Arctic sea ice reaches record low, Nasa says, page 1


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Topic started on 27-8-2012 @ 04:54 PM by pause4thought
The Arctic has lost more sea ice this year than at any time since satellite records began in 1979, Nasa says.

Scientists involved in the calculations say it is part of a fundamental change.

What is more, sea ice normally reaches its low point in September so it is thought likely that this year's melt will continue to grow...

...The thickness of the sea ice is also declining, so overall the ice volume has fallen far - although estimates vary about the actual figure.

Joey Comiso, senior research scientist at Nasa's Goddard Space Flight Center, said this year's ice retreat was caused by previous warm years reducing the amount of perennial ice - which is more resistant to melting. It's created a self-reinforcing trend.

"Unlike 2007, temperatures were not unusually warm in the Arctic this summer. [But] we are losing the thick component of the ice cover," he said. "And if you lose [that], the ice in the summer becomes very vulnerable."

Walt Meier, from the National Snow and Ice Data Center that collaborates in the measurements, said: "In the context of what's happened in the last several years and throughout the satellite record, it's an indication that the Arctic sea ice cover is fundamentally changing."

Professor Peter Wadhams, from Cambridge University, told BBC News: "A number of scientists who have actually been working with sea ice measurement had predicted some years ago that the retreat would accelerate and that the summer Arctic would become ice-free by 2015 or 2016.

"I was one of those scientists - and of course bore my share of ridicule for daring to make such an alarmist prediction."

But Prof Wadhams said the prediction was now coming true, and the ice had become so thin that it would inevitably disappear...

..."Implications are serious: the increased open water lowers the average albedo [reflectivity] of the planet, accelerating global warming; and we are also finding the open water causing seabed permafrost to melt, releasing large amounts of methane, a powerful greenhouse gas, to the atmosphere."

Opinions vary on the date of the demise of summer sea ice, but the latest announcement will give support to those who err on the pessimistic side.

A recent paper from Reading University used statistical techniques and computers to estimate that between 5-30% of the recent ice loss was due to Atlantic Multi-decadal Oscillation - a natural climate cycle repeating every 65-80 years. It's been in warm phase since the mid 1970s.

But the rest of the warming, the paper estimates, is caused by human activity - pollution and clearing of forests...


Source article


Here we go again. Another year, more records tumble. The change is real; but to what degree does it reflect the earth's natural cycles? According to this article several human influences have magnified or accelerated even the natural processes that might explain some degree of change.

The release of methane deposits, a significant reduction in the Greenland ice cap, resultant rising water levels, changes in ocean salinity and consequent effects on currents — and thereby on climate: all are being predicted in connexion with the waning Arctic ice cap.

So where do the bounds between natural cycles and man's impact on the environment lie? Are the two becoming increasingly inseparable, perhaps?

And the note of alarm running through the article: is it journalistic hype, or does it reflect a sober assessment of the latest scientific data?


reply posted on 27-8-2012 @ 05:40 PM by pluginkid
reply to post by pause4thought


What's amazing(or absolutely terrifying) is there's still republicans that refuse to believe that global warming is even real. Even more amazing is the fact they can be swayed by big business/oil companies not to admit this fact. That money is more important to these fools then the environment/Mother Earth.
Do these idiots not realize that without our environment,all the money in the world doesn't mean a f*#@ing thing!!
What good does money do ya when half the world is flooded and over half the population is gone?
What good does money do ya when radiation due to extreme high temperatures is so high you can't walk outside??
It's a sad fact that when alternative energy is developed,car and oil companies buy the rights and turn around and shelve it. All for the sake of greed.
50 years from now(if we're still here) we're gonna look back and compare this era of politicians and big business to the mob. (or Satan depending on how you look at it; )
Except it wont just be "conspiracy theorists" but the entire world will be aware of this.

Unfortunately according to many scientists around the world, global warming is much worse then they had predicted over a decade ago. Like uhhhh by a long shot. It may be to late to really do anything about it.
We should have swayed away from fossil fuels many moons ago. Who knows where we will be even five years from now.
Only time will tell.............


reply posted on 27-8-2012 @ 05:44 PM by speculativeoptimist
reply to post by Mianeye


Global warming is only a small part, co2 is the goverments excuse to tax us and make people think they are actually doing something, rediculous

But take that 'small' and apply it to China and India 10 to 20 years from now, and the 'small' may become more significant. It is a 2 fold situation and I don't think the majority of concern should be on our part/activities, but at the same time, we could always improve our processes/polluting and contribute to lessening our affect on the climate.
The other part, just general major change is still a concern and this melting ice will affect the salinization of the oceans thus affecting the currents and weather. It is too bad that science has been infiltrated with special interest groups and money. The actual truth is getting harder to find, but all the records being broken speaks volumes imo.

