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Anyone who thinks UFOs don't exist read this!!!

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posted on Aug, 25 2012 @ 11:02 AM
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Originally posted by Beavers
Since joining ATS i've stopped believing in aliens.

I've not seen one single piece of evidence that couldn't be faked or just a light in the sky.

I want to believe, but I just don't!


Same here.

I used to be totally sure of the fact we are being visited. I am now sceptical. Not totally closed off from the concept we have had ET involvement. Simply not convinced.

In my personal opinion, the evidence we have seen does not prove conclusively any ET visitation. The best 'evidence' is bad photos/ video, witness testimony and radar data. Witness testimony does not count for much when it is not backed up with with something else. I could tell any story I wanted to. People make mistakes and people lie. Radar data shows that something was there, but that does not automatically mean it was not of earthly origin. Just because something is recorded going at unbelievable velocities, or performing crazy manoeuvres does not mean it is alien. We have no idea what remarkable pieces of technology 'they' have got hidden away in the 'black' world.
Believers also like to refer to supposed UFOs in classic works of art. What is in such pictures is very much open to debate and individual interpretation.

But what has really left me disillusioned is the fact that ufology is overpopulated by so many conmen. They peddle their quasi spiritual garbage and in doing so ruin any real scientific study that is going on. Steven Greer, John Lear, Alex Collier... such people show what a sorry state the search for any truth is in.

I would really, really LOVE to see some incredible evidence. Something that blows my mind. Something that is nigh on impossible to dispute. I pray that I do. I would really love to find out the truth of what is going on. To find out facts about the technology our supposed alien visitors utilise.

But the fact of the matter is, sixty five years since Roswell, there has been nothing solid, beyond any dispute presented to us. We have yet to see a reasonable quality video of a craft (reasonable as in good quality picture and close enough to analyse form well). I mean, what is the best we have seen? Little more than a few pixels square? Not exactly impressive.

Of course somebody will likely reply saying 'Oh, what about the [x] case?' (The Tehran incident is a particular favourite for people to use as an example). But nothing is conclusive. All we have is faith. I've never heard a single case that says 'Aliens. Nothing else it could possibly be but aliens'. What's more is that believers are all too quick to belittle those who remain sceptical, labelling them 'closed minded'. But the fact is, two people can witness the exact same stimuli and come to completely different conclusions. So, I think, when a believer labels a sceptic 'closed minded' it in fact shows them to be closed off from the possibility there is another way to view the situation. You should at least try to look at things from the other camp's perspective in order to retain objectivity.

In my humble opinion, aliens are a cover story to distract from the truth about black project aircraft and associated technology. I wouldn't be surprised if alien abductions are a cover for some horrible programme of medical experiments the US government is undertaking, for what ever reason God (and TPTB) only know.

Nick Cook's excellent book 'The Hunt for Zero Point' was the most decisive nail in the coffin of the question 'Are we being visited by aliens?' I never used to buy in to how advanced Nazi technology was, but he laid out the case with such style and conviction. UFOs (aka flying saucers) are man made, and until a grey is kind enough to take me for a spin in his craft, they will remain man made (in my HUMBLE opinion).

I pray I live long enough to see something remarkable on the ET ' front'. Turning on Sky News one day and seeing a saucer hovering over London, up close, clear and with many people standing beneath, pointing, gasping and screaming 'Oh my God, they're here, it's the End of the freaking World!!'

edit on 25-8-2012 by JamesMc82 because: Edits, edits edits. Always with the edits!




posted on Aug, 26 2012 @ 06:44 AM
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Finally I'd just like to say the Cometa report and Washington 1952 UFO incident are real. They are not hoaxes or fake in any way and should be taken seriously. Anyone who disagrees I can only assume hasn't seen the large amount of material and references on them I've seen. Also if you study physics and aviation you can have a very good idea about exactly what is possible with our current technology. Science and physics are not top secret.



posted on Aug, 26 2012 @ 08:06 AM
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reply to post by JamesMc82
 


"THE HUNT FOR ZERO POINT" I'm sure is an entertaining read. But.

As one reviewer states.

"Unfortunately, Cook himself has a poor grasp of science. He makes several false statements in the book (and only partially incorporates the corrections pointed out by his pseudonymous British expert.)
Read it for its insights into the last days of Nazi Germany. The claims or hints of hidden scientific breakthroughs in antigravity, time travel, and zero-point energy are baseless and can be ignored, or read for enjoyment only."

An anti-gravity car would be great wouldn't it! Time travel! Wow!



posted on Aug, 26 2012 @ 09:06 AM
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reply to post by JamesMc82
 


Brilliant post.

You've nailed it.

My signature sums it up nicely



posted on Aug, 26 2012 @ 09:35 AM
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Even if you can idenitify the shapes of a craft which I did it my incredible UFO sighting they still are UFOs.I do not believe the government has this kind of technology some people are seeing that zips off into outer space or is totaly silent.

