Memo To Mitt Romney: The 47% Pay Taxes Too

Originally posted by Red Cloak
Right wing talk radio and Fox News started all this crazy nonsense about 47% of Americans not paying taxes (which is totally absurd and untrue).

Originally posted by OccamsRazor04
reply to post by Red Cloak

 

Federal income taxes. I believe it is true. You are wrong.

the Tax Policy Center, which provides data showing that in 2011, 46.4 percent of American households paid no federal income tax.

www.cbsnews.com...

Niether of you are technically wrong.

And as I made clear early in this thread...there is a difference between federal income tax and taxes.

Federal Income Tax accounts for roughly 25% of tax revenues to the federal government.

Other taxes...payroll, gasoline, sales, real estate etc. account for 75% of tax revenues...and are paid by the 47% Romney refers to.

reply to post by autowrench


After listening to and reading about Jesse Ventura lately, I would vote for him in 2016. People should really check out his position on the issues.

Jesse Ventura on the Issues

Low income. There's no income tax if your income falls below a certain threshold. For a family of four, that threshold was $26,400 last year.

Benefits for the elderly. Some Social Security payments are not taxed as income. The elderly also get an extra standard deduction that lowers their taxes, in some cases to zero.

Benefits for the working poor and children. These include the earned income tax credit, the child tax credit, and the child care tax credit. Because of these special benefits, a family of four (two parents, two children) earning up to $45,775 last year would not have had to pay income taxes, primarily because of special credits for children.

Other benefits. This includes itemized deductions, tax credits for education, and the income tax exemptions for everything from disability payments to interest on municipal bonds

This one shows a breakdown by annual income of all households that pay no income tax.

Among those households paying neither income tax nor payroll tax, almost all are either elderly or earning less than $20,000 a year. Here's a graphic from the Tax Policy Center that breaks this down.

www.npr.org...

No they don’t. Less they half of this country pay taxes. If you’re thinking of the tax at MacDonald’s or Burger King or the liquor store, we’re not counting that. We’re talking about federal income tax, taken from a pay check. WIK, LINK and any other cards don’t count as income. I am one of the 42% that work for the 1% to support the 47%. You’re welcome.

reply to post by Indigo5


F&S for the Op Indigo!

I wonder, (if we were to see Mitten's tax returns for 2009 & 2008) is Mitt Romney one of those who payed no taxes in the past as well?

www.slate.com...

So why not release a nice even five years of tax data? Perhaps because of something that happened in 2009.

Something like this:

Wealthy U.S. taxpayers, concerned about an Internal Revenue Service crackdown on the use of secret overseas bank accounts as tax havens, are rushing to meet a Thursday deadline to disclose those accounts or face possible criminal prosecution. The concern was triggered this summer when Switzerland's largest bank, caught up in an international tax evasion dispute, said it would disclose the names of more than 4,000 of its U.S. account holders.
The decision shattered a long-held belief that Swiss banks would guard the identities of its American customers as carefully as they did their money, and it raised concern that other international tax havens might be next. Under an amnesty program, the IRS is allowing taxpayers to avoid prosecution for having failed to report their overseas accounts. As a result, tax attorneys across the nation have been besieged by wealthy clients who are lining up to apply even though they will still face big financial penalties.

Just saying.

reply to post by D1Useek

Originally posted by D1Useek
If you’re thinking of the tax at MacDonald’s or Burger King or the liquor store, we’re not counting that.

Well, isn't it convenient that you're "not counting" the tax that the 47% DO pay...

So... 47% of the country don't pay taxes, (not counting the taxes they DO pay). Is that what you're selling? Seriously?

Originally posted by D1Useek
No they don’t. Less they half of this country pay taxes.

You are confused...perhaps read the thread?

Federal Income Tax only accounts for 27% of tax revenue for the government.

So you "Don't count" the vast majority of taxes? Convenient.....

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
reply to post by Indigo5

 

Originally posted by Indigo5
...someone who hides thier vast fortune overseas to avoid paying taxes deriding half the country as "not taking responsibility for thier lives" for not contributing sufficiently in Federal Income Tax.

