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The economy keeps expanding...

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posted on Sep, 6 2012 @ 02:41 PM
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reply to post by thepresident
 


Lets say you had some credit card debt that you can barely make the minimum payment on and you're behind, bankruptcy is at your heels, no end in sight and the balance, regardless of your payments, doesn't seem to ever go down. Today, you came home with a .20 cent raise in your check so you decide to go and blow another $5,000 on your card to celebrate. Would that show a positive increase in your personal economy? Great, you got a raise. But now you're $5,000 plus interest deeper in the hole than you were last week.

This is the state of our economy. Yes, new jobs get created (even if they're mostly low paying service jobs) and may even show some positive growth but if the debt keeps growing higher and higher, faster and faster, how exactly is our economy expanding?

Expanding in the red, maybe.

edit on 6-9-2012 by CoherentlyConfused because: (no reason given)




posted on Sep, 6 2012 @ 02:44 PM
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reply to post by CoherentlyConfused
 


for the national debt stand point thats a great example.

for another example,

you get your monthly check for $200. SWEET, your $200 richer, but wait, your house payment is $350.... so you lost $150 for the month.

edit on 6-9-2012 by camaro68ss because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 6 2012 @ 02:46 PM
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reply to post by camaro68ss
 


Would someone else have done better, with 'austerity instead fo grwoth', 'trickle down economics'. 'privatise profits but socialize debts' and 'tax the middle classes and poor instead of rich so that the rich can create bubbles in the casino stock market and property' policies?

Spain had tried that and saw what happened to them? growing High unemployement, high debts, etc.

I am sure Spaniards would prefer to work and live in USA today than Spain, so too would many other countries with new entrants in the labour market eye USA enviously with what the administration had fought so hard, and could have better figures if congress had not been hell bent on party loyalty instead of national loyalty.



posted on Sep, 6 2012 @ 02:54 PM
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reply to post by camaro68ss
 


Exactly - - it isn't a question as to how many jobs are gained or lost. That number is used as fluff to say, "hey, look how good we're doing." The important number is the percentage of the workforce that is fully employed.



posted on Sep, 6 2012 @ 02:57 PM
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Originally posted by SeekerofTruth101
reply to post by camaro68ss
 


Would someone else have done better, with 'austerity instead fo grwoth', 'trickle down economics'. 'privatise profits but socialize debts' and 'tax the middle classes and poor instead of rich so that the rich can create bubbles in the casino stock market and property' policies?

Spain had tried that and saw what happened to them? growing High unemployement, high debts, etc.

I am sure Spaniards would prefer to work and live in USA today than Spain, so too would many other countries with new entrants in the labour market eye USA enviously with what the administration had fought so hard, and could have better figures if congress had not been hell bent on party loyalty instead of national loyalty.


I Blame the political partys, there bought and paid for. These companys and corporations needed to fail in 08. They took the risks and lost. But the government stepped in and back stopped the loses with the peoples money. Thats F***ed up!

So you can gamble, risk it all and if you win you keep the profits, if you lose, send the losses to the american people.

Not cool. Its a major problem that washington has shown that it will allow.



posted on Sep, 6 2012 @ 03:01 PM
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Originally posted by thepresident

Originally posted by crawdad1914
How many centuries of continued "expanding" will it take to pay off a 16 trillion dollar debt?
So far this "expanding economy" has cost us a few Trillion in added debt.

I dont buy into this fluff, no matter who is serving it up to me.
edit on 6-9-2012 by crawdad1914 because: clarify


So you don't think America is adding new jobs?

Or are you protesting that this is positive information?


Let me try to put this into simpler terms....

Let's say I am working one job that pays me $2000.00 per month. My spending to maintain my lifestyle cost me $4000.00 per month and I am accumulating debt.

So my response to this accumulating debt is to go out and pick up 2 more part time jobs which will bring me to a total of $3500.00 per month in income. Now that I am making more money with these part time jobs, instead of paying down my debt, I start spending more and I increase my spending to $6000.00 per month.

Is this a positive thing or does this make me completely stupid?

So you see, it would not matter if under Obama's watch 1 million jobs were created this month. If the spending continues to increase, we are not fixing this economy. We are still accumulating debt.



posted on Sep, 6 2012 @ 03:04 PM
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reply to post by acparker7
 


In terms of percentages that you are alluding to, be glad it is hovering around 8% for the past 3 years after a frightening rising 9% during the moron bush's term.

It could have been worse, with hundreds of thousands new entrants annually, as Spain with its horrifying rising 26% unemployment rate and a number of other nations experiencing in this downturing economy worldwide where even China, the factory of the world that produces cheap and toxic goods.

I am not taking sides with any party, neither communist, socialist, libertarian or whatever nonsensical labels heaped, but only seeking for the truth. Only the truth can set us all free to grow and evolve. Living in lies, half truths, and deceptions will only regress all mankind.



posted on Sep, 6 2012 @ 03:09 PM
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Originally posted by CoherentlyConfusedYes, new jobs get created (even if they're mostly low paying service jobs) and may even show some positive growth but if the debt keeps growing higher and higher, faster and faster, how exactly is our economy expanding?


