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Marine blogs say U.S. embassy did not authorize service members to carry ammo

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posted on Sep, 13 2012 @ 05:00 PM
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Glad somebody is bringing this up. It's actually been this way for a while where service members are not allowed to actually carry ammo or load their gun without 20 billion authorizations and red tape under only super special circumstances.

Richard Marcinko went to Lebanon in the 80's to survey the security of the US embassy there. He found that none of the marines were allowed to load their rifles and had to call the boss and ask for permission to load their weapons or chamber a round if they were under attack.

He asked them to change that rule because it made the embassy a much softer target. He also advocated putting up small boxes on the roof of the embassy that broadcasted for a thousand feet all the radio frequencies so that it would trigger a car bomb before it got close enough to the embassy. They rejected all of his ideas called him an idiot and sent him packing. His last words to the embassy chief was "you're going to get hit by a car bomb and soon"

They ignored him and just weeks later the embassy in Lebanon was indeed blown up by a car bomb.

He has stated several times that this rule of not allowing marines to keep their weapons loaded with a round chambered while on security duty needs to be changed and that it's absolutely stupid. It's stupid for so many obvious reasons to leave them that vulnerable.




posted on Sep, 13 2012 @ 05:46 PM
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Reply to post by BASSPLYR
 


Worse than simply being a soft target they are walking around with enticements.

Carrying their unloaded equipment is like some kid waving a gold chain around in the middle of a ghetto.

Hey! Look at all that awesome equipment those guys have! Gimme that bolt action .22lr we got and let's take all their machine-guns.


 
Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com
 



posted on Sep, 13 2012 @ 05:51 PM
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reply to post by filosophia
 


So the post office and DHS can have tons of ammo to protect themselves? LoL

Nice comment you made here....

Sounds like a set-up if it's true. Nothing piss's the American public off more then seeing innocent people killed...

"sigh"



posted on Sep, 13 2012 @ 06:33 PM
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“Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it.”
Sir Winston Churchill



The Beirut Bombing occurred on October 23, 1983. The act was a terrorist attack against the United States Marine Headquarters during the Lebanese Civil War...
...Shiite Muslim suicide bomber, encountered unarmed marines and detonated his truck with 12,000 pounds of TNT, creating the largest non-nuclear explosion ever seen by the FBI.

www.u-s-history.com...

Apparently we learned nothing in the last 29 years.



posted on Sep, 13 2012 @ 09:04 PM
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I was reading "Rogue Warrior" by Richard Marckino last week ... I cannot believe that it's been 30 years since Red Cell was giving the DOD and the US government warnings about their ineffective and useless security procedures and we still have not learned our lesson



posted on Sep, 13 2012 @ 09:33 PM
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The military barracks in Dhehran Saudi Arabia got bombed because Clinton forbid our military from having weapons over there.

The military KNEW the people were mad and were going to do something. So 1 guy drove a big truck through two fences and killed our military. All they could do was watch it come.

Sacrificial pawns. Part of foreign policy. Nobody remembers the names of the people we sacrificed.......denied them their right to defend their own life.

Don't join the US military unless your suicidal. This isn't the first time they refused to let our military carry ammo or weapons. They want you DEAD....your own country!



posted on Sep, 13 2012 @ 09:40 PM
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Originally posted by ChrisF231
I was reading "Rogue Warrior" by Richard Marckino last week ... I cannot believe that it's been 30 years since Red Cell was giving the DOD and the US government warnings about their ineffective and useless security procedures and we still have not learned our lesson


Rumsfeld forced the Air Force to start being a military and deploy their troops along with the Army with firearms. The Air Force didn't send them with any ammo and those Air Force boys ended up in front line battle IN the Army units during the Iraqi War.....didn't get issued 1 bullet.

Many of them are dead. Rumsfeld tried.....but the Air Force is still to this day very anti gun and not fit for ground war. Rumsfeld tried....the Generals below him trumped him and kept their airmen without ammo....and they died.

But they did get deployed with firearms finally.....just no bullets. Start investigating the Air Force deaths in the Iraqi War and you'll be surprised at what you find. They were sacrificed.



posted on Sep, 13 2012 @ 10:01 PM
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reply to post by filosophia
 


I can't count how many times I have stood watch with an M-16A2 in my hands with an EMPTY magazine. There were only two times I had ammo while standing watch, once when I was guarding a field armory, and once directly after 9/11. To this day it makes zero sense and this was during the Bush Jr. era while I was in the Marines.



posted on Sep, 13 2012 @ 11:07 PM
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WHY is this common practice?


WHY hasn't this practice changed?

We worry about checking shoes for bombs, and intrusive scanners, and 20000 drones in our skies, but cant give out ammo?






posted on Sep, 14 2012 @ 10:44 AM
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reply to post by filosophia
 

NOT TRUE! My buddy who is retired after 30 years of service in the U.S.M.C. known as "Gunny" LOL
He did 2 years of embassy duty in Egypt and 2 years in Iran told me any Marine that is on guard duty ALWAYS has Live Ammo!



posted on Sep, 14 2012 @ 05:19 PM
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Originally posted by nighthawk1954
reply to post by filosophia
 

NOT TRUE! My buddy who is retired after 30 years of service in the U.S.M.C. known as "Gunny" LOL
He did 2 years of embassy duty in Egypt and 2 years in Iran told me any Marine that is on guard duty ALWAYS has Live Ammo!


