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A possible paradox involving eternal happiness?

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posted on Sep, 5 2012 @ 04:21 PM
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Originally posted by ErroneousDylan
reply to post by ottobot
 


I'm sorry for your pain. The only thing I can recommend determined acceptance of this pain. Eckhart Tolle (whom I think is great) refers to the Ego as the "pain body" because it causes you pain, both mental and physical. He says some people have strong pain bodies and others have lesser. As was mentioned in a response to someone else in this thread, strong pain bodies can actually be a better teacher than lesser ones. He also mentions that coming into the Now while the pain body is still hanging around will bring your awareness to the pain and can make you feel worse or discomfortable, almost like a self-defense mechanism for the survival of the Ego.

Ok, so this is the problem then: I already know how to dissociate from Ego, but when I do I have no emotion. I am null and I am void. I still feel physical pain, but it just rolls off me, and nothing else phases me at all. It is not pleasant or unpleasant, it is completely blank.

I have lived for a long time in a state of continual acceptance of whatever happens, neutral in all things, and I can't live like that anymore. When I look at myself without a Self, I am nothing.

Granted, I have always believed I am nothing/worthless anyway, but that's another story for another day.

I guess I am trying to find that balance between allowing myself to feel while not tipping into the "feel too much" category. Which is, really, the root of my issue. I can't seem to find the middle ground between either extreme of emotion.


I get very bad headaches from TMJ and clenching my jaw and I notice that if I actually take some time to sit down and meditate my jaw will loosen up, but what's worse is that the pain in the jaw will increase. Of course, meditation wouldn't actually cause me any more pain but I think it allows me to finally notice the pain that has been there all along. Sometimes I get jealous of morbidly obese people (that might be an overstatement) when I see them walking around and eating whatever they want but it doesn't seem like it is effecting them mentally any way. They seem happy although rather rotund, but if I eat one cheeseburger, I feel horrible. My only conclusion is that we tune our focus away from this pain until eventually we don't notice it any more.

Yeah, very strange, I see people walking around and doing outrageous things and I wonder how it is so easy for them? How do they justify their actions and have no negative repercussions? Are they really content, or is it just an act?



So, I reckon if you've had pain for awhile in your life that coming to the present moment might actually make you notice it more and intensify it. Tolle recommends that you actually focus on this pain but try and keep aware of the Now and relaxed. The more attention you bring to it the more you counteract this pain body's self-defense mechanism.

Well, no matter how much I focus on the pain, it does not dissipate. I feel like I'm doing something wrong, because it persists no matter how I treat it. It doesn't make much sense, and itseems hopeless to me. I don't want to shut down again.


To truly accept something means you are O.K. with it even if it is not pleasant. I'm not trying to make an assumption but perhaps you aren't 100% accepting of your unpleasant Now?... The truth is, we are all stuck in the Now, as no other moment physically exist other than in our heads. Life is just one constantly changing and warping moment.

No, I accept it. I take responsibility for my life. I know my life is a product of my past actions, there's nothing I can do about it short of dying or running away and abandoning several people who depend on me. Honestly, dying seems like a better option, mostly because I wouldn't have to feel anything, and I could finally rest. Again, what is the middle ground? I know there is one, but I can't seem to find it.

I get it: there are no second chances for me, no fantasy futures awaiting me. The issue is that regardless of this knowledge, there is still pain. Like, my heart actually HURTS, my eyes start to water, it becomes hard to breathe in some moments. The bleakness of having only one moment for the rest of my life, and a life I accept just because there is nothing else is painful, every moment.



It sounds like you've already done a great deal of work though so you are probably closer than some to finding some peace. Focus on your breath, be present, and feel your existence, is all I can recommend.

Yes, my only recourse at this point is to focus on the earth around me and focus on the love I have for my loved ones. Normal meditation doesn't really work for me, but Yoga does, so that is where I put all of my pieces back together.

Well, thanks for your kind words and time. Maybe I will figure it out someday




posted on Sep, 5 2012 @ 10:57 PM
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reply to post by ErroneousDylan
 


Thoughts are happening. It is a part of human nature.
Sure, you can meditate but they'll come back.

To think of the present is to actually observe - the thoughts of observation come naturally.


"Bird... Wind... Tree.... Car..."

