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Did a RAF Tornado crash during a UFO intercept mission in 1997?

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posted on Aug, 28 2012 @ 07:21 PM
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Monday March 24th 1997 was a cold spring evening with a bright full moon and clear skies above Northern England. Not long after dark, around the Howden Moor area of the Peak District, a series of peculiar events were about to unfold. The Hale Bopp comet was visible in the skies and had attracted a number of serious and casual observers to venture out. People in the nearby areas, such as Sheffield, reported hearing sonic booms, seeing bright flashes in the sky, low flying aircraft and lights throughout the night. There were even reports of a black, triangular UFO seen in the skies that night. It was later speculated that it was being pursued by RAF Tornado jet fighters as part of an intercept mission to add to the mystery.

courtesy Google Earth.

Later in the evening a number of independent witnesses reported a single aircraft apparently crashing into the moor land areas to the east of the Ladybowen and Howden Reservoirs and hearing a loud explosion. Was a UFO defending itself against the fighters, eventually forcing one down with some kind of exotic weapon? Did the crippled aircraft plunge into the Howden Reservoir or the soft peat moor lands nearby?



WITNESS REPORTS

Shortly after dusk the reports of low flying aircraft and or strange lights and sounds began.
According to various witnesses an approximate timeline is:

6.30pm approx - Around dusk - A Park Ranger in Derbyshire hears “an horrendous noise” in the sky.

7.40pm – Bryan Haslam, travelling by train in the Barnsley area, sees “a triangle shaped object with lights all around it hovering…”. He told police “"There's no point in you looking for a crashed plane, it definitely wasn't a plane."

8.30pm – Gavin Stewart, a motorist on the M62 in West Yorkshire, oberves what he believes to be an aircraft in a nose dive disappear over a ridge. He expects to see flames but saw nothing more. Around the same time another driver, Paul Bradley, on the A61 - Chesterfield bypass sees a formation of three military jets headed towards the Derbyshire moors.

9.30pm – Tony Moore and Paul Byson are watching the Hale Bopp comet from the Shiregreen area of Sheffield. They see a formation of fighter jets flying directly above them in the direction of Derbyshire. A number of other witnesses, including a radio reporter from Hallam FM, report hearing “a loud humming noise” on the Peak District moors.

9.45pm approx - A former RAF officer, John Brassington, reports to police that "Two RAF jets came over low and fast then a twin engine plane circled twice over Dronfield. Those jets were so low they shook the foundations of my house”. At the same time a Mr. Rhodes states seeing a glowing orange object going over Mosborough.

9.55pm – Multiple reports from Dronfield, Derbyshire of aircraft travelling in a north direction towards the Peak District that describe a jet aircraft and at least one light aircraft. Emma Maidenhead also describes a triangle object, wide as the street; really bright and just above the rooftops flying pretty slow heading for the moors.

10.00pm - A woman on the outskirts of Sheffield sees a long dark cigar shaped object flying in a across the moors towards the Peak District surrounded by an eerie “glow” like it was on fire, low and almost at rooftop level.



MORE WITNESS REPORTS

10.05pm –A South Yorkshire Police Special Constable, Marie-France Tattersfield, sees a light aircraft coming down ,no higher than 500 feet with its windows lit up and then disappears behind some tall conifers. She also hears a loud boom in the area.
10.06pm – Mike and Barbara Ellisione are watching TV and hear ,“a terrific explosion” ,in the sky outside their home on the moors. After an initial sweep of the moors they phone 999 (emergency services) to report an explosion which is logged by Sheffield Police incident room

10.10pm - A farmer and his mother at Edge End Farm, Bolsterstone see what they believe to be an aircrash, an orange glow, followed by several plumes of smoke and detect “a strong smell of burning”.





10-10.15pm - John Littlewood, on the moor in his four-wheel drive vehicle spots what looks like an old wartime plane making a loud humming noise.