Having a sidearm with a magazine in it but not one in the chamber is the standard condition without authorization from the Ambassador or the Embassy Security Officer.

Yes, they have live ammunition much like guards at various locations in the US have live ammunition when guarding certain points - ammunition, or vehicles prepared to deployment at Green Ramp. However, the ammo (likely one or two shotgun rounds) is firmly locked away at least in an ammo pouch never locked and loaded without express authorization from the Officer of the Guard. Not Commander of the relief - Officer of the guard. Serious delay between needing it and using it.

Also, while I am not a Marine - I am retired SF Officer.

Let’s address what the MSG is and is not… The Marines at the Embassy are not the Ambassadors PSD nor are they trained to be. Not to say they are not competent - they are Marines and being selected for the duty of MSG is an arduous one along with the training. They are professionals and all good men (and now even women I think) However, their mission is to secure the building, control access points - look sharp in their uniforms and inspire awe at the might of the US presence there. They are icons of our power – identifiable representations of our might. In the event of a breach their mission is to destroy the classified communication equipment and documents and delay any attackers so that the Ambassador and his PSD can get away safely. They are unfortunately expendable.

The PSD is provided in some cases by a special branch of the Foreign Service that was created for that specific function; however, as we can see in the past few years that function has been contracted out to PSD's, Backwater (no longer called that) DynCorp and a host of others. I got offered a Team Leader Job with DynCorp after retirement for 250k to do the same thing - not worth it.... These teams are filled by former SF, Seals and Force Recon types along with some MPs with the PSD training.

I have served on a PSD in Iraq, as a team leader - it is a # job. Long hours, thankless jobs… Our principal treated us like errand boys. We protected Iraqi Leaders ntil enough PMC contraftors cold be trained. Key individuals mine was a low level Minster of XXXXXX. I lfet it out in case someone can link my id with him. We had some tense moments since he didn’t listen to our advice and got us in some #ty circumstances.

Never had a big firefight but some tense moments for sure. Rammed a few civilian cars and knocked back a few protesters with a rifle butt. He had a wife and a mistress, liked to drink and was a borderline criminal thug. We got to see it all. You couldn't pay me enough to risk my life for these assholes again.


edit on 14/9/2012 by Golf66 because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 14 2012 @ 08:23 PM
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reply to post by Golf66
 


Couldn't have said it better myself. All you are to do is look pretty, that is about it other than hope you survive until a response, whether green or blue, gets to you in time.
edit on 14-9-2012 by milkyway12 because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 14 2012 @ 08:34 PM
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Originally posted by thisguyrighthere
Same with the guards on duty during the Lebanon embassy bombing in 1983.

This doesn`t matter.
We cant blame Obama for that, so please re-edit.
This is all Obama`s fault, Obama should have loaded those guns personally.



posted on Sep, 14 2012 @ 08:47 PM
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Originally posted by milkyway12
reply to post by Golf66
 


That is a major breach of protocol, and you're talking about a major # storm has just entered your life. You can cause an international crisis if you fire that weapon. All you are there to do is basically look pretty.
edit on 14-9-2012 by milkyway12 because: (no reason given)


I am pretty sure that is what I said. The Commander or the access guard might have a magazine on hand but It's likely not loaded in the weapon - if it is, there is no round in the chamber. I said the Marines are Icons of America - they are totally expendable. They look good in their uniforms that's about it.

As for the PSD - I have several ex team mates who work as contractors for the companies who provide PSD for the State Department. They have live ammo 24/7 locked and loaded and ready to roll at all times. That along with a good stock of flash bangs, frags, cs, and a couple of AT4's in the trunk for good measure. While the Ambassador can order the Marines about regarding ROE and ammo the PSD team are contractors - part of thier agreement is that they can work thier way or no way....

They are defensive only but rest assured they can bash the # out of a car that gets too close (or shoot it up) and drive away like nothing happened if they get too close without any reprisals what so ever.

Our ROE in Iraq for protecting the Minister of X was one warning bash for a car that gets too close then we could fire up the engine click with AP. If people got too close and ignored a verbal we'd lay em out. If they got up (which never happened) - then it was freefire time. That was early post war Iraq though.

ETA: Your edit acknowledged - I was talking the sidearm.

edit on 14/9/2012 by Golf66 because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 14 2012 @ 08:50 PM
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reply to post by Golf66
 


My apologies, i meant to reply to the post by filosophia (the one you quoted), and i dumb ed it up and replied to you for some reason. I should have read your entire post, and you hit everything on the head pretty much, no reason for me to even post.
edit on 14-9-2012 by milkyway12 because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 5 2013 @ 07:32 PM
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Marines aren't there to protect the embassy anyway. i'm just sayin





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