Brain Death and the Organ Donor Conspiracy

reply to post by Shax35


I was the one who had to pull the plug on Pa, as Ma was too out of it emotionally to make the decision.
I literally walked out of the ER and collapsed onto the ground and couldn't move.
My aunts had to pull me up and get me to a bench.

Life and Death decisions are very hard.

reply to post by Pigraphia


Life and Death decisions are very hard, put it in writing so your relatives know. Talk about it, a lot.

If you have a young person - please, don't let the "organ money makers" make you regret something, they are right on the spot, at the worst time.

I'm a nurse, I've had to take care of a convicted child molester who had diabetes and wouldn't take care of himself with a "donated" kidney. I'm sorry, makes me sick to thing someone died to give that idiot an organ to abuse even further -- on the tax payer's dime.

At least one doctor agrees that there is pressure on docs to declare brain death.

Organs taken from patients that doctors were pressured to declare brain dead: suit

The New York Organ Donor Network pressured hospital staffers to declare patients brain dead so their body parts could be harvested — and even hired “coaches” to train staffers how to be more persuasive, a bombshell lawsuit charged yesterday.

The federally funded nonprofit used a “quota” system, and leaned heavily on the next of kin to sign consent forms when patients were not registered as organ donors, the suit charged.

“They’re playing God,” said plaintiff Patrick McMahon, 50, an Air Force combat veteran and nurse practitioner who claims he was fired as a transplant coordinator after just four months for protesting the practice.

NY Post

He cites four cases in which he feels the families were pressured to sign away their loved one's organs when they still had a chance or the brain death diagnosis was questionable.

They got rid of him really quick once he started objecting to their practices. Hopefully, his lawsuit will bring an end to that sort of stuff in the hospitals.

reply to post by FortAnthem


Wow, great find.

That's so scary to contemplate. Nightmares tonight, thats for sure....

Of all the threads I could have read tonight...

I signed the organ donor section earlier today. o_O

I've actually gone to do so on many occasions, but never managed to do it until today.

I always thought, "Well if I'm dead already, I might as well let somebody live".

I just never got over the creepiness of it

I did today however, completely spontaneous decision.

And now this comes to light aha.

It's making me question everything.

I want to bump this thread, and thank smyleegirl for making it.

Earlier this week there was an article about a guy who'd been in a "vegetative state" for over a decade, and now they are learning how to do brain scans to determine the "thought process."

This topic fascinates me (being a mind/brain fanatical wanna-know)......

I've always felt that organ donation is wrong and weird. But, when/how do we know what to do??

I have stories of transplant receivers, and morgue experiences, and it just seems........somehow wrong to tamper with.
Just, thanks for the thread, smylee. If you're still paying attention.

I was a Certified Nurse Aide for several years while I was completing my degree in IT. I took care of several residents who were (and had been for years) in vegetative states. These folks were unreponsive to "stimuli", but they were not on life support. They could not answer questions. they could not "squeeze" an answer with their hands, or write, or indicate a positive or negative, but their eyes were wide open, and they LOOKED at us, and FOLLOWED us with their eyes. We saw their eyes change when they appeared to like or dislike things we did or said or tried to feed them.

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I want to make sure I distance this reply from the question of life/death that has to be decided for persons who are in a Coma. These residents were all "unplugged" and still alive, without being sustained on life support, but all were considered "vegetative" on their charts.
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We were expected to feed them, change their adult diapers, turn them regularly during each shift (to prevent bedsores), bathe them, and move them from place to place, per their charts. The RN's took care of more technical, higher level duties, with more responsibility, such as IV's, diabetic nail clippings, packing wounds, inserting/removing catheters, etc.

None of them were lying entirely immobile in a bed. They were constantly moved from beds to full-support wheelchairs (that means there are wheelchair extensions with padding, that provide additional body support, which are placed in such a manner that it supports the resident's full weight when they are laid back and/or exceed the length of an ordinary sitting-up type wheelchair). They could and did make minor body shifts in their sitting or lying positions. Not a single person in a vegetative state, that I took care of, was entirely immobile.

