What was God doing before "In the beginning"?

Originally posted by Glass
I know this probably wasn't what you were implying. You probably meant something along the lines of "humans have wild imaginations and just make stuff up."

Wut? I mean that we all have the same organ.

We all have the capacity to willingly suspend our disbelief, so that we may believe whatever makes us content.

We all contemplate death and look for ways to avoid it. An afterlife is the ultimate avoidance of death.

We all want laws that protect us, so we believe in a great protector.

We all want answers. Gaps in understanding are filled with someone who creates things just like we do.

We look out for ourselves 1st, as do all animals. It's the survival instinct. A moral high ground helps us dominate.

We all have the ability to lose our minds the same ways. This is why psychotropic drugs work across the board.

That's some of what I meant.

Originally posted by ChristianJihad
reply to post by coop039

 

He was busy creating dinosaurs, just like humans he screwed up couldn't get them to cooperate and such so had to create a big rock and throw it at the earth. Then he had to figure out a way for the dinasurs to be found by humans in order to make it harder for them to believe he was real. He created an enemy for himself that sometimes goes by the name of Satan then got satan to magically turn the dinosaur remains into stone,. I think this was about the time that satan created the gorgon and got the gorgon to go around all the dinosaur remains staring at them to turn them to stone.

It would appear that the jew/xtian god at least was very busy before creating humans and the human type earth so he would have been quite tired asfter all this, we can see he was totally knackered after his 6 day creating binge warranting a whole day of rest so millions of years dinasour creating needed some searious R&R.

What god got up to after his 7nth day nap puzzles me, he stopped talking to everyone after a while stopped creating, hell he doesn't even take out the trash, one can only conclude that he died . This death of god begs another question, because he was such a twat of a father perhaps he had to obey by his own rules ans ended up in hell. Hm

1...What do you say to all of the artworks by humans which depict dinosaurs before they could have ever had even a remote understanding of their appearance. how about the recent discovery that some dinosaur bones contain actual soft tissue after 70 million years. also, dinosaur is a modern word. however, dragons are mentioned and spoken of as fact throughout time, including in the bible. i dont KNOW anything, but i also dont allow peremptory beliefs to cause me to automatically discount a possibility...

2...God didn't need to "get" satan to turn anything to stone. mainstream science has shown that natural fossilization occurs rapidly....

3...What?!?!?

4...Yes, he ended the creation process, as stated in the bible, and rested....

5...I love you.

Originally posted by MagnumOpus
god was having a serious conflict, way back when there was no one to talk too, and he could not decide if he was an egg or a chicken. It created such an internal conflict that the internal friction caused a Big Bang, and all that is left is a well cooked universe.


Other than that, humans just don't know even if the concept for god applied, or a chicken, or an egg.


Most think that god really doesn't matter as long as everyone considers we all live in each other's care, don't seek to play god or King with wealth or otherwise, and that everyone has a duty for stewarship to maintain a generous equality.


god is a highly overrated concept.



Perhaps the most dangerous issue in the Bible Narrative is most don't know that this god, of the original creation for the Universe theme, isn't the same god that is called Yahweh, the gods of Anu, Enlil, Enki, or Jesus. The first one is theoretically millinea old, and the second is very recent and what the Bible Narratives are about.

That god is a faked up god, the gods of Anu, the gods of the Pantheon, the Elohim, the Creator gods, which the Bible is about, isn't even a proper god concept.


The only think there is a bunch of jealous beings of higher intelligence that needed a few slaves. Abraham, Enoch, Elijah, and a bunch of others bumped into these jealous gods, and started a fine mess with bad concepts.

edit on 29-8-2012 by MagnumOpus because: If anyone every finds the god of the beginning, it will be a first

Your understanding of the bible & biblical history is just plain inaccurate. either that, or intellectually dishonest. your post is very confusing though, so it may be just me...no offense...

reply to post by MagnumOpus


Yes i completely agree, when it comes to animals i am reminded of when Jesus says that the kingdom of heaven is childlike, because a small baby doesnt really have a concept of time, has not yet learned sadness, greed, hatred etc and is completely dependent on his mother (i.e nature) and his father (i.e guidance, role model, provider, protector) jesus says to be like this towards your god, always have faith in the father and the mother, be completely ego-less without hate jealousy andger greed etc and god will give you the things you desire, you worry about being righteous and not about how to get things you need, and god will provide you with those things, no need for any of the above bad emotions/feelings/actions perhaps animals are in a similar state to babies.


