Al Azif: Is The Necronomicon Real?

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posted on Sep, 4 2012 @ 06:36 PM
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reply to post by Xoanon
 


I honestly thought about buying one as joke, but i dont know anyone else who reads lovecraft




posted on Sep, 4 2012 @ 06:49 PM
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reply to post by Xoanon
 

Yes, there are whole books of letters that Lovecraft wrote. You can buy them on Amazon, or any bookstore. He never claimed the Necronomicon to be real.
There is no debate about whether it is a hoax; it is KNOWN to be a hoax. He admittedly created it to use in his fiction. Writers such as August Derleth took it and ran with it to create the entire Cthulu mythos.
Why are people questioning whether or not it is a hoax when it is a proven fact that it was a figment of Lovecraft's imagination? This thread is flabbergasting me. If only there was some sort of vast information network where people could look this sort of thing up....if there was such a thing (let's call it the "internet"), i bet it would take a grand total of 2 seconds to find this information....



posted on Sep, 4 2012 @ 07:12 PM
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reply to post by CallYourBluff
 





Manson thinks otherwise.




Hi CallYourBluff,

I watched the video, mainly because I just can't get enough of the lore surrounding The Necronomicon, so I wanted to get Marilyn's story too.

The Simon Necronomicon was released for public consumption in 1977 (same year Star Wars came out). It was released as a paperback, keep that in mind, it's important in a moment.

So, Marilyn Manson was born in 1969, he went to an Episcopalian school until tenth grade, that puts him at about 13 or 14 when the events in the story he tells happened.

So, that would have been 1983 or 1984, plenty of time for a kid to get ahold of even a second hand copy of the Simon Necronomicon which sold like evil little hot cakes. I was thinking that we might have something here if the experience that Manson describes had happened before the publication of Levenda/Simon's book. But it does not look like it.

Also, at 7:38 you see Manson pantomime a bit with his hands the way he was holding the book when the 'thing' happened to him. It looks like it was a small paperback that he was holding, to me, and not a giant tome as shown in the T.V. dramatization.

Just to be thorough.



X.



posted on Sep, 4 2012 @ 07:22 PM
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reply to post by silent thunder
 





in a large part due to the fact I think this book-about-a-book is also a hoax and designed as apologetica to shore up the "Simon" myth. Still, it might make a good fiction read some dark and stormy eve.


Yep, that is exactly it. The book you have was 'written' by Simon, who is Peter Levenda. And I agree, the books, and Simon/Levenda's back story make for really entertaining reading. There is not much I have ever read by Peter Levenda that I haven't liked.

Glad you found something that you liked on the thread, thanks for being here.

X.



posted on Sep, 4 2012 @ 07:24 PM
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reply to post by Druscilla
 


Lol... I'll swallow your soul!



posted on Sep, 4 2012 @ 07:29 PM
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All I know is that I read off some of this stuff when I was about 18. That night lights cut off in my house by themselves when I was in the house alone and I heard someone whisper my name through an inside window of my house, when all the doors were locked and windows were shut. I was experimenting that night because my parents had left. I am 40 now and I have had demons haunting me ever since. They still do to this day. They are terrible looking. I really did nothing else to bring this on myself, no Ouija, nothing. That was the only occult thing I ever messed with..so it has to be that.
edit on 4-9-2012 by Phenomium because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 4 2012 @ 07:31 PM
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reply to post by Maroboduus
 





Yes, there are whole books of letters that Lovecraft wrote. You can buy them on Amazon, or any bookstore. He never claimed the Necronomicon to be real. There is no debate about whether it is a hoax;

Why are people questioning whether or not it is a hoax when it is a proven fact that it was a figment of Lovecraft's imagination? This thread is flabbergasting me.


Well Maroboduus King of Marcomanni,

Folks on ATS just like to share stuff that they know about for the entertainment of other members. Sometimes its about stuff they don't know about and would like to learn more of.

And some folks like to be entertained by being presented with questions about things that they know a lot about, by people that have the same interests that they do, so that they can suspend their disbelief for a while and bask in a favorite subject as a lion basks in the sunshine, belching and farting after a meal of gazelle.

That is often what we do at ATS, serve up hot media drenched UGC for the delectation of our brothers and sisters.

Now, what's up my friend? What can I do for you?



X.



posted on Sep, 4 2012 @ 07:39 PM
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reply to post by Phenomium
 


Do you remember what the cover looked like? Did it look like the color picture at the bottom of the first post of the OP, on the first page?

Thanks in advance.

X.



posted on Sep, 4 2012 @ 07:40 PM
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reply to post by Xoanon
 


Sorry to be so negative, but it's dumb-founding to me when people say stuff like "i tried to find out if it was real, but everything was a dead end." Like i said, it literally takes 2 seconds of research to find multiple sources showing it is fake. The first sentence on the first website that pops up says it is fake. It's not like its lack of validity is obscure information or something.

