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Originally posted by conspiracy88
Originally posted by LesMisanthrope
Very good post Wandering Scribe, one that may not be too appreciated by the we are one crowd. But it doesn't matter, the insults of hardcore idealists are just as light and fluffy as the clouds they live in.
You say that...
Originally posted by LesMisanthrope
Sorry? If any of your theories on reality find any ground to stand on, they may even be considered by a rational human being. Until then, they remain in the clouds, and are harmless.
Then say this...
So insults are ok as long as they're on your side. Oh, you're one of those.... shocking.
"Carl Jung did not believe in God, as we define it!"
"Jung - who unlike a true theist, only reflected on the existence of the afterlife - is barely mentioned in The God Delusion, and his "presence" is hardly an essential part of the book. The point being made could be made without him, using another more suitable example. But where he is mentioned, it gives a false impression I think. Jung did waffle on interminably about religion as if he cared, but he also came out with statements like
The wheel may lead our thoughts towards the concept of a "divine" sun, but at this point reason must admit its incompetence; man is unable to define a "divine" being. When, with all our intellectual limitations, we call something "divine", we have merely given it a name, which may be based on a creed, but never on factual evidence.
and when discussing the meaning of a dream -
The dream is in fact a short summary of my life, more specifically of the development of my mind. I grew up in a house 200 years old, our furniture consisted mostly of pieces about 300 years old, and mentally my hitherto greatest spiritual adventure had been to study the philosophies of Kant and Schopenhauer. The great news of the day was the work of Charles Darwin. Shortly before this, I had been living with the still medieval concepts of my parents, for whom the world and men were still presided over by divine omnipotence and providence. This world had become antiquated and obsolete. My Christian faith had become relative through its encounter with Eastern religions and Greek philosophy. It is for this reason that the ground floor [of the house, his home, in the dream] was so still, dark and obviously uninhabited.
- from Approaching the Unconscious, the chapter he wrote in Man and his Symbols, the last book he completed with associates before his death.
The word "belief" is a difficult thing for me. I don't believe. I must have a reason for a certain hypothesis. Either I know a thing, and then I know it - I don't need to believe it."
Source and further information:
Read more: Was Carl Jung an atheist? | Answerbag www.answerbag.com...
post by arpgme
Can't psychosis happen from messing with different areas of the brain? They even took someone who believed in God and tested both sides of their brain and one side believed in God while the other side didn't . That would be evidence of a physical brain to a materialist.
Then again, it COULD just mean that - like a broken TV - the brain is not receiving the signal. But, it isn't PROVEN either way, and that was my point, so until then, it is just ONE possible explanation - but there may be others - and maybe one of the others is true, who knows...
And just because there is something that we cannot fully understand yet (psychosis) does not automatically mean materialism is false - how many theories did we come up with that had misunderstandings in the beginning? A lot.
This is like saying "We do not know what causes thunder so obviously it is Zeus".
It is close-mindedness on both parts the materialists and the spiritualists.
Multiple Discovery wikipedia
Commonly cited examples of multiple independent discovery are the 17th-century independent formulation of calculus by Isaac Newton, Gottfried Wilhelm Leibniz and others, described by A. Rupert Hall; the 18th-century discovery of oxygen by Carl Wilhelm Scheele, Joseph Priestley, Antoine Lavoisier and others; and the theory of evolution of species, independently advanced in the 19th century by Charles Darwin and Alfred Russel Wallace.
There's the problem with Karma, and to your point. The victims of James Holmes must of done something atrocious in this life or a previous one, right? Nonsense. If universal Karma is used as an excuse for bystanding then all practical human value in spiritual philosophy falls apart.
I'm not sure if denying insurmountable evidence to the contrary of your beliefs is rational, but I guess it depends on how you look at it.
If one gets depressed at the thought of man not possessing any superpowers or being special in any way, by all means, he should curb his depression with delightful thoughts. If one fears being compared to "meat computers," then one doesn't have to make that comparison. I for one, cannot see anything in that comparison at all. A computer is something that sits on my desk, completely void of instinct, emotion and love. But denying the facts in favour of keeping man on his pedestal, merely because anything else is too difficult to swallow, is not only irrational, but wishful thinking.
Is it okay to believe in your side sometimes, and the other side sometimes? Can I be a believer for God in one moment and a calculated scientist the next?
But the evidence is merely behavioral symptoms of possessing a consciousness within a material world, and imply no causation nor any defining limits either.
And the conclusions drawn from this observed behavior are also nothing but opinion. As long as each party has all facts then each conclusion drawn is equally valid.