that we will die as men. That comes with the territory. I'm just saying that we are eternal, as gods are. We didn't begin at fertilization inside our mommies tummy. We were also there when God held his "divine council."

reply to post by NOTurTypical


But he cared enough about Rome to enlist as a citizen. He cared enough to kill followers of Jesus for Rome. He was a Roman by his citizenship and he killed followers of Jesus.

Herod was employed by Rome at the time of Jesus' birth. They were interested before Jesus was even born.

I am reading all of your words, it's you who isn't reading them. You specifically say Rome had an influence on the story, what influence do you think it had? Maybe they used Paul to pervert Jesus' message then later they added the sun worship themes?

Those are the pagan themes that you admitted were being taught by the pagan preachers after Christianity's legalization.

So you think they had an influence on the story but not really at all? You are arguing with yourself, going in circles.

Either they influenced the story by putting in pagan themes that are still present today or they didn't have an influence at all. Which is it?

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

So you're saying religion hasn't changed over time? How many years was it between the OT and NT? Something like 400 years? What makes you think that the pagan themes couldn't have been inserted after 300 years?

You even admitted you thought the pagans messed with the stories so why are you arguing with yourself? The reason they messed with the stories is because Rome allowed them to mess with it.

Except that, isn't it amazing that in the Dead Sea Scrolls, the Book of Isaiah is exactly the same as it is now?

reply to post by windword


That still leaves the question of judgement. We may all be eternal, but an eternity away from God isn't an eternity I want to experience.

reply to post by WarminIndy


The OT was written 400 years before the NT and Christianity was based on on the Torah (OT) so yes, religion does change over time. What makes you think they wouldn't change it again 300 years after Paul and his letters?

When do you believe the story of Jesus was influenced by pagans and why doesn't it matter to you?

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

But he cared enough about Rome to enlist as a citizen. He cared enough to kill followers of Jesus for Rome. He was a Roman by his citizenship and he killed followers of Jesus.

Herod was employed by Rome at the time of Jesus' birth. They were interested before Jesus was even born.

I am reading all of your words, it's you who isn't reading them. You specifically say Rome had an influence on the story, what influence do you think it had? Maybe they used Paul to pervert Jesus' message then later they added the sun worship themes?

Those are the pagan themes that you admitted were being taught by the pagan preachers after Christianity's legalization.

So you think they had an influence on the story but not really at all? You are arguing with yourself, going in circles.

Either they influenced the story by putting in pagan themes that are still present today or they didn't have an influence at all. Which is it?

edit on 21-9-2012 by 3NL1GHT3N3D1 because: (no reason given)

edit on 21-9-2012 by 3NL1GHT3N3D1 because: (no reason given)

edit on 21-9-2012 by 3NL1GHT3N3D1 because: (no reason given)

Are you aware of certain facts? Rome at that time was still pagan. Do you ever read anything from history? Saul was a Pharisee, a Jewish sect. His father was a Roman citizen, but a Jewish one.

Ok, here is a challenge. Because the Romans were meticulous record keepers about their Empire, can you show me one document that proves Saul of Tarsus was in their employ? When did he apply to be a citizen? Did he serve in the Roman army? What was the Emperor, Prefect or Governor he worked for? Can you substantiate your claims?

Show us a document and we will look at it.

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
reply to post by WarminIndy

 

The OT was written 400 years before the NT and Christianity was based on on the Torah (OT) so yes, religion does change over time. What makes you think they wouldn't change it again 300 years after Paul and his letters?

When do you believe the story of Jesus was influenced by pagans and why doesn't it matter to you?

edit on 21-9-2012 by 3NL1GHT3N3D1 because: (no reason given)

There was 400 years of silence in prophecy. not in teaching. You still have to address the Dead Sea Scrolls.

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
reply to post by WarminIndy

 

The OT was written 400 years before the NT and Christianity was based on on the Torah (OT) so yes, religion does change over time. What makes you think they wouldn't change it again 300 years after Paul and his letters?

When do you believe the story of Jesus was influenced by pagans and why doesn't it matter to you?

edit on 21-9-2012 by 3NL1GHT3N3D1 because: (no reason given)

Let's see, Pliny the Younger in a letter to Trajan...

Soon accusations spread, as usually happens, because of the proceedings going on, and several incidents occurred. An anonymous document was published containing the names of many persons. Those who denied that they were or had been Christians, when they invoked the gods in words dictated by me, offered prayer with incense and wine to your image, which I had ordered to be brought for this purpose together with statues of the gods, and moreover cursed Christ--none of which those who are really Christians, it is said, can be forced to do--these I thought should be discharged. Others named by the informer declared that they were Christians, but then denied it, asserting that they had been but had ceased to be, some three years before, others many years, some as much as twenty-five years. They all worshipped your image and the statues of the gods, and cursed Christ.

If Christianity were pagan at this time, why didn't Pliny the Younger and Trajan not recognize it? They were both pagan so you would think they should have picked up on it...but they did not recognize their beliefs or those of the Greeks or of the Persians.

Trajan to Pliny the Younger You observed proper procedure, my dear Pliny, in sifting the cases of those who had been denounced to you as Christians. For it is not possible to lay down any general rule to serve as a kind of fixed standard. They are not to be sought out; if they are denounced and proved guilty, they are to be punished, with this reservation, that whoever denies that he is a Christian and really proves it--that is, by worshiping our gods--even though he was under suspicion in the past, shall obtain pardon through repentance. But anonymously posted accusations ought to have no place in any prosecution. For this is both a dangerous kind of precedent and out of keeping with the spirit of our age.

In keeping with our Zeitgeist...interesting.

Pliny and Trajan on Christianity If you accuse me of borrowing from a Christian site, I gave you one from a liberal one, PBS.