When it comes to the last supper, i think its easy to understand that Jesus was saying he wants you to remember when you eat and drink that we are all one, and that if you know the son, you know the father therefore you absorb christ in everything you eat and drink, but really this is impossible because god is already in us at all times, we can however choose to ignore him or accept him. The rituals are mainly just to remind you, they are not sacred in and of themselves, any of them, it is the spirit of holiness that makes them sacred.

the way i see it with false religion is that, in the same way america began as the perfect country (im scottish but i think the constitution is absolutely brilliant and consider it quite close to the best way a country could work) and has fallen to what it is now, the same way that like, when pythagoras effectively discovered music he didnt expect justin bieber, when JLB invented the television he didnt expect geordie shore; Jesus, Moses, Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Muhammad, Krishna etc etc etc definately did NOT expect what has happened to religion, i mean could someone tell me WHERE it says in the bible anything about catholic, protestant, or the need for a pope, or in the koran where does it say to murder in the name of god, or in the vedas or bhagavad gita, where it says we are allowed to put all our waste in the ganges or sell girls as sex slaves in sacrifice to one of the devas? It doesnt.

So in the same way the sinful nature of man seems to corrupt everything good eventually, the people in power have used religion to control us instead of give us true freedom, and the idiot sheep have believed all the rituals and the like will bring them closer to God because likely they are too lazy or stupid to try and understand what any of the holy texts ACTUALLY say.

When i was an atheist i used to think that the whole religion thing was just absolutely absurd, completely like WHY do people do this and that was because no one in the church or at school or anywhere ever tried to explain WHY the truth is the truth, they just parrot it out and tell you to repeat it, and I, being someone who NEEDS a logical reason for everything and anything, began to seek the truth, which led me full circle to God and looking back I was surprised to see that I pretty much had the same views as when i was an atheist, just that, love, be generous, be compassionate, be fair, THATS what the religions say, and that i still actually feel the same way about most religious people as i did before, because what are any of the rituals or anything to do with anything to do with religion without knowing God? theyre completely empty thats what, and about 3% of any of the religious people ive met since becoming a believer actually know The Lord.

The bible says about God: I AM THAT, I AM

The koran says: He is the Hearer, the Knower

And hinduism says: The Lord is the very faculty through which we perceive everything, without him there is nothing.

And buddhism is pretty much an offshoot of pure hinduism, probably i am talking about Advaita Vedanta but the vedas and the pantheon etc are not meant to be a seperate religion from the bhagavad gita and the upanishads

LOVE YOU xd

reply to post by MagnumOpus


You seem to use a lot of words that say nothing, or they constantly repeat them self and become redundant.

For the record, I'm not religious nor do I consider myself a Christian.

You seem to have not really understood my words, as they are an expression of everything in nature.

You see, I'm that which we call spirit mixed with flesh, just as you are. We are two types of beings and one will perish.

Harry Potter is another story altogether but when combined with other stories in can also be seen as truth, yet not the entire truth. Words together tell a great story from which derived as a mere thought.

Matter doesn't overcome that which is in my truer essence and I only know this from the expressions of science.

What we do with matter, is what's important at the end.

Take it or leave it, your individual story is being played out by you and for you.

We all have a story to tell, and the story is recorded by your subconscious mind. When your days are over on Earth you will not have the flesh but what you take with you in regards to matter is what will count. You will see your story played out from the outside looking in and there lies your inner " truth".

Originally posted by gentledissident

Originally posted by Glass
I know this probably wasn't what you were implying. You probably meant something along the lines of "humans have wild imaginations and just make stuff up."

Wut? I mean that we all have the same organ.

We all have the capacity to willingly suspend our disbelief, so that we may believe whatever makes us content.

We all contemplate death and look for ways to avoid it. An afterlife is the ultimate avoidance of death.

We all want laws that protect us, so we believe in a great protector.

We all want answers. Gaps in understanding are filled with someone who creates things just like we do.

We look out for ourselves 1st, as do all animals. It's the survival instinct. A moral high ground helps us dominate.

We all have the ability to lose our minds the same ways. This is why psychotropic drugs work across the board.

