New Testament Fairy Tales

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
reply to post by ALightBreeze

 

That's a possibility of course but it's all based on perspective.

You tend to believe that authors made up his life story without 100% proof while I believe he was real without 100% proof. I can definitely see where you're coming from though because I tend to believe Paul was a man made-up by the Romans to push their own agenda.

With any spiritual book such as the bible you have to allow deciphering to come into play.

There is light and there is darkness and so it is also in the Bible or any information that's being expressed.

You can definitely feel what is of God ( light) and what is not ( darkness) when you read the Bible. No doubt!

Like I told you before though, when you read it a few times like a book, a lot of things become more clear and you can see a certain passage in a different "light".

I think it's always important to remember where you live and who you truly are. We are not of this world. Lol

In War of the Jews there are nine Eleazars, three Jacobs (Jameses), six Jesuses, five Matthiases (Matthew), one Mary, four Mariammes, eight Johns, seven Josephs, ten Judases, and thirteen Simons.

In the New Testament the same pattern occurs: there are seven Marys, nine Simons, two Johns, two Josephs, four Judases, two Lazaruses (Eleazar), two Matthiases (Matthews), two Jameses, and, at the minimum, three Jesuses.

Pick a Jesus, any Jesus. rofl

reply to post by MamaJ


I've always been very interested in Cayce and his readings. Sounds like a very interesting book. Drop me a line when you are done with it and let me know what you thought of it. I would be very interested to know.

reply to post by ALightBreeze


I'd like to see any evidence of this Jesus trinity that you keep talking about. This is ATS after all, and you know what extraordinary claims require.

Originally posted by Cancerwarrior
reply to post by MamaJ

 

I've always been very interested in Cayce and his readings. Sounds like a very interesting book. Drop me a line when you are done with it and let me know what you thought of it. I would be very interested to know.

I began reading about him when I was a freshman in college. He is a pretty cool guy. He sacrificed himself to help others and this is why I connect with him as I'm sure you do as well. He was a sweet soul!

He wasn't about making a fortune, just a living.

I will let you know about the book, may even do a thread about it when I'm finished as I think it will be that good!

It's about 550 pages, although I read the preview which was 148 pages. Really interesting as he believes Jesus was also the first and last Adam. I've always believed in reincarnation and believed Jesus was alive before the first Adam ( man) as I believe we were too and cayce confirms the idea. That's pretty exciting to me!

reply to post by MamaJ


Maybe reincarnation is one of Jesus teachings that has been distorted by the church.

You know I never gave reincarnation much of a thought until I went to a Civil war reenactment once a few years back (actually I hate to admit more like 10-12 years back). It was the first time in my life that I really got Deja Vu and it was just a weird surreal feeling that I did'nt particularly enjoy. The same thing happened again when I was in the Army and got deployed to Bosnia during the war. We entered this town called Ztinge that was on a mountaintop and I knew I had been there before. I knew where the church was, the market square, etc. The officer I was with at the time thought I was weird because I knew where to go without needing to be told where to go. It was very weird. I looked up some info on reincarnation and it turns out many people have these sorts of deja vu experiences in places that they've never been to. I think now that I've been a soldier in this life and maybe several lives.

I was driving my father in law home the other day from my house. I live out in the country and theres a big cattle ranch on the way to town just off the highway. I was kinda shocked when Big Wayne told me that he dreams about that place all the time. He told me he remembers being there, he said he could take me up there and show me where everything is because he used to work there in a past life. You have to understand what kind of fella my father in law is. He is straight up good ol God fearing country boy baptist that likes his beer and does not ever talk about such fringe topics, ever. Life is weird.

Originally posted by ALightBreeze
In War of the Jews there are nine Eleazars, three Jacobs (Jameses), six Jesuses, five Matthiases (Matthew), one Mary, four Mariammes, eight Johns, seven Josephs, ten Judases, and thirteen Simons.

In the New Testament the same pattern occurs: there are seven Marys, nine Simons, two Johns, two Josephs, four Judases, two Lazaruses (Eleazar), two Matthiases (Matthews), two Jameses, and, at the minimum, three Jesuses.

Pick a Jesus, any Jesus. rofl

I fail to see how the fact it was a common name at the time indicates that Jesus of Nazareth (the figure we are discussing here), did not exist and the new testament was a fictional work written by Josephus. I asked you to cite sources for your claims, not personal anecdotes.

Originally posted by Cancerwarrior
reply to post by MamaJ

 

Maybe reincarnation is one of Jesus teachings that has been distorted by the church.