Just taking notice of what is happening now.

"Type...word...think..."

It doesn't necessarily have to be done with thoughts of "words", but just the fact that Now is being Observed is good enough to get rid of the "desire" - "lack" - "suffering".



posted on Sep, 6 2012 @ 12:54 AM
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reply to post by arpgme
 


To actually think about those things and label them would be would to put yourself in the past. There is an extremely short but still existant time between seeing something and thinking about it in your head, which means by the time you think about it, you are thinking about what was in the "past".

What would keep you in the Now would be to experience these things. Be aware of them. Do not think about them but acknowledge their existence through awareness.



posted on Sep, 6 2012 @ 06:57 AM
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reply to post by ErroneousDylan
 


That is not a good argument. If that's the case, we are NEVER in the present, because it takes a little while before the brain can recognize and interpret light.

So just by seeing something there is already a time delay...



posted on Sep, 6 2012 @ 07:22 AM
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Eternitys measure for happiness is evermore newness AND possession (control) of non-existence.



posted on Sep, 6 2012 @ 09:43 AM
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reply to post by tkwasny
 


I don't think I understand. How can there be "possession" of non-existence? or
"newness" of non-existence?



posted on Sep, 6 2012 @ 03:17 PM
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Originally posted by arpgme
reply to post by ErroneousDylan
 


That is not a good argument. If that's the case, we are NEVER in the present, because it takes a little while before the brain can recognize and interpret light.

So just by seeing something there is already a time delay...


That is correct.



posted on Sep, 6 2012 @ 03:26 PM
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reply to post by ErroneousDylan
 


Yes, but staying focused on now (or close enough to it) instead of the future or past will free you from a lot of bad experiences, longing, and worries....



posted on Sep, 6 2012 @ 03:32 PM
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Originally posted by arpgme
reply to post by ErroneousDylan
 


Yes, but staying focused on now (or close enough to it) instead of the future or past will free you from a lot of bad experiences, longing, and worries....


Sure but you have to feel it, not think about it.



posted on Sep, 6 2012 @ 03:59 PM
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reply to post by ErroneousDylan
 


If you do that, then you may begin to believe that you are your emotions, and you will still act from emotion and be unhappy with experiences...

You are not the thoughts or the emotions, emotions come and go...

With this understanding, you can always be satisfied (happy) understanding that these are "things" (emotions/desires) that just come and go and not the real you.



posted on Sep, 6 2012 @ 04:47 PM
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reply to post by arpgme
 


Awareness does not imply emotion.



posted on Sep, 6 2012 @ 07:28 PM
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reply to post by ErroneousDylan
 


I couldn't agree with you more.

If you can experience that which comes and go, then you are not "it".

Thoughts come and go...
Desire comes and go...
The body comes and go... (it's cells and changes)...

But what is constant? What is always there, the awareness...

Now, if you think and feel... there is nothing wrong with that since this awareness is having a human experience, but by thinking thoughts in alignment of awareness instead of judgments and feelings...

you align very close to the source....


Better to think, "a bird..", "a plane...", "a tree...", "the wind..." - present thinking...

instead of

"Why did that happen to me! What will I do about tomorrow!" and becoming entangled in worry...



posted on Sep, 7 2012 @ 09:31 AM
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Originally posted by arpgme
Now, if you think and feel... there is nothing wrong with that since this awareness is having a human experience, but by thinking thoughts in alignment of awareness instead of judgments and feelings...

Better to think, "a bird..", "a plane...", "a tree...", "the wind..." - present thinking...

instead of

"Why did that happen to me! What will I do about tomorrow!" and becoming entangled in worry...

What makes no sense about this (to me) is that you present all past/future thoughts as negative and useless. Yes, it is pointless to fixate on past/future, but it is very useful when one uses skills or makes decisions based on past experiences or future existence.

I can think, "A truck..." and nothing more, or I can think, "A truck, step to side to avoid death.", or I can think, "There's a truck in front of me, if I step in front of it to save that child I might die, but if I step away, that child might die."

I don't think it is always so easy as recognizing your awareness. Because, your awareness cannot exist in this time without the body you are in. Your awareness must be aware of the body's potential survival, but its knowledge is not limited to thoughts of one's own awareness.



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