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Abductee support group thread

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posted on Sep, 17 2012 @ 05:40 PM
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Kidding with the title, i am a abductee and during my experience you go through phases, and im long past trying to tell my story to 'convince' someone. Im more trying to find some people to chat with that has had a encounter like mine.
So anyone think aliens and the afterlife are somehow connected? Like does anyone else think abductions and near death experiences are very simalar ?
If your a abductee and feel this is a possibility please chime in.With your thoughts.
I know this is a open forum , but to all the skeptics and people who want to argue , thats not the point, as technically we are talking about something to which doesnt exist.




posted on Sep, 17 2012 @ 06:02 PM
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reply to post by Stimpy
 


I'm pretty much quoting myself from another similar thread:


The majority of Alien Contact reports and claims can be described and attributed to subject specific personally subjective Psychological Phenomenon experiences.

Such stance is supported by:
The Psychology of Alien Contact and Abduction Claims

The Construction of Space Alien Abduction Memories

The Ordinary Nature of Alien Abduction Memories

Memory Distortion in People Reporting Abduction by Aliens

Transcultural Psychiatry - Sleep Paralysis, Sexual Abuse, and Space Alien Abduction

as well as many other well documented citations, and papers listed in the public domain on the subject.

Further, as supported by above documentation and other studies conducted regarding the phenomenon, the majority of Alien Abduction accounts can be accounted for by Schizotypy and/or Schizotypal Personality Disorder (SPD) as well as several other classifications.

Please note, this is not a personal criticism of anyone, but a classification as held in the Psycho-Social diagram.

Of further note; such classifications are not a statement of mental health, or illness, though such factors as relevant to this phenomenon of Alien Contact do make presentation.

In support of this statement;

Schizotypy isn't necessarily a 'bad' thing.
There is such a state as "Healthy" Schizotypy:

Although aiming to reflect some of the features present in diagnosable mental illness, schizotypy does not necessarily imply that someone who is more schizotypal than someone else is more ill. For example, certain aspects of schizotypy may be beneficial. Both the Unusual experiences and Cognitive disorganisation aspects have been linked to Creativity and academic achievement. Jackson proposed the concept of ‘benign schizotypy’ in relation to certain classes of religious experience, which he suggested might be regarded as a form of problem-solving and therefore of adaptive value. The link between positive schizotypy and certain facets of creativity is consistent with the notion of a "healthy schizotypy", which may account for the persistence of schizophrenia-related genes in the population despite their many dysfunctional aspects.


I encourage those unfamiliar with, or biased against Psychological classifications to educate yourselves.
"Crazy" is not a clinical designation, but a societal perception.

Schizotypy in some ways, considering the creative aspects associated with healthy subjects, could be like having Synesthesia which is actually quite a wonderful and fascinating condition.


Thus, in summary:
The majority of Alien Contact accounts can be described as Psychological Phenomenon; subjective personal experiences had by subjects as the result of Schizotypal Personality Disorder, Sleep Paralysis, or similar where such is held out and supported in the documentation provided above.

Individuals are welcome to their own views for any reason or no reason at all.
The views expressed in this post are a majority held view in the scientific community as upheld by rigorous peer reviewed and replicated research.

This position is not a criticism of any individual person. This is not an accusation or diagnosis of mental health. This is simply the view of the scientific community in regard to the topic of Alien Contact as described in the Psychological diagram.

edit on 17-9-2012 by Druscilla because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 17 2012 @ 06:09 PM
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I don't understand how you would connect alien abduction and the afterlife. To me they are two seperate things. Curious as to why you would connect them.



posted on Sep, 17 2012 @ 06:25 PM
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reply to post by Druscilla
 


Are you saying that alien abduction isn't happening or has never happened?

Not trying to come off as a, you know what, I am just curious.

-SAP-



posted on Sep, 17 2012 @ 06:41 PM
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I think the only connection (or at least, one of the connections) is, time is relative. Whether we're abducted or die....time as we know it in our 3D existence, ceases to exist.

Now...I'm not sure how the mechanics work as far as our bodies and abductions are concerned but somehow, all laws of physics, break down and become suspended.

What I know is, there's life after life.
This is just an experience. We are not our bodies. Our bodies are like a ride at an amusement park. We're just experiencing 'life' in this mechanical apparatus filled with programmed systems.

What is so sad is, we know all this. We are born with all this knowledge. But however it's been done....it's been successfully engineered that we start forgetting the moment we start breathing.