10.30-11pm – Sharon Aldridge and friend, Joanne at Boot’s Folly on a hill above the Strines Reservoir hear what Sharon describes as “a weird noise”.

10.35pm – Teenagers, Leon Rockley and Alex Hardy, film a low-flying light aircraft. Police examine the footage but cannot identify the plane and don’t take their inquiry any further.

10.54pm - A Derbyshire Police traffic patrol unit report seeing “a plume of smoke” rising into the air to the west of the Woodhead area while heading for the suspected crash zone. Unexplained smoke is spotted later near the Strines Inn and fire crews are asked to direct a spotlight in the direction from which the smoke appeared. The West Yorkshire Police helicopter (Y99) searches the area but finds nothing.

11.15pm approx – Snake Pass on the small viaduct over Ladybower reservoir. A mini-bus is flagged down by a man stinking of what smelled like "aviation fuel". He is not allowed onboard as the bus is already full. A passenger reports the incident to police.

11.45pm approx –Businessman, Dan Grayson sees “a bright red light stationary in the sky” towards Glossop.



....continued in Part II
edit on 28-8-2012 by mirageman because: formatting
edit on 28-8-2012 by mirageman because: formatting




posted on Aug, 28 2012 @ 07:25 PM
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Part II

NONE OF OUR AIRCRAFT ARE MISSING
Based on the large number of reports coming in to the local police forces, a major rescue operation was launched by the UK Emergency Services. A search for a downed aircraft and survivors took place. Over 140 mountain rescue volunteers, RAF personnel and a large number of police officers from four neighbouring forces were involved in a 13 hour search across the Moors. A thorough search was made on foot and from the air. By 10am next day a 10 mile area around the Howden Reservoir was set up as a no fly zone to enable two helicopters to complete their search unhindered by other military or civilian aircraft.



THE SEARCH ENDS

Mar 25th 1997 around noon to 1.00pm – Chief Inspector Burbeary, heading the operation, gave the order to scale down the operation:

“We got nothing back from air traffic control, no reports of aircraft failing to return, and eventually, having looked at all the circumstances, the decision had to be made to call the search off.
The conclusion at the end of the search had to be that no aircraft crashed on the moor.”

However, she re-iterated a number of genuine reports of “phenomena”, including a low-flying aircraft, a huge explosion in the sky, and smoke.

Mike France, the Mountain Rescue co-ordinator, remained as baffled as the police. He said his teams knew the area intimately and had thoroughly searched the moorland with help from the helicopters. “There was no scouring to the moor; there were no bits of wreckage. There was no oil traces on the reservoirs,” he said.







The police log for the night of March 24th revealed that a check of radar tapes was in fact made by Lt. Stilwell at the RAF’s Air Sea Rescue Centre at RAF Kinloss at 12.04am on March 25. He told police: “…we have consulted with all radar information for that particular area and surrounding area, nothing significant is indicated from the readings. “

That same night the British Geological Survey (BGS) microphones at Leeds University recorded two sonic booms or air explosions over the Sheffield area. The first was recorded at 21.52 over the Peak District area and the second was reported at 22.06. The BGS did contact the RAF Low-Flying Complaints Department on March 25th and were told they “could not confirm” that a military jet was the cause. An MOD spokesman said at lunchtime that day that the MOD were not involved in the investigation of the incident, and that it was outside their remit, He stated that “nothing had been picked up on radar and an RAF plane was not responsible.” And he added that the report concerned a low flying aircraft and the inquiry was “a matter for the police




Dr Jacqueline Mitton of the Royal Astronomical Association at Cambridge University ,speaking in April 1997, said that the events were consistent with a bolide meteor. However there was no evidence to suggest that such a meteor had flown over the Peak District and South Yorkshire on the evening in question. The mystery of what the witnesses saw to trigger the reports remained. Was it a meteor, an illegal drug operation, a secret military operation, a ghost plane, or even a UFO?

PARLIAMENTARY QUESTIONS

The incident became so high profile that questions were eventually asked in the Houses of Parliament in March 1998.