Basically, i just find it absurd when people claim to have an interest in something, and yet somehow don't know anything about it whatsoever. I honestly can't relate to claiming interest in something and willingly remaining ignorant about it. If you truly have an interest in something, then shouldn't you actually try to be informed about it? Doesn't that seem reasonable? Deny ignorance, right? So take some time to freaking learn about stuff!


And like i've said numerous times before....i'm just a bitter old jerk. So don't mind me.


(My annoyance wasn't aimed at you, by the way. Like i said: i just hate it when people claim to be interested in something, yet make no effort whatsoever to actually learn about it. I honestly can't understand that mindset.)
edit on 4-9-2012 by Maroboduus because: (no reason given)
edit on 4-9-2012 by Maroboduus because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 4 2012 @ 07:52 PM
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reply to post by Maroboduus
 


Hello My Friend,



Basically, i just find it absurd when people claim to have an interest in something, and yet somehow don't know anything about it whatsoever. I honestly can't relate to claiming interest in something and willingly remaining ignorant about it. If you truly have an interest in something, then shouldn't you actually try to be informed about it? Doesn't that seem reasonable? Deny ignorance, right? So take some time to freaking learn about stuff!


Listen, I am a little dumbfounded as to why this thread is so popular myself but...

I think that part of the attraction here might be that people do know that the Necronomicon is a literary hoax but they don't know what exactly makes it so. The problem is that Simon Necronomicon, as you can see, there are all sorts of horrible anecdotes about it. It is the one that is involved in many occult crimes and the one that outcast teenagers keep under their bed or in a drawer.

And pulling apart the morass that Levenda has made of the situation has been no cake walk. But now with all the resources spread so thin on the web it is easy to nail him.

You'll notice in the OP that I spend little time on Lovecraft's obvious creation and move on to the tougher nut to crack, which is The Simon Necronomicon. For years stubborn people have pointed to it as being real because its origins could not be nailed down. Well, they can and we did that here in this thread. Levenda wrote it.



And like i've said numerous times before....i'm just a bitter old jerk. So don't mind me.


I think you are just fine.

Thanks for posting.

Have a good one.

X.
edit on 4-9-2012 by Xoanon because: .



posted on Sep, 4 2012 @ 07:57 PM
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I first read the book back in 1992 or so and at that time never heard of H.P. Lovecraft, except that I knew he had been a writer.

Nothing ever bad happened to me from reading the book, and the symbols in the book seem to coincide with little that I've studied in the occult since, except for the "pentagrammy" thing.

However, in the years since, (and I still have the pocket book copy), a lot of the Sumerian texts have since been translated, and I am amazed at how much the stories and "gods" in this book, co-insides with Sumerian texts supposedly not translated until after it was published.

I have tried to do spells and incantations with the book and never got any results which I guess is good for me, since I am still alive and not crazy (although, some will probably try to argue that point)

However, I will point out, that it does say in the book that you must not engage in any sexual activity (even with yourself) I think for at least 30 days, and I never believed in the book enough to actually go 30 days celibate from all sexual activity, so maybe that's why the spells didn't work and in this case, if the book be a true book of summoning very bad demons then I guess my lack of self control regarding masturbation, saved my life and sanity (how ironic, since they used to say that masturbation lead to insanity)

REBEL V



posted on Sep, 4 2012 @ 08:13 PM
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Levenda is brilliant and it would not surprise me to see that the Necronomicon as a Tulpa, thoughtform
that did exactly what a Tulpa does,, gains a life of its own by the sheer power of thought put into it.

I find myself in his description of those of us who look behind the Curtain. So no matter what you have to enjoy the Brilliance of mind that creates such things.
(From Sinister Forces)




. The people we trust are those who can measure the measurable. The people we distrust are those who point to the invisible and shout to get our attention. Our world is marching calmly to an obscure and unknowable end because we, the people, hear the drum, feel the beat, know our place in line. That’s better, somehow, than jumping off the path into the dark forest where God dwells like a hungry tiger. There is too much personal responsibility in jumping out of line, and if you then try to jump back in, you will find you have lost your place and your fellow marchers no longer want you to join them. You are dirty; you are crazed; you have seen what they are afraid to see.
edit on 9/4/2012 by EarthCitizen23 because: source of quote added



posted on Sep, 4 2012 @ 08:13 PM
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reply to post by Xoanon
 


Sorry dude...i wasn't trying to criticize the thread itself, or imply that it shouldn't be popular. Just flabbergasted that people who take an interest in these things haven't bothered to learn anything about them. This was just the culmination of feeling the same way about numerous threads today. I just tend to get a little worked up sometimes.

