Does EVIL really exist and if it does did GOD create it?

Originally posted by sacgamer25
reply to post by AfterInfinity

 

Richard Dawkins says a lot of things that sound smart but really he is exactly what he is complaining about. It is impossible to have an intelligent conversation with someone that rules out creationism.

He talks about how Genes between any two animals areremarkably similar and follow a remarkably identical pattern.

Have seen Thomas Kinkades paintings have you ever noticed how similar they are? Did one painting evolve from the other? Why is the only answer evolution? Is it not ok for God to create all life to follow the same pattern?

You see he says Theologians will always revert back to the theology. But he always reverts back to evolution. He can no more prove his theory than I can prove the bible. He just thinks that he is smarter. Unfortunately many people listen to his big words and complex theories and believe him without any proof. It is impossible to argue with anyone who believes that he is 100% correct. So by his own words it is impossible to argue with him and I would guess you for that matter.

Funny thing is the only logical answer for origins always has been and will be God. Because I don’t know is not a logical answer.

reply to post by sacgamer25


The problem with evolution and creationism is both theories have been concocted by man, who cannot grasp the entirety of either theory. My personal opinion is that the answer lies somewhere between, at a level that very few scientists and priests are willing to dive to, because they are afraid of what they might find...or more precisely, of not being able to understand it.

We are not yet ready for the answer. Until then, we pretend we already have it, and we fight amongst each other because we are unwilling to admit we're wrong.

I agree with the below quoted text.

You have an interesting viewpoint but have never heard it expressed the way you express it. You say that God was not making mortals when He made Adam but was trying to make gods? In other words God screwed up? Is that what you are saying? According to your understanding He must have screwed up because there are no gods here that I know of. You look at this in a different way than I do. You look at the tree of knowledge to do good and evil as being the tree of awareness but Adam and Eve were already aware that the tree was forbidden. They had the awareness to rationalize this command and they knew that they were doing something that God had told them not to do. What they did do is the very same as even angels do. They disobeyed God's command and they also were aware that the penalty was death of the body. The entire premise of this (in my understanding) was that God knew, with His foreknowledge, that they would do this very thing. I do not believe that God was surprised in the least by their actions. I believe that God was not harsh in the death penalty but knew that men and angels would and did sin and that the tree of life was taken from them only to be given back to them after they graduate from this school. This Lucifer or Satan or Devil etc. was cast down to this world as a tool in teaching this school. Out of all of the universe that God could have cast him into, He choose this world where Adam was created. This was not a coincidence by any means. It was planned for the entire salvation message.

reply to post by Seede


I also think Lone is correct too. There are many half truths....

The " Gods" part is in my understanding, in the beginning, in Genesis before man was created as well as other creation stories of old may tell it.

With good and evil or god and satan its also my understanding the good represents god and the evil represents the vibration of the spoken word..... sent out...... in the flesh but not in spirit. It's just a way of measuring the " good" in time. For example, how good is it? Oh, it's not good, it's terrible. Lol

reply to post by MamaJ


That made no sense. Can you explain again?

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by MamaJ

 

That made no sense. Can you explain again?

Sorry it didn't make any sense. I tried.

The vibration of the/a word is manifested in a literal, spiritual, and metaphysical " sense", meaning had by our senses.

Good and evil is a measurement of which we try to understand the good. Meaning there are both and the same.

Evil is the same as good, the concept comes with degrees of the same but each has an opposite, or poles. North south pole and W. E. are in the middle as balance.

A balance of good and evil feels good.

A balance that's at the tipping point of good is a living and acting revelation. Or .... That's the way I see it, feel free to see it however you want.

You asked for further explanation and I gave it.

reply to post by NOTurTypical

. . . Isaiah 14:12 is attacking the spirit force behind a man, the angel empowering a man. It's a prophecy about the end times, a man will be represented by a crescent moon and a star. Satan, the accuser, will be possessing this man. Can you think of anything today that identifies itself with a crescent moon and star? Check out what the modern names are of the nations in the Psalm 83 prophecies.

Psalms and Isaiah are not apocalyptic books, so are not talking about "end times".
I think you are drinking more cult kool-Aid.
Isaiah was talking about Nebuchadnezzar, and comparing him to a character in Canaanite mythology, who was a sort of sky god associated with the Morning Star, known to us today as the planet, Venus.
He started out as an ordinary enough sort of star but aspired to place himself above the others by making himself the Pole Star, which itself was a mythological explanation for how the pole stars replace each other over time, and for why Venus appears often so low on the horizon.
Nebuchadnezzar was a king who wanted to become king of kings over a great empire, and was ruthless in the process and without regard for the gods of the people he defeated.

reply to post by AfterInfinity


Well said.