John Spellar [Under Secretary of State for Defence] eventually admitted that a number of military aircraft were booked to carry out low flying training in northern England on the evening of 24 March 1997. ”No reported sightings of “UFOs” on 24 or 25 March were received by my Department…..We have no record of sonic events being generated by RAF or NATO aircraft for the evening of 24 March 1997…It is not possible, twelve months after the case in question, to state precisely where military aircraft activity was being carried out. Records kept show only that aircraft were booked to carry out low-flying over the Peak District between 20:30 and 21:07 hours local time on the evening of 24th March 1997 [-Note that these times are before the reports of explosions and an aircraft coming down]. No low level flying is permitted over the Sheffield urban area, or any other major conurbation. Records of flying at medium level – between 2,000 and 24,000 ft – are not maintained so it is possible that there were aircraft in the area at medium level.

......continued in part III



posted on Aug, 28 2012 @ 07:28 PM
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Eventually further pressure revealed that a number of Tornado GR1 and Jaguar aircraft were involved in an exercise with an RAF spokesman further commenting “…..We don’t discount there may be unexplained phenomena in the sky, but we are not funded to investigate them. We would admit the fact if we had chased a UFO. There were no intercept missions that night. There is no cover-up. We don’t know what caused the sightings and the sonic booms and the whole thing remains a mystery to us. We don’t know what went on and there will always be people who seize on mysteries like this to make claims about cover-ups.” (Ref UK National Archives release DEFE 24 2076)

CONCLUSIONS



Max Burns


The main proponent of a UFO/Tornado crash was a man called Max Burns. An odd character who seemed to alienate himself by making unfounded claims that a radar operator from Royal Signals at RAF Linton On Ouse had tracked a UFO. Independent investigations showed that the radar at Linton was not powerful enough to pick up a radar return from the moors and the station was actually closed at the time. Burns also claimed that the mysterious gentleman covered in jet fuel, who flagged down a minibus, was in fact a surviving co-pilot of a downed Tornado. Police later confirmed that this was actually an aborted suicide attempt by the individual concerned. A subplot developed where he then began to talk of conspiracies that the military, government and UFO researchers Andy Roberts and Dr. David Clarke (amongst others) were all out to destroy his credibility and cover up the real truth. That episode is a whole different story and the musings of the ironically named , Max Burns,can be seen here: www.checktheevidence.co.uk...
The general conclusion on this case is that nothing crashed in the Peak District that night. There were no records of a lost RAF aircraft and all known civilian flights reached their destinations safely according to research by Dr. David Clarke and his report in the Sheffield Star newspaper.



However one thing that Burns may appears right about is that there was a military cover-up. The most likely source of the sonic booms comes from supersonic aircraft. Aircraft that , were the responsibility of the RAF or a foreign power with permission to use UK airspace. If neither of those points is true then the the British MoD are not in control of UK airspace.

At first the RAF and MoD said that they had no involvement in the incident. Then as the pressure grew they changed their story, but would still not admit to having any aircraft in the air at the times the explosions were reported. Why the lies and the secrecy? Was there really a UFO or even an experimental craft being tested that night? There are still the unaccounted sightings of one or more light aircraft that no one has ever traced either according to the official logs.
The incident also happened less than two weeks after the Phoenix Lights incident in the USA.
Coincidence? Perhaps.

The hardest thing to accept is that nothing much really happened to trigger a major and costly rescue exercise in the UK.


Sources:
drdavidclarke.co.uk...
www.militaryairshows.co.uk...
rense.com...
www.checktheevidence.co.uk...
www.abduct.com...
magonia.haaan.com...
www.ufoupdateslist.com...
members.tripod.com...



posted on Aug, 28 2012 @ 07:37 PM
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Whether or not the UFO(s) were extraterrestrial or military is not an issue in my mind.
If it was military, the craft was in all probability inspired by ET/Other intellegence craft.