Trust me, my grumpiness is much more endearing once you get to know me, haha. Picture a cranky yet endearing old man, then make him 28 years old. I mean well enough, i just (admittedly) get annoyed too easily.

It IS an interesting subject, though.
I'm going to go ahead with a S & F, because i feel bad now....



posted on Sep, 4 2012 @ 08:31 PM
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Ah,The Necronomicon! I have a copy myself and have heard accounts that the thing actually works.As for me the jury is still out on that.Still an interesting read and good thread.
S&F



posted on Sep, 4 2012 @ 08:43 PM
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Originally posted by rebelv
However, in the years since, (and I still have the pocket book copy), a lot of the Sumerian texts have since been translated, and I am amazed at how much the stories and "gods" in this book, co-insides with Sumerian texts supposedly not translated until after it was published.

The Simon Necronomicon was released in the mid-70's.
They started translating the Sumerian texts, with varying success, in the mid-1800's. I believe most of the mythology had been translated by the 1940's....



posted on Sep, 4 2012 @ 08:44 PM
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Things like the Necronomicon start to work when people start to believe in them. Some people venerate Elvis Presley so much that they have had "experiences" related to Elvis, interventions on the spiritual or mental plane by him.

Religion is activated by belief.

If one venerated fire hydrants, set up a shrine to them, prayed to them, always acknowledged them and looked to them for guidance, it wouldn't be too long before they started providing guidance. A fire hydrant religion wouldnt necessarily be a bad thing. They are generally solid and dependable.



posted on Sep, 4 2012 @ 08:57 PM
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Originally posted by Xoanon
reply to post by Phenomium
 


Do you remember what the cover looked like? Did it look like the color picture at the bottom of the first post of the OP, on the first page?

Thanks in advance.

X.


As I recall, it was a black paperback book with that weird star thing on the front. I thought it was fascinating, it was also a bit of peer pressure that caused me to buy the book. I tried to summon some demon of the death out of curiosity. Don't know if I pronounced the words right, but something happened and I have been paying for it ever since. I am used to the demons, but somehow I can't seem to get "really" used to them because they keep me awake at night and it costs me my effectiveness in life and my vocational insurance. I have some serious bags under my eyes. It's not the paper or ink that is read from, rather the words that are spoken, that are the danger. The only way I can truly sleep is to be knocked out by alcohol or sedated by some kind of pill. Otherwise, sober...I am game. I went 8 years without alcohol and they schooled me. I don't know if the creator, whomever he was, was a legitimate occultist, I know what is. I don't care about the source or how credible he is, we all wear masks in society and show people who we want them to believe we are. Who make this book, I have no clue. The results...no doubt. Don't mess with this stuff unless you want the rest of your life to be sleepless nights of terror..Hell in the sheets and some outside of the sheets. Mostly while you sleep though, think that's when they are strongest. At night. 3:00 am and forward..Hell even 2:30 they make an appearance. I hate this. I really do. It isn't about lying or being cool or a hoax or anything of the nature...it is about, don't do this crap..it isn't cool, it will F*k up your life, it will make you tired on a daily basis, either the alcohol will get you or the demons will, either way you are tired at work the next day.....your wife will question your sanity, your kids will think you are cool and start drifting into a "Gothic" lifestyle, horror is normal to you and there is no empathy....except fo those who truly deserve it. Call me a sociopath....but it all started when I read a few passages of this book. The demons have made it quite clear since.....they are going nowhere.
edit on 4-9-2012 by Phenomium because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 4 2012 @ 09:03 PM
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reply to post by EarthCitizen23
 





Levenda is brilliant and it would not surprise me to see that the Necronomicon as a Tulpa, thoughtform that did exactly what a Tulpa does,, gains a life of its own by the sheer power of thought put into it.


Yes indeed, a Tulpa, you have a very well informed imagination, EarthCitizen23.

I would like to use your post as an example of how far folks will go to legitimize the Necronomicon. Which, of course, does not exist. At all. No way. Honest.

As I said earlier, I would like to get in to discussing some of the people behind the cults that swear by the validity of The Necronomicon.

British occultist and head of a renegade version of the O.T.O, Kenneth Grant, believed that Lovecraft's Necronomicon could be accessed on the astral plain; yes, that's right, an Astral Necronomicom.

Please bear with me here, I want to illustrate as best I can how all these authors have been tying one another in to a matrix that has been fomenting this Necronomicon hoax since the letters started with H.P.L. in the late 20's. They are very dodgy and as slippery as a worshipper of Dagon.

When you are the head of an organization that claims to have secret knowledge regarding something people are interested in and want (Grant was the head of the O.T.O. in Britain) people listen to you. And this is what Grant was saying...

