Originally posted by daskakik
I was just pointing out why the masons backed off.

Right, because you would know. Got it.

Glad you are here to point out my obvious lack in reading comprehension.

Originally posted by daskakik
Great that you got something out of it. I believe you still would have gotten the same thing if he had left out the background story which sounded iffy and took forever to get out.

Dude! NN is beyond brilliant!

I just reread his First thread and boy talk about a journey great game, masterfully played.

First the hook, then the line, then that hook that just sunk right in... silence for a moment, then everyone just went ape@#$% totally destroying the thread. All those people looked, the denial the war they are so unaware of. it was almost as revealing as what he said.

To think some one would stick their neck out for a chance for those who would hear it's just truly a most loving thing to do.

Slander, ridicule or discredit cannot shadow what he did in the eyes of some, friend.

Originally posted by daskakik
Thanks for the desire to guide but I passed that stage a while back.

No desire to guide the unwilling, as I said I am not skilled.

The Rat.

Originally posted by TucoTheRat
heh, you are funny. Stepping o the wrong toes is dangerous even when your walking your doggy. Stepping on the wrong toes and knowing it is sticking your neck out.

Who's toes did he actually step on? I have seen people post things similar to what he posted and they are still around and I have yet to hear any of them claim that someone came after them in any way.

Look I know you have your issues with NN and his great work but subjectively popping up every 15th episode yelling exterminate! exterminate! exterminate! like a Dalek fighting the Doc'ta makes no sense unless you give a little background as to why you have such issues.

Not sure what you mean by "subjectively" popping up.

I have already posted the issues. But to recap, he embellished, his over-dramatic delivery was lame and his "truth" is based on the bible with new age catchphrases thrown in, maybe new to you but nothing new, unique or special about it.

Originally posted by daskakik

Originally posted by TucoTheRat
heh, you are funny. Stepping o the wrong toes is dangerous even when your walking your doggy. Stepping on the wrong toes and knowing it is sticking your neck out.

Who's toes did he actually step on? I have seen people post things similar to what he posted and they are still around and I have yet to hear any of them claim that someone came after them in any way.

Look I know you have your issues with NN and his great work but subjectively popping up every 15th episode yelling exterminate! exterminate! exterminate! like a Dalek fighting the Doc'ta makes no sense unless you give a little background as to why you have such issues.

Not sure what you mean by "subjectively" popping up.

I have already posted the issues. But to recap, he embellished, his over-dramatic delivery was lame and his "truth" is based on the bible with new age catchphrases thrown in, maybe new to you but nothing new, unique or special about it.

Every single post between you and myself has been a battle based on pure subjectivity. You mind vs mine. The fact that we are not U2Uing each other shows the will for other minds to choose between the subjective. I admit I am stubborn. But only to the point to where it becomes useless.

This is a simple example of what happens in everyday life. This what is happening between you and me.

What NN did, in my opinion is help us see our mind and the war that rages in our own mind. If one can be considered to be 'asleep" where would this slumber take place?

I now see it takes place in the mind, sleep happens because we choose to let the war rage while we hid in a safe place from what I have understood. But that safe place will soon be shattered and before that happens it is best for me to wake the hell up in the small chance I keep my sanity when the poop hits the fan.

You are saying that NN could have popped in posted God loves you and people would have heard and understood that, understood their minds role in what we see as reality and take what every one on ATS is drooling over the poop hitting the fan on the chin like big boys and girls. Subjective and to me highly doubtful.

Love, our human ability to love what ever it is we consider as God and why he would put us through this is a mental frequency produced in the mind. It will help you out there are those who think differently or perhaps just don't care and just want the job over with. What ever it is people consider god to be they must see that God is everything in order to be able to find that fervency in their mind to stay afloat.

In the end of NN first post he laid it all out in a way that you had to see, because you were stung out until you looked.

Some looked and eminently fought against it, almost lost it, some agreed and wanted to know why. Others held out and made their best play, it was the best play because they let it play out in their minds. And now have a chance to reach that frequency to say afloat.

The mind friend, why it wants to know and the love that will help you stay afloat. Much more than fits in a message.