Good thread, this is an interesting case! Star and flag.
edit on 28-8-2012 by thesearchfortruth because:



posted on Aug, 28 2012 @ 07:44 PM
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Was a UFO defending itself against the fighters


I would have to say no an alien craft could surley fly faster than any missiles fired at it and possibly cloak it self rendering any military intention useless



eventually forcing one down with some kind of exotic weapon? Did the crippled aircraft plunge into the Howden Reservoir or the soft peat moor lands nearby?


No matter how sophisticated you can not cover up a plane crash unless the MIBs are real
Penflash and you forget
Good post though
S=F

Cran
edit on 28-8-2012 by cranspace because: grammer



posted on Aug, 28 2012 @ 08:05 PM
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Burns also claimed that the mysterious gentleman covered in jet fuel, who flagged down a minibus, was in fact a surviving co-pilot of a downed Tornado. Police later confirmed that this was actually an aborted suicide attempt by the individual concerned.

What???? really ???. Then that person must have been admitted to some Hospital in the region as Petrol and Jet fuel, left on the skin long enough damage it quite badly. I believe there are a few police come out since this incident and they are of the opinion that "something actually happened" that night. The MOD, bless 'em, know full well that no aircraft are routinely allowed to go supersonic over Britain's land mass and that, if they did, then there would have to be, at the very least, good cause given for doing so.

That said, this area of the country has a positively rich history of so called "Ghost Planes", including during WW2 several people reporting a re-run of a fatal crash that had happened only days previously.

drdavidclarke.co.uk...

As for David Clarke, I've said this before. the bloke does some sterling and excellent work in the field however, he has begun to veer to believing any old cock and bull the MOD dish out to him as "fact", over the last few years. What's more, Clarke seems to be only too willing to accept the MOD's word on cases that actually have a decent amount of evidence to suggest something happened that was "out of the ordinary", that directly involve the MOD.



posted on Aug, 28 2012 @ 08:07 PM
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Most excellent work! fascinating conjecture.....The BB triangle is a good possibility....
There are fairly accurate reports of two F 15/F18 variants being swallowed whole in mid air by an UFO off puerto Ricos hot spot....that lagoon they talk about.....anyways maybe the tornado was eaten by the UFO...there is precident.
It is hard to imagine losing a tornado over the moors and no evidence .otherwise......



posted on Aug, 28 2012 @ 08:15 PM
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Interesting....

My most memorable (that I recall) UFO encounter was in the UK in 1997, and according to reports, there were a lot of sightings for 300 miles in the US around March 1997....this list is interesting, it is partial though shows there were sightings well before the sceptics fav ''sci fi movies influenced'' sightings.

UFO list



posted on Aug, 28 2012 @ 08:38 PM
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Great thread OP
I live pretty local to this area and had not come across this story, so thanks for the well presented info. I'll star and flag as soon as I work out how. (I'm new here)

My dad was 22 years airforce and, whilst he worked on all sorts of stuff that wasn't reported in the media, if this was a routine event like an illegal sound barrier or normal crash it would be common knowledge amongst the local RAF folk, and as such I'd say someone one would have come forward and cleared up years ago.

My guess it was probably an exercise that went wrong involving an experimental plane, something stealth, or possibly a natural event (like a meteor) that occurred alongside an exercise.

Of course it could have been an alien spaceship, but I tend towards the opinion that anything capable of visiting from light years away would have little problem evading our primitive jets and would be unlikely to take a dive unless in exceptional circumstances.

Great story though, I'm certainly very curious as to what all the witnesses really saw.



posted on Aug, 29 2012 @ 08:21 AM
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reply to post by FireMoon
 


Hi Firemoon,

I condensed this story down to include the basic facts, brief witness reports and a some of the speculative theories on the case.

The paragraph about the gentleman covered in fuel came from a number of sources although some of the details of this are disputed. It was not too clear so here are the details in a bit more depth.





Source : drdavidclarke.co.uk...

