Can India liberate Tibet if it wanted to?

@indian

Are you chickening out???? Can you point out one thing that I posted that's wrong? You know this is not Bahrat Rakshak forum where you indians indulge in insulting us with all kinds of bullshiit while banning practially all chinese from that forum. This is a free board where people can learn facts and learn that how hypocritical and unrealistic you indians are???

Why don't you spend some time and challenge any thing I said here, I mean any thing?????

China is no. 2 in Olympics Gold metal accounts while India had only 1 silver this summer. Is this also made up by me???

What real work do you exactly do when you can't even dispute one point I made? Whatever you do, I doubt you will be successful because you simply lack the dedication and passion; most of all, you lack the ability to face reality and chicken out when you face challenges.

[edit on 26-10-2004 by Hawkssss]

Firstly, I have an avatar. Refer to me with the avatar. You do not seem to respect fellow members of this forum. I have seen your responses to vagabond as vagaband. I think the moderators ought to put this guy in his place.

Are you chickening out????

No, I am leaving you in your realm. What is there to 'chicken out'? Have you noticed everybody here is posting against you and not for you? So what is there to chicken out.

Can you point out one thing that I posted that's wrong?

Everything. All links are from the chinese forum. Whats there more to say?

You know this is not Bahrat Rakshak forum where you indians indulge in insulting us with all kinds of bullshiit. This is a free board where people can learn facts and learn that how hypocritical and unrealistic you indians are???

Oh, offended by the insults, are we? You should have thought of that before you start gloating your arrogant posts.

Why don't you spend some time and challenge any thing I said here, I mean any thing?????

I have. You just are not reading my previous posts. I posted my thread with URLs. So they are not my opinion. But the world at large. RAND study to be more precise.

China is no. 2 in Olympics Gold metal accounts while India had only 1 silver this summer. Is this also made up by me???

What does that prove? That you have a higher anxiety levels?? You can run faster? That you are great followers but not leaders? That you consume frog saliva, tiger's penis and say it improves your libido?

What real work do you exactly do when you can't even dispute one point I made? Whatever you do, I doubt you will be successful because you simply lack the dedication and passion; most of all, you lack the ability to face reality and chicken out when you face challenges.

And I think YOU lack the gumption to move any where up in the world. With your kind of arrogance, greed and materialism on the internet, who needs a life, right?

It is all well and good finding someone to be cocky with on the internet. I wouldn't be hardpressed to meet you in real life. Find a place to wank off your frustrations pal, don't find me to 'chicken out' from your posts. I have to work in real life (trust me, you don't want to know what I do in real life).

And your multiple question marks doesn't make you any the wiser.

Enuff said.

[edit on 26-10-2004 by aryaputhra]

Who is exactly posting agianst me, you and vagabond, and who else? Lucretius agrees with me while Russian has posted data on both militaries that favors china huge?

So do you want to dispute and challeng my points or do you just want to blah, blah your way around thinking that's gonna give you credibility???

If you can't dispute my points, just leave it because people have nothing new to hear from you besides your rhetorics.

Why moderators? What did I say that violated any rules? Is stating facts, providing solid links, pictures against your rule? Reminder, this is not Bahrat Rakshak forum where indians rule. Face the reality, pal and don't chicken out.

[edit on 26-10-2004 by Hawkssss]

Who is exactly posting agianst me, you and vagabond, and who else? Lucretius agrees with me while Russian has posted data on both militaries that favors china huge?

Oh, baby that makes everybody else for you. Please rewind.

So do you want to dispute and challeng my points or do you just want to blah, blah your way around thinking that's gonna give you credibility???

I already HAVE disputed your posts you dumbhead. Gimme a break. Read my previous posts. Your an amazing wacko.

If you can't dispute my points, just leave it because people have nothing new to hear from you besides your rhetorics.

Yes, and all peace and harmony prevails in China. What a tosser!!!! LOL

You are losing your cool here by calling me a wacho. Where is your karma? Only because I presented facts, links and pictures, I am a wacko? You are somthing.

which point have you disputed other than providing an aritcle saying all chinese numbers are fake?????

Did you challenge my points about ship building capability, our J-10s our tanks, our new DDGs and frigates, our economy growing faster and 2x bigger than yours?

What have you challenged again? and what facts, links have you provided?