But again this is subjective, is it not?

The Rat.

Originally posted by TucoTheRat
But what does surprise me is the context of your post. It makes no sense.

So you know man is asleep and you know your knowledge yet you down play or call old news knowledge that some one wants to share with others in the hope that wake up. Why would you do that?

Honestly, because of personal experience, I believe that someone who is truly awake realizes that there is no god. At least not in the biblical sense. Mixing ideologies of enlightenment with christianity, to make christians feel safe, is a step away from truth, not towards it.

I have already been at the stage where I tried to force experiences to fit my christian beliefs. I later came to realize that it was a mistake.

Of course this is also subjective and only my opinion, but on this topic, pretty much everything is. Even NN's part.

I've never read that book you quoted and never would. does not mean i would call it old news or downplay it, it's juts not for me and so I have not read it.

How would you know it's not for you if you don't at least read a bit. To be honest they are not really for me either. I just used it as an example that touches on the "mind" aspect that you pointed out in your post.

Originally posted by TucoTheRat


What NN did, in my opinion is help us see our mind and the war that rages in our own mind. If one can be considered to be 'asleep" where would this slumber take place?

In the end of NN first post he laid it all out in a way that you had to see, because you were stung out until you lookedThe Rat.

Hi TTR, would you post the details? I missed the initial post and have not been able to find it. Thanks

Originally posted by TucoTheRat
I know what you mean. but that is why love is important you see. Everything and nothing exist at the same time. It's a simple choice. you can choose to die or you can choose to live on. You can choose to be a happy corporate consumer or you can choose to see the evil corporation. Both are real and both are nothing.

You see this is what I did not understand about the mind, my mind your mind. We don't need to hurt ourselves we can choose to be love.

This is why I think this brand of enlightenment is not the real deal. Love and seeing or not seeing evil corporations are not part of real enlightenment.

if some thing in the universe and beyond both loves us and hates us at the same time and is real and not real at the same time, i don't mean the literal biblical God rather a force or being, why not choose to see the love, the real.

You still presented it as an "if". That force does exist but why do you associate it with love?

It's like carl jung or Freud the choice is yours ours both are correct and incorrect at the same time but in your mind you choose which one is real and which one is incorrect.

Se we are not animals, we are different because although we want to survive we have the mind and in this mind we can see far beyond any animal purpose.

Let me put it to you this way friend I choose to love, and I know a love in this universe and beyond time and space loves me and this love that I have loves you as well. I try to love all things now and i with ease truly tell you that I love you.

When you say that you know, I assume you are talking about something you feel, correct?

To me enlightenment isn't about words and feelings but about first hand experiences outside of reality.

The choice is yours friend. your mind is your Choice but you must look in your mind to find what you seek.

We don't have the same interpretation of what the war within man's mind is.

Originally posted by teapot

Originally posted by TucoTheRat


What NN did, in my opinion is help us see our mind and the war that rages in our own mind. If one can be considered to be 'asleep" where would this slumber take place?

In the end of NN first post he laid it all out in a way that you had to see, because you were stung out until you lookedThe Rat.

Hi TTR, would you post the details? I missed the initial post and have not been able to find it. Thanks .

the are things you have to come up with on your own. I meant his first thread.

The Rat.

Originally posted by daskakik
This is why I think this brand of enlightenment is not the real deal. Love and seeing or not seeing evil corporations are not part of real enlightenment.

Real enlightenment is real to you and not to another minds. Some people can find real enlightenment in the cartoon movie "How to Train Your Dragon" while others see Luciferian brain washing.

Originally posted by daskakik
You still presented it as an "if". That force does exist but why do you associate it with love?

If fits does and does not, for the reader. Because it is both at the same time, I could choose both or love neither or hate or indifference or anything or everything. one helps me get out of bed in the morning.

Originally posted by daskakik
When you say that you know, I assume you are talking about something you feel, correct? To me enlightenment isn't about words and feelings but about first hand experiences outside of reality.