A report, recorded on the police log, of a dark-skinned man seen wandering on A57 road at the Ladybower Viaduct, apparently covered in fuel, has been interpreted by Burns as a sighting of the co-pilot of the downed Tornado. This man was spotted by the passengers of a minibus returning to Sheffield at around 11pm, an hour after the reported “aircrash” and the police report reads: “…when crossing the viaduct over the reservoir at Ladybower they were flagged down by a man who was walking towards Sheffield. The man said he needed to get to Sheffield and wanted a lift. The mini bus was full so it was declined. There were no parked vehicles anywhere in the area. The man smelled strongly of diesel. Said to be of eastern extraction, Indian/Pakistani and dressed in dark brown clothing…” The young man who was a passenger in the minibus reported the incident to the police the following morning after hearing the reports about the plane crash on the moors, and told them he thought the man was behaving “suspiciously.” More than a year later, when he was contacted by a UFO investigator, he had begun working for the RAF as a jet engine engineer at RAF Cosford and was able to claim that the “diesel” he smelled that night resembled that of the aviation fuel he was familiar with at air bases. As a result, Max Burns felt he was able to conclude that the man spotted that night was the pilot or co-pilot of the Tornado jet he believes was lost as a result of ET action above the Peak District,.... Unfortunately for this theory, the identity of the man encountered by the mini-bus on the Snake Pass that night was known to both the police and the Peak National Park ranger service. A spokesman for the latter said: “I do remember the incident as it was reported to the Peak Park Ranger service the next morning. I understand it was a failed suicide attempt. It was someone who had driven out to the country and poured petrol or some other inflammable liquid over himself. But he had not gone through with the suicide. It had been reported to South Yorkshire Police who had passed it to Derbyshire to deal with. It’s the sort of thing that happens occasionally in a remote area like this.”




Max Burns story is :



Source : www.abduct.com...

There are thirteen reservoirs in the area concerned and they searched two.They did not even search LadyBower which is just about the largest reservoir In the peaks and happens to run along and under the very bridge where Jonathan Dagenhart encountered the man who was covered in aviation fuel.. After writing a letter to this man regarding his comments in the police log he telephoned me. Here follows the edited verbatim transcript of my telephone conversation.

Taped interview between Max Burns and Jonathan Dagenhart on 2/5/98 Time 11.10 am

I had to call the witness back on another phone so as to set up the recording Equipment the conversation went like this. He consented to being recorded.

.....

Burns So what happened that night? ...

Dagenhart Well, we'd been to Wales, Um on the way home,Um driving down Snake Pass and all of a sudden just coming up to the viaduct this man stepped out in front of us, flagged us down so we stopped, pulled over I was in the front of the minibus with the driver and another passenger so I wound my window down and he started speaking to us he said I've got to get to Sheffield, Sheffield and that's basically all he said.

Burns Did he look in shock?

Dagenhart Yer, he didn't seem to really know which way Sheffield was or what he was doing or anything and the thing is I said at the time when I rang the police he smelled of diesel fuel, well since then I've joined the airforce and I'm now working for the airforce and it wasn't diesel fuel it was aviation fuel that he'd got on him


As I mentioned earlier though Burns believed that David Clarke was part of a conspiracy against him and worked with the UK MoD to cover up what really happened. Make of that what you will.



posted on Aug, 29 2012 @ 09:26 AM
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My family used to own a caravan in that very area. I cannot say for certain what the year was but it was certainly in the late 1990s. My wife and i were woken in the night by a sound we pulled back the curtains to see the whole of the hope valley bathed in a strange lights they almost looked like a chain of searchlights going all the way down the valley pointing straight up into the sky. I tried to video it but digital video cameras were not too great in those days. Never did find out what it was buti have heard of reports of "earthlights" in this area



posted on Aug, 29 2012 @ 10:46 AM
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reply to post by mirageman
 


Reading the various toing and froing between the antagonistic parties one thing did strike me and think it might hold a clue to what is actually going on. Burns is a far far better writer than Clark, his prose style is vastly superior to Clarke's which is stilted and at times narratively confusing. Burns prose also comes across as more coherent in his depiction of events and his time lines all gel neatly with each other, with Clarke's work I have often found myself having to go back and re-read passages because he isn't that good at actual composition.