That there was a secret powerful connection between Crowley and Lovecraft in that they both made contact with the 'Elder Gods' (*scoff*), Crowley through his magick and Lovecraft through dreaming his stories. Grant claimed to have the connection as well, and claimed that it was given to him directly from Crowley. Grant told people that they could make the connection too, and wrote some books about it that sell quite well to this day.

So you see how that allows Grant to tap both Lovecraft and Crowley simultaneously as he tries to create some validity for himself. This was all pre-1977 which was when Simon/Levenda released his Necronomicon.

still with me?


Now! To complicate the issue, Levenda uses Grant's allusions to an Astral Necronomicon in the introduction to the Simon Necronomicon, tying the whole thing together. And then others did the same, Like Donald Tyson.

See? the Necronomicon is so real that it doesn't even exist. It is in 'The Astral'

So no, EarthCitizen23, I think that we can safely strike Tulpa off the list of candidates for The Necronomicon, regardless of how refreshing and quasi-brilliant your idea may be.

Go on back to the books now, nothing to see here.



X.
edit on 4-9-2012 by Xoanon because: .



posted on Sep, 4 2012 @ 09:23 PM
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Originally posted by Xoanon
reply to post by EarthCitizen23
 





Levenda is brilliant and it would not surprise me to see that the Necronomicon as a Tulpa, thoughtform that did exactly what a Tulpa does,, gains a life of its own by the sheer power of thought put into it.


Yes indeed, a Tulpa, you have a very informed imagination, EarthCitizen23.

I would like to use your post as an example of how far folks will go to legitimize the Necronomicon. Which, of course, does not exist. At all. No way. Honest.

As I said earlier, I would like to get in to discussing some of the people behind the cults that swear by the validity of The Necronomicon.

British occultist and head of a renegade version of the O.T.O, Kenneth Grant, believed that Lovecraft's Necronomicon could be accessed on the astral plain; yes, that's right, an Astral Necronomicom.

Please bear with me here, I want to illustrate as best I can how all these authors have been tying one another in to a matrix that has been fomenting this Necronomicon hoax since the letters started with H.P.L. in the late 20's. They are very dodgy and as slippery as a worshipper of Dagon.

When you are the head of an organization that claims to have secret knowledge regarding something people are interested in and want (Grant was the head of the O.T.O. in Britain) people listen to you. And this is what Grant was saying...

That there was a secret powerful connection between Crowley and Lovecraft in that they both made contact with the 'Elder Gods' (*scoff*), Crowley through his magick and Lovecraft through dreaming his stories. Grant claimed to have the connection as well, and claimed that it was given to him directly from Crowley. Grant told people that they could make the connection too, and wrote some books about it that sell quite well to this day.

So you see how that allows Grant to tap both Lovecraft and Crowley simultaneously as he tries to create some validity for himself. This was all pre-1977 which was when Simon/Levenda released his Necronomicon.

still with me?


Now! To complicate the issue, Levenda uses Grant's allusions to an Astral Necronomicon in the introduction to the Simon Necronomicon, tying the whole thing together. And then others did the same, Like Donald Tyson.

See? the Necronomicon is so real that it doesn't even exist. It is in 'The Astral'

So no, EarthCitizen23, I think that we can safely strike Tulpa off the list of candidates for The Necronomicon, regardless of how refreshing and quasi-brilliant your idea may be.

Go on back to the books now, nothing to see here.



X.
edit on 4-9-2012 by Xoanon because: .




I'm not in the occult. I dabbled with it one time. I couldn't care less about the intricacies of who did what, when, where or how....I make my claim that this crap screwed my life up to this day and demons do not stop, as I speak. HG Wells, Crowley, Levanda (whoever that is)...doesn't matter. I have a personal account of this crap haunting me from the age of 18-40. It doesn't get easier either. I would say do it yourself, just to make a point...but I wouldn't wish this on an enemy. Don't do it. If you say it doesn't happen though, and you don't know for a fact,...the problem is that it breaks down the walls of doubt to where people will try for themselves, to find out, and then.....it's too late. Just don't say either. These demons want to just destroy you...nothing more. You might be curious...but they know EXACTLY what they want to do.
edit on 4-9-2012 by Phenomium because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 4 2012 @ 09:44 PM
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Originally posted by ipsedixit
Things like the Necronomicon start to work when people start to believe in them. Some people venerate Elvis Presley so much that they have had "experiences" related to Elvis, interventions on the spiritual or mental plane by him.

Religion is activated by belief.

If one venerated fire hydrants, set up a shrine to them, prayed to them, always acknowledged them and looked to them for guidance, it wouldn't be too long before they started providing guidance. A fire hydrant religion wouldnt necessarily be a bad thing. They are generally solid and dependable.


you literally said exactly what I was thinking... except the part about the mighty fire hydrant... fire hydrant IS everywhere!





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