Pastor who "kicked" Holy Spirit into woman banned from UK! Religious discrimination?

US-based Christian pastor Todd Bentley has been refused entry into the UK.
www.guardian.co.uk...

Many articles refer to his controversial methods of "healing" and "Holy Spirit baptisms", which he himself admits and recognizes as impromptu reactions to messages from God's "Holy Ghost".

Personally I think there's no difference to Pastor Bentley's methods and other forms of faith healing, which can prove just as harmful.

The official reason is that Bentley (apparently Canadian born) has a criminal history.

I think it's a demonstration of atheist rule from the UK, who think that kicking people in the face, punching them and slamming their limbs on the floor cannot be a spiritual experience.
Who says it can't?

It's also presumptuous to say that a violent, money-grabbing thug cannot be a good preacher.
If one starts questioning religious leaders along those lines it's a slippery slope to atheism.

If people are willing to follow Pastor Bentley it's their right, and the UK government should not intervene, and allow a special pass for religious leaders of all denominations, no matter what their scandals or strange behavior by willing devotees.

Pastor Todd Bentley describes his methods of God-ordained healing and baptisms.

But so what?
Who is without violence and controversial harm in religion?
Let them cast the first stone.

Originally posted by halfoldman
US-based Christian pastor Todd Bentley has been refused entry into the UK.
www.guardian.co.uk...

Many articles refer to his controversial methods of "healing" and "Holy Spirit baptisms", which he himself admits and recognizes as impromptu reactions to messages from God's "Holy Ghost".

Personally I think there's no difference to Pastor Bentley's methods and other forms of faith healing, which can prove just as harmful.

The official reason is that Bentley (apparently Canadian born) has a criminal history.

I think it's a demonstration of atheist rule from the UK, who think that kicking people in the face, punching them and slamming their limbs on the floor can not be a spiritual experience.

It's also presumptuous to say that a violent, money-grabbing thug cannot be a good preacher.
If one starts questioning religious leaders along those lines it's a slippery slope to atheism.

If people are willing to follow Pastor Bentley it's their right, and the UK government should not intervene, and allow a special pass for religious leaders of all denominations, no matter what their scandals or strange behavior by willing devotees.

edit on 24-8-2012 by halfoldman because: (no reason given)

To me he sounds like a dangerous nutt job who assults people in the name of God, this would be another reason as to why he is refussed entry, as well as his past criminal record.

Vicars/preists/rabbis/what not are welcome in the UK, we have many church's and mosques and everything all over the country, but we don't want a mad man beating up his visitors into this country. [snip] that guy,lol

reply to post by halfoldman


This is the funniest thing I've seen today People actualy buy into this? I sincerely hope...OUCH!! I think I cracked a rib laughing. Better go see the healer.

reply to post by halfoldman

‘And I’m thinking why is the power of God not moving? And He said, “Because you haven’t kicked that woman in the face.”

‘And there is this older lady worshipping right in front of the platform and the Holy Spirit spoke to me. The gift of faith comes on me. He said, “Kick her in the face with your biker boot.” I inched closer and I went bam! And just as my boot made contact with her nose, she fell under the power of God.’

Best...church...ever.

If I were subject to this kind of "healing", I'd pretend to be perfectly healthy too.

reply to post by halfoldman


Is this guy for real?

His planned visit had sparked alarm among those critical of his controversial style of preaching, which he has said often involves "curing" people of diseases, including cancer, by means of physical force. In various videos posted online, the self-styled "preacher with the tattoos" claims he once choked a man to health; in one he claims he banged a woman's legs "up and down on the platform like a baseball bat" until she was miraculously healed. In one typical claim, he is filmed telling an audience: "And the Holy Spirit spoke to me, the gift of faith came on me. He said, 'kick her in the face with your biker boot'. I inched closer and I went like this – bam! And just as my boot made contact with her nose, she fell under the power of God."

He sounds more like a comedian than a pastor to me. Chuckled whole way through that article and that video.

Anyway, I believe he's been denied entry due to his chequered past rather than his brand of preaching. As you mentioned in your OP, he has a criminal history, and that alone would've made things hard for him even without this odd gig, so I don't see the grounds for your dispute? It's not like the sole reason they denied him entry is because he's choking people to health. I agree, people should have the right to follow this man if they so choose, but the question is whether he should have the right to enter the country based on his personal history?

reply to post by namine

Yes, he's for real, for more see:

Bentley was criticized in mainstream media and on internet blogs for occasional violence done to participants,[23][24][25] in the tradition of Smith Wigglesworth.[26][27] Todd Bentley was known to forcefully kick, hit, smack or knock over participants. In one incident, a man was knocked over and lost a tooth. In another, an elderly woman was intentionally kicked in the face. Bentley held that the Holy Spirit led him to such actions,[24][25] saying that those incidents were taken out of context and adding that miracles were happening simultaneously.[23]

en.wikipedia.org...