When this all first came to the the fore, I was minded to give Clarke the benefit of the doubt, having read Burns' own accounts I am re-assessing that stand point I would say this, given the gravity of the accusations against Clarke and his seeming reticence to have the accusations removed and to ever actually deal with them on a point by point by point basis, that he simply can't and that Clarke has taken on someone who is actually far more savvy and intelligent than he is.

The evidence is beginning to mount against Clarke, take the "Solway Firth Spacemen photograph" and the fall out from it with regards to Woomera and the Blues Streak Rocket tests. Clarke now asserts and totally dismisses the Woomera film, that has conveniently gone "missing", as having nothing interesting at all and the "UFOs and possible figures contained therein", as. Nothing more than a technical glitch on the film. Clarke's source for this is "Someone in the MOD told me". You tell me does Clarke's explanation sound credible given what Jenny Randles talks about in tihs clip from first hand sources at the "Office of Records"?

Jenny Randles investigates the "Solway Firth Spaceman"

Then there's the "Boston Stump Incident", Clarke trots out the whole MOD line about it, which completely contradicts what the local news channel were told by an Astronomer and a person from the Met Office about that nights weather conditions and the ability to be able to see the Planet Venus, some 30 degrees above the horizon at 2;00 am in late October.

That doesn't mean I'm buying into Burns' whole story however, I am of the opinion that Clarke is probably being at best "economical with the truth" and that Clarke's real problem with Burns is simply, he's outright jealous of the bloke's ability to write and present his information.

edit on 29-8-2012 by FireMoon because: (no reason given)
edit on 29-8-2012 by FireMoon because: grammar



posted on Aug, 29 2012 @ 11:16 AM
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reply to post by mirageman
 


I remember reading about this case years ago, probably in UFO magazine. Very interesting! I still have a lot of those magazines in binders, I'll have a leaf through them to see if I can find their report.



posted on Aug, 29 2012 @ 01:48 PM
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reply to post by mirageman
 


What a fantastic thread OP, been a while since I have come across one of this high standard on ATS we need more threads like this one on ATS.

S&F.



posted on Aug, 29 2012 @ 02:28 PM
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Well done for bringing us a great thread .....
it seems as if threads like this are rare nowadays.

well done and thanks !!

snoopyuk



posted on Aug, 29 2012 @ 03:30 PM
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reply to post by FireMoon
 


Some interesting points there firemoon.

I do find Clarke's writing style a little awkward myself now you've pointed it out. Whilst researching this case I did actually find myself having to re-read his paragraphs to fully comprehend his point(s). Burns, in comparison has a more natural flow and pace to his text. Which is something we should all bear in mind when preparing future opening posts of this type.

I am not so sure that Clarke is jealous of Burns presentation abilities. Clarke has a cosy position as a lecturer, journalist/writer and was appointed as the 'chosen one' to comment on the MoD UFO File releases during the past decade. He is by nature a sceptic. Whereas Max Burns does appear to have manufactured his own UFO case out of this incident. If anything perhaps Clarke's ego was bruised by the whole affair and he found Burns a difficult character to deal with. Burns was eventually convicted for drugs offences. He claims was a stitched up and holds Clarke (plus another researcher and sceptic Andy Roberts and the MoD) being a party to his conviction. That is all a sub-plot to this case and is probably best left where it stands.

As for the Solway Firth spaceman photo I really don't know enough about it to comment. (That's the "little girl with an astronaut standing behind her" picture behind isn't it?) . The Boston Stump Incident is another case I have little knowledge of but will check out. So forgive my ignorance on those.

Anyway back on topic.