Yes, abductions are real. Not sure who exactly are behind them but I know certain departments of different governments know all about it though.

I also know (not from experience rather, innate knowledge) that when we 'die' it's very similar to a molting snake who leaves their skin.



posted on Sep, 17 2012 @ 06:47 PM
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reply to post by Druscilla
 


Why are you here? I mean, really? If you don't believe or have any experience in these esoteric like matters, why are you parked on a conspiracy forum? It's a total disservice to truth and I resent you being a human speed bump.

You know nothing but yet you pretend to. You posture yourself as the All-knowing, All-seeing member of this community.

Your opinions (that are always dipped as 'factual') are 100% wrong as far as this phenomenon is concerned.
You can't read up on this. One has to experience it. So here again, you know nothing about this. I wish you'd start your own forum and leave this one alone. Seriously.



posted on Sep, 17 2012 @ 06:49 PM
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Originally posted by Night Star
I don't understand how you would connect alien abduction and the afterlife. To me they are two seperate things. Curious as to why you would connect them.



I think the connection is, we experience a different reality when we're abducted or when we die. A different dimension if you will.. A different 'life'.
So I can see where OP is connecting the two.



posted on Sep, 17 2012 @ 07:18 PM
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I don't feel a real need to talk about it especially, but I noted some correlation in my experiences.
If it can be interesting or helpful to others with similar experiences, I will share mine.

The one in which a UFO (of the typical metalic disc type) was hovering above me, and then made manouvers impossible for any known aircraft we have today had an element of that sort.

As I watched it (for my car and all the cars on that road had stalled, we could do nothing else but stare at this),
I first thought it was some sort of military aircraft, that I was seing from a particular angle just giving this false impression of it's shape. So I had no sense of it being "otherworldy" at all.
So I was confused when I suddenly felt I was recieving some sort of communication from or connected with it, which included the voice or energy of my mother! For she had passed away a few years earlier.

Then it started to make it's strange manouvers and I lost any sense of this thing being a normal experience associated with an abnormal one- it was just ALL abnormal.

But for quite a while I couldn't make sense of why I felt one phenomenon associated with another.
Later, durign experiences that developed of more complex and interactive communication with other consciousness, I recieved an explanation.

I once thought it was a very individual and original view point, but since have come to find it is echoed in many "channelled" messages that are popular- that we are non-physical beings in essence, that change containers, and experiences in time and space, including different planets, different biologies.

We have been in different vehicles, from different planets, we shall be, we are right now. Our access to our memory and our various other levels of self is effected by the DNA of the vehicle we inhabit.

I won't make any effort to make anyone believe that- I cannot claim I believe it myself! I think it is perfectly possible that my experiences were some sort of psychotic break, and the many other people involved, (like the other drivers on that road, and later the rest of my family-) suffered the effects of collective hallucinations.

I went through extensive testing with a psychiatrist, and he could not find any other signs of schizoid or psychotic tendancies, but as I was sure that must be it anyway, I went to a psychoanalyst to fidn some way to fit these events into such an explanation.

It was rather difficult, but eventually we came up with a theory somewhat along Jungian lines, that in a sort of phase of growth in self awareness, in between having my personality that was formed early in life destroyed and my conscious construction of a new one, a period without boundries of ego happened.
I went through a trip in the collective consciousness.

The thing which would explain the other people involved in my experiences would have to involve a concept that the collective consciousness and the elements within it have a sort of level of reality all their own, that can move from one individual to the next , regardless of space and without sensual communication.
LIke an underground river, through which the entities, the avatars, the archetypes, can flow from to the other, on deep levels, despite what ever thougths and beliefs the person has consciously, as an individual.

That still opens a can of worms just as hard to believe for some people, as the physical entity from outer space hypothesis, but it was the best we could come up with considering all elements of the events.

But it also means to me that the messages and concepts I felt were "communicated" to me might still be valid, even if they just came up from such a deep source of knowledge and memory.

So I don't worry about the messenger and deciding what or who it was, I just remain attentive to the messenges!
edit on 17-9-2012 by Bluesma because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 17 2012 @ 07:20 PM
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reply to post by Stimpy
 


I'm not an abductee but do sympathise with your respective group and believe what you are going through is indeed happening.