If you put food to their mouths they would eat, at least a little. We had some who would suck on a straw placed in their lips, others would swallow from a spoon put to their mouths. Regardless, they all needed supplimental feeding tubes because none could take in enough to support their bodies needs.

Two of them were young men, who had been in (entirely separate - not even the same nursing home) car accidents, whose heads were mostly caved in. Imagine a softball sized dent in your loved one's head, never "pops" back out again. Like that. Long healed over, with hair and all, but permanently caved in.

One never had visits from his family, but he could eat, and he seemed more comfortable, and relaxed when I would play the radio while I fed him. I always used to talk to him while I fed him, and I could usually get a full bowl of hot cereal mush (whatever was on his order that he would not choke on) into him, and I would tidy him up and give him a hug before I had to go on to my next resident.

The other had visits from his fiancee, who had been with him during the accident, but was not injured, and from his family, who hated the fiancee and blamed her for everything. I felt worse for him. I KNOW he knew what was going on, but could not communicate it. Every time I entered his room, it felt cold, and his family visits only brought stress. He was the only resident I ever took care of who had so many blood transfusions that we had to take special HIV and Hepatitus precautions, double gloves and so on. The poor guy - I felt so bad for him. Half his head caved in, no way to communicate, no physical contact due to the extra precautions, and regular visits from feuding family - with no voice in it and nothing he could do about it one way or another. What a living hell this poor young man went through (still may be, for all I know - he was only in his twenties when I helped care for him.)

Just giving you folks an idea of what "vegetative" means outside of the news papers. We all, all of the Nurse Aides, felt they had personalities, even though they could not communicate. We looked into their eyes every day, and they looked back. These folks were not lying motionless, with closed eyes, unmoving. "Vegetative" does not equal "unaware" or "not alive" in my book.

Originally posted by spirit_horse
This absolutely kills me inside. My 15 year old daughter overdosed on prescription medication she took. She came out on a Saturday evening and was perfectly fine and told everyone she loved them and goodnight. Sunday morning when we went to wake her to go to church she was unresponsive, not breathing, apparently deceased. She had a temperature of 104 when the paramedics and police arrived. They took her to the hospital emergency room and homicide showed up and we were all dealing with them for about 30 minutes before we were able to go to the hospital.

When I got there a nurse told me she was deceased and would I sign a release for organ donation. I was very distraught and not in my right mind obviously. Believing that they would be telling me the truth and considering my daughter's always willing to help others we thought that she would want us to use her organs to help save some other child’s life and I signed the papers.

I was later very disturbed to find out what exactly they did and really don't want to discuss it here. However, I found out she was supposedly being kept alive on a respirator. Considering she had a temperature of 104 when the paramedics arrived and they rushed her to the hospital, she had to be alive in order for them to use the organs. They supposedly have to be alive or the organs would be quickly destroyed.

I received a letter several weeks later which informed me that for some reason they were unable to use anything they harvested (their word) from her. That was just that much worse because I can't get this mutilation out of my mind. They took not only organs, but bones, tissue, etc. Try living with that on your mind and also knowing that it was all for naught.

I am now horrified at what they did to her and can't get it out of my head that exactly what this thread is about happened to my daughter. I can barely continue living with myself as I signed the authorization. I can't tell you all the things that run through my mind and if I didn't have such a strong family and their support, you would probably have read about me in the news by now. I would seriously give great consideration and discussion amongst your families about the possibility of having a similar situation develop with one of your loved ones and being confronted with an overzealous medical person asking for a signature because there is nothing that can be done to save your loved one.

I once accidentally overdosed on pain medicine which I had been given increasingly potent form of over 22 years. I was on life support for several days and my family was told I had no brain activity and they didn't think I would recover from it. Well, the doctors, and my family were shocked when I pulled the respirator hose out of my throat twice before waking up and immediately being conscious and talking. They said they had never seen someone come out of it like that. The doctors told the family that if I did come out it would take several days and I may not be able to speak or have any real ability to function normally. I am telling you this for one reason. The doctors do not know for sure what the hell is going to happen. This happening over the same narcotic pain medicine that my daughter took further convinced me that had I not signed the organ donation papers that she may have had a full recovery.