You know I never gave reincarnation much of a thought until I went to a Civil war reenactment once a few years back (actually I hate to admit more like 10-12 years back). It was the first time in my life that I really got Deja Vu and it was just a weird surreal feeling that I did'nt particularly enjoy. The same thing happened again when I was in the Army and got deployed to Bosnia during the war. We entered this town called Ztinge that was on a mountaintop and I knew I had been there before. I knew where the church was, the market square, etc. The officer I was with at the time thought I was weird because I knew where to go without needing to be told where to go. It was very weird. I looked up some info on reincarnation and it turns out many people have these sorts of deja vu experiences in places that they've never been to. I think now that I've been a soldier in this life and maybe several lives.

I was driving my father in law home the other day from my house. I live out in the country and theres a big cattle ranch on the way to town just off the highway. I was kinda shocked when Big Wayne told me that he dreams about that place all the time. He told me he remembers being there, he said he could take me up there and show me where everything is because he used to work there in a past life. You have to understand what kind of fella my father in law is. He is straight up good ol God fearing country boy baptist that likes his beer and does not ever talk about such fringe topics, ever. Life is weird.

edit on 6-9-2012 by Cancerwarrior because: (no reason given)

Oh wow, that's a really cool story and believe me, love me some country men and women. I'm born and raised here in Tennessee and grew up on a farm. Lol love it!

Think of it like this... Or like me... Lol

We were first spirit.

God moved within himself and outside of himself and began to think about us. He wanted companions, or kids is maybe a better word.

We became souls ( subconscious mind).

We awed over his creations like any children would.

We hovered over the earth before it was ever in material form.

We had free will ( still do) and once the entanglement happened we found our self separated from our father.

We became entangled with matter as the earth formed.

We are like little kids lost in a store trying to find and hold onto our father!!

We now at present are trying to obtain atonement again or the Christ consciousness whereas our flesh and our soul and spirit are at one with God.

Humanity is not doing very well and there is a fight between those of us who remember where we came from and those of us who don't. Even if you don't recall " being" before you came into life ...this time on earth.... you probably experienced something like I did.

I remember as a child talking to the sky and asking questions. Most children begin asking questions at three and four. They become conditioned to this world. However, I have never been able to conform. Lol I'm stubborn I guess but at the same time I remember feeling separated from my mother and wanting us to communicate without words. I felt as though we should be able to think what each other thinks and feel what each other feels. I do actually feel it ... to an extent. I'm very in tune with people and their emotions.

Humanity also has to be able to combine all knowledge. Religion, philosophy, science.... All of it.

There is a law of cause and effect or karma. It's real! Lol we see this! Each life we have on earth has goals for the soul that we accepted for our soul with our own free will. Each time we come we have those goals in place and are faced with many challenges. If we don't meet the challenges we are said to have sinned( missed the mark).

Each and every atom whether it's in us or in the solar system is an expression of and from God. Even the earth is an atom in the Universe of other worlds.

Originally posted by MamaJ

But let's go here for a moment: You have some intelligence, so you know that a child would have a hard time deciphering anything in the bible. There are people more intelligent than you (theologians with years and years of study) that would say that you aren't intelligent enough to decipher the bible. Also, these wise men would be quite ignorant to think that they could understand God and the bible. Why would a god make it so hard to understand his messages and meanings? Some would say that the messages are unclear in order to make us work for the answers. Hey, this is the welfare of our souls we're talking about here! You get the bible messages wrong, and it's off to hell you go for all eternity.

reply to post by jiggerj

 

Oh I'm so glad you asked! Hahaha.... I love thinking and talking about God, some may say I'm addicted.

I do enjoy chatting about it, as long as the other person isn't downright stupid about it. And, clearly, you are NOT stupid. I, on the other hand, maybe only fifty-seven but I am physically old and tired. So, if I miss a point, please feel free to remind me of it, okay? Going to read your story now.

Originally posted by Cancerwarrior
reply to post by ALightBreeze

 

I'd like to see any evidence of this Jesus trinity that you keep talking about. This is ATS after all, and you know what extraordinary claims require.

What?

reply to post by ALightBreeze


extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence my friend.

Originally posted by Cancerwarrior
reply to post by ALightBreeze

 

extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence my friend.

"People who use cliches as truths lead cliche driven lives", my friend.

Originally posted by Cancerwarrior
reply to post by MamaJ

 

Maybe reincarnation is one of Jesus teachings that has been distorted by the church.

You know I never gave reincarnation much of a thought until I went to a Civil war reenactment once a few years back (actually I hate to admit more like 10-12 years back). It was the first time in my life that I really got Deja Vu and it was just a weird surreal feeling that I did'nt particularly enjoy. The same thing happened again when I was in the Army and got deployed to Bosnia during the war. We entered this town called Ztinge that was on a mountaintop and I knew I had been there before. I knew where the church was, the market square, etc. The officer I was with at the time thought I was weird because I knew where to go without needing to be told where to go. It was very weird. I looked up some info on reincarnation and it turns out many people have these sorts of deja vu experiences in places that they've never been to. I think now that I've been a soldier in this life and maybe several lives.

