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Western Concept of War vs. Islamist Concept of War

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posted on Sep, 19 2012 @ 02:01 AM
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reply to post by dontreally
 


Well, until you actually live in a Muslim country, they are not infringing upon you at all. You fear that they one day could, while you still live?

Christianity could be said to have infringed on those very rights 500 years ago. They did not give aboriginal populations a choice and heretics were burned at the stake. That no longer takes place, as the religion has evolved with civilization. Islam is 700 years younger than Christianity and, like it, will eventually evolve as well.




posted on Sep, 19 2012 @ 02:02 AM
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reply to post by dontreally
 

It is in the STUPIDITY of Fanatical Islamic Planning that the possible Dirty Bombing of Israel would be of some victory in their best interest.

First of all...the U.S. has the ability to use Satellites to track Gamma Ray and Neutron Radiation to the point that we can track Nuclear Material.

In the event that a Islamic Terrorist Group did carry out any form of Nuclear Attack...the Resulting Counter Attack by the U.S. would be to terrible to contemplate. Split Infinity



posted on Sep, 19 2012 @ 02:06 AM
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reply to post by SplitInfinity
 


Can the tracking determine the difference between weaponised nuclear material and medical?



posted on Sep, 19 2012 @ 02:07 AM
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reply to post by DaesDaemar
 





Well, until you actually live in a Muslim country, they are not infringing upon you at all.


So you think I could go to Egypt and say "screw Islam - I reject this religion" - nobody would infringe my right?

You are simply prattling now. Reiterating your stupidity.




Islam is 700 years younger than Christianity and, like it, will eventually evolve as well.


Ya, well, it took a metaphysical and theological foundation amenable to the development of modern society that made Christianity become what we have in the modern world today.

Islam does not. As I wrote, but apparently you chose not to notice, Ibn Hanbal, Al Ashari, and Al Ghazali are the metaphysical theologians of mainstream Sunni Islam; these thinkers forbid the development of a tolerant Islam.

OK? Get the picture yet? Islam as is exists is bad. A new Islam compatible with the "evolution' you described would be good. It has nothing to do with "Islam is 700 years younger" but everything to do with the metaphysics and theological concepts developed.

Christianity had Augustine and Thomas Aquinas. Islam needs to look back to Avicenna and Averroes.



posted on Sep, 19 2012 @ 02:08 AM
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reply to post by SplitInfinity
 


The US has a habit of turning a blind eye to thing's politically advantageous.



posted on Sep, 19 2012 @ 02:12 AM
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reply to post by DaesDaemar
 

It is supposedly sensitive enough to track Medical Radiation Treatment...but Super Computers are easily able to determine by specific Radiation Emissions what exact type of Radioactive Material as well as what quantity as well as if it is either Uranium or Plutonium.
Split Infinity



posted on Sep, 19 2012 @ 02:23 AM
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Infinity, you are forgetting Diamona which is Isreals breeder reactor for the materials for their nukes.....
they # it down, i believe, but the materials there would make a dirty enough bomb that would contaminate the country.
They only have to hit it with CONVENTIONAL MISSILES>>>>>>>
really....



posted on Sep, 19 2012 @ 02:26 AM
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Originally posted by dontreally
reply to post by DaesDaemar
 


So you think I could go to Egypt and say "screw Islam - I reject this religion" - nobody would infringe my right?

You are simply prattling now. Reiterating your stupidity.


I don't agree with you, so you resort to trying to insult me? How civilized of you


I'm pretty sure many westerners travel to Egypt and are not muslim. So this is more about what they get away with inside your country, a political issue?



OK? Get the picture yet? Islam as is exists is bad.


Ah, yes I do get the picture, it's not political at all, it's religious and only your opinion counts. Well, whatever helps you sleep at night.



posted on Sep, 19 2012 @ 02:26 AM
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reply to post by dontreally
 

There is no doubt about that. Never the less. The ONLY REASON why we even put up with the CRAP that we get from countries in the Middle East is because of the OIL!