Please, take serious consideration before you make any decision like that and discuss it with your family and with medical professionals that have no personal interest in a potential situation like that. I would have made a totally different decision and living with something like that decision is a nightmare!

edit on 19/9/12 by spirit_horse because: typos

Spirit_Horse - I wish for the blessing of peace to you and yours. I can't say more, words are not available. Much love - truly - Gwynn

Excellent thread

I have long suspected organ donations are being done in haste, using these brain dead patients.
I wonder why it really is that you have organ donor on your drivers license. Is it so that at the scene paramedics know right away to keep you alive so you are of service when they take you to the hospital for potential organ donation?

For one, they don't want organs from dead bodies. They are of no use. The organs are kept alive and transported very quickly to the intended recipient.

Some people think they are only donating because they're dead anyways and say things like I may as well give them away and help save a life, when indeed they could be setting themselves up to be terminated prematurely.

By the time the family arrives at the hospital the patient has already been placed in the drug induced coma and aren't going to look like they will pull through to the family. The patient is so drugged up and sedated.
If they are on a ventilator they can't talk because the tube is shoved down into the vocal chords.
They don't have much of a chance or no strength to muster up a hand squeeze or murmur a noise, show any reactions or signs somebody is in there.

They launch into their requests for your loved ones organs within a few hours, saying there isn't a good chance of survival and his organs can help save another.....And in some way he lives on.

It seems they are in disagreement over what brain dead is.
Once they do agree, I'm sure it will be written to lawfully acquire organs. It has to be that the organs are kept alive but the remaining body parts or brain have to be 'dead' for reasons of talking the family into donating.

It's entirely possible that road accident victims are used as the best to choose from, that they might not be in the serious condition doctors tell the family. In a multiple victim car accident its usually a few survive while others are critical, the families weren't at the scene themselves and only know what they are told happened to their loved one.

There are so many stories of patients who pull through and even recover completely.

Those who say they could hear people in the room talking.

I found this forum a little later, but I have been doing some research on organ donation. I'm all for saving lives, but early death so that my organs can be used to save other people. I am not an organ donor (maybe a living donor for family) and I will not accept an organ from anyone unless maybe from a relative. I will donate my body because I figure there won't be any need to speed up my death cause cadavers do not need to be collected minutes after death. Anyways it disturbs me that there are is an increasing amount of stories of declared brain dead people waking up and living normal lives. These people were being prepped to be organ donors! One guy was found (by relatives) not actually brain dead 2 hours before the harvesting of his organs. The guy heard doctors asking his family to make him a donor and he couldn't do anything.
It's kind of shocking how people react to others who don't want to donate their organs, calling them selfish and bad people. Our bodies are ours and we are not obligated to give our body parts away. Of course, not being mean, people needing transplants always say hey everyone should be an organ donor so people like me don't have to suffer. I'm fine w/that, but I would like to know how many of them are willing to donate organs if they can? If you don't want to why should I? Some people's comments also made them sound entitled, like i'm sick, gimme your organs or you are a selfish human being. As I said no one has to give up their organs. I would also like to know how many of the people that work w/organ transplantation (all people in the field, from the doctors to nurses to the reps) would donate theirs? They never talk about that and they should. If the percentage is small, then there is something going on. I've heard stories of people being hounded by organ donation after they have just lost a loved one, this shows complete indifference towards the family and the deceased, I don't care about the time limit, there is a loss of a life. Giving up on one life to save 7 others absolutely does not make a wrong right. If a person isn't gone and they take their organs, saving those lives does not at all make up for murder. i find it weird that someone is hoping for lungs, a heart, a kidney etc, they are pretty much hoping for someone w/their match to die, I would never want a transplant like that.