I was driving my father in law home the other day from my house. I live out in the country and theres a big cattle ranch on the way to town just off the highway. I was kinda shocked when Big Wayne told me that he dreams about that place all the time. He told me he remembers being there, he said he could take me up there and show me where everything is because he used to work there in a past life. You have to understand what kind of fella my father in law is. He is straight up good ol God fearing country boy baptist that likes his beer and does not ever talk about such fringe topics, ever. Life is weird.

edit on 6-9-2012 by Cancerwarrior because: (no reason given)

I, too, have pondered the possibility of re-incarnation. I, too, have experienced very similar things that led me to believe it was very plausible.
I questioned a very good and wise friend who is a minister, to ask his opinion.
He thought on it a bit, and knowing what makes me tic, he said, "What if all of those experiences that seem so real to us, are simply thoughts and emotions passed down through our DNA from someone we are descended from, who WAS at those places?"
I honestly had not thought about it like that. The de' ja-vu was so strong! The knowledge of places and the visions of past events, could it be that my ancestors were there? And through some unknown connection to them, I could "see" what they saw?

I still have not made up my mind which to believe. What do all of you think?

Returning to the OP topic...

I would note that the satirical system of the NT and War of the Jews can be seen as an exercise in mind expansion, in that to solve the puzzles the reader must learn to think "outside the box," so to speak. The authors were making the point that the narrow focus the Sicarii Zealots maintained regarding only a few scrolls was a limited and inaccurate mode of thought.

The authors seem to be suggesting that only by seeing all sides of a problem can the truth be known. Therefore, it is possible that they designed the New Testament as a tool to intellectually uplift the messianic rebels.

If such was the Flavian authors' intention, it only adds to the incredible nature of the work, which is perhaps more amazing when seen as a secular psychological device rather than as a imagined world-historical religious work.
gious work.

reply to post by GoOfYFoOt

I, too, have pondered the possibility of re-incarnation. I, too, have experienced very similar things that led me to believe it was very plausible.

But there were a few things that always bothered me as a paranormal investigator, mainly because one of the first lessons I learned as such was that things are almost never what they appear to be. You always have to dig deeper.

First, if reincarnation is true, why are there so many "old ghosts"? Second, what part might ancestral memory play in the reincarnation experience? And finally, what would quantum mechanics, the branch of physics on which I base my own theories and methods, have to say about reincarnation?

The first question can be answered by the other two. The few researchers who have sought to correlate pastlife memories with genealogy have sometimes found that people share memories that probably belonged to their ancestors. This, of course, would include memories only up to the time of the birth of the child from whom the subject is in turn descended. And it wouldn't explain death memories.

It's to quantum mechanics that we can look for an explanation of reincarnation that ties up all the loose ends.

Einstein and his successor scientists have essentially proven that time is relative. It exists only in relation to the observer. String theory and quantum mechanics have taken this to the point that we can no longer say that past and future even exist in any objective form.

If there is no past, how can there be past lives? And if there is no time, how can there be such a thing as death?

There can't.

reply to post by ALightBreeze


You should really attempt to stop talking in circles and contradictions.
You use science to prove a series of points, but your very first paragraph attempts to turn Occam's Razor, on it's head?

You seem to be doing a lot of copy & paste, as well. Where are you getting your material from?

Sense. Try writing with it.

I'm convinced that what we call reincarnation is the experience of parallel or simultaneous lives. And that's exactly how at least one interpretation of quantum mechanics - the one I believe I see in day-to-day action - views how the universe is constructed.

Like soap bubbles in a bathtub, there are billions of parallel worlds side by side with us all the time and with which we constantly interact.

Originally posted by MamaJ

But let's go here for a moment: You have some intelligence, so you know that a child would have a hard time deciphering anything in the bible. There are people more intelligent than you (theologians with years and years of study) that would say that you aren't intelligent enough to decipher the bible. Also, these wise men would be quite ignorant to think that they could understand God and the bible. Why would a god make it so hard to understand his messages and meanings? Some would say that the messages are unclear in order to make us work for the answers. Hey, this is the welfare of our souls we're talking about here! You get the bible messages wrong, and it's off to hell you go for all eternity.

reply to post by jiggerj

 

Oh I'm so glad you asked! Hahaha.... I love thinking and talking about God, some may say I'm addicted.

Here is where I'm at in my jouney of life on Earth.

It's a story.

God is expressing himself through his creation. Think about this for a moment and look around. The sentence itself is very deep and can go as deep as you want or mind will allow.

Anything you read has been inspired to an extent.

Anything you listen to has been inspired to an extent.

Anything you touch has been inspired to an extent.

From ALL of your senses you are in commune with God daily all day and all night long.