From a perspective of actual all out WAR...the entire Middle East is just CANNON FODDER. Middle Eastern Fanatical Leadership tends to Brag about Capabilities they do not have. They TALK AND TALK AND TALK....but when real Military Action occurs....they STOP TALKING. Split Infinity



posted on Sep, 19 2012 @ 06:55 AM
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reply to post by dontreally
 


lol the lack of serious thinking is strong with you

if you really thought about about it it's saudi arabia that should be anihilated along with mecca
burn the infection at the roots as it were.

a much less violent, more reasonable, yet ultimately more destructive to any foolish [and ultimately futile] delusions of world dominion by islam. would be to destroy OPEC and the oil cartels, completely getting rid of the petroleum based energy complex, by rolling out a new energy source, i'm sure there's 2 or 3 systems kept under wraps.

the way the house of saud goes through money they'll be impoverished in less than a decade or 2 [after running the country into the ground, putting paid to worthless fantasies islam peaked around haroun al rashid, the ottoman empire was the equivalent of the 2 roman empires. they wont be getting to that level again ever.

of course that means crushing the fascist house of bush, western xtian oil barons,and the american taliban scum, and putting an end to their hoovering up money as well,

awww who'd of thunk it, they're a greater threat to humanity these religious freaks, including the undercover nazis of the synagogue of satan, the zionists

you'd know that if you were thinking and not parroting/reading from a playbook
of a conspiracy that goes back to the days when the albino psychopaths of Transcaucasia,
the original Aryan conquerors [whose main tactic has always been: divide and conquer, unite and rule ]
started coming down from their mountains in droves

but those who subscribe exclusively and fanatically to using the religious paradigm as a tool of domination and politics have never truly contributed to the advancement of humanity and only serve to keep the human race in the muck

oh well, its like a turd spiraling as the toilet is flushed



posted on Sep, 19 2012 @ 11:52 AM
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Originally posted by dontreally
reply to post by DerepentLEstranger
 





ranian women wear designer jeans, in the privacy of their own homes, of course they can even study martial arts among other things


oh wow, designer jeans.

They also can't go out after 8pm without a chaperone.
They also can't practice karate with a head scarf.
The also cant go swimming without full body covering and a head scarf.

Yay! Look at how "modern" Iran is.

yay!
Iran Cleric Pummeled by ‘Badly Covered’ Woman After Warning, page 1
www.abovetopsecret.com...
www.newsmax.com...

The government condemns short, tight and colorful coats and loosely tied head-scarves, and routinely organizes police patrols to enforce the Islamic dress code. Public surveillance increases in summer when some women opt for flimsier clothing.

Beheshti said he was hospitalized for three days. The Iranian cleric said it was his religious duty to apply the principle of “commanding right and forbidding wrong,” and that he would continue to do so even after living through what he called “the worst day of my life.”

It isn’t the first time that clerics in Iran have been beaten up after delivering warnings, Mehr said.

Read more on Newsmax.com: Iran Cleric Pummeled by ‘Badly Covered’ Woman After Warning
Important: Do You Support Pres. Obama's Re-Election? Vote Here Now!



posted on Sep, 19 2012 @ 12:02 PM
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Originally posted by dontreally
... really, the earth has no other example of a people as intellectually and morally primed for battle as Muslims are.

Right now, or ever?
The Vikings come to mind.
Didn't they have to die in combat to enter Valhalla?



posted on Sep, 19 2012 @ 01:13 PM
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Originally posted by dontreally
reply to post by Tw0Sides
 





You see it as a Negative, But it is Honorable to the Max.


No, on the contrary, I see that as a positive. Love for God is great.

What I see as a negative is their refusal to recognize my right to believe as I want to.




If some foreign country invaded yours, wouldn't you fight to the Death?


You don't seem to get it, do you? You think, I am sure, that 9/11 was an "inside job" (the western elite merely enabled them; they didn't equip them with ideology and purpose). Given all I've written, does it not make sense to you why devout Muslims would hate the west? For one, they tried to change them (for our sake, so we could avoid martial confrontation later on) by introducing science and democracy into the region; but it never worked. Every Arab state has been a creation of the west; unnatural, hated by the majority of Muslims. Now that they have extricated themselves from western influence, some idiots take this as a good sign - "yay" freedom. Freedom from western influence; Freedom for the full implementation of Shari'a. Not good for us in the west.

You people seem to forget that the Muslims have had a caliphate for 1300 years. It was only 90 years ago that the Ottoman Caliphate collapsed; and to Muslims, that is a travesty.

So let me make something clear to you. When you let people with this sort of ideology to mobilize, what is the result? The result is allowing them to empower themselves; to reestablish the caliphate, and then become a much more prickly thorn in the side of the west.