You think your empty blah, blah is gonna cut it???? lol

[edit on 26-10-2004 by Hawkssss]

No, China certainly has a lot problems of our own. For example, huge wealth gap between the haves and the have-nots, military threats from the US, our banking sysmte NPL problem, huge population, increasing pollution due to construction and cars, energy shortage, etc. Afterall, China is still a 3rd-world country with a per capita GDP of just a little over $1000.

But, aren't talking about military and taking over tibet here? If you want, we can open another thread and I will be happy to discuss chinese problems as well as indian problems. Let me know!

[edit on 26-10-2004 by Hawkssss]

I am not going to substantiate your claims since indeed China has a huge numerical advantage. I have disputed this numerical advantage = superiority theory as hogwash in my previous post. I don�t intend to repeat myself unlike you who has more than enough time in your hands.

And please, spare me your J-10 - it really is pathetic to flaunt that piece as a masterpiece, lol!

Here�s a report on China�s Hollow military

www.brook.edu...

Ground force leadership, training in combined operations, and morale are poor. The PLA is still a party army with nepotism and political/family connections continuing to predominate in officer appointment and advancement

origin.rfaweb.org...
PETITIONERS ATTEMPT MASS SUICIDE IN BEIJING

What a Pity we have CCP Drones that come and Parade the CCP BS, while Real people are suffering ....

Oh, yes and the US loves CHINA

Commies upto their great tricks. � Copying.

www.businessweek.com...

On June 23, Yi Bin Zhu was discovered after hours at the SuperComm show in Fujitsu's booth removing the casing from a $1 million piece of networking gear and taking photos of the circuit boards inside. According to a July 21 letter sent by Melanie Scofield, the Fujitsu unit's chief counsel, a security guard was summoned and confiscated the photo card in Zhu's digital camera along with a notebook containing notes and diagrams of other suppliers' gear.

SENT TO THE FBI. Executives from AT&T (T ), Cisco, Lucent (LU ), Nortel (NT ), and Tellabs (TLAB ) also received copies of the letter, suggesting Zhu may have had information on some of their products as well. Zhu was wearing a badge saying he worked for an unknown company called "Weihua" (Huawei, with the syllables in reverse order). But a source tells BusinessWeek Zhu gave the guard a Huawei business card as well.

Fujitsu has given the photo card and notebook to the FBI. "Because of the potentially sensitive nature of this information, the only logical conclusion that one can draw is that the employee in question was engaged in unlawful activities that may have been a violation of the Economic Espionage Act of 1996,"

www.taipeitimes.com...

Another wonderful US CHINA relationship

During a visit to Beijing, Admiral Thomas Fargo told Chinese political and military leaders that US Pacific sea and air forces maintain a high state of readiness, in contrast to the drain on ground troops from deployments to Iraq and Afghanistan.

www.newsmax.com...
U.S. at War With Beijing, Reports Cite China as No. 1 Threat


[edit on 26-10-2004 by aryaputhra]

I think we should liberate America and let Native Americans have all their land back.... How's that sound to you?

so why can't our indian friend refrain from name-calling, such as calling me commie, CCP drones etc. Do you think it is hard for me to insult you, especailly one form a 1-billion country that can only get 1 silver in the olympics? What would people call you, weaklings? So please be nice, calling names doesn't add any credibility to your argument and it only shows how shallow you are and how brain-washed you are. Understand, my veggie-eating friend? lol

We not only have overwhelming numerical advantage, we also enjoy huge technological advantage over you. Plus, we make most of our stuff while you buy most of your stuff. J10 might be crap, but you can't even make a crap on your own and your pathetic LCA just failed a test in Russia recently.

Here are my article attacks for you just like what you are doing to me... lol

See it is not too hard to do this, but where did you prove india has quality superiorty over China????

India lost 3 Mirage 2000 in three weeks.
timesofindia.indiatimes.com...

LCA fails engine test in Moscow. oops... lol
www.telegraphindia.com...

US arms Pakistan again and Uncle loves indians. lol
timesofindia.indiatimes.com...

India's flying coffin
news.bbc.co.uk...

Comparions between China and India by INDIANS! LOLOL Are you fellow indians also propagandist? lol
Yet, the gap between Shanghai and any Indian city is so stark and visible that the comparisons seem laughable.
timesofindia.indiatimes.com...

[edit on 26-10-2004 by Hawkssss]

[edit on 26-10-2004 by Hawkssss]

@redhare,

That sounds great btw, and the whites should also return lands to the natives of Austrialia, Canada, South central america, etc. etc. ... lol

Originally posted by Hawkssss


India lost 3 Mirage 2000 in three weeks.
timesofindia.indiatimes.com...

