Whats your thoughts on the rapture , before during or after the great tribulation ?

This post is not to engage in an argument with others but to simply give my own understanding:

1. I believe there are two types of "raptures", I use the word rapture although it is entirely unscriptural as a "word" but since "Being Taken" has been modernized into the word rapture than I will just go with it for this topic.

2. The First rapture mentioned in the beginning books of The New Testament is the same as the flood where many who did not listen were "swept away" or taken away or raptured away if you will. The Word of our Master is set up so that the scripture that proceeds the parable of two in the field and one will be taken will lend understanding to what is being described. It reminds us briefly that Noah was saved however he was not taken or swept away but rather remained on this earth in his physically imperfect body until his appointed time while all those who would not listen were taken or raptured or immediately swept away.... This signifying what is being described. What ever religious leader tells you that "the good" will be taken up into heaven is showing terrific ignorance by not reasoning what proceeds this prophecy. These ones are not going to be "beamed Up" supernaturally, no more so than any of those who were wordless baal worshipers at the time of Noah who would not listen were also not beamed up but rather died a quite real and physical death by drowning...

Mat 24:37 "As it was in the day of NUWiach (יהוה leads our Family, sn - Noah), so it will be in the coming of The Son of AHdam. Mat 24:38 For as in those days which were before the flood, they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage until the day that NUWiach entered into the ark, Mat 24:39 and they did not believe the danger until the flood came and took them all away. So it will be at the coming of The Son of AHdam Mat 24:40 when two men will be in the field: one will be taken and one will be left.


3. In the book of Thess. we see a completely different thing occur that many will call a rapture but is referred to as being "taken up" into the "cloud" to be with our Master. This is a completely different occurrence and refers in scriptures being taken up into the "air" and into the "clouds". This "after" the descension of our Master from the Heavenly realm and in my mind signifies that we who are alive and faithful to our Master will ascend not immediately into the Heavenly realm but that we will first meet Him in this Carbon based realm which is signified by AIR and Clouds AFTER His decent into this realm.

1Th 4:16 For יהוה The Master Himself will descend from ShamaYAim with a shout, with the voice of the archangel and with Almighty Loving YA of All Creation’s trumpet. The dead in יהוה our Beloved King will rise first, 1Th 4:17 then we who are alive, who are left, will be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet יהוה The Master in the air. So we will be with Master forever. 1Th 4:18 Therefore comfort one another with these Words.

Blessings in your search for truth!

reply to post by truejew


You are a liar, you still refuse to provide my quote saying "Peter taught salvation by works", which so said I made. I quoted you saying that several posts ago. You refused to provide any quote of me saying it. That is a lie. I said the gospel is clearly laid out in 1 Corinthians 15, you disagreed with that gospel and said no that it was in Acts 2. And you rejected the 3 verses from John 6 where Christ said no man can come to Him unless His Father first draws that man. You rejected His statement when He said He would never cast out anyone who called upon His Name, and you rejected that anyone who believes in Him as Savior already has eternal life.

Lets try again:

1. Is the gospel laid out plainly in 1 Corinthians 15?
2. Can people have trust in Christ all on their own apart from the Father bestowing it to them by grace?
3. Will Christ cast out people who trust in Him and call upon His Name?
4. Do people who trust in Christ already possess eternal life?

Four "Y" or "N" responses will suffice.

reply to post by YAHUWAH SAVES


The word "rapture" isn't unscriptural. It's a carry-over term from Latin. It does appear four times in the Latin Bible. The Koine Greek term is "harpazo", which in English we use "caught up".

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by truejew

 

You are a liar,

No, I am not. You are arguing against the necessity of Acts 2:38, against what Peter taught. Otherwise you would not be arguing against me.

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

I said the gospel is clearly laid out in 1 Corinthians 15, you disagreed with that gospel and said no that it was in Acts 2.

I did not disagree with 1Cor. 15. I however do disagree with you that the Gospel message does not require the faith response given by Peter in Acts 2:38. Christ said that we are to take up our cross and follow Him. That includes death to sin (repentance), burial with Him (baptism in His name), and rising to a new life (receiving the Holy Spirit).

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

And you rejected the 3 verses from John 6 where Christ said no man can come to Him unless His Father first draws that man.

I do not and have never disagreed with John 6.

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

You rejected His statement when He said He would never cast out anyone who called upon His Name,

I do not reject that. I do however reject any opinion of what "anyone who called upon His Name" means that goes against Peter's teaching in Acts 2:38.

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

and you rejected that anyone who believes in Him as Savior already has eternal life.

I do not reject that. I do however reject the idea that someone can reject God's plan of salvation given in Acts 2:38 and still "believe in Him as Savior".

reply to post by YAHUWAH SAVES


Just a side note... Yah is actually the Egyptian moon god. EhJeh is God's name and is where we get the name Jesus from. Jesus means EhJeh is salvation.

reply to post by truejew


This is exactly why the 144000 Virgin Jewish men will bring the Gospel of the Lord Jesus . These will have no guile , no opinion , no agenda and will preach the true Gospel . That's something we can not do with our own likes and dislikes .

reply to post by truejew

I do not reject that. I do however reject the idea that someone can reject God's plan of salvation given in Acts 2:38 and still "believe in Him as Savior".

Yeah but the thief who asked Jesus to remember him and whom Christ said would be with him in paradise that day couldn't be baptized or recieve the Holy Spirit because he died before Pentecost, so there are "deathbed decisions" that are still quite valid and outside Acts 2:38. In this case the thief had a change of heart and believed and it was enough. If immersion were a requirement for salvation then that thief was screwed anyway wether he repented or not and that makes absolutely no sense because Jesus said he'd be in paradise with him that day.

Originally posted by lonewolf19792000
reply to post by truejew

 

I do not reject that. I do however reject the idea that someone can reject God's plan of salvation given in Acts 2:38 and still "believe in Him as Savior".

Yeah but the thief who asked Jesus to remember him and whom Christ said would be with him in paradise that day couldn't be baptized or recieve the Holy Spirit because he died before Pentecost, so there are "deathbed decisions" that are still quite valid and outside Acts 2:38. In this case the thief had a change of heart and believed and it was enough. If immersion were a requirement for salvation then that thief was screwed anyway wether he repented or not and that makes absolutely no sense because Jesus said he'd be in paradise with him that day.

edit on 24-9-2012 by lonewolf19792000 because: (no reason given)

Salvation is by grace through faith. Since the thief died before Peter's Acts 2:38 message, he could not follow it through faith. All after Peter's Acts 2:38 message must take that step of faith in order to receive the grace of God.

Since it appears the false doctrine teachers have given up, I have decided to write a post to the readers.

True faith cannot be separate from faith action. A person who claims to have faith that a bridge is safe to cross and refuses to cross it, does not really have faith. A person who rejects to enter the kingdom of God by Acts 2:38, a faith action, does not have true faith to enter the kingdom.

The false teachers love to ignore that and ignore what Peter taught in Acts 2:38. They use Scripture like Ephesians 2:8 that say we are saved by grace through faith as a base to ignore Acts 2:38. When it comes to Acts 2:38 they forget their own first rule of hermeneutics. They forget who the letters of Paul were written to. They were written to the Church, people who were already saved. He did not need to re-teach Acts 2:38 to them.

In Acts 2, Peter preached the Gospel. Those who heard him, asked what shall we do? Peter told them to repent, be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ, and receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. Those who heard him took that faith action and were added to the Church.

Have you taken the faith action of Acts 2:38 to enter the kingdom of God since you were preached the Gospel?

Since it appears this thread is coming to a close, anyone who wishes to ask questions can reach me by the board message system.