I think this video sums it up nicely

reply to post by halfoldman


That's beyond ridiculous, but can't deny I was entertained.

I still think it's all for show. Another silly brand of reality TV.

There are far too many lunatics like this in Christianity..

Makes sense that Jesus said "many have called on my name, but they do not know me".

If this guy actually has a criminal record, then they have every right to refuse his entry into the UK. That is not a conspiracy, that is the law. Maybe it is to do with his methods of preaching, but maybe he's just playing the victimisation card, which is what these idiots tend to do when they don't get their own way.

reply to post by namine

Why is it beyond ridiculous?

Physical mortification is a long-established form of religious worship.

For example: Physical mortification in Catholicism:
en.wikipedia.org...

reply to post by halfoldman


Well, have you seen the kind of things he claims he's capable of? Curing cancer? Rising people from the dead? Allowing the blind to grow new eyeballs? All with kicks, punches, and chokes? Don't you think if even one of these claims was legitimately proven, the whole world would know about him?

His antics are okay for harmless (or not so harmless) entertainment, but beyond that I don't see any reason to take him at his word.

Are you winding me up?

reply to post by namine

No, but in context are any of his claims better than those of other religious and spiritual charlatans?
That's my point.

Are they better than those of the Catholic Church?
Is it better than telling a wife with an HIV-positive husband not to use a condom and to rather die a torturous death as a martyr?
Are they better or worse than Benny Hinn or other faith healers?

Many churches have burnt people alive, including Catholicism or forms of Protestantism.

Many faith-healings have harmful after-effects when the natural endorphins wear off.

Then we also see mass mutilation, even of children in some religions, and beating kids (and sometimes women) into the fold is acceptable to almost all.

What about the psychological violence done to people who waste their cash on those who "talk to the dead"?

So on what religious basis does one condemn this?
Are you having me on and telling me this is different or unique in religious history?
All religion is built on physical and psychological violence, and it's unfair to discriminate against one religious group on that basis.

reply to post by halfoldman


To be honest, I have more than my fair share of doubts about religion on the whole, and part of the reason is for the examples you pointed out in your post. I'm not looking to compare which claims are "better" than others -- I consider Bentley's claims on their own, which helps minimize my bias towards other things related to religion. Without even bringing Christianity into it, he claims he can do things, which for all intensive purposes, he hasn't proven he's capable of. I'm not discriminating against or dismissing any religion -- only this particular man's claims. If people wish to believe in his practice, it's on them. Personally, I find him and his claims funny at best, ridiculous at worse.

Halfoldman, you are totally right.

If people wish to participate in that, that is their right, as long as the crazy guy is willing to offer it.

As a believer in Jesus Christ, I understand that what he is doing is wrong. I understand those people are wrong.

He is selling because of the endorphins released from the damaged. It makes people feel more aware. Unfortunately, because of this, they readily accept a spirit into them that is not good, but evil.

However, this discussion is not about whether this man is a true believer in the Lord Jesus Christ.

This discussion is about religious freedom. Well, it's actually about freedom in general.

If someone wants to be punched or kicked in the face, then let them have it. Why should the law prohibit what people desire for themselves?

But then there is another side of this coin. I don't think it is too much to ask that the government creates a deterrent law against self-abusing stupidity on account of the fact that people have kids and those kids ARE victimized because of the rash actions of masochistic people.

So, I understand the need for a deterrent law (not that I agree with a state taking kids from a parent based on such loose interpretation of laws and ordinances), but at the same time, as far as the religious experience is concerned..

If they want it, let them have it. That's how God operates as well. What people wish for is what they get. It's just that most people have no clue the danger they wish upon themselves.

As well, there is something very dangerous going on here for the gentleman claiming he is kicking the Holy Spirit into peoples' faces; because if he is lying, then he is condemned. Blaspheming the Holy Spirit is unforgivable.

Let's hope that he is completely ignorant of what he is doing and has done.

reply to post by TarzanBeta

Thanks for that, and I can imagine that such open violence is wrong to many sincere faithful people.

But then shouldn't a "culture war" be waged by religious people on religious abuses, rather than a "culture war" on aspects of secular society?

Shouldn't religious politics be all about removing such abuses, admitting them and repenting from them?

Originally posted by halfoldman
kicking people in the face, punching them and slamming their limbs on the floor

People following such a person actually DO deserve to be punched and kicked, but do that to
ANY of my loved ones, i will introduce the glory of GOD straight to your goolies,
and give praise while i grind them down with the heel of my boot.

I'm a yank, but I know the UK has no Bill of Rights. Maybe one of our Brit posters can elaborate. Personally, I wish we could do this sort of think in the U.S. Oh, were it that easy for us to get rid of cranks. It might surprise many non-Americans here, but there is a high percentage of folks who believe such voodoo is not only possible, but normal. How's that for scary?