I saw triangular crafts and a green and yellow oval shaped object,which was probably a disc shaped craft with a green and yellow light around it.Rendleshem Forest Case no doubt has to be real.
The government would be able to hide some of it and probably do hide some of it.But most of that stuff is for military purposes.The government is not gonna fly around trees tops and over top airports and back inside deep parts of the woods.They would have had an accident all ready with a big major airline if there where humans going at the speeds some of these UFOs are reported to do.
edit on 26-8-2012 by Jobeycool because: (no reason given)



edit on 26-8-2012 by Jobeycool because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 26 2012 @ 12:56 PM
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reply to post by JamesMc82
 


That book "The Hunt For Zero Point" is fantastic. Secret Nazi anti-gravity flying saucers! Love it!



posted on Aug, 27 2012 @ 11:29 AM
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Show me the proof!!!

Here's some evidence which I think is interesting.

There's a lot of genuine NASA footage if you can actually be bothered to find it and watch it.

Google disclosure project and have a read.

www.disclosureproject.org...

Let me guess it's all fake and they're all lying.
edit on 27-8-2012 by JimTSpock because: Add



posted on Sep, 12 2013 @ 11:18 AM
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reply to post by Phage
 



Phage

Originally posted by JimTSpock

Please be fully familiar with the material before attempting any arguments against it!


You should take your own advice.

COMETA was not a "French military report". COMETA was a UFO study group which produced a report in 1999. In it, the group concludes that about 5% of the cases they studied were inexplicable by any other means than extraterrestrial. Not everyone agrees, not even other UFO groups.

You are confusing UFOs with extraterrestrial visitors. There is no doubt that people have reported unidentified objects. There is plenty of doubt about what they are.

edit on 8/21/2012 by Phage because: (no reason given)
You're right but look at the kind of people involved.

COMETA was .high-level French UFO study organisation from the late 1990s, composed of high-ranking officers and officials, some having held command posts in the armed forces and aerospace industry. The name "COMETA" in English stands for "Committee for in-depth studies." The study was carried out over several years by an independent group of mostly former "auditors" at the Institute of Advanced Studies for National Defence, or IHEDN, a high-level French military think-tank, and by various other experts.
link
That has to count for something though.



posted on Sep, 12 2013 @ 12:51 PM
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DeadSeraph

Originally posted by JimTSpock
reply to post by Phage
 


Well according to you the link I posted is incorrect then. With all due respect I find the report and it's authors highly credible. I'm just highlighting material I find interesting and compelling. You're not really arguing with me rather the authors of Cometa.

Are you really trying to say you think the report is not credible and should not be taken seriously? I don't think that would be a very persuasive argument.


No. What we are saying is that those 5% of cases which can't be explained, while fascinating and unusual, cannot be concretely explained by the "extra terrestrial hypothesis". It's only one of many theories, and thus the report is really nothing new. Jacques Vallee and J.Allen Hynek concluded the same thing decades before this report, but at least they had the ability to admit that the extra terrestrial hypothesis couldn't adequately explain all of the phenomenon being reported, although both admitted it was a possibility.


I am very suspicious about the percentages of 'unexplained/explainable'. Explainable is not the same as explained. Ok, you have some guy hungover on Monday morning and a report comes in. The report says there was a bring light...he finds that Venus was in that part of the sky at the time - "Ok that's Venus" he says and throws it in the trash can. But was it Venus? Not enough information. I suspect many of the 'explainable' ones are not really explained at all.

Concerning the ET hypothesis. It could not explain everything because at the time the ET concept was very nuts-and-bolts - metal ships with a physical drive etc. But now it is becoming clear that there is something extra dimensional about this and at the same time the nuts-and-bolts effects are still manifest. So the can be ET beings that are also spiritual beings. ie, spirits from another world who sometimes have physical bodies.



posted on Sep, 13 2013 @ 06:03 AM
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I have a question on craft not from this world, which I've been thinking of for a while.

Let's say some species not from this planet have developed the advanced technology to visit us – technology which is probably 1000+ years out for us, I believe. They have mastered the problems of space radiation, collision avoidance, incredibly fast inter-stellar speeds, life-span enhancement, and a billion other technologies and solutions to get here.

So why do they need lights?

For the record, I strongly believe we are not alone in this wondrous universe – we can't be, but I cannot bring myself to believe (however much I'd like to) that any other intelligent life has visited us. Even if they had, they certainly wouldn't need navigation lights once they arrived.
edit on 13-9-2013 by TerraLiga because: expansion



posted on Sep, 13 2013 @ 06:59 AM
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JamesMc82

Witness testimony does not count for much when it is not backed up with with something else. I could tell any story I wanted to.

I would really, really LOVE to see some incredible evidence. Something that blows my mind. Something that is nigh on impossible to dispute.



Apologies for the selective quoting but do you see the issue between those two sentences ?

Could you also point out any "black project" that hasn't simply been a progression of existing technology ?

And then how that technology can explain well documented sightings, including sightings that have taken place in era's where there were no such things as "black projects" ?