That's some of what I meant.

edit on 30-8-2012 by gentledissident because: (no reason given)

This is all great stuff to explain the various religious beliefs.

But I made no mention of an afterlife, a protector God, or a moral high ground. That stuff is dogma that became related to the idea of God through religion.

Dogma is not truth.

Originally posted by MagnumOpus

Originally posted by simplyLOVE

It is said that when we achieve Self-Realization we merge with the divine, fully conscious, another thread asked, what is gods goal? well gods goal is for every living soul that exists to merge in him (Our God is a Consuming fire. Paul. in Hebrews i think) when this happens god himself will achieve Self-Realisation, that is gods goal, to know himself through the medium of the universe, and when this goal is reached, it will be Jesus Christ who is the newly perfected beyond mans conception of perfection, God, whenever someone reaches enlightenment the enlightened atma is added to gods stockpile of conscious consciousness and the son of man will have gods throne and all the power in heaven and we will all have a share equal to him but not quite, because there will be unity, no him or us, but unity.

Well that is really close. god exists only on the basis of: "I think, therefore: I am." (Descartes)
god exists via "The Word" and didn't exist before the word, which is a human incarnation for god.

Animals have no real concept for god, as they don't have the extensive language ability. Yet, they live in the same universe, the same natural order, so how could they be exempt?

Just as Jesus is resurrected in the minds of man, as the body of Christ concept, it is only via this god like ritual of spirit existance via the word being shared.

The Last Supper's theme for this is my blood and this is my body, which you consume, makes you the body of Christ. It is pretty simple concept, but one mostly one not understood by those in religion.


The question then becomes should such ritual be considered reality, or an illusion such as Santa Clauss.

Has that ritual been abused in the sense of departure from the ideals of Jesus, this to alter values.

Did the Jesus concept really seek to have a Chosen People, or equal status for all. Thus, there was never a need of Royals seeking power, control, and money in the real set of Jesus' Values.

Religion taught correctly tells that we all live in each other's care with high emphasis on equality and equity to others.

In place of real religion, it appears what has happened is the Christians use the body of Christ theme to assume they are god, and from there think they are above others and do little for equality, even though the US Constitution wants this, and they promote the downfall of the US via the concept of a King coming to rule over the world. Christians exhibit an arrogance toward anyone insisting on their return to the real values of the Jesus theme, as it insists on equality and not their being more special than anyone else.

Such wayward Christian ideas are dangerous to the US, its Constitution, and the universal ideals for equality and freedom. Is such religious adherence for illusion really good for the world, or should speaking in the simple terms of reality be held as more valuable than imagination concepts of god that depart from reality think.

edit on 30-8-2012 by MagnumOpus because: I think, therefore: I am

Your statement (in place of real religion...) is just plain wrong. The church is a major force for good in this world, and while some Christians are definitely arrogant to the point of sinfulness, most are not and definitely do not see themselves as God....How do Christians promote the downfall of America?? What are you saying are "the real values of Jesus"?....Your point about equality suggests that Christians should ignore the Great Commission and embrace behavior which the Bible clearly says is sin....we are told to embrace and love the person, but hate and distance ourselves from sin. Lastly, this country was founded upon Judeo-Christian values...Read "the books and papers of the presidents"--it is volume after volume of prayers and statements of faith. for many presidents, a prayer was their first act as president. You am....

There is an old saying, one the CIA values: "The truth will set you free." Truth doesn't need the religious imagination and illusions that complicate that which is evident to all into that which is a greater hidden and embellish mystery. Weak minds appear to get into this aversion from reality because they have to have the illusions, like a child needs the illusion for Harry Potter. Those that like truth, value the sciences and don't need to call them religion, science is just the process for seeking the truths and it doesn't need faith in anything, doesn't buy gods that made miracles by human pleedings, and really just thinks all this time wasted on religion and spirit games such as yours, as silly wastes of time that do great harm due to the differences in the faiths and illusions in the mind. Truth needs no illusions of the mind, doesn't need a god concept to promote peace, unity, and common understanding. Truth doesn't need any religion. Ignorance isn't reality. To deny Ignorance is truth. To deny Religion is reality. In the modern world, the concept of god is just a mind game. Religion is the denial of reality. If religion can ever give up the spin games and speak with common sense, it will have reality value, but then cease to be religion in need of faith. If that should occur, all of religion will become the myth, not history, not truth, not science, nor archiology, nor evolution, nor the issues of faked up concepts of gods. When Christians use religion to sidestep reality and so quickly depart into imagination and illusion, can that be called good. When the Catholic priests that used religion to exploit little kids for sex and a sexually derived serotonin boost in the brain, was that any different that the Christian departing reality and truth for a serotonin rush. When the drug abuser so easily uses drugs to get into a drug fanstasy world, with serotonin derived departure from reality, how is that different than the Christian's constant need to depart from simple truths and into nonreality that require some faith