LCA fails engine test in Moscow. oops... lol
www.telegraphindia.com...

US arms Pakistan again and Uncle loves indians. lol
timesofindia.indiatimes.com...

India's flying coffin
news.bbc.co.uk...

Comparions between China and India by INDIANS! LOLOL Are you fellow indians also propagandist? lol
[

[edit on 26-10-2004 by Hawkssss]

Thats called free and open media my friend, a concept your country seems to severely lack amongst other things.The fact that the indian media sometmines bashes its own military, shows that we allow room for contructive criticism which can only help.

Any criticism from within china about its policies and its goverment, and whoops its heads rolling down the hill..no wait down tiannemen square!!

You know what, we have many articles saying the same thing about china. But, too bad, you can't read chinese and we chinese aren't as in english as the indians are. Plus, our indian friend will provide enough negative stuff on china that there is no need for me to do so.

China of course is still lagging in terms of a free media. But, hey, we are communists and we can. lol

Oh, btw, your shining example: india has sth called the Caste system still in place and I guess that's a sign of democracy when some people are still untouchable in their society. Of course, they will deny it's a thing of the past, but I can provide evidence that it is still in existance especially in the country side. (see, I always back up what I say..lol)

Ciao

[edit on 27-10-2004 by Hawkssss]

I still say my money is safe with a bet on China.

What China lacks in air logistics support (which by the way they'd blast with EMPs) they make up for in space based eyes and centralized combined arms command.

China has clear numeric and technological superiority, Russian's numbers are quite correct according to the United State CIA factbook on global military power. Our Chinese friend was also quite correct in saying that the nickname for India's air force is the Flying Coffin. As for the navys, well I'd take China's new surface fleet and subs over India's 2 unseaworthy and rusting aircraft carriers and support ships any day.

Long analysis short, India would loose the coflict for three major reasons:

1: India's military has been built around fighting it out with the Paks, China's military has been designed from the begining to defend against invasion.

2: The western powers will not step in, there's too much to loose and almost nothing to gain. If anything the United States will side with their trade ally and back China because of the political ease of defending an attacked nation, and their massive trade and debt interests in China. India is rather expendable to the US compaired with China, regardless of what type of government the countries have. If the European Union had to pick a side (which I highly doubt they would) they have an alliance with China, and again the international community is sympathetic to the defender, so it'd be politically viable for the EU to back China. Japan would stay out of it for sure, they can't mobilize without a constitutional ammendment and that has had a very serious history of failure. Russia's got their own problems to worry about and it's not like their interests would be harmed so why should the Bear lift a finger?

3: Attacking China is suicide for India because of the current state of their nation. China also has one thing that no amount of troops can make up for, some of the world's best tactical minds. Ever read The Art Of War, Little Red Book or Manifesto For Revolution? China would play the political angle like no other too. Imagine, India is bogged down fighting China in the east, all avalible troops and supplies are needed, gee what do you think the Pakistanis are going to do about that? My guess is that Delhi and Mumbai would be radioactive craters, and the Chinese would be the one's to convince the Paks that the time to strike has come. India also can't pull the whole total war thing against China also. Remember India is a third world (read largely unindustrialized) nation and the fighting would be on their front lawn. China is almost finnished with their full scale leap over the industrial age and right into the info age. The fighting would be on the edge of their property and their large industrial centers in the east would be untouched, separated by thousands of miles.

In conclusion, China has the numbers, tech and tactical mastery to blow India away. The only thing India can compete with is sheer manpower, and with loss of air superiority, feeble supply lines throught mountainous terrain and the Paks opening a western front, I'd say they wouldn't last long.

May Peace Travel With You
~Astral

Originally posted by Hawkssss
You know what, we have many articles saying the same thing about china. But, too bad, you can't read chinese and we chinese aren't as in english as the indians are.
Oh, btw, your shining example: india has sth called the Caste system still in place and I guess that's a sign of democracy when some people are still untouchable in their society. Of course, they will deny it's a thing of the past, but I can provide evidence that it is still in existance especially in the country side. (see, I always back up what I say..lol)


[edit on 27-10-2004 by Hawkssss]

You've got to be kidding me about those chinese articles. Your regime is one of the most oppressive in the world.