You conflating the Private Economy with the government's debt.

The Private economy is expanding... again why are you trying SO HARD to
turn this good news into bad news?

I do not belong to the government and I am not responsible for their debt,
if you cannot make the distinction and draw that same line for yourself,
that is your problem.

I would like to see China or the FED try to collect from all of us, you assign and accept
your fate too easily.



posted on Sep, 6 2012 @ 03:10 PM
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reply to post by MrWendal
 


In even simpler economic terms, you would be a fool to spend more if it cannot generate returns.

In good times, the wise save. In bad times, the wise spends, for he knows inflation will eat into his savings and nothing will be left in time, such as austerity drives will be such consequences.

Money need to be spent and circulated, so that it can generate returns. Invest in infrastructure so as to increase productivity, the fastest way to see returns. Invest in focussed education, so that more will be intelligently trained to necessary jobs required for expansion. Invest in health, so that more can get healthy and return to contribute to the economy.

The mantra is to SPEND, BUT SPEND WISELY, not CUTS and be extinct.



posted on Sep, 6 2012 @ 03:18 PM
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Originally posted by camaro68ss


plus government doesnt create jobs. only the privet sector does.
edit on 6-9-2012 by camaro68ss because: (no reason given)


So you don't consider the military Government jobs.

It's hard to give you any credibility when you over look such available data.

us-military-branches.findthedata.org...



posted on Sep, 6 2012 @ 03:28 PM
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Originally posted by MrWendal

Originally posted by thepresident

Originally posted by crawdad1914
How many centuries of continued "expanding" will it take to pay off a 16 trillion dollar debt?
So far this "expanding economy" has cost us a few Trillion in added debt.

I dont buy into this fluff, no matter who is serving it up to me.
edit on 6-9-2012 by crawdad1914 because: clarify


So you don't think America is adding new jobs?

Or are you protesting that this is positive information?


Let me try to put this into simpler terms....

Let's say I am working one job that pays me $2000.00 per month. My spending to maintain my lifestyle cost me $4000.00 per month and I am accumulating debt.

So my response to this accumulating debt is to go out and pick up 2 more part time jobs which will bring me to a total of $3500.00 per month in income. Now that I am making more money with these part time jobs, instead of paying down my debt, I start spending more and I increase my spending to $6000.00 per month.

Is this a positive thing or does this make me completely stupid?

So you see, it would not matter if under Obama's watch 1 million jobs were created this month. If the spending continues to increase, we are not fixing this economy. We are still accumulating debt.


You actually need a lot more complexity -

If you spent $6,000 a month but got a job that made you $12,000 a month in two years,
you would be a wise man,

Investing in Eduction, for example, would be a wise investment - bombs would not be.



posted on Sep, 6 2012 @ 03:28 PM
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Originally posted by olaru12

Originally posted by camaro68ss


plus government doesnt create jobs. only the privet sector does.
edit on 6-9-2012 by camaro68ss because: (no reason given)


So you don't consider the military Government jobs.

It's hard to give you any credibility when you over look such available data.

us-military-branches.findthedata.org...



No, government doesn't create jobs. Government dosent create products, goverment dosent create goods. It doesn't create revenue without taking from others. Military is a service to your country, not a job. Name one government job that doesn't take money from the people to create a job?
edit on 6-9-2012 by camaro68ss because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 6 2012 @ 03:36 PM
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Originally posted by thepresident
Yes, Cincinnati has a population of 296,000 people

The economy gain 200,000 jobs


I LOVE this quote. This is a PERFECT example of misrepresenting the numbers to make your point.

So let's look at the reality of this number and what it means to YOU as an individual who would be living in Cincinnati Ohio.

296,000 people is not a lie, but it is a misrepresentation. In 2008 the population of Cincinnati was roughly 340,000. So in the last 3 years you have roughly 40,000 people leaving the city.

The 296,000 people is the population that live within the City limits. That does not represent the surrounding area, and people in the suburbs need jobs too. Where do you think they work? Usually in the City. This would inflate the population within City Limits during the working hours.

So taking that into account, to get an accurate idea of what the true population is, you would need the population of the Cincinnati Metro area which according to the 2011 Census was 2,138,038. The 27th most populated Metro area in the United States


So does 200,000 jobs employ 2/3 thirds of Cincinnati? No. More like under 10%



posted on Sep, 6 2012 @ 04:00 PM
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Originally posted by MrWendal

Originally posted by thepresident
Yes, Cincinnati has a population of 296,000 people

The economy gain 200,000 jobs


I LOVE this quote. This is a PERFECT example of misrepresenting the numbers to make your point.

So let's look at the reality of this number and what it means to YOU as an individual who would be living in Cincinnati Ohio.

