Historical Evidence of modern day CHRISTIANITY being PAGAN!

Okay, so maybe you do know some things. Good to see you know the sabbath is not sunday. Good to see you know about the holidays that were ALREADY mentioned. Just one question. Why do you accept some but not all truth, but half?

reply to post by watchitburn

reply to post by ruthlesstruth

The only thing constantly contradicting is the cult itself. So many sects of it, so many completely different ways, rituals, and practices, yet all unite under a common banner to bring about the Apocalypse. And they also lobby Congress to make their faith the law of the land.

Originally posted by autowrench
reply to post by ruthlesstruth

 

The only thing constantly contradicting is the cult itself. So many sects of it, so many completely different ways, rituals, and practices, yet all unite under a common banner to bring about the Apocalypse. And they also lobby Congress to make their faith the law of the land.

Your speaking of the Catholics (Modern Christians), Orthodox, and Zionist Jews.

I spent a lot of time myself, having been raised in the Christian church, seeking out the full truth about a LOT of things, took all of 2011 to do it. The thing I realized most was that I desired to know God outside of the limits that had been placed upon him by Protestantism in some areas, while not casting aside my fellowship in the family of God, nor blaming those who were not awake to these things yet. It takes a lot to question so many things and still remain strong in your center with your maker. God has proven to me in my 45 years so very strongly of his existence over and over, that I would not ever want to turn away from his glorious gifts or his overwhelming power and presence for any school of thought or ways of man. I was told that the best church for me, with my current understanding and desires to worship in spirit and truth, would be to find a Messianic congregation. Alas, there are none to be found in my large county in southern California, but I do my best to find my way in spite of that and yet desire so much to be with others who "get" what I am talking about.

reply to post by TarzanBeta

reply to post by TarzanBeta


Why would the Messiah have a Greek or Latin name which IS TRANSLATED to "Hail ZEUS" in which has nothing to do with the God of ISRAEL. The key note here is the God of Israel. Oh and technically you and I are both right.His name was Tiberius Julius Caesar Augustus as is in the link below. So part of his name Tiberius and Augustus.

en.wikipedia.org...

You are making things up. This is becoming a problem.

You are the problem. Why is it you act like a fool by talking so ignorantly.

reply to post by TarzanBeta


So you and I agree about the Pagan holidays and other facts. So if you care about this topic so much why don't you admit Yeshua, Yahshua, or Yahushua is his REAL name. Also, I want to make a statement to the board of ATS. You all are pathetic! You deleted Lethalized post. Why? I guess it is because you all don't want anyone's feelings getting hurt. Well I say this, it is ridiculous you can't be blunt and honest in this world no more because liberal people like the board of ATS. How about if you are going to delete her stuff why don't you delete my thread too so you can show how much of pieces of garbage you all are. As a matter in fact I am looking forwards to going to a new forum web site which allows TRUTH to be spoken 100%. Besides most of the news here on ATS is full of propaganda. Not only propaganda but unfair judgement. IGNORANCE IS BLISS!

Originally posted by ruthlesstruth

Originally posted by obixman
Interesting point about Julius Caesar - he died in 44 BC and so couldn't have had anything to do with your conjectures.

Actually, he was one of the many people who objected Yahshua and demanded he'd be crucified.

The only people demanding He be crucified were the Jewish authorities. Pilate, representing Caesar, stated 7 times that he found no fault with Him.

Originally posted by lethalized
reply to post by TarzanBeta

 

Why would the Messiah have a Greek or Latin name which IS TRANSLATED to "Hail ZEUS" in which has nothing to do with the God of ISRAEL. The key note here is the God of Israel. Oh and technically you and I are both right.His name was Tiberius Julius Caesar Augustus as is in the link below. So part of his name Tiberius and Augustus.

en.wikipedia.org...

You are making things up. This is becoming a problem.

You are the problem. Why is it you act like a fool by talking so ignorantly.

This is (my) ruthless truth's post. I apologize for the confusion but there is two of us who live here. I assure you we are two different people.

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by ruthlesstruth

Originally posted by obixman
Interesting point about Julius Caesar - he died in 44 BC and so couldn't have had anything to do with your conjectures.

Actually, he was one of the many people who objected Yahshua and demanded he'd be crucified.

The only people demanding He be crucified were the Jewish authorities. Pilate, representing Caesar, stated 7 times that he found no fault with Him.

Don't you know, NOTurTypical? That was a roman conspiracy to get the jews to love roman occupation since the romans actually authored the new testament!

Seriously. The OP needs to read about the historical evidence. First it was threads proclaiming the Emperor Vespasian and his heirs were responsible for the authorship of the new testament, and now it's Julius Caesar?

If this is such a grand conspiracy and "Jesus" translates into "hail zeus" (It doesn't by the way, people need to comprehend what transliteration is and how this applies to linguistics), What does this have to do with the Romans, since they didn't worship Zeus (Zeus being a GREEK god)?