After reading your many posts about what Christians are like, and what Christians think, i am left with the question: what is the basis for all these statements. they are absolutely inaccurate. you are simply stating what you think about Christians, and what you think Christians think, and what you think Christians motivations are, and, well, basically, its all just that...what you think. i know alot of Christians and their intelligence range is the same as you find in secular society. it is your reality, it seems to me, that has departed from truth. as soon as you turn from focusing on honesty to support your debate, and go to caricature making to try and discredit a position, or person, or group that you disagree with, you lose credibility. I will defend to the death your right to say, think, and believe what you want to, just as i would for my right to the same. But your method of debate will never convince anyone, it will only get you a few cheerleaders who already believe the same thing you do...but i think you know all that, and i think you asked a pregnant question to put yourself in the position to make those very distorted (if not intentionally offensive) statements here....not that i'm in any way offended.

What's funny is that you asked a question that mainstream science hates with a passion. their answer would be that there was no beginning, the universe is infinite, we cant understand that concept....etc,etc. different versions of the same answers that have been rejected out of hand here. they don't like the concept of a beginning because it implies something that they hate....

Originally posted by stupid girl

Originally posted by Maroboduus

Originally posted by Sinny
That said, conciousness is infinate. No beggining, no end.

Infinity is a completely meaningless term.

Originally posted by stupid girl
there is is no "before" the beginning. No beginning, no before.

This is also completely meaningless.

edit on 28-8-2012 by Maroboduus because: (no reason given)

Mmmkay.
So, I'm assuming you mean that you don't understand it.

Well then, you probably shouldn't make assumptions. I understand the concept, but it is essentially meaningless.
See: my comments about infinity on previous pages. Same reasoning.

Originally posted by Maroboduus

Originally posted by stupid girl

Originally posted by Maroboduus

Originally posted by Sinny
That said, conciousness is infinate. No beggining, no end.

Infinity is a completely meaningless term.

Originally posted by stupid girl
there is is no "before" the beginning. No beginning, no before.

This is also completely meaningless.

edit on 28-8-2012 by Maroboduus because: (no reason given)

Mmmkay.
So, I'm assuming you mean that you don't understand it.

Well then, you probably shouldn't make assumptions. I understand the concept, but it is essentially meaningless.
See: my comments about infinity on previous pages. Same reasoning.

Alrighty then.
I disagree.

Originally posted by Glass

This is all great stuff to explain the various religious beliefs.

But I made no mention of an afterlife, a protector God, or a moral high ground. That stuff is dogma that became related to the idea of God through religion.

Dogma is not truth.

I wasn't defining what you think. I was showing that your definition of my thought was incorrect.

Originally posted by xGuitarPlayerx

After reading your many posts about what Christians are like, and what Christians think, i am left with the question: what is the basis for all these statements. they are absolutely inaccurate. you are simply stating what you think about Christians, and what you think Christians think, and what you think Christians motivations are, and, well, basically, its all just that...what you think.

One finds your issue couched in what Christians think, not what Jesus taught. There is a difference.

Why do you need a big building with Jesus nailed to a tree in gold, when Jesus ministered to all without a building.

Why do you tithe, when Jesus taught the message without need of money.

Why do you teach the same Yahweh is god message, when it is clear Jesus protested the vengeful god.

Why do you promote Jesus is god, using the same Trinity concept of Nimrod's and Semiramus, when you know that was forged into the John narrative.

Why does your religion pretend to be the body of Christ, and assigen Jesus as god, so your message is you want to play god.


The answer is you didn't speak from what Jesus taught, but from what Christian's self-aggrandization want.

When one looks at the churches of this day, nobody sees the real Jesus nor this humble values and lessons.

