Can Expansion Theory Really Explain Observed Universe?

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posted on Aug, 29 2012 @ 11:23 AM
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I would like to ask a question about the graphic of the expansion of the universe. Is there a model of cosmology that it applies to or are the lines based on various theories? What theories and what type of data are used? And is the dark energy also called the cosmological constant/vacuum energy density? That is what I have a convoluted hypothesis (without evidence) that I hope the forum will take the time and patience to work me out of.

I do acknowledge what arbitrageur said about momentum vs. gravity, but my hypothesis includes my delusions about a greater universe; a landscape of big bang arenas that play out from the big bang to the formation of matter, galaxy formation, and separation until they intersect and overlap with other nearby arenas, crunches form in the overlap space, and crunches collapse/bang into dense dark wave energy
. It will be fun for us all, lol.
edit on 29-8-2012 by BogieSmiles because: (no reason given)




posted on Aug, 29 2012 @ 11:37 AM
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Reply to post by swan001
 


Just commenting to keep this thread on my page


When I get back from bingo tonight (I know, 22year old male going to bingo, how masculine
the old ladies are great banter!) I will put up a few links for you and others who are interested, apparently it has been observed that rather than an expanding universe, the galaxies are all expanding in one direction, rather than from a central source, which could possibly open doors to the idea that another entire universe's gravitational pull, and our own, are attracting each other.

Not sure if I agree, to be honest any origin is possible, just have to see the evidence for both and judge which one is more probable.

Will he back soon with links


Also look up Tom Campbell - Calgary lectures and watch the Saturday and Sunday lectures (people that have time to spare). His theories on the universe being subjective rather than objective are fascinating, and he talks about the Double Slit Experiment (original and pretty much infallible second version of the experiment) and it's possible explanation of a virtual universe, created by consciousness.


 
Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com
 



posted on Aug, 29 2012 @ 11:39 AM
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reply to post by BogieSmiles
 


"a landscape of big bang arenas that play out from the big bang to the formation of matter, galaxy formation, and separation until they intersect and overlap with other nearby arenas, crunches form in the overlap space, and crunches collapse/bang into dense dark wave energy . It will be fun for us all, lol."

what would stop you from assuming the arena of big bangs,, is not contained in an arena,,, contained in an arena of arenas of big bangs?



posted on Aug, 29 2012 @ 11:41 AM
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reply to post by CLPrime
 


Ah, now that make sense. You're saying that, according to expansion theory, space would stretch in a way that time is not influenced. Now, that would be consistent.



posted on Aug, 29 2012 @ 11:46 AM
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reply to post by MamaJ
 


Please, do not have the impression you are forcing your thoughts on me! I am actually all the time considering all kind of views, I have christians friends also, I consider everything. It's just that physics is a hard, inflexible science. I myself find that regrettable.



posted on Aug, 29 2012 @ 11:47 AM
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reply to post by ImaFungi
 
You mean Turtles all the way down? To reject it "out of pocket" would be the same as rejecting a nicely functioning arena landscape as the highest level of order. Both would be supported by the same lack of evidence (unless Dark Flow counts and I don't know if if does)?



posted on Aug, 29 2012 @ 11:59 AM
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Originally posted by BogieSmiles
reply to post by ImaFungi
 
You mean Turtles all the way down? To reject it "out of pocket" would be the same as rejecting a nicely functioning arena landscape as the highest level of order. Both would be supported by the same lack of evidence (unless Dark Flow counts and I don't know if if does)?



Do you think regardless the largest arenas, would be composed of near infinitesimal constituents like this universe is composed of the quantum?



posted on Aug, 29 2012 @ 12:16 PM
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reply to post by ImaFungi
 
Actually, yes, the very same quanta. And arenas all have essentially the same total energy when they collapse/bang in my scenario. That is because the crunch will accumulate galactic material in the overlap space from the "parent" arenas ... until a critical capacity of the crunch is reached. It is a maximum natural limit to wave energy density, but yikes, is it fair for me to do this here?