Peace


reply posted on 27-8-2012 @ 06:00 PM by Mianeye
reply to post by speculativeoptimist
True and i agree, what i mean, is that the blame at the moment is put on co2 alone, and i refuse to believe thats the only reason, that is more a money maker than a problem solver.

Imo the main reason for the wierd weather is what i linked in the document above, but you can't solve that problem, to much have been build and created or destroyed allready.


reply posted on 27-8-2012 @ 07:14 PM by dontlaughthink
reply to post by pause4thought


Well tell them to turn off the mini-nuke power station they have under the ice..


reply posted on 27-8-2012 @ 07:37 PM by speculativeoptimist
reply to post by Mianeye


True and i agree, what i mean, is that the blame at the moment is put on co2 alone, and i refuse to believe thats the only reason, that is more a money maker than a problem solver.

I see, yea they are trying to bank off of the situation and we don't need that.

Imo the main reason for the wierd weather is what i linked in the document above, but you can't solve that problem, to much have been build and created or destroyed allready.

I just wish we could get some honesty form the politicians and unfettered reports from scientists, so that we can at least be aware and prepared for climate catastrophe.


reply posted on 27-8-2012 @ 08:13 PM by Mianeye
reply to post by speculativeoptimist



I just wish we could get some honesty form the politicians and unfettered reports from scientists, so that we can at least be aware and prepared for climate catastrophe.

It's all about the money, so i don't think thats ever going to happen...
They would have to make people live a completely different life, and that means losing money, and thats a no go for them

Plus the majority of the people don't want to change their way of living, they actually don't care or maybe they simply don't understand that they have to if this have to change for something better, it's all to confusing for them.


reply posted on 27-8-2012 @ 09:03 PM by pluginkid
Originally posted by mee30


The Arctic has lost more sea ice this year than at any time since satellite records began in 1979, Nasa says.


Wait... This is "proof" of "global warming"? And it is also proof that man has caused this?

Did everyone skim past the part that says since 1979... This is a nano second in relation to the history of the earth! This would be like measuring your heartbeat for a nano second and then using that data as evidence as to your long term health! You may well be dead according to the "data"... LOL

This proves absolutely nothing! The fact people are jumping on it as proof kinda shows desperation...



Are you really that naive? Screw the satellite records on the Artic, have you stepped outside lately? We're breaking heat records almost on a daily basis. Are you trying to tell me you haven't noticed how the weather is dramatically changing around the world? Are you saying that fossil fuels do not put out gases that are extremely harmful to the environment? That there isn't documented evidence that supports that claim?
Let me guess, you're more qualified then hundreds(if not thousands) of scientists?
Scientists from all around the world that have all came to the same conclusion? What is their agenda? Honestly can you tell me that?
That they give a s#@t about the environment and want to protect it anyway they can??
Ooh those evil bastards. How dare they give a crap about the environment.

Give me a break. The fact that people still argue whether or not "global warming" is real is a joke.(that or they're paid shills trying to throw out disinformation to further distract people from the truth)
You're right, 1979 to the present is "a nano second in relation to the history" but what you're not considering is the fact that we have only been burning fossil fuels a little over a hundred years. If you look at data, you can clearly see the rise in gases. And right around the late 70's it dramatically jumped which makes sense because there were more more people driving cars at that point. There was a much higher demand.

Before you make a statement like that, you may want to do a little bit more research.
Here in a few years when you can't step outside because your face might melt off and the radiation is so bad, maybe you will reflect back to this time when you were in total denial. Maybe you'll wonder "God I wish we would of taken some precautions". "I wish we would of done something".
Wake up man,


reply posted on 28-8-2012 @ 03:30 PM by Hellhound604
reply to post by mikellmikell


You are confusing the issues. Global warming is happening, and there is no denying it. Green taxes, blame the frigging capitalists for that, that just want wants to make money, money, money, instead of thinking of ways to help the survival of humanity, and the other animals that share this planet with us.
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