And what do you mean by "india has sth called the Caste system still in place"...??
You mean to say our political system endorses it? Its a relic of ancient times which we strive to overcome along with any other short comings vis-a-vis communalism etc.
Remember the mass riots and killings which took place a couple of years ago where hindus and muslims killed each other. The pro-hindu government was blamed for instigating the aftermath and allowing the violence to continue for their own devious means. They lost the recent elections, and that proves the Indians have a sense of brotherhood (irrespective of caste and creed) and have the power to exercise their beliefs. We've come a long way from the "caste system"
When people raise their voice in your country...they're 'erased' and swept under the rug. Im sure you lost someone or you know someone who lost a kid a tiannemmen. What can anyone do about it ..nothing..

10) Bottom line: China is making proportionally more and more indigenously while India is still buying most of its stuff from overseas while we outspend them 3 to 1. This only means India is being left behind by China further and further just like our economies. Our eoconomy grows faster than india's and in a decade, Chinese economy will be about 3X that of India while their population will surpass that of China in the next decade, without any revaluation of our currency which is most likely to happen in the next decade. Do you know what that means?????

Oh my god, you'll need to buy even more of your energy from Australia! Yes, no?

You'd better look at the international analysis. If China's numbers don't go down soon they're going to create their own meltdown a la Thailand '97.

You're building most things indiginously? There's a reason the west jokes about Asian quality control. Only Japan and Taiwan have it. I like my cheap denim jeans but I'm not going to ride a Chinese motorcycle.

Numbers don't count that much. Look at how large Poland's army was.

Your T34 and T54/55 knockoffs won't cut it against Vijayantas. I'd even take the Vickers job over T64s and 72s.

As for bombers, I'll take the Sepecat over anything wearing PLAAF colours.

HowlrunnerIV

Just ignore this Hawksss guy, he's exactly what I said he is, a CCP drone that no form of logical argument that will penetrate into his thick chinaman skull, apart from name calling.

For him, repetition is the name of the game, and he keep on saying what he believes as true with no alternative point of view. To him J10 is state-of the art and AWACS is a true sign of cutting edge Chinese technolodgy. Space travel is 'lightyears" away from India and will be "lightyears' away from NASA as soon as the latest photocopies and stolen blue prints materialise. Everything is copied. Even their cars are pirated.

www.detnews.com...

Frankly its best to give up on him.

[edit on 27-10-2004 by aryaputhra]

oops,

The indians are pulling what they use on Bharat Rakshak forum, empty talk and personal attacks. lol

Indians, let's see some links, evidence saying india can take over Tibet and why don't you challenge my points. lol

Why are you so lazy??? Is that why you are so much behind China. Average Chinese is twice richer and live 10 years longer than an indian. lol Plus, you got only 1 silver in the olympics. Eating too much veggie, I recken. lol

Yes, we copy things, but you don't even have the capability to copy things. lol and India just topped out as the world's no. 1 pirator for pay movies and I will come back with the link.

You guys have really degraded this threat which is supposed to be military. lol I think you folks have no idea about military at all.

[edit on 27-10-2004 by Hawkssss]

You people need a middle men to bring all the info to you. i will again post somemore info to back my self up on the claim that China has the upper hand. I will try get to it asap. Also I must say that as a Russian I really want China and India being allies with Russia. Both would be great allies and will help in whatever comes up.

Out,
Russian

USA would lose at least two of their carriers in the first week if they involve in when China attacking the island--in a USA military report to Bush's admin.
Don't know what will happen to India's 2 precious carriers. Half an hour?

Chinas Army

Main Battle Tanks

Typ 90 II: 100
Typ 85 II: 800
Typ 80: 500
Typ 69/79 III: 800
Typ 69 I/II: 200
Typ 59 I/II: 6,000

Armored Vehicles

Typ 63: 1,200
Typ 62 I: 800
BMD 3: 100
Typ 63: 2,000
Type 90, WZ501, YW534, WZ-553, -551: 3,300
Tunguska M1: ?
155mm PLZ 45, 152mm Type 83,122mm Type 89, 122mm Type-85,122mm Type -54: 1,200
(MRL) 122 - 237mm: 2,500
100 - 155mm: 14.500