My apologies to anyone who feels I am hijacking. Sorry. I just can't help myself. Help me stop, Swan.



posted on Aug, 29 2012 @ 12:24 PM
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Originally posted by BogieSmiles
reply to post by ImaFungi
 
Actually, yes, the very same quanta. And arenas all have essentially the same total energy when they collapse/bang in my scenario. That is because the crunch will accumulate galactic material in the overlap space from the "parent" arenas ... until a critical capacity of the crunch is reached. It is a maximum natural limit to wave energy density, but yikes, is it fair for me to do this here?

My apologies to anyone who feels I am hijacking. Sorry. I just can't help myself. Help me stop, Swan.



and when did the first arena exist? or have they all always existed? or was there once one and now many multiples of arenas? was it quantum all the way down to before the beginning of time? is quantum the truest and most original nature of reality? did the quantum always take up an infinite area? is there an end? or is there only everything always?



posted on Aug, 29 2012 @ 12:37 PM
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Originally posted by ImaFungi

Originally posted by BogieSmiles
reply to post by ImaFungi
 
Actually, yes, the very same quanta. And arenas all have essentially the same total energy when they collapse/bang in my scenario. That is because the crunch will accumulate galactic material in the overlap space from the "parent" arenas ... until a critical capacity of the crunch is reached. It is a maximum natural limit to wave energy density, but yikes, is it fair for me to do this here?

My apologies to anyone who feels I am hijacking. Sorry. I just can't help myself. Help me stop, Swan.



and when did the first arena exist? or have they all always existed? or was there once one and now many multiples of arenas? was it quantum all the way down to before the beginning of time? is quantum the truest and most original nature of reality? did the quantum always take up an infinite area? is there an end? or is there only everything always?
Wow, I love you.

Eternal Inflation vs. an infinite past. Heavy questions and lot of good discussion topics. FYI I often use the terms potentially infinite and eternal, and I don't invoke a singularity. But you can wave off almost everything if you need it to be science, evidential, testable, falsifiable. My interest is in hypotheses that if true would explain things that we don't yet have the answers for. I'll start a thread and you can have fun with me.
edit on 29-8-2012 by BogieSmiles because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 29 2012 @ 12:56 PM
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reply to post by BogieSmiles
 


alrighty sounds good..,,. you know you can go to any thread and comment a few lines that have to do with the topic to get your 20 posts to start your thread,..., or we can just chat back and forth 9 more times about the supposed expansion theory of the observable universe..


what do you think of the big bang theory?

what do you think of redshift?

what do you think of the possibility of space itself expanding, in effect causing an acceleration in expansion of the visible universe?

in your other arenas,, do you think the quantum realm always produces atoms and then ordered universes similar to the one we inhabit and are made of?



posted on Aug, 29 2012 @ 01:10 PM
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Originally posted by ImaFungi
reply to post by BogieSmiles
 


alrighty sounds good..,,. you know you can go to any thread and comment a few lines that have to do with the topic to get your 20 posts to start your thread,..., or we can just chat back and forth 9 more times about the supposed expansion theory of the observable universe..


what do you think of the big bang theory?
It's a good story. I use parts of it that are obvious and that closely correspond to actual observation.


what do you think of redshift?
I love the raw redshift data. It is, along with the CMB, among my favorite observations and data.


what do you think of the possibility of space itself expanding, in effect causing an acceleration in expansion of the visible universe?
I don't like it and here is a good one, I don't invoke theory that requires curving or stretching of space or spacetime, but in its place a have my own delusions about wave energy density in a foundational medium (aether if you like)

in your other arenas,, do you think the quantum realm always produces atoms and then ordered universes similar to the one we inhabit and are made of?
That's my bet because the laws of physics are the same everywhere. Of course, as a layman, I do enjoy invoking new physics now and then. That is one advantage I have over professionals, lol.



posted on Aug, 29 2012 @ 01:25 PM
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reply to post by BogieSmiles
 