This is an imperialistic religion. Your beliefs are not protected. Islam is not communism. The communists were atheists, and so considered self survival as much more important then mutually insured destruction. The Islamists are packed with an ideology so explosive and so ecstatic that to give them the power of wielding a nuclear bomb, gives them the power over your life: the simple question is: Should Muslims respect the lives of non-Muslims? If they know you'll refuse conversion, should they still leave you alone to live in peace?? No. Islam if given the opportunity would exterminate every non-Muslim to make room for Islamic expansion and make the World completely Islamic.
edit on 18-9-2012 by dontreally because: (no reason given)


So I take it you have spoken and got to know the personal feelings of all 1.5 Billion Muslims to be able to say the things you say. You seem under the impression that all of Islam is what society calls extremist or fanatical, Why? Are you a Muslim?

You speak of what the west wants, How many people occupy these western lands you speak of, I know Im one of them and I dont see or want anything that you see or want because all you want is death and destruction and disguise your hatred by blaming others for wanting death and destruction.



posted on Sep, 19 2012 @ 01:24 PM
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Originally posted by dontreally
reply to post by DaesDaemar
 





How exactly are they infringing on you?


They're belief system mandates that Islam control the non-Muslim world.

For instance, Muslims believe - and the Muslim Brotherhood insisted upon - that non-Muslims be restricted in their speech when talking about Islam. Is that right? Are you ok with being told "you can't say F*** Mohammad"; do you not find something terribly wrong with a totalitarian religious ideology overturning the sacred bill of rightsn which insures one the freedom of expression?

That is what I mean by infringing on my personal rights. I don't want to be harassed by people who believe something different telling me that I should consider sacred something they do. Of course, it's right to be respectful and not openly insult; but that doesn't change the fact that were indued with that right.


Point proved that you just want to fight, you do have the freedom to say/do whatever you wish just as I or Joe down the street have the right to do /say as we please however in a world of so much separation if you wish to speak Ill of ones beliefs expect some retaliation.

Who is harassing you because of your beliefs, I know I am but Im not Muslim, Im a westerner so this in it self makes your thread irrelevant or relevant to only the bigots of society.



posted on Sep, 19 2012 @ 01:31 PM
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Originally posted by dontreally
reply to post by DaesDaemar
 





Well, until you actually live in a Muslim country, they are not infringing upon you at all.


So you think I could go to Egypt and say "screw Islam - I reject this religion" - nobody would infringe my right?

You are simply prattling now. Reiterating your stupidity.




Islam is 700 years younger than Christianity and, like it, will eventually evolve as well.


Ya, well, it took a metaphysical and theological foundation amenable to the development of modern society that made Christianity become what we have in the modern world today.

Islam does not. As I wrote, but apparently you chose not to notice, Ibn Hanbal, Al Ashari, and Al Ghazali are the metaphysical theologians of mainstream Sunni Islam; these thinkers forbid the development of a tolerant Islam.

OK? Get the picture yet? Islam as is exists is bad. A new Islam compatible with the "evolution' you described would be good. It has nothing to do with "Islam is 700 years younger" but everything to do with the metaphysics and theological concepts developed.

Christianity had Augustine and Thomas Aquinas. Islam needs to look back to Avicenna and Averroes.


Is this thread part two to that movie just released insulting Islam.

Telling a group of so many people how they should act and with your suggestions of going to egypt and saying what you wrote keeps proving your immaturity. You've must have blinders on because every thing you seem to hate about them is exactly what your doing.

They shouldn't infringe on your beliefs, same goes for you, stop being bigoted and attracting bigots from the side you oppose.



posted on Sep, 19 2012 @ 02:08 PM
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reply to post by dontreally
 




The western concept of war is rooted in "war, as a last resort", whereas the Islamist concept is rooted in "War, at the first opportunity";

Only according to you.

I'll believe that once we all see muslim countries start outdoing the west when it comes to invasions and full scale wars.

Also, theres this...



Let me guess, its a good thing that a single western country has so many military bases around the world, right? Its ok because their concept of war is rooted in "war as a last resort", right?



edit on 19-9-2012 by sk0rpi0n because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 21 2012 @ 05:10 AM
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Generalising all Muslulims in the same category in a poorly written and poorly evidenced pseudo-racially fueled article on an internet forum is exactly why your opinion holds no weight... Moreover your history of anti-Muslim rants further diminished the credibility of anything you write.



posted on Sep, 21 2012 @ 06:13 AM
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reply to post by DaesDaemar
 





Well, until you actually live in a Muslim country, they are not infringing upon you at all.