No argument.

reply to post by jmdewey60


Are you kidding? Isaiah and Psalms have some of the richest prophecy in the entire Bible.

reply to post by NOTurTypical

Are you kidding? Isaiah and Psalms have some of the richest prophecy in the entire Bible.

No, I am not kidding.
There is a difference between prophecy and apocalypse.
A book you may want to read on the subject is:
The Apocalyptic Imagination: An Introduction to Jewish Apocalyptic Literature by John Joseph Collins.

reply to post by jmdewey60


No thanks.

reply to post by NOTurTypical

No thanks.

I guess your cult does not allow its members to read actual credible biblical scholarship since it would remove the support to the old outdated and flawed cult version of wild speculation and just morphing your own pseudo-scripture by fusing together scraps of text from all sorts of unrelated contexts.

reply to post by jmdewey60


And he's "credible" because he spouts Preterism or anti-Israel theology? Which one, or both?

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by sacgamer25

 

The problem with evolution and creationism is both theories have been concocted by man, who cannot grasp the entirety of either theory. My personal opinion is that the answer lies somewhere between, at a level that very few scientists and priests are willing to dive to, because they are afraid of what they might find...or more precisely, of not being able to understand it.

We are not yet ready for the answer. Until then, we pretend we already have it, and we fight amongst each other because we are unwilling to admit we're wrong.

Let me say it this way. The only problem with Creationism is evolution. The only thing wrong is despite all the fine sounding arguments that science makes they cannot prove thier claims. They can only guess at the age of the earth, and all they can prove is that all life is designed very similar. They say evolution I say signature. Same signature on all life sounds like only one creator to me.

reply to post by NOTurTypical

And he's "credible" because he spouts Preterism or anti-Israel theology? Which one, or both?

Because that is mainstream Christian biblical scholarship and not some loser backwards cult from 1800, like what you belong to.
If you were into any sort of serious biblical study, you would be very aware of John J. Collins and Adela Yarbro Collins, who are among the most respected professors in the field.
You seem to be familiar with the most fringe of the kook self-appointed prophet type with pseudo-scholarship and YouTube videos.
btw: I just ordered Adela's commentary on Mark a couple hours ago since I found a really good deal on a used copy.

(Adela Yarbro Collins) is the President of the Society of New Testament Studies.
en.wikipedia.org...

reply to post by jmdewey60


Sorry guy, I don't support the Origen/Augustine theory of interpreting Eschatelogical passages, I'm moved by details and precision, not allegory. And seeing as you didn't answer my question, I'll assume he takes both positions.

reply to post by NOTurTypical


What if allegory is the only way to understand? The purpose of allegory is to allow you to relate to something through a similar experience that you've had that has certain parallels with another experience that you have not dealt with, and so otherwise would not understand.

Also, it's a means of simplification. And in this world, simplification is often a blessing.

reply to post by NOTurTypical

I don't support the Origen/Augustine theory of interpreting Eschatelogical passages, I'm moved by details and precision, not allegory.

I was talking about how you define what are "eschatological passages".
What your cult does is decide everything is fair game if it has words in it that you can take out of context and combine with some other parts of other verses, that you think you can use to describe whatever is in the headlines today, in order to stir up fear in people's minds to where they just want off this world and right now. It is psychological warfare against people and you are dangling on the strings of the puppet masters who are using this for propaganda purposes to further their geopolitical agenda.

And seeing as you didn't answer my question, I'll assume he takes both positions.

Not everyone is so bound up in your cult philosophy, whether for it or against it. Not being of your cult beliefs does not in most people's minds make them feel compelled to label their beliefs in those derogatory terms. They are just following the best evidence and not believing something because some charismatic preacher is telling them to think so in YouTube videos.

Originally posted by buster2010
God was supposed to have created everything so he created evil also. God is nothing but a child with an ant farm and a magnifying glass.

Well, according to the book, yes, God created evil.

"I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things."(Isaiah 45:7, KJV)

The Hebrew word Râ‛âh refers to "adversity," or "calamity," but was translated as "evil in the Christian Bible. A question comes to mind:

If God is All Things, then God must be evil too. The "evil God" would be the dark side of the personality. There could not be a separate entity, for remember, to Christianity God is everything inclusive, hence, all things. Good/Bad, Healer/Murderer, Kind/Hateful, Peaceful/Warlike.

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

What if allegory is the only way to understand? The purpose of allegory is to allow you to relate to something through a similar experience that you've had that has certain parallels with another experience that you have not dealt with, and so otherwise would not understand.

Also, it's a means of simplification. And in this world, simplification is often a blessing.

Because allegory is a license to invent. People can turn the Bible into anything they want it to mean. God is very precise with His Word and esteems His Word even higher than His own Name.

reply to post by jmdewey60


Dude, read what you want, doesn't bother me. Enjoy.