296,000 people is not a lie, but it is a misrepresentation. In 2008 the population of Cincinnati was roughly 340,000. So in the last 3 years you have roughly 40,000 people leaving the city.

The 296,000 people is the population that live within the City limits. That does not represent the surrounding area, and people in the suburbs need jobs too. Where do you think they work? Usually in the City. This would inflate the population within City Limits during the working hours.

So taking that into account, to get an accurate idea of what the true population is, you would need the population of the Cincinnati Metro area which according to the 2011 Census was 2,138,038. The 27th most populated Metro area in the United States


So does 200,000 jobs employ 2/3 thirds of Cincinnati? No. More like under 10%


I mentioned the population of the city limits.

I did not hide that, but you have to make sure to give the impression I did


Then you can attack my character easier and dismiss the entirety of the data
in the OP, am I following you???


Mr. Wendel is here to make sure consumer confidence stays down and he is the upmost
champion for all theories pointing to American decline



posted on Sep, 6 2012 @ 04:12 PM
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Originally posted by camaro68ss
you need 350,000 new jobs every month to keep up with population growth. The DNC likes to say 4.5 million jobs have been created since obama took office. But 6.5 million americans have entered the job market. Thats a net loss of 2 million jobs.


plus government doesnt create jobs. only the privet sector does.
edit on 6-9-2012 by camaro68ss because: (no reason given)


People debate anything these days... Especially when truth is only perception for most.



Republicans

Richard Nixon: Increase of 7.1 million jobs
Gerald Ford: Increase of 1.3 million jobs
Ronald Reagan: Increase of 14.7 million jobs
George H.W. Bush: Increase of 1.5 million jobs
George W. Bush: Decline of 646,000 jobs

Total: Increase of 23.9 million jobs under Republican presidents

Democrats

John F. Kennedy: Increase of 2.7 million jobs
Lyndon B. Johnson: Increase of 9.5 million jobs
Jimmy Carter: Increase of 9.0 million jobs
Bill Clinton: Increase of 20.8 million jobs
Barack Obama: Increase of 332,000 jobs

Total: Increase of 42.3 million jobs.

Nearly two-fold.


Source



posted on Sep, 6 2012 @ 04:16 PM
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reply to post by thepresident
 


I'm not trying to turn good news into bad news. I'm trying to keep it in perspective instead of seeing only a small piece of the puzzle and praising the government on how good of a job they're doing. You're looking at how good the economy is doing because of an increase in jobs but that's not the only indication of how the economy is really doing. You have to look at the bigger picture and that includes all of it, including the debt and the policies that led us to the hole we're in.

Those 200,000 jobs are fantabulous and I hope the figure keeps going up but they're not going to stop the government from continuing to recklessly blow your money.Who do you think will take the biggest hit and hardest fall when it all comes crashing? Obama? Bernake? China? No...me and you

It's actually much worse than my first scenario. It's like you getting a 20 cent pay raise and then Congress going out and charging $5,000 on your card. You think it's the government's debt? No, sir. It's ALL yours and mine.



posted on Sep, 6 2012 @ 04:16 PM
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reply to post by thepresident
 


Here's a keeper:




posted on Sep, 6 2012 @ 04:16 PM
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Originally posted by Americanist

Originally posted by camaro68ss
you need 350,000 new jobs every month to keep up with population growth. The DNC likes to say 4.5 million jobs have been created since obama took office. But 6.5 million americans have entered the job market. Thats a net loss of 2 million jobs.


plus government doesnt create jobs. only the privet sector does.
edit on 6-9-2012 by camaro68ss because: (no reason given)


People debate anything these days... Especially when truth is only perception for most.



Republicans

Richard Nixon: Increase of 7.1 million jobs
Gerald Ford: Increase of 1.3 million jobs
Ronald Reagan: Increase of 14.7 million jobs
George H.W. Bush: Increase of 1.5 million jobs
George W. Bush: Decline of 646,000 jobs

Total: Increase of 23.9 million jobs under Republican presidents

Democrats

John F. Kennedy: Increase of 2.7 million jobs
Lyndon B. Johnson: Increase of 9.5 million jobs
Jimmy Carter: Increase of 9.0 million jobs
Bill Clinton: Increase of 20.8 million jobs
Barack Obama: Increase of 332,000 jobs

Total: Increase of 42.3 million jobs.

Nearly two-fold.




Are you happy America has gained 200,000 jobs this last month?

If anyone reads this thread it sound like that is BAD news for most
who have participated.

Is this because they cannot accept reality or is it because they hate America
and love more people on welfare?



posted on Sep, 6 2012 @ 04:18 PM
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LIES LIES LIES LIES LIES......
Second Line....one trillionth BS LIE!!!



posted on Sep, 6 2012 @ 04:19 PM
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Originally posted by ldyserenity
LIES LIES LIES LIES LIES......
Second Line....one trillionth BS LIE!!!


What?What?What?What?
Second line




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