That is the real irony, isn't it? Too funny!

Yes. In the only year Romney has released tax returns, 2010, he carried forward capital losses from 2009...the year the stock market tanked. So it follows that he maximized his capital losses in 2009 and had leftovers to carry forward in 2010. Otherwise...there is strong evidence assuming his accountants (who seem to be the best money can buy) are competent, that Romney himself paid no taxes in 2009...but of course we will never know.

Originally posted by D1Useek
No they don’t. Less they half of this country pay taxes. If you’re thinking of the tax at MacDonald’s or Burger King or the liquor store, we’re not counting that. We’re talking about federal income tax, taken from a pay check. WIK, LINK and any other cards don’t count as income. I am one of the 42% that work for the 1% to support the 47%. You’re welcome.

They should get rid of the whole system and give us something that is easier to understand.

Maybe the elitists made it complex on purpose?

reply to post by schuyler


I dont believe that figure about 47% being on some kind of assistance like food stamps. No one in my entire family, sisters brother their kids, cousins, aunts and uncles, have ever been on any kind of assistance. We are not rich either. We are hard working middle class, ( at 50-70 K not 200K) people. If no one I know is on assistance then it cannot be 47 % because that would be one out of every two

It is truly sad at how incredibly stupid the average American is.

Originally posted by ELectricalApprentice

He's projecting his own evils onto 47% of the population. All the things he accuses them of, the accused could also say about him. Personally, I don't think Obama is any different behind closed doors, but what do I know?

This statement is so true. Even the birther issue started with his father who was born in Mexico and ran for president. When the question of his birth came up he quit.

Originally posted by Indigo5
Memo To Mitt Romney: The 47% Pay Taxes Too
FORBES

A secret videotape of Republican Presidential candidate Mitt Romney talking at a private fundraising event earlier this year could revive—in virulent form— the debate Texas Gov. Rick Perry started last year when he complained of “the injustice that nearly half of all Americans don’t even pay any income tax.”

Romney at his most candid and impolitic.

Here’s part of what he had to say:

There are 47 percent of the people who will vote for the president no matter what.

All right, there are 47 percent who are with him, who are dependent upon government, who believe that they are victims, who believe the government has a responsibility to care for them, who believe that they are entitled to health care, to food, to housing, to you-name-it.

That that’s an entitlement. And the government should give it to them. And they will vote for this president no matter what…These are people who pay no income tax….

"[M]y job is is not to worry about those people. I'll never convince them they should take responsibility and care for thier lives

OK...47%???

let me make a few serious points about the 46.4% of American households who paid no federal income taxes for 2011.

First of all, according to the Tax Policy Center, more than 60% of those non-income tax paying households did pay federal payroll taxes—meaning Social Security and Medicare taxes. (Considering all Americans households, including those that owed income tax, 62% paid more in payroll taxes than in federal income taxes.)

Payroll taxes..

What of the 18.1% of U.S. households that paid neither income nor payroll taxes? More than half of them were headed by a senior–in other words, by someone who paid payroll taxes and likely some income taxes too, in the past.

Half of that 47% percent are retired SENIORS...that take no "responsibility for thier lives"...moochers..

Tax Policy Center researchers calculate that 16.7 million elderly households will pay no tax in 2011 because of those two breaks and a special low income credit for the elderly.

By comparison, the earned income tax credit, the child credit and the child care credit combined keep only 11.5 million households with kids from paying income tax.

And the other taxes of daily living beyond Federal Income tax?

Of course, it goes without saying, that those folks who aren’t paying federal taxes are almost all paying state and local taxes—state sales taxes, real estate taxes (either on their homes or built into their rents) and possibly state income taxes too, since those taxes tend to exempt fewer poor families than does the federal income tax. If they buy gasoline, liquor or tobacco, or have telephones, they’re also feeding the federal purse.

Read that above list again...now multiply it by 99...who pays more in everyday tax? 99% of America or the 1%?