Of course there are some who lie, some purposefully to discredit those who are honest, but I hold faith in humanity hope you're being honest.



posted on Sep, 17 2012 @ 07:24 PM
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reply to post by Human_Alien
 


They travel, and exist, in the 4th density. When we die we go a level higher, 5th density, it is theorised. The similarities are that 4th density is supposedly partial physical, partially ethereal. 5th density and up are ethereal.



posted on Sep, 17 2012 @ 09:55 PM
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reply to post by Bluesma
 

Very nice post. Well put...thanks for the effort. Im pressed for time so i just want to get a quick reply out.
I saw myself fly through the stars and into a round object, i had missing time , broad day missing time, so skeptics please dont chime in sleep dis order, and a few other things that i dont have time to speak on, but as for flying into a ufo ship, i doubt i flew through a wood roof, so i think it was a out of body experience, and the missing time, i dunno, 5 hours passed, and i only can remember one question a ' alien' asked me. It was poof. It was telepathy , as thats how they communicated . But i have seen objects in real life, and i dont know what they were, so , i do think ufos could be real objects, which is a confusing statement, im basically saying 'aliens' are real, and are ghosts, which sounds stupid, but i do think many abductions happen, and the human never left the bedroom..gotta go, ill post the rest in a bit



posted on Sep, 18 2012 @ 12:01 AM
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Originally posted by SloAnPainful
reply to post by Druscilla
 


Are you saying that alien abduction isn't happening or has never happened?

Not trying to come off as a, you know what, I am just curious.

-SAP-


Please note, I use words like 'majority', 'most', and other such quantities that still leave open margin for whatever it is that anyone wants to believe or have faith in.


Originally posted by Human_Alien
reply to post by Druscilla
 


Why are you here? I mean, really? If you don't believe or have any experience in these esoteric like matters, why are you parked on a conspiracy forum? It's a total disservice to truth and I resent you being a human speed bump.

You know nothing but yet you pretend to. You posture yourself as the All-knowing, All-seeing member of this community.

Your opinions (that are always dipped as 'factual') are 100% wrong as far as this phenomenon is concerned.
You can't read up on this. One has to experience it. So here again, you know nothing about this. I wish you'd start your own forum and leave this one alone. Seriously.


Please note, my assertions are followed up by, linked to, and supported by documentation that's peer reviewed, verified, and upheld in the scientific community.
What does that say?
Where's your proof?

Why am I here? I think people have been asking that question for as long as people have been people.
Further, last i checked, this is an open forum. My post is on topic, and very relevant as it concerns the topic, regardless of whether you like it, and regardless of what your opinion of the person making the statement is.

I'm not attacking you. Why are you attacking me?
Show proof and documentation to support your claims. I have.



posted on Sep, 18 2012 @ 01:37 AM
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Originally posted by Druscilla

Originally posted by SloAnPainful
reply to post by Druscilla
 


Are you saying that alien abduction isn't happening or has never happened?

Not trying to come off as a, you know what, I am just curious.

-SAP-


Please note, I use words like 'majority', 'most', and other such quantities that still leave open margin for whatever it is that anyone wants to believe or have faith in.


Originally posted by Human_Alien
reply to post by Druscilla
 


Why are you here? I mean, really? If you don't believe or have any experience in these esoteric like matters, why are you parked on a conspiracy forum? It's a total disservice to truth and I resent you being a human speed bump.

You know nothing but yet you pretend to. You posture yourself as the All-knowing, All-seeing member of this community.

Your opinions (that are always dipped as 'factual') are 100% wrong as far as this phenomenon is concerned.
You can't read up on this. One has to experience it. So here again, you know nothing about this. I wish you'd start your own forum and leave this one alone. Seriously.


Please note, my assertions are followed up by, linked to, and supported by documentation that's peer reviewed, verified, and upheld in the scientific community.
What does that say?
Where's your proof?

Why am I here? I think people have been asking that question for as long as people have been people.
Further, last i checked, this is an open forum. My post is on topic, and very relevant as it concerns the topic, regardless of whether you like it, and regardless of what your opinion of the person making the statement is.

I'm not attacking you. Why are you attacking me?
Show proof and documentation to support your claims. I have.





I mean no disrespect in saying this - but some people believe that they have had genuine abduction experiences. Not all who claim they have are mentally unwell. I know that is not what you are implying. Your sources are well cited, as some people who believed they have had said experiences were indeed either mentally unwell or their imaginations got the better of them. When you post what you do in these threads, people who believe their abduction experiences to be real take offense - as if what you are trying to say is that these experiences are only a product of the sources you cite; whether it is not your intention at all.



posted on Sep, 18 2012 @ 02:38 AM
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Originally posted by Rubicant13

I mean no disrespect in saying this - but some people believe that they have had genuine abduction experiences. Not all who claim they have are mentally unwell. I know that is not what you are implying. Your sources are well cited, as some people who believed they have had said experiences were indeed either mentally unwell or their imaginations got the better of them. When you post what you do in these threads, people who believe their abduction experiences to be real take offense - as if what you are trying to say is that these experiences are only a product of the sources you cite; whether it is not your intention at all.