In the beginning is a story. It's a story of matter and light and that story is continuing today. The way it manifests within is totally up to you and your journey with " light of the matter".

The way it's manifested within me is matter became a serpent, then an apple. It began a story of sensing good and bad and how matter can manipulate.

When you read the Bible over and over again you begin to have a feeling of good and bad. God being good and God being bad. Different characters in the Bible take on either a good role or a bad role. The book is filled with stories!!!!! These stories teach us something. Maybe the story is only shedding light on God being " bad" but when looked in a different light you may SEE something entirely different.

When I was a child, maybe six, I had the gift of deciphering. I can still tell a lie from truth whether it's coming from a friend, my coworker, or my mom. Lol I just know. It's a gut feeling I've always had and use it when reading ANY spiritual text. The words that come to you daily have been inspired by thoughts, music, literature and so on.

The theologians may be smarter than me, but they do not have my heart. They may have boxed them self in whereas my mind and heart is wide open.

My father graduated from Vanderbilt with a PHD. He WAS a Methodist Minister for many years and he and I have had some really deep conversations whereas his eyes were opened from me thinking aloud and asking questions.

I don't believe in the hell fire for eternity bit... I believe it's a cleanser if you find yourself there. Some things ( matter) have to be let go in the pit as its not able to travel beyond there. Matter can only stay here in this realm where IMO hell is not far. This is where matter reigns and matter is the deceiver.

It sounds like (and this is not an insult) you first decided to believe in a god, and then figured, and thunked and thinked him into what you wanted him to be.

You've pretty much nailed him down to pure energy. I can go halfway with you on this, seeing as if everything were to disintegrate, energy would still exist. Plus, how many times over the centuries have wild imaginations inspired science into creating what could only have been dreamt of before? Planes, trains, automobiles, rockets... If god were taken out of the equation, it would sure look like WE are responsible for the creation of all the wonders within the universe. We think it, and it comes into existence. But, everything comes into existence without breaking any laws of nature or science.

So here's the rub. Did god use magic to create the universe and life? If true magic were possible, it would break some or all of the laws that govern everything. This means that god could've waved his magic wand and had all the humans he wanted right there in heaven, rendering this earthly existence irrelevant. He could have made them smart, funny, original thinkers, righteous... Any and all types of people. Even evil people if he wanted.

However, if god couldn't break the laws of nature, if he had to adhere to the strictest rules of science in order to create us, then he isn't a god. He's a scientist!

Originally posted by ALightBreeze

Originally posted by Cancerwarrior
reply to post by ALightBreeze

 

extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence my friend.

"People who use cliches as truths lead cliche driven lives", my friend.

Nice deflection, evidence for your 3 jesus claims please?

Originally posted by GoOfYFoOt

Originally posted by Cancerwarrior
reply to post by MamaJ

 

Maybe reincarnation is one of Jesus teachings that has been distorted by the church.

You know I never gave reincarnation much of a thought until I went to a Civil war reenactment once a few years back (actually I hate to admit more like 10-12 years back). It was the first time in my life that I really got Deja Vu and it was just a weird surreal feeling that I did'nt particularly enjoy. The same thing happened again when I was in the Army and got deployed to Bosnia during the war. We entered this town called Ztinge that was on a mountaintop and I knew I had been there before. I knew where the church was, the market square, etc. The officer I was with at the time thought I was weird because I knew where to go without needing to be told where to go. It was very weird. I looked up some info on reincarnation and it turns out many people have these sorts of deja vu experiences in places that they've never been to. I think now that I've been a soldier in this life and maybe several lives.

I was driving my father in law home the other day from my house. I live out in the country and theres a big cattle ranch on the way to town just off the highway. I was kinda shocked when Big Wayne told me that he dreams about that place all the time. He told me he remembers being there, he said he could take me up there and show me where everything is because he used to work there in a past life. You have to understand what kind of fella my father in law is. He is straight up good ol God fearing country boy baptist that likes his beer and does not ever talk about such fringe topics, ever. Life is weird.

edit on 6-9-2012 by Cancerwarrior because: (no reason given)

I, too, have pondered the possibility of re-incarnation. I, too, have experienced very similar things that led me to believe it was very plausible.
I questioned a very good and wise friend who is a minister, to ask his opinion.
He thought on it a bit, and knowing what makes me tic, he said, "What if all of those experiences that seem so real to us, are simply thoughts and emotions passed down through our DNA from someone we are descended from, who WAS at those places?"
I honestly had not thought about it like that. The de' ja-vu was so strong! The knowledge of places and the visions of past events, could it be that my ancestors were there? And through some unknown connection to them, I could "see" what they saw?

I still have not made up my mind which to believe. What do all of you think?

Very interesting to ponder. I've never really thought of that before. Better yet, what if you actually WERE those ancestors that you are descended from.