The lengths some will go to in order to twist the truth never ceases to amaze me.

Furthermore, how do proponents of this idea respond to Tacitus (a roman senator and historian) who wrote this:

"Consequently, to get rid of the report, Nero fastened the guilt and inflicted the most exquisite tortures on a class hated for their abominations, called Christians by the populace. Christus, from whom the name had its origin, suffered the extreme penalty during the reign of Tiberius at the hands of one of our procurators, Pontius Pilatus, and a most mischievous superstition, thus checked for the moment, again broke out not only in Judæa, the first source of the evil, but even in Rome, where all things hideous and shameful from every part of the world find their centre and become popular. Accordingly, an arrest was first made of all who pleaded guilty; then, upon their information, an immense multitude was convicted, not so much of the crime of firing the city, as of hatred against mankind. Mockery of every sort was added to their deaths. Covered with the skins of beasts, they were torn by dogs and perished, or were nailed to crosses, or were doomed to the flames and burnt, to serve as a nightly illumination, when daylight had expired."

Originally posted by ruthlesstruth

Originally posted by ruthlesstruth

Originally posted by obixman
Interesting point about Julius Caesar - he died in 44 BC and so couldn't have had anything to do with your conjectures.

Actually, he was one of the many people who objected Yahshua and demanded he'd be crucified.

I made a mistake here. Augustus Caesar was the one who demanded he'd be crucified excuse me for my incorrect statement above. Though Julius Caesar still had a lot to do with the Paganism in Christianity as Lethalized explains.

You're thinking of Pontius Pilate, who finally relented to the Jews after stating 7 times he found no fault with the man. He washed his hands at the verdict symbolically showing Christ's blood would not be upon him, but upon the Jews who demanded it.

The word pagan just means "local". The messianic movement did begin as a cult as Jesus was viewed as a rebel leader and an apostate by the religious jewish sects of 2000 years ago, the Pharisees, Sadducees and the Essenes. Half of the people who wanted to overthrow roman rule wanted to make him king, the other half wanted to kill him because he was screwing with their prosperity from Rome and because he branded them the apostates and exposed their hypocrisy.

il be honest i dont understand the connection between God and religion, so how can i understand the link between christanity and paganism.

Originally posted by lethalized
Okay, so maybe you do know some things. Good to see you know the sabbath is not sunday. Good to see you know about the holidays that were ALREADY mentioned. Just one question. Why do you accept some but not all truth, but half?

Let me guess, you're an SDA? Sunday sabbath is the mark of the Beast huh? :shk:, well then that makes you a Saturn worshipper because you worship on Saturn-day. Gotta love that SDA circular logic. I'll give you a hint, hebrew days began at dusk as the moon was rising, the sabbath was tied to certain phases of the moon, not particular days of the week. Thats why they needed 2 reliable witnesses to see the moon and determine when sabbath was. You're rolling with the gregorian calendar, not the hebrew calendar. Even the hebrew calendar has been off for 1900 years as the leap years were based on wether or not the wheat was Abib so you got about 1900 years worh of missed leap years to make up for which is impossible to know now. So in otherwords, we're all on faith now, that's the entire point for the destruction of the second temple, now we worship in spirit and in truth, not based on trivial things man can corrupt the way the Feastdays were corrupted.

So what is wrong with Christianity being a pagan religion. It doesn't bother me at all, I read about this stuff before and still believe in god. I don't care what gods name is, not worth screwing up enjoying life over. Those who don't believe in a god are missing out on it. Going overboard is not fun, it makes life too boring. Be honest and treat others with a respect that they truly deserve and your good to go. I don't respect people for the credentials or wealth they have, I base respect on their honesty and integrity. I don't like tricksters. I don't like pushy people.

Click here for more information.

Originally posted by lonewolf19792000

Originally posted by lethalized
Okay, so maybe you do know some things. Good to see you know the sabbath is not sunday. Good to see you know about the holidays that were ALREADY mentioned. Just one question. Why do you accept some but not all truth, but half?

Let me guess, you're an SDA? Sunday sabbath is the mark of the Beast huh? :shk:, well then that makes you a Saturn worshipper because you worship on Saturn-day. Gotta love that SDA circular logic. I'll give you a hint, hebrew days began at dusk as the moon was rising, the sabbath was tied to certain phases of the moon, not particular days of the week. Thats why they needed 2 reliable witnesses to see the moon and determine when sabbath was. You're rolling with the gregorian calendar, not the hebrew calendar. Even the hebrew calendar has been off for 1900 years as the leap years were based on wether or not the wheat was Abib so you got about 1900 years worh of missed leap years to make up for which is impossible to know now. So in otherwords, we're all on faith now, that's the entire point for the destruction of the second temple, now we worship in spirit and in truth, not based on trivial things man can corrupt the way the Feastdays were corrupted.

