a motion introduced to place a ban on cigarette sales to anyone born after the year 2000?

reply to post by Raist


Raist,

You bring up excellent points that I think people seem to quickly forget when they have an emotional motivation behind something.

I, Like you, Believe when someone tries to dictate the bahavior/beliefs of another person. Trouble ensues.... It's very simple, yet so complex..

I'm a smoker, and yes, I don't want my child to smoke. In fact, I don't want ANYONE to smoke. It's a BAD HABIT. BUT, When you try to regulate a persons bahavior through criminal legislation you are opening up a Pandora's box of trouble. Because it really comes down to ones philosophy.. And you REALLY CANNOT regulate ones Philosophy. You cannot FORCE someone to DO something.

Now, "Anti-Smoking" campaigns and educating people of smoking's ill effects....YES.... But trying to use force to change peoples behavior has been PROVEN to fail everytime! and anyone who argues that must have their head up their a$$! I don't think it gets any clearer then that! I really don't...

reply to post by Agit8dChop

The Health system would be free from all those selfish life long smokers taking up hospital beds.
Cities would be tidy, no more cigerette buts.

By your logic we should ban all things unhealthy.

What about all those selfish junk food eaters? Heart disease and obesity kills more people than smoking does. All those ugly fat people making the streets unpleasant to walk down.

What about all those nasty fumes coming from cars, planes, factories ..... etc? Let's ban all motorized transportation next.

I guess we should also ban cooking on a BBQ grill in your backyard too. Because vegetarians don't like to smell that dead cow you're roasting and the fumes cause cancer and are bad for the environment.

I hate when people say that, another freedom taken away. be reasonable...

Its just another life altering drug being removed from the world.

You say that, means you believe coc aine and heroin being removed from the ''allowed'' list is also taking away your freedoms, well ok then.. would you like your kids to live in a world where heroin and coc aine are freely available over the counter? if not, then why cigerettes? they cause as much harm as anything else? and worse yet the tobacco companies engineer it in a way so your hooked and addicted to it.

Alcohol is one of the most dangerous and most abused substances out there. It causes addiction and many health problems. It has ruined relationships and destroyed families. People who drink alcohol stink.

Cocaine and Heroin are used to create other drugs in the medical field. They are used as pain killers and for anesthesia. As well as other uses treating sick patients. You've been brainwashed.

Why sugar is just as addictive as coc aine

Cigs prey on the weak deliberately, and they kill people at the same time clogging up health centres.

Cigs are more dangerous than terrorists, in my mind!

Corporations prey on the weak from all directions. My question to you is why only ban cigarettes?

Why not ban junk food, BBQ's, alcohol, gasoline? Having sex without condoms is dangerous too ..... let's ban that also Okay?

Your way of thinking is more dangerous than terrorists, in my mind.

Originally posted by davidmann
reply to post by Agit8dChop

 

Tobacco isn't bringing a thing to you, so be it. Others like it. As mentioned, there are many positive attributes of tobacco. I dislike booze, but wouldn't want to impinge on your habits. I could smoke all day long, but it would be matched by one or two revolutions of a car engine idling in traffic, in terms of particulate. Can't do anything about that, can I?

What is it with these fascist urges people get? Live a little. I feel like I'm feeding a troll, keeping a stupid idea visible for people to suffer through.

No, Bud, There's still a few of us left....And godda mnit... We'll prevail!

reply to post by foodstamp


I used to smoke, been 6 1/2 years since I have had one. I know both sides of the smoking fence. I think passing laws about banning smoking though is ridiculous. Personally I would rather see laws against alcohol, but know for a fact that failed miserably before. Trying to ban smoking will end just as badly.

Raist

Originally posted by Agit8dChop
reply to post by GAOTU789

 

same here, but think of it this way.

in 20yrs, you'll be 32 and you will not be able to buy cig's.

its going to stamp out smoking!

Yeah, because clearly the bans on drugs are keeping drugs out of their hands.

Welcome to NannyLand, population, you.

reply to post by Raist


Raist,

I don't know where your from, but here in Grand Rapids, Michigan they recently outlawed smoking in business's completely except for the Casino's. Cause, well, They had more money... Anyway, now business's are making little ramshackle wooden "outhouses" for smokers to still be able to be covered from the elements while smoking. NOW the town is trying to stop business owners from building small "outhouses" on their own property because "They don't look good".

This is just a perfect example of how regulation of people's behavior inevitably leads to a tyrannical police state. You cannot continue to criminalize behaviors that don't truly harm others...It just doesn't work on the township OR federal level. I feel soemtimes in America we're going to "legislate" ourselves out of existence! it's insane..

reply to post by Agit8dChop

I hate when people say that, another freedom taken away. be reasonable...

Its just another life altering drug being removed from the world.

You are the one being unreasonable. "They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." If people can't control what they do with themselves that is not my problem or the governments place to act.

You say that, means you believe coc aine and heroin being removed from the ''allowed'' list is also taking away your freedoms, well ok then.. would you like your kids to live in a world where heroin and coc aine are freely available over the counter?

First off heroin is available over the counter, in the form of various morphine extracts. Second coc aine is used in hospitals still to this day. And are you familiar with adhd meds? I was prescribed speed (amphetamine) at the age of 6! Wake up and open your eyes brother.