I think Dr. David Clarke and Max Burns both conclude that the MoD have not told the whole truth in this case despite their differences. A costly search and rescue mission was instigated involving the emergency services and RAF rescue teams. This was not a decision taken lightly and the high number of reports of strange aerial phenomenon coming in obviously influenced the actions of those in charge.

It is hard to believe the RAF could lose a Tornado aircraft (maybe personnel too) and keep it out of the media. However the RAF and MoD refused to admit to any activity in the Peak District areas after 9.30pm, despite the numerous witness reports. Max Burns may just have been onto something but ended up looking in the wrong direction for a crashed Tornado. Perhaps the real story was is entirely different?


edit on 29-8-2012 by mirageman because: spelling



posted on Aug, 29 2012 @ 04:33 PM
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reply to post by mirageman
 


It's all quite old news now, regarding the spats between the two people however, this was when Clarke was trying carve out his own little niche and I think Burns has something when he says that Clarke was seeking to bend BUFORA to his will and no-one else was allowed a voice if he , personally, didn't vet them. The revelations about Robert's own drug conviction are very interesting and do show a huge hypocrisy on behalf of Clarke.

As for professional jealousy, well that can be absolutely vicious in every field of life and I have to say, Burn's description of Clarke's personality bares a remarkable to consistency to other's I know who have met the bloke. The key difference for me though lies in the way the two present their evidence. Clarke is long on wind and opinion and short of specific details, ie dates, exact transcripts, whereas, agree with him or not, Burn's presents everything down to exact dates, times, dialogues etc.

Contrast that with Clarke's older work that is very detail heavy and specific against his later work where it seems to become; "I'm David Clarke, I know" and he increasingly relies on "sources inside the MOD told me" and you have to question not only his accuracy rather, his motives as well.

Burns is right when he points out Clarke totally contradicts himself about "losing an aircraft" when, Clarke himself wrote up the whole story of the crash, in the same area, from 1993 where the plane was actually totally lost and never recovered because of the bog it crashed in, leaving only an 8 foot deep pool of water within hours of it's demise to show where it came down.

Given the description of the person "covered in fuel" and given how many foreign pilots train over here. it could be that the following happened. A Tornado found itself in trouble, dropped its' weapon pod(s)/long range fuel tanks and the pilot ordered his co-pilot/trainee to eject and then managed to wrestle back control of the aircraft. Now that would fit the scenario and could easily, if so wished, be "hushed up".

Here's a record of Tornado crashes Tornado Crashes

Note the precedent for only the navigator to eject.,



posted on Aug, 29 2012 @ 04:57 PM
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reply to post by FireMoon
 


Thoughtful stuff and I like your style up:

However I have a long day ahead of me tomorrow so will have to leave this debate until another time.

Thanks again.



posted on Aug, 29 2012 @ 07:51 PM
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Great post

Well researched and very well presented S&F



posted on Aug, 30 2012 @ 09:33 AM
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reply to post by mirageman
 


This is a strange coincidence that happened around the same time in Doncaster UK. My brother is a security guard on a site of an old school we used to go to as kids.

At about 9pm while on the site in his girlfriend's car they both looked up and saw this triangle shaped craft that had a strip light down the sides meeting at the point of the triangle it also had a rotating circle of strange red lights in the centre of the craft they both looked up through the car windscreen and my brother said to his girlfriend "do you see that" and she like yes sure I do.

They watched it fly over the horizon for a couple of minutes. About ten minutes after the sighting it got even stranger as a full blown fire crew turns up gets out walks over to my brother and asks him if he has seen anything "strange" how weird is that?
they take a walk on the fields at the back of the school seemed satisfied after looking round for 10 minutes then get back in their fire engine and off they go. He says it was one weird night he will always remember.

In 1997 there was a spate of UFO sightings all across the country.

Could they of been looking for a crashed Jet or UFO? they somehow knew that the UFO or Jet went over that area that's for sure.
edit on 30/8/12 by Ezappa because: (no reason given)






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