Armed Helicopters

SA-342 L / Gazelle: 8
Z-9: 25

Helicopters

Mi 8/17: 150
Mi-6 Hook: 4 - 6
Z-11: 24
Z-5: 300
Alouette IIII: 32

Chinas Air Force

Combat Aircrafts

FC-1: 8
J-11: 144
J-10: 300
J-8 II: 300
J-8: 150
J-7: 700
J-6: 300
Q-5: 400
Su-27 SK: 76
Su-30 MKK: 76

Bombers

H-9: ?
H-6: 120
H-5 IS/IM/IB: 200

Reconnaissance Aircrafts

HZ-5: 45
JZ-6: 100
JZ-5: 150
Trainer HJ-5 / JJ-6 / JJ-7: 230

Transport Aircrafts

Y-12: 2
Y-11: 15
Y-8: 45
Y-7: 25
Y-5: 300
Il-76: 10
Il-18: 10
Il-76 D: 28
Il-78 TD: 20
An-32: 80

Helicopters

Bell 212: ?
SA-332 Super Puma: 4
Mi 8: 30
Z-5: 100
Z-9: 70

Chinas Navy

Aircraft Carriers

Ex-Varyag 67,000: (1) A huge chance its coming by 2010

Destroyers

Sovremennyy: 4
Luhai: 4
Luhu: 2
Luda-II: 1
Luda I: 15

Frigates

Jiangwei-II: 6
Jiangwei: 4
Jianghu V: 6
Jianghu IV: 1
Jianghu III: 3
Jianghu I/II: 25

Submarines

Xia: 1
Han: 5
Kilo: 4
Song: 2
Ming: 17
Yuan: 1

Combat Aircrafts

J-8: 54
J-7: 66
Q-5: 40
Su-30 MK: 24

Bomber
H-6: 22
H-5: 66

Trainer PT-6 / JJ6 / JJ-7: 70
J-6: 300

Reconnaissance Aircraft

Be-6 ASW: 12
SH-5: 6

Transport Aircrafts

Yak-42: 2
Y-5: 50
Y-7: 4
Y-8: 6
An-26: 6

Armed Helicopters

Z-9: 12
Z-8 ASW: 20

Helicopters

Ka 27: 2
Ka 28: 2
Ka 28 ASW: 4
Ka 28 SAR: 4
Mi 8: 10




Indian Army

Main Battle Tanks

T-90 S: 310
T-72 M1: 1,500
T-55: 700
Vijayanta Mk1: 1,200
Arjun Mk1: 40

Armored Vehicles

PT-76 / BDRM-2: 190
BMP 1 / 2: 1,450
OT-62: 150
WZT-3: 228
VT-72: 155

Artillery
(MRL) 122mm BM-21, 122mm LRAR, 214mm �Pinacha�: 200
105 mm �Abbot�, 130 mm mod. M-46, 152 mm 2S19: 180
Howitzers 155mm: 4,175

Helicopters

HAL: (400)


Indian Air Force

Combat Aircrafts

MiG-29 A/UB: 75
MiG-27: 189
MiG-25: 8
MiG-23 MF: 125
MiG-21: 418
MiG-21-93: 170
Su-30 MKI: 22
Mirage 2000 H/TH: 44
Jaguar IS/IM/IB: 114

Bomber

Mirage 2000-5: 10
Tu-22: 4

Transporter, Tanker, Aufkl�rer Transport / Tanker / Reconnaissance Aircrafts

Il-78: 6
A-50EhI: 3
Il-76 AWAC: 5
Il-76 D: 28
An-32: 100

Helicopters

Mi-24/35: 60
Mi-8/17: 190
Mi-26: 10
HAL: 60


Indian Navy

Aircraft Carriers

Old Britsh Carrier 29,000 12 Harrier 9 Sea King: 1 (Out of Service in 2010)
ex-Admiral Gorschkov 45.000: (1) In by 2009

Destroyers

Delhi: 3
Rajput: 5

Frigates

Nilgiri: 22
Bramaputhra: 1
Talwar: 3
Godavari: 3
Leander: 3

Corvettes

Khukri: 7
Korvette: 2

Submarines

Akula: (2) Rumors that Russia might lease 2 Akulas to India If yes then they are in service by 2010
Kilo: 10
Foxtrott: 4
Shishumar: 4
Scorpene: 4

Patrol Aircrafts

Il 38: 6

Helicopters

Ka-31 AEW: 9
HAL: 73
Sea King: 33

Combat Aircrafts

Harrier / Mk51/T.Mk60: 23
MiG-29: 28





Ok I tryed to get the best info I could.

Out,
Russian