Yes, I understand that there is a certain demographic who's idea of 'open minded' is to deny any and all evidence that doesn't jive with what they believe, and to take extra special offense when they feel they're being personally criticized (even when they are not).
Such have a tendency to send me hate mail, and/or put on the 'respected foe' list.

For anyone and everyone who is going to believe, whatever it is they are want to believe, often in spite of and contrary to all evidence that may dispute whatever belief they have, nothing I can or will say, or present, no matter how rationally and politely done so will ever breach their bias.

For those who are genuinely open minded and rational about introspection, honest self examination, as well as willing to actually question everything, including questioning their own perception, these may benefit from posts such as mine.

In cases of Schizotypy, someone unaware of their own condition may then become self-aware, self-actualized, even embrace the condition to exploit it like lucid dreaming where the creative drives typically extent in cases of Schizotypy may then benefit and thrive with such liberated awareness. Becoming self aware/actualized may grant them a degree of control over their life they didn't even know existed due their life long impression and conviction that what they saw and experienced was in fact reality.
For some, knowing the name of the 'demon' gives them control over it.

Further, ATS also has a silent audience. There's a number of people who don't post, and don't even have member accounts that read these forums. Some cases of claimed abduction recount nightmare scenarios and a life lived in waking fear of the next 'event'.
Detailing documented papers that describe exactly what they go through, how these perceptual experiences can be replicated in the lab, may enable such cases hope whereby assistance in mitigating their experiences might be effective and successful from a psychological perspective.

If one person finds relief from a life lived in fear from these experiences due any information I've provided, then, I'll consider my post successful, even if I never hear about the success, even if the post floods my inbox with hate mail, even if my posts are mercilessly ridiculed and attacked in the threads I post them.

None of this claims that there are not actual real physical experiences. I do, however feel, supported by all the documentation, studies, and peer reviewed papers that the majority of all 'alien' encounter cases can and are easily described and can be attributed to the Psychological and/or Psycho-social models.

I have not called anyone 'crazy', or unwell, nor have I implied such.



posted on Sep, 18 2012 @ 03:21 AM
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reply to post by Druscilla
 


Still, if you have no experience with any sort of paranormal, who are you to comment in any case? When this thread is meant to stand in *support* of experiencers, your "contribution" only serves to rub salt in what may be still a painful wound. You do no one any service with what you perhaps innocently (or ignorantly) proffer.

You know, as one who has spent the best part of my adult life doing professional pastry, I would be pretty annoyed at someone coming into my kitchen and suggesting stuff to me when the breadth of their experience was watching a few episodes Just Desserts. It does not make you relevant.

My sister and I were - less 'abducted', more 'taken' - when we were very small children. Neither of us were traumatized in the least by this so I cannot comment on such things, though I do have direct experience. Keep your place and hold your tongue, at the very least in the name of your own self-awareness and otherwise out of compassion for others.



posted on Sep, 18 2012 @ 03:29 AM
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reply to post by Druscilla
 


Hi Druscilla,
I m aware of the argument you bring to the table and it's value (and that it comes up short in some cases as well).
I think it is a valid position to bring forth in a discussion or debate upon the truthfulness or objective reality of the abduction experience.

I am a bit confused though, at why you brought it into this discussion, which is not on that ?



posted on Sep, 18 2012 @ 04:30 AM
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Originally posted by CosmicEgg
reply to post by Druscilla
 


Still, if you have no experience with any sort of paranormal, who are you to comment in any case? When this thread is meant to stand in *support* of experiencers, your "contribution" only serves to rub salt in what may be still a painful wound. You do no one any service with what you perhaps innocently (or ignorantly) proffer.

You know, as one who has spent the best part of my adult life doing professional pastry, I would be pretty annoyed at someone coming into my kitchen and suggesting stuff to me when the breadth of their experience was watching a few episodes Just Desserts. It does not make you relevant.