I love you!

I knew there was something off about the Sabbath that SDA and SDR(Seventh-day Remnant) keep to, but I didn't know exactly what it was.

I have found that the SDA and the SDR are very intelligent, however, far too legalistic and yet still I have noticed in their teachings that they are really wrong (such as their ideas concerning wine, which can quickly be disproven; which makes me wonder how in the world, being so thorough and intelligent with research, how can they miss such a very simple thing and make a mistake of it - among other things??)

But because of this post, you had me dive further into it. In fact, I am astounded that I was not wise enough to discern this stuff on my own. But what can we do on our own? For all things belong to God! So what can I do except seek and wait for Him to give me wisdom?

That being said, you have done an excellent service here.

You have not only allowed me to release guilt over not being able to follow the Sabbath according to SDA/SDR teachings (which I have known to be far too legalistic, but I desire wholly to obey the commandments of God, so I found myself in a HUGE FIX of conscience).

But then there are a few other things.

John the Revelator was in the Spirit on the Lord's day.

Now some say that Revelations was not written until 70 AD. However, Preterists believe that most of Revelations covers the events of 70 AD (which I do not completely agree with). And they believe that the writings obviously had to occur earlier...

But point being, if the Jews adopted the seven-day string instead of considering the new moon a day of rest to itself and not counting it in the days of the months until after the captivity of Babylon; this still took place many hundreds of years before Jesus Christ arrived. So regardless of whether John the Revelator was in the Spirit on the Lord's day before or after the events of 70 AD seems pointless. If the Jews adopted that seven-day string from Babylonian captivity, and the Sabbath was still discussed by Jesus Christ - insofar that when He performed works on the Sabbath, the Pharisees sought to condemn Him for it - but He did not say, "Today is not actually the Sabbath" - He simply said that it is lawful to do well on the Sabbath. And then when John is in the Spirit on the Lord's day, that is also the Sabbath. So then, where is the line here? Because it would not be discussed in Revelations at all if the Sabbath was not still important - that John was in the Spirit on the Lord's day.

Here is a link which I found very useful after doing some research after your post, which I love.

Supports your statement

Based on Genesis 1:14 the moon phase system is reasonable for any agrarian
or collective community. But the primary law that governs Sabbath keeping is
Moses Law: a seventh-day rest can only be after six working days. If we can
identify the meaning of seventh-day sabbaths in this way, Sabbath keeping in
modern settings can be directly applied to any individual’s own timing system,
(no more tied to traditional calendars).

Everyone should go to that link. It is a lesson in learning, too.

Point being, the Sabbath is STILL a commandment. But the manner in which we keep it cannot be so legalistic because of the society we are in today.

But God will make a New Heaven and a New Earth and then there will be TRUE REST!

Being where I am now, there was no hope in resting on the Sabbath... there has only been hell where I live now. There is no rest here, Sabbath or not.

lonesome-- thank you very much.

But RCC does claim sunday as their mark. Please look it up.

reply to post by TarzanBeta


Don't worry about SDA and their circular logic. The sabbath wasn't even given to gentiles, no records even exist that Adam kept the sabbath either. Sabbath wasn't even part of the Noahide covenant that i remember which was only 7 laws. The old sabbath was given as a sign between God and Israel, the gentiles were not invited to that party and that is a fact SDA's like to ignore and they do not keep it correctly either according to the phases of the moon. So do not worry about Sunday worship being the mark of the Beast because it is not, we're supposed to keep everyday holy to God now, Yeshua (who we call Jesus) bought us perpetual sabbath (rest) at Calvary with his self sacrifice so you can quit feeling guilty, sabbath was a type of dress rehearsal for the coming rest and the end of Man's labors for righteousness, just like how Rosh Hashana (Feast of Trumpets) is the dress rehearsal for the rapture, Yom Kippur (Day of Atonement) is the dress rehearsal for Christ's second coming and Sukkot (Feast of Tabernacles/Booths) is the dress rehearsal for the Millenial reign of Christ.

Now Sabbath keeping may come into play when Christ comes to rule on earth with New Jerusalem or when he lifts the curse on Creation for the new heaven and new earth (restores earth to what it was before Adam fell). Here's a messianic jewish christian preacher you should talk to named Dr. Michael Brown, he knows alot about where gentile people fit in God's plan, he's the one who broke the insanity SDA's had inflicted on me when their circular logic had me bound up in knots fearing i could never know enough to recieve salvation.

AskDrBrown

Here's the link he sent to me when i had asked him about the Sabbath and he has a internet radio show he addresses questions people have and he does debates with jewish rabbi's and SDA's.

askdrbrown.org...

And you also need to look at how close the expression "Son of God" is to "Sun God"

The "Sun God" was widely worshipped around the world in many Pagan societies.