No friend I know. Not even as a child did I doubt. Before Sunday school I knew. Since then I have been trying to understand. But the thing is everyone knows I think, they just get stuck and asleep. I don't presume to be awake but just not as asleep as I was. asleep or awake i think has nothing to with knowing.

To me things like love and hate are a feeling in the body represented by a frequency in the mind. a lot of things even noise can make the brain feel a certain way than the way you feel can affect the mind but once you see who is the car and who is the driver the mind gains more power over the body and it's brain. I think at least.

Like the Dog Whisperer. Dogs immediately submit to him because in his mind he projects that he is their master and the dog the animal. Dogs feel this frequency from him and play their role as dog. But they dog does not even know what the hell his going on in the hands of it's owner who projects a "your my little scruffly puffly cutie wooty" frequency to the dog which makes the dog just flip out not knowing what he is.

humans, my self included, don't even have mastery over our own mind and let the body run the show which is like letting a your dog run the house. When that happens people who do have mastery and rule with their mind can control humans like the dog whisperer.

Originally posted by daskakik
We don't have the same interpretation of what the war within man's mind is.

I can see that. So tell me your reality, if there is such a thing.

The Rat.

Originally posted by TucoTheRat
Real enlightenment is real to you and not to another minds. Some people can find real enlightenment in the cartoon movie "How to Train Your Dragon" while others see Luciferian brain washing.

Sorry but that is personal interpretation of this world. Real enlightenment is personal observation of reality (which is not limited to this world).

No friend I know. Not even as a child did I doubt. Before Sunday school I knew. Since then I have been trying to understand. But the thing is everyone knows I think, they just get stuck and asleep. I don't presume to be awake but just not as asleep as I was. asleep or awake i think has nothing to with knowing.

Actually it does, but thinking that it doesn't explains why you believe as you do.

Like the Dog Whisperer. Dogs immediately submit to him because in his mind he projects that he is their master and the dog the animal. Dogs feel this frequency from him and play their role as dog. But they dog does not even know what the hell his going on in the hands of it's owner who projects a "your my little scruffly puffly cutie wooty" frequency to the dog which makes the dog just flip out not knowing what he is.

This is also wrong. He uses the dogs established order to assume the role of pack leader. This, by the way, is a power move not something accomplished through love.

Love, or what they think expresses love, is what the owners try and it usually backfires.

I can see that. So tell me your reality, if there is such a thing.

Can't be done, it has to be experienced.

Originally posted by daskakik
Sorry that is personal interpretation of reality. Real enlightenment is the observation of reality (which is not limited to this dimension).

LOL well at least we have stopped saying to each his own. This is more useful.

So you are saying you observe reality, with out interpreting reality. yet you have interpreted my interpretation of what I consider reality which is there is no reality but that which you interpret.

You are stating there is a real beyond that which you create and is being observed and I am saying there is only that reality which you create by observation. Any thing beyond observation is not real which is why real and not real are at the same time. It's a matter of choice in the mind.

But what I don't understand is if you are an observer observing why are you interpreting what I say as an interpretation as if it is an argument against what enlightenment truly is?

This is what does not make sense to me?

In this conversation you will need to not interpret what i'm saying for your real to hold any wait against mine. What you would have to do is Observe like everyone else that is not posting but reading. But even when just observing you would not be able to think about it, It would be like listening to a Chinese radio talk show and not knowing Chinese. Or listening to music and feel nothing. because anything else is interpretation of what enlightenment is.

I understand what your saying and it makes sense in some part of my mind but that fact that you can say it does not fit in this dimension and breaks down. So you are correct but not when it comes to reality which is not real lol.

But again reality is very real in the minds of many. Even if they are just observing else where.

Originally posted by daskakik
Actually it does, but thinking that it doesn't explains why you believe as you do.

Well i am trying to explain myself.

Originally posted by daskakik
This is also wrong. He uses the dogs established order to assume the role of pack leader. This, by the way, is a power move not something accomplished through love. Love, or what they think expresses love, is what the owners try and it usually backfires.

It's not just that, he does use the way dogs are programmed by nature but dogs feel his frequency as well which is why he is given as pack leader.