My sister and I were - less 'abducted', more 'taken' - when we were very small children. Neither of us were traumatized in the least by this so I cannot comment on such things, though I do have direct experience. Keep your place and hold your tongue, at the very least in the name of your own self-awareness and otherwise out of compassion for others.


Respectfully, it's also trying when a pastry professional attempts to tell someone accredited with concentration in Psycho-Social discipline what is and is not relevant regarding the Psycho-Social discipline.

My initial post focused on the Psychological and Psycho-Social aspects of the majority of abduction cases.
Do you have any accredited and/or professional experience in the study of abduction claimants, or the replication of attributable aspects to the abduction phenomenon in a lab setting?

You may very well have had a 'real' experience to whatever degree that amounts to.
Examine it how you will.
The honest approach would be to ask all the questions, including those answered in the position I've framed.


Originally posted by Bluesma
reply to post by Druscilla
 


Hi Druscilla,
I m aware of the argument you bring to the table and it's value (and that it comes up short in some cases as well).
I think it is a valid position to bring forth in a discussion or debate upon the truthfulness or objective reality of the abduction experience.

I am a bit confused though, at why you brought it into this discussion, which is not on that ?



This discussion brought up alien abduction.
The argument is relevant.


Originally posted by Stimpy
So anyone think aliens and the afterlife are somehow connected? Like does anyone else think abductions and near death experiences are very simalar ?


Now, Bluesma, and or anyone else asking the same question, please, if you will, and you are willing, read through the links I posted in my first posting on this thread, and you will see how alien abduction experiences are related to near death experiences as both are easily attributable as Psychological phenomenon and both experiences can easily be replicated under controlled conditions in a lab setting.

The Psychological and Psycho-social position is entirely relevant any time this subject is brought up.
Honest examination of this phenomenon would not be complete without address from this perspective.



posted on Sep, 18 2012 @ 05:56 AM
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Originally posted by Druscilla


This discussion brought up alien abduction.
The argument is relevant.



The argument is relevant in a debate upon the objective reality of the abduction experience,
which this didn't seem to be. I interpretted the OP to be introducing a thread fro experiencers to share their personal interpretations and perceptions upon the link between that and another type of experience.

But I guess you could claim you have the "right" to- just as you have the "right" to go into an AA group meeting, not ever having been alcoholic, and present an argument against alcoholism. It is a free world and board-
the question was, what is your motive in doing so? How do you find it constructive?

But that too, you do not need to answer. I will not press it.


Now, Bluesma, and or anyone else asking the same question, please, if you will, and you are willing, read through the links I posted in my first posting on this thread, and you will see how alien abduction experiences are related to near death experiences as both are easily attributable as Psychological phenomenon and both experiences can easily be replicated under controlled conditions in a lab setting.

The Psychological and Psycho-social position is entirely relevant any time this subject is brought up.
Honest examination of this phenomenon would not be complete without address from this perspective.




I won't, but thank you. I wish to stay on topic here.
If you'd like to start a separate discussion on that, I will gladly participate. There is some really interesting things to say on that!
But I personally feel uncomfortable taking such a distanced and detached approach to the experience with people who are actually effected and living and struggling with the experience, and feeling the need to express it in their own words and ways as part of their processing it. I believe that is important at some stages.

If you are a mental health care professional, then I guess you don't need me to explain further what I mean by that?



posted on Sep, 18 2012 @ 06:02 AM
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reply to post by Druscilla
 


This thread is in *support* of abductees. Which part of that concept is incomprehensible to you? Support does not mean to cast aspersions upon nor to attempt to invalidate one's personal experience. This is for abductees or those who believe they are to discuss their cases. As the OP states - and this is directed particularly at what you are doing on this thread - : "I know this is a open forum , but to all the skeptics and people who want to argue , thats not the point, as technically we are talking about something to which doesnt exist."

So use your training and back off. It is out of place specifically here, and as it was, by your own confession, reposted from another thread, you may respectfully withdraw from this thread. It is specifically your approach that is unwanted. Is that fairly clear? If not, read the OP again, and then consider the aim vs your response. See the conflict? If not, you probably need to reexamine your "professional" attitude.



posted on Sep, 18 2012 @ 06:03 AM
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alien abduction experiences are related to near death experiences as both are easily attributable as Psychological phenomenon and both experiences can easily be replicated under controlled conditions in a lab setting.
reply to post by Druscilla
 


Ufos are real, I have seen one close enough to know how real they are. I wasnt asleep i was wide awake outside at night, and actually walking my dog. I know what i saw!!!!!!!






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