And yes I do think any form of drug control is taking away from our freedoms. It is not up to governments to make choices for the people. The people should make choices for the government.

reply to post by foodstamp


Here in the town I live in, in Missouri they have had votes on banning smoking in businesses. Many places just did it because they were sure the laws were going to pass so many places have no smoking. One of the hospitals has it set up so that you cannot even smoke on their property.

As for little out houses the place I work at has one of those. It looks like a bus stop. It is barely a shelter at all. They are cold and often wet. There are a few places that still allow smoking inside but the area has grown smaller. Even going to eat at these places I do not get bothered by smokers as they are easy to avoid. Like I said in that one post it is easy to avoid smokers, I am not sure why people exaggerate the drama of making it seem as if one cannot avoid them.

To be honest I have more trouble breathing due to the normal things in nature such as dust and pollen than other pollutants or allergens. Which makes it sort of hard on me at times when I am out doing the things I love lol. This spring my face was literally melting (itchy watery eyes, runny nose, and itchy scratchy throat) due to all the pollen. When I smoked being trapped in the little smoking jails places would put you in was pretty hard on my sinuses but other than that if one is out in the open you are getting less pollutants from the nearby cigarette than you are the other pollutants in the air.

I do not want others to start smoking as I agree it has health issues and many other issues. However, I think the key to beating it is education not outright banning. Anyone thinking banning is the solution is delusional at best. Banning things has never worked to stop what ever was being banned.

Raist

Ahh....let me clarify that "any form of drug control" statement ^^^

Prescriptions should still be a necessity for drugs with the potential for abuse.

Originally posted by foodstamp
reply to post by Raist

 

Raist,

I don't know where your from, but here in Grand Rapids, Michigan they recently outlawed smoking in business's completely except for the Casino's. Cause, well, They had more money... Anyway, now business's are making little ramshackle wooden "outhouses" for smokers to still be able to be covered from the elements while smoking. NOW the town is trying to stop business owners from building small "outhouses" on their own property because "They don't look good".

This is just a perfect example of how regulation of people's behavior inevitably leads to a tyrannical police state. You cannot continue to criminalize behaviors that don't truly harm others...It just doesn't work on the township OR federal level. I feel soemtimes in America we're going to "legislate" ourselves out of existence! it's insane..

We went through that here in my little town.

A old 60's hippie got elected mayor because nobody else ran. He started proposing bans on all kinds of weird crap. The entire chamber of commerce went to a council meeting and we threatened to move out of town if he didn't stop.

He stopped.

reply to post by Agit8dChop

You drinking booze, doesnt put alcohol in my mouth, its personal. Smoke drifts!

So do all of the pollutants in the air, but we cannot pick and choose what to ban based on personal preferences--that's just not going to be fair to anyone.

reply to post by Agit8dChop


Honestly i dont know why i smoke either! Do i want to quit? YES! Do i have the "drive" to quit! Possibly. But i do it because im addicted.
I grew up in a family of smoker's, So it was destined for me to become a smoker. They always told me to never touch a cigarette. But Once my parents tried to quit, there i was craving a cigarette because i wasn't getting any good ol' second hand smoke.

what about alcohol?

it causes so much misery...

Originally posted by Thinair1
reply to post by Agit8dChop

 

Honestly i dont know why i smoke either! Do i want to quit? YES! Do i have the "drive" to quit! Possibly. But i do it because im addicted.
I grew up in a family of smoker's, So it was destined for me to become a smoker. They always told me to never touch a cigarette. But Once my parents tried to quit, there i was craving a cigarette because i wasn't getting any good ol' second hand smoke.

Do you really believe that?

If so... Then I must say, "Victimhood" is the pre-curser to knowing that you really do control your own reality. And I see good things for you in the future. So long as you continue to self analyze and hold no bias.. I found that, myself, and those around me are addicted to all kind of things. And too much of any of them. No matter how benign, will damage that person and those around them. Kudos to you...

reply to post by Agit8dChop

ATS, what has become of a site i loved so much with so many people who are intent on making people feel dumb just because they think differently.

You mean as you have done here?

Dont agree with me? keep your knickers on for crying out loud, stop being so over the top and childish.

Words like Hatred, ignorance, prohibition.. ATS has turned to rubbish and its purely because of all those people who cannot have a civil debate without sniping someone purely because they disagree.

Im not calling for red meat, lollies, sugar blah blah blah.. your just being stupid to try and make a stupid comparison.

People being called stupid and dumb because they think differently and/or disagree

reply to post by Agit8dChop


Sorry, but i think it'll just turn into a new drug trade.

Im all for it, even as a smoker.

but people will get their fix, whether jail time is included or not.

Mike

Originally posted by Agit8dChop
reply to post by TechVampyre

 

Its just another life altering drug being removed from the world.

I thought (sometimes) life altering drugs where a good thing?

I'm not sure if I could really trust anyone who hasn't been "experienced"

reply to post by Agit8dChop



Tasmania is not my country, I do not like cigarette smoke. But if they do this and it stands, what else will they do??? Imagine a new parliament legislature of people going after everyone they disagree with??

Click here for more information.

reply to post by Agit8dChop


Wouldn't bother me a bit if cigarettes were permanantly banned for all people. Filthy habit that kills millions and i'm allergic to cigarette smoke, it makes my throat sore just breathing it.