Many UFO sightings could well be explained by advanced military craft but there are so many that couldn't it just isn't a catch all answer.

Aside from the multiple independent expert witness cases corroborated by radar or secondary means there are always the physical trace cases to try and explain as well.

Not trying to convince you of anything other than that currently there are many cases that are unexplained and that the ETH is worth consideration as a possible explanation.



posted on Sep, 13 2013 @ 07:02 AM
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reply to post by TerraLiga
 


Seriously, thinking of for a while - and the only possible explanation you could come up with for the luminosity effects reported in some sightings is that they are navigation lights ?



posted on Sep, 13 2013 @ 07:10 AM
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reply to post by chunder
 


So they're engines? From what little research and thinking I've been doing, any sort of engine that's going to propel a craft for vast distances and at enormous speeds will need to be almost perfectly efficient, which eliminates all forms of waste such as heat and light.

And yes, people describe flashing lights, among other things – what possible use would they be otherwise? What are they, if you know so much?

I have many other questions which I'd prefer to post as my own thread when I've built up enough posts.



posted on Sep, 13 2013 @ 07:28 AM
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CaptainBeno
I would have to say that from my point of view I have come to this conclusion:

No evidence of ET. (No publicly released photos, no video, no real public sightings)

Plenty of UFO sightings. (More than you can shake a stick at)

so that equals - No ET but there are these things flying around we know nothing about?

Tadarrrrr


In 1979 at the Pittsburgh PA Steelers game 52,000 stadiums witnesses saw two ufos hovering above the football game. They were filmed and on national television. There are U Tube videos of this live broadcast. If I weren't
technologically challenged I would embed it here.



posted on Sep, 13 2013 @ 08:39 AM
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reply to post by JimTSpock
 


There is something going on...The countries..nations...which are proudly releasing UFO documents are holding back...IMHO. If the air-defences of countries like France, England and some other 'significant' countries is in order there must be cristal clear fighterjet gun-camera recordings of UFO's.

But these recordings are not released...why? Why does not one of these countries release these in-focus and undeniable recordings? I can not think an other answer than that these countries made an agreement with the USA....the country in control and holding back.

Hopefully one of these countries will have enough of the lying and manipulating of the people and will decide to throw it all on the street for us to enjoy...



posted on Sep, 13 2013 @ 09:01 AM
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reply to post by zatara
 


I think the answer is pretty simple for any logically thinking, rational person – there is no evidence because it hasn't happened.

Why us? How did they find us? How did they get here? What do they want that? Why collude with governments (who in the most part are elected) when they could make themselves known and speak to the people of the planet in unison?

If you could climb out of your American box for a while and think on a global scale, how in the world could a 'secret' like this remain so? With so many political, idealogical or moral enemies, what a coup it would be to 'reveal the truth'. It hasn't happened and it won't happen because there is nothing 'to' happen.



posted on Sep, 13 2013 @ 10:08 AM
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JimTSpock
We have a myriad of evidence. Credible eye witness accounts from fighter pilots, civilian pilots, radar operators, police officers etc etc etc etc. Photographic evidence from before photoshop was invented. Radar tracks recorded. Video from the likes of NASA etc etc etc. Military and air force reports of failed interceptions etc etc etc.
Phage I refer you to one of my previous posts where I said if 2 people describe the same thing but have never met then it must be true etc etc etc.
It's true eye witness accounts can be unreliable but they can also be very reliable if your talking about people like fighter pilots, radar operators etc who know what the # they're talking about.


Photos have been manipulated since photography was established, that is not an assumption, it's a given...

www.fourandsix.com...

The fine line as with all things is the point where someone says "I saw something I can't explain" to "ET life was watching me".

Beside that, could you show any video from NASA for which a pragmatic, prosaic explanation does not exist but the anti-debunkers debunk because it doesn't match their own opinion? Please not the ISS tether videos, let's not go there.



posted on Sep, 13 2013 @ 10:33 AM
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reply to post by rigel4
 


rigel, if I may....

None that the public has been made aware of
!



posted on Sep, 13 2013 @ 10:52 AM
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I thought this thread was dead, it's pretty old. Certainly is a very unique and interesting subject. But anyway I think my position is clear. I believe there is a large body of credible evidence for the existence of extra-terrestrial craft visiting Earth.
I made another thread with the full english translation of the Cometa report which is quite interesting.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Personally I don't believe it's possible for an objective observer to dismiss 100% of the evidence. The skeptic 100% denier position is one which I believe is becoming increasingly ridiculous. The Washington DC 1952 UFO incident is one which really stands out for me and Iv'e noticed the skeptics tend to completely ignore it.

If indeed ET craft have visited this planet they would almost certainly be capable of faster than light travel, even with our current physics this may be possible by using worm holes or bending or warping space. Such technological capability is so far beyond our understanding we can only speculate and imagine what other fantastic capabilities such technology may be capable of. Star Trek type technology and more.



posted on Sep, 13 2013 @ 11:05 AM
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reply to post by Beavers
 


Beavers.... they are already here!!



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