Actually, you are mistaken. In some European countries, they are currently infringing upon the rights and lives of many citizens. Childrens school lunches are becoming obligatory Hallal, for example, in countries like France, where the Muslim population is reaching fifty percent in some cities.





Islam is 700 years younger than Christianity and, like it, will eventually evolve as well.

Originally posted by dontreally

Christianity had Augustine and Thomas Aquinas. Islam needs to look back to Avicenna and Averroes.


By the time Thomas Aquinas was born, there was already a Pope- Catholicism had already come into power.
Augustines influence was embraced much later, and is considered one of the major influences of the Protestant movements.

So these philosophers influenced the movements of these religions after their passage to major power.
Avicenna and Averroes might rise in influence after this one... there might be an Islamic equivalent to the Protestant movement one day in the future.

I think stirring very strong panicking hatred and fear of Islam can be detrimental to those moderates?
Those moderates who are being victimized by the fanatics, are being told by the fanatics- join us! The westerners hate you anyway, they do not understand you, your only choice for security is join us!

Then they are faced with the ignorance and hatred of fueled up westerners who have come to believe all Muslims are the same and are all our enemies...

How long you think they can hold out before they decide the fanatics are right?


I don't know, I try to have the courage to change that which I can,
the ability to accept that which I can't,
and the wisdom to know the difference.

I guess we're all doing the best we can in that effort, huh?
edit on 21-9-2012 by Bluesma because: (no reason given)
edit on 21-9-2012 by Bluesma because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 13 2012 @ 05:11 AM
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Originally posted by dontreally
There is a continuity between the non-reality of this world experienced in the mystical state and Islams political doctrine of seeing everything outside the boundaries of dar al Islam as essentially non-existent and thus suitable to be warred upon; hence, everything outside the boundaries of Islam is called in Islamic parlance "Dar Al Har" - abode of war. Meaning, at its root, those parts of creation which "war against Allah".


An important point. And this is the difference. The problem with apologetics is they have no understanding of Islam at all. They believe the weight of their liberal morals, protecting oppressed minorities, is where the argument starts and ends. They are ignorant enough to believe Islamic fundamentalism is blowback from 20th century western policies. They try to use peaceful moderate muslims to prove their point, because they have no understanding of history or Islamic doctrine to support their argument.


And the west in turn will take advantage of these attacks to enforce draconian laws on us; so we'll probably have civil war aswell; the source of the conflict would be Muslims - so many would probably attack Muslims, who in turn will stealthily deny wanting to convert non-Muslims; the US government will interfere to protect the Islamic population. I can already see how this all will proceed.


Could you elaborate? Civil conflicts will occur in Europe first. Check the demographics, north-western Europe is turning into a time bomb. We have a rapidly increasing Islamic population, radicalism spreading like wildfire, and a public that is gradually becoming intolerant of it.


This is why they are being enabled. They are the perfect pretext to installing a police state government.


Possibly. Depends if you buy into the myriad of NWO conspiracy theories. I suspect that the liberal and cultural marxist indoctrination in the academic and political classes (particularly in Europe) is a more likely cause. It is in their ideology to create a globalized, multicultural utopia. They believe the best way to diffuse radicalism within the ranks of the muslims is to afford them more rights and cater to their demands. It's always how liberals deal with angry, oppressed minorities. It helps that they have a disdain for the west and their own native cultural and racial identity. The left will never befriend the muslims however, no matter how hard they try.


Currently the great ARMED threat to the west is Iran.


Iran is a threat. If Pakistani radicals gain control of the government and nuclear stockpile they will present a much greater threat than Iran. Egypt is also experiencing a tidal wave of Islamism. Al Qaeda has a big presence in Libya and Egypt post-democratization. I am certain we will see several hostile Sunni theocracies pop up in the next couple decades. The people will eventually turn on the state department funded puppets. Sorry Hillary, your plan is not going to work.



posted on Oct, 13 2012 @ 07:54 AM
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What scares you more, a hungry tiger looking at you from a far or a lion eating your body while you have no weapons?

Priorities, have them. The US has so many bases around the world and yet, I do not see as much from Iran or most Arabic and Islamic countries.





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