Yes sometimes a balance is needed.

but once the dog knows who is pack leader they love the pack leader.

The Rat.

Originally posted by TucoTheRat
This is what does not make sense to me?

I edited my original post for clarity. I hope.

Well i am trying to explain myself.

I thought we were trying to explain what knowledge is.

It's not just that, he does use the way dogs are programmed by nature but dogs feel his frequency as well which is why he is given as pack leader.

Without the order he would have nothing, even if he had frequency coming out of every pore.

but once the dog knows who is pack leader they love the pack leader.

Wouldn't they love him if he wasn't pack leader?

Originally posted by daskakik
I edited my original post for clarity. I hope.

What did not make sense still dos not, sorry. changing reality with world and dimension with world, in my mind changes nothing.

You think worlds, realities and decisions are different, I say this because apparently you feel that by changing the worlds you change what is said. Or perhaps you elude that by changing them you dumb it down for me.

But if you want to clarify you either have to make me understand your world or speak in mine.

perhaps I am incapable or perhaps the reason you can't clarify is because you lack clarity in what your trying to say. Either would not make sense to me.

Originally posted by daskakik
I thought we were trying to explain what knowledge is.

I'm trying to explain something I see, by do so in just words I try to make myself understood as to what I see, have seen what others may not see.

knowledge represents something but in it'self it is just a word. But that word can ether represent what is in the Websters English dictionary or a whole never ending sea of what others see.

I don't know if your paying off my worlds or what, but I hope you understand that I'm trying to make myself understood to you and anyone who wishes to read. Whether i'm an idiot or lack true enlightening is of no consequence to me as some things are out of my hands, but I am trying to understand what you are trying to say and why you say it while making myself understood.

Originally posted by daskakik
Without the order he would have nothing, even if he had frequency coming out of every pore.

But the order is there. There is an order to every living thing, In everything that is dead, the golden ratio, the moons, the planets, the sun, the galaxy, the universe, dimensions everything to nothing has an order to it even chaos.

And just like the dog whisperer uses that order he must knows how he must be at a mental frequency to know how and it was his love for dogs that got him there to that knowledge and others peoples love and his love to create an environment for the spreading of that knowledge and when people learn of the knowledge they work on achieving that frequency of pack leader.

And just like there is love there is hate and it uses order and has it's knowledge and has it's frequencies.

Both work together to know each other. What the hell is a Jedi with out the Sith? But only in movies does a Sith know he is a bad guy and a Jedi the good guy but in each their minds they are the good guys.

So what is good, what is bad, up down, left right, but something that is both are at the same time. some times balance is needed.

Originally posted by daskakik
Wouldn't they love him if he wasn't pack leader?

To hump his leg maybe. Dog have their own order really. maybe it is a bad comparison.

The Rat.

Originally posted by TucoTheRat
But if you want to clarify you either have to make me understand your world or speak in mine.

Not trying to dumb it down, I just wrote it wrong the first time.

The world is this dimension. Not the subjective world that everyone experiences individually, but the one that says that if you go to Liberty Island, your going to see a copper statue of a lady holding a torch. Whether you see an american icon or Illuminati codes in it, that's your personal interpretation.

Reality includes this world and other places. You can only experience them by going there.

I hope you understand that I'm trying to make myself understood to you and anyone who wishes to read. Whether i'm an idiot or lack true enlightening is of no consequence to me as some things are out of my hands, but I am trying to understand what you are trying to say and why you say it while making myself understood.

Fair enough but whether you are an idiot or lack true enlightening is important to the reader who is seeking what NN promised. You claim to have understood his message so you must be awake (synonym of enlightened).

What I am saying is that awake/enlightened is often used for mundane happenings like positive changes of mood, finding faith or realizing something about the world that you didn't know.

That was the let down.

And just like the dog whisperer uses that order he must knows how he must be at a mental frequency to know how and it was his love for dogs that got him there to that knowledge and others peoples love and his love to create an environment for the spreading of that knowledge and when people learn of the knowledge they work on achieving that frequency of pack leader.

Your putting words in the man's mouth.