It doesn't take a genius to understand that 99% of America pays those gasoline taxes...taxes on the grocery bill, etc. etc. etc. 99 times more often than the 1% in any given year. And the 1% doesn't eat 99 times more food than the average person...use 99 times the amount of gas etc.

Not all of those escaping income taxes have modest incomes, however. In 2009, according to Internal Revenue Service studies, six of the 400 U.S. tax filers with the highest adjusted gross income (meaning AGI of at least $77 million) paid no U.S. income tax, while 19,551 U.S. households with income above $200,000 owed no U.S. or foreign income tax.

Some other stats...

This 47% also includes almost all US Soldiers...

It includes Half of all households making between 30k-40k

A Quarter of households making making between 50k-70k

It includes college students and those blue collar, hard working, middle class families.

Just so everyone knows who Romney and his surrogates are referring to with folks who "take no responsibility for thier lives" and are looking for "handouts"

Interested in opinions ....

edit on 18-9-2012 by Indigo5 because: (no reason given)

edit on 18-9-2012 by Indigo5 because: (no reason given)

edit on 18-9-2012 by Indigo5 because: (no reason given)

Maybe we should give those same 47% a free pass to not have to pay sales tax as well.

Your argument is rubbish. If you want to make that argument, calculate what we tax payers actually pay each year in real terms, too? That would start a revolution.

Originally posted by Indigo5

Originally posted by D1Useek
No they don’t. Less they half of this country pay taxes.

You are confused...perhaps read the thread?

Federal Income Tax only accounts for 27% of tax revenue for the government.

So you "Don't count" the vast majority of taxes? Convenient.....

edit on 19-9-2012 by Indigo5 because: (no reason given)

Riiiiight. Those on govt assistance get money from the govt (hence govt assistance). Handed out to them. Welfare, Food Stamps, EBT cards, whatever you like there are hundreds of programs. So they take that free money and go buy something... a shirt, a Big Mac, an Xbox, an iPhone, gasoline. It's really quite a stretch to say they pay taxes... with free govt money. I mean technically they paid taxes but not really.

It's like if I owe you $5 and I borrow another $20 from you to pay back the $5. You could say I paid you back, but really you're in the hole for even more now.

Originally posted by jjkenobi

Originally posted by Indigo5

Originally posted by D1Useek
No they don’t. Less they half of this country pay taxes.

You are confused...perhaps read the thread?

Federal Income Tax only accounts for 27% of tax revenue for the government.

So you "Don't count" the vast majority of taxes? Convenient.....

edit on 19-9-2012 by Indigo5 because: (no reason given)

Riiiiight. Those on govt assistance get money from the govt (hence govt assistance). Handed out to them. Welfare, Food Stamps, EBT cards, whatever you like there are hundreds of programs. So they take that free money and go buy something... a shirt, a Big Mac, an Xbox, an iPhone, gasoline.

Half of the 47% that Romney accused of not "taking responsibility for thier lives" are SENIORS...
Many of the remainder are college students, soldiers etc...and then there is the working poor niether on welfare nor paying taxes.

Less than 14% recieve anything remotely related to foodstamps..

It still boggles my mind when folks don't acknowledge facts, but return to false arguments...

It's like if I owe you $5 and I borrow another $20 from you to pay back the $5. You could say I paid you back, but really you're in the hole for even more now.

Or when you lend the government money your entire career with the promise that you will be paid back in Social Security and Medicare benefits when you are elderly...

And then the government spends that money on two unfunded wars...

And tells you that you are a leech and a moocher for expecting to be paid back those funds as the government promised...Demands to eliminate the mechanism in which you will be repaid...looks to hand over the remaining funds to the same wall street morons that lost everyone's 401ks....Derides you as "entitlement" parasites...all for expecting a return of some of the funds you willingly paid the government with the promise of repayment later in life.

And now Mitt Romney says YOU take no responsibility for your life!