"I don't like it and here is a good one, I don't invoke theory that requires curving or stretching of space or spacetime, but in its place a have my own delusions about wave energy density in a foundational medium (aether if you like) "

ok so the fundamental property of "existence" is an aether/medium of space,, which is not only closely related to all energy/matter but is what births consolidated and macro expressions of energy/ matter itself? so energy/matter in any form it can ever take on is a form and function of the potentially infinite, potentially eternal aether?

can you elaborate on your delusions about wave energy density?



posted on Aug, 29 2012 @ 01:41 PM
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Originally posted by ImaFungi
reply to post by BogieSmiles
 


"I don't like it and here is a good one, I don't invoke theory that requires curving or stretching of space or spacetime, but in its place a have my own delusions about wave energy density in a foundational medium (aether if you like) "

ok so the fundamental property of "existence" is an aether/medium of space,, which is not only closely related to all energy/matter but is what births consolidated and macro expressions of energy/ matter itself? so energy/matter in any form it can ever take on is a form and function of the potentially infinite, potentially eternal aether?

can you elaborate on your delusions about wave energy density?
You've been reading my stuff!

They only allow 5000 characters per post, lol. But that is a good thing. You can imagine though that anything that can be accomplished by curved spacetime would have to be accomplished by wave energy density. Take Eddington's measurement (is he the guy?) of the positions of stars as measured during an eclipse. I have a wave energy density explanation for the effect. I can't quantify it but I'm a layman so I can hypothesize that light would slow down when passing close to mass because the wave energy density surrounding mass is higher and diminishes with distance.



posted on Aug, 29 2012 @ 02:20 PM
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reply to post by swan001
 


That's right. Either time is stretching or space is stretching, depending on how you want to look at it...but not both. It's a subtlety that even I wasn't aware of until yesterday.



posted on Aug, 29 2012 @ 02:35 PM
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Originally posted by CLPrime
reply to post by swan001
 


That's right. Either time is stretching or space is stretching, depending on how you want to look at it...but not both. It's a subtlety that even I wasn't aware of until yesterday.
I think that Swan001 has boiled it down to the essential question. I vote for time "stretching" but I would phrase it that the measurement of time is stretching, i.e. if space doesn't curve or warp, then clocks have to slow down or speed up under the same conditions that cause space to curve or stretch.
edit on 29-8-2012 by BogieSmiles because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 29 2012 @ 04:03 PM
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reply to post by BogieSmiles
 


How does time stretch? or what does time stretching mean? could you give an example?
edit on 29-8-2012 by ImaFungi because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 29 2012 @ 04:17 PM
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Originally posted by ImaFungi
reply to post by BogieSmiles
 


How does time stretch? or what does time stretching mean? could you give an example?
edit on 29-8-2012 by ImaFungi because: (no reason given)
It is the measurement of time that changes as the energy density of the environment hosting the clock changes. Space is not empty in my delusions, and all space contains wave energy. Particles are composed of it in standing wave patterns, objects like clocks are composed of it because they are composed of particles, and the wave energy density surrounding objects contains the inflowing and out flowing components of the standing wave patterns that establish the presence of particles. The closer a clock is to a gravitational source the slower it runs. Move away from a gravitational source and the clock speeds up. The change in the rate that the clock measures time is due to the change in the wave energy density of the environment, I hypothesize.



posted on Aug, 29 2012 @ 06:42 PM
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Originally posted by CLPrime
reply to post by swan001
 


That's right. Either time is stretching or space is stretching, depending on how you want to look at it...but not both. It's a subtlety that even I wasn't aware of until yesterday.


I wasn't aware of it neither. How come it does? What happened yesterday.
edit on 29-8-2012 by swan001 because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 29 2012 @ 06:55 PM
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reply to post by swan001
 


You asked the question yesterday.

This has a good explanation of what happens during metric expansion: Universal Misconceptions #1: The expansion of time.
edit on 29-8-2012 by CLPrime because: (no reason given)





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