Originally posted by xGuitarPlayerx

Your statement (in place of real religion...) is just plain wrong. The church is a major force for good in this world, and while some Christians are definitely arrogant to the point of sinfulness, most are not and definitely do not see themselves as God....How do Christians promote the downfall of America?? What are you saying are "the real values of Jesus"?....Your point about equality suggests that Christians should ignore the Great Commission and embrace behavior which the Bible clearly says is sin....we are told to embrace and love the person, but hate and distance ourselves from sin. Lastly, this country was founded upon Judeo-Christian values...Read "the books and papers of the presidents"--it is volume after volume of prayers and statements of faith. for many presidents, a prayer was their first act as president. You am....

It appears religion was so respected by the Founding Fathers they demanded the country's Govt be separate of religion, because they had enough of the King George and his Church. Plus, most of the founding fathers learned how religion drowned the European and Middle East in blood.

The US was founded on Govt separate of religion, but wanted to open the door to other religions other than King George's control as a new Freedom, but one separate of Govt.

The US Govt was founded to be totally separate of religion. Persons like Jefferson and all the Masonic Fathers of the US didn't buy the story that Jesus was god. Jefferson even made a Bible with all the over the top miracles and such deleted. For all those founding fathers Jesus was just a man.

The way I understand your question to mean is that there was no "before" in existence. "Before" is a creation that was created for this creation that we exist in now. After our death "before" will not exist. It will be "now" -- The Creator does not exist in a sequel of time but only created the law of time to finish the creation of this universe. It would be the same as everlasting. "Everlasting" was not created because everlasting is "now" and therefore "everlasting" can have no "before".

We are creatures of what we are created for. The entire universe of laws were created for each to function as a family of existence. As the creation ceases to exist in this existence, it then passes into another celestial existence which has another family of different laws. That existence is "now" and has no beginning or end. It is "Forever". Through my understanding as a creature of this creation, I have a "before" but to the creator "before" does not exist.

reply to post by coop039

One day, I hope to ask Jesus these and all sorts of other questions! From reading in the four gospels I observe that Jesus loved to dialogue with people, children, even with those who did not understand Him. We may not have the answers now, but one day, when we sit at His feet, what a time of discussion that will be! He will answer all of our questions and we will discover answers and questions we never even imagined!

reply to post by coop039

Before God created the heavens and earth, what was he doing? Was he alone in a vast nothingness? If he created everything who or what created him? is there a race of gods? Do they all have their own planets that they watch over? Just what was he doing? What was before god?

He was not alone, but with another. There is no one equal or above him. Nothing created him, he was always there. Man coins their own attributes unto him. What he was doing, is not spoken down here.

reply to post by MagnumOpus


''Most think that god really doesn't matter as long as everyone considers we all live in each other's care, don't seek to play god or King with wealth or otherwise, and that everyone has a duty for stewarship to maintain a generous equality.

God is a highly overrated concept"

this is a quote from you, I find it funny because the above is what all the religions teach, and is Gods desire and Christs Golden rule.

Let me put it this way, atheists are wrong fro the right reasons, most religious people are right for the wrong reasons.


Its surprising how many atheists are actually christians and how many christians are actually Godless

reply to post by rogerki

It really is disheartening to know people will continue to cling to religion. I'd like to have a planet full of individuals who think along my line. I think we'd get a lot more done. However, religion is such a powerful drug, people will actually take, "Wait until you're dead, then Jesus will explain everything," as a substitute for science and their own religion's shortcomings. Why does this not appear as obviously naive wishful thinking to everyone else?

Most likely the same thing he is doing now
God is outside of time...what we know as time is not something God is bound by
The better question to as is...What will you be doing 102 trillions years from now?
will you be with God or without God?

Originally posted by coop039
Another thread I was reading got me thinking about this.
I am in no way trying to bash Christians, Im just wanting to know what your thoughts are about this.

Before God created the heavens and earth, what was he doing? Was he alone in a vast nothingness? If he created everything who or what created him? is there a race of gods? Do they all have their own planets that they watch over? Just what was he doing? What was before god?

Im sure I will get the "he was in heaven with the angels" response, but Im wondering what was before that. If he created everything (heaven and angels included), What was he up to before all that?

Father was with Mother, planning the creation of above, then came the planning of man with above. Before he split himself to create Mother, he was surmised in his own thoughts.