I totally understand what you mean. Blacks auto-cast votes for Obama, it's apparent by the OP of this thread and it's apparent in how he replies to other posters. He talks about Mitt Romney shooting first and then aiming later. And when it comes to his own threads and posts, he pretends not to understand the pertinent questions and answers them extremely vague. He then goes off-topic by attacking the poster with distractions. You cannot reason with this OP's hypocrisy.

Back To The Topic:
Mitt Romney did not back down from the 47% statement and rightfully so. How can you apologize for people's blatant hypocrisy? This gravy train is headed towards a big wreck. Thankfully, most Americans are not on board and will not be.

-au

Originally posted by OccamsRazor04

Originally posted by Logarock

Originally posted by Indigo5

Originally posted by ELectricalApprentice

He's projecting his own evils onto 47% of the population. All the things he accuses them of, the accused could also say about him.

Well that is too honest an observation...someone who hides thier vast fortune overseas to avoid paying taxes deriding half the country as "not taking responsibility for thier lives" for not contributing sufficiently in Federal Income Tax.

Evils? Yes Mitt should want to make life as confortable as possible for the 47%.

Poor little babies.....bad ol Mitt.

Lets face it .....for at least 1/2 of the 47% its a gravy train!!!!! You would have to walk through life with blinders on not to see this. What ever side of the deal your on, your a self deluded tool not to see it.

I do not know if I would go that far. But there are some segments of the population that will pretty much auto cast their vote for Obama. Some of these 47% are in that camp. Every black person I know, and let's face it, pretty much all the ones I don't know, will also auto cast for Obama. I tried having a discussion about the job growth report with a black co-worker and he wouldn't believe me. I brought up about 10 sources all saying the same thing. He wouldn't listen and stopped talking to me saying it was a lie. This is a smart college educated professional man too.

Originally posted by D1Useek
No they don’t. Less they half of this country pay taxes. If you’re thinking of the tax at MacDonald’s or Burger King or the liquor store, we’re not counting that. We’re talking about federal income tax, taken from a pay check. WIK, LINK and any other cards don’t count as income. I am one of the 42% that work for the 1% to support the 47%. You’re welcome.

mitt romney paid no FEDERAL INCOME TAX...he paid tax on his investments ONLY....amounting to (he claims) 13%...and only on investments the government forced him to reveal.

reply to post by alternateuniverse

Mitt Romney did not back down from the 47% statement and rightfully so. How can you apologize for people's blatant hypocrisy? This gravy train is headed towards a big wreck. Thankfully, most Americans are not on board and will not be.

Then why doesn't Mitt complain about the 4000 millionaires that pay no income tax. Or about corporations that pay no taxes but receive millions in returns. Those are the real freeloaders.

Originally posted by buster2010
reply to post by alternateuniverse

 

Mitt Romney did not back down from the 47% statement and rightfully so. How can you apologize for people's blatant hypocrisy? This gravy train is headed towards a big wreck. Thankfully, most Americans are not on board and will not be.

Then why doesn't Mitt complain about the 4000 millionaires that pay no income tax. Or about corporations that pay no taxes but receive millions in returns. Those are the real freeloaders.

How about you do some research on the facts. If you make $500,000 and lose $500,000 your net income is zero. No income means no income tax. What happened in 2008? A financial crash, which means many people lost a lot of money, more than their income.

If you are retired and give sizeable charitable donations this also can offset income to where you do not pay taxes, because you have already donated MUCH more than you would have paid in taxes anyway. Then there are foreign tax credits because you already paid taxes to another country. Please get educated.

Originally posted by jimmyx

Originally posted by D1Useek
No they don’t. Less they half of this country pay taxes. If you’re thinking of the tax at MacDonald’s or Burger King or the liquor store, we’re not counting that. We’re talking about federal income tax, taken from a pay check. WIK, LINK and any other cards don’t count as income. I am one of the 42% that work for the 1% to support the 47%. You’re welcome.

mitt romney paid no FEDERAL INCOME TAX...he paid tax on his investments ONLY....amounting to (he claims) 13%...and only on investments the government forced him to reveal.

Wow the ignorance is crazy. Romney paid $3.1 million in federal income tax last year. Just wow .....