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Why isn't Bradley Manning a statue on ground zero by now?

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posted on Aug, 21 2012 @ 01:48 PM
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For over 60 years, we (the US), Israel and jews all around the globe have hunted germans for fighting in the German armed forces. The logic is that by not opposing to their roles within the third reich they are guilty of crimes against humanity. The latter is especially true if the german was placed as a prison camp guard or of a higher rank and took part in activities that later have been considered controversial.

Now we have a soldier, Bradley Manning, who has done exactly what we claim germans should have done some 70 years ago. As we all know, Bradley Manning stopped believing in his cause and started to obstruct our armed forces and sabotaged their doings by revealing secret information to Wikileaks.

So why don't we applaud him? Why aren't everyone happy now? Especially the jews should salute him for being brave and a man of integrity; a man of peaceful solutions to conflicts. But what do we do? We throw him into into a dungeon bereft of all dignity and with no legal rights at all.

Is this 'double think' or just double standard?




posted on Aug, 21 2012 @ 01:56 PM
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reply to post by jiwozejy214
 


I think he was a genuine hero, and the reason the United States doesnt think so is because its leaders are only interested in power and control.

If this world was sane, he would be a celebrity and people would admire him everywhere. But its not, and people like Obama gets the peace price.

edit on 21-8-2012 by PrimitiveWorld because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 21 2012 @ 02:01 PM
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Originally posted by jiwozejy214
So why don't we applaud him? Why aren't everyone happy now? Especially the jews should salute him for being brave and a man of integrity; a man of peaceful solutions to conflicts. But what do we do? We throw him into into a dungeon bereft of all dignity and with no legal rights at all.


Germans were prosecuted for killing 8 million Jews, Roma, and others who didn't measure up to the Aryan Race standard. Bradley Manning committed treason and put the lives of many at risk. He didn't do this out of his "principles," but out of spite for his fellow soldiers. For that he ought to be executed. It's an apples and oranges comparison. He probably won't be, only because it's not PC to execute little gay men who have anger management problems and shouldn't have been in that position in the first place. There's plenty of blame to go around.

But a statue? Not just no, but hell, no. Perhaps we could set up a virtual grave to spit on. I'd donate to that.



posted on Aug, 21 2012 @ 02:12 PM
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Originally posted by schuyler

Originally posted by jiwozejy214
So why don't we applaud him? Why aren't everyone happy now? Especially the jews should salute him for being brave and a man of integrity; a man of peaceful solutions to conflicts. But what do we do? We throw him into into a dungeon bereft of all dignity and with no legal rights at all.


Germans were prosecuted for killing 8 million Jews, Roma, and others who didn't measure up to the Aryan Race standard. Bradley Manning committed treason and put the lives of many at risk. He didn't do this out of his "principles," but out of spite for his fellow soldiers. For that he ought to be executed. It's an apples and oranges comparison. He probably won't be, only because it's not PC to execute little gay men who have anger management problems and shouldn't have been in that position in the first place. There's plenty of blame to go around.

But a statue? Not just no, but hell, no. Perhaps we could set up a virtual grave to spit on. I'd donate to that.

Yes, the US has not killed that many, nor even close to that many, people, but, they are killing people who don't measure up to the "Western" standard.
He committed treason. I don't think anyone can argue otherwise. By doing so, he has however, done exactly as stated in the OP. Please source how he "didn't do this out of his principles".
You can donate to his virtual grave to do your virtual spitting, but, just remember all the soldiers who were actually spit on when they came home from Vietnam, after serving a gov't that lied to them to get them involved in a war. You think it would have been different then? Would you have applauded them if they let people know that they were being lied to? Or would you have been there with the rest of the mob, spitting on them?



posted on Aug, 21 2012 @ 02:32 PM
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Manning, one of the few heroes from the USA in the last few years.

It's a tragedy that people like him are incarcerated and tortured yet thugs and villains get voted in by idiots.



posted on Aug, 21 2012 @ 02:40 PM
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reply to post by jiwozejy214
 


I just threw up all over my keyboard.

A hero???? Not really. A whistle blower??Sure, I will agree to that. He still broke Military Law, and should face the punishment like a big boy, since he played big boy games. .

A statue??? AAAAARRRRRRGGGGHHHH!!!!!!!!!!
There it goes again. Just barfed everywhere at that thought.



posted on Aug, 28 2012 @ 12:02 PM
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reply to post by schuyler
 


Germans were prosecuted for killing 8 million Jews, Roma, and others who didn't measure up to the Aryan Race standard.
Being prosecuted and being guilty are two different things. It's ironic that you are active in a forum with the slogan DENY IGNORANCE and still seem to believe in fairy tales. That's ok though, I used to believe in them too. Here's a start for you and all of your kind:
www.youtube.com...

He didn't do this out of his "principles," but out of spite for his fellow soldiers.
Not taken out of thin air of course, A source please?



posted on Aug, 28 2012 @ 12:10 PM
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Originally posted by macman
reply to post by jiwozejy214
 


I just threw up all over my keyboard.

A hero???? Not really. A whistle blower??Sure, I will agree to that. He still broke Military Law, and should face the punishment like a big boy, since he played big boy games. .

A statue??? AAAAARRRRRRGGGGHHHH!!!!!!!!!!
There it goes again. Just barfed everywhere at that thought.


Is/was it wrong to pursue these trials of Nazis and depict them as being inhuman because they didn't do exactly what Brad Manning did? After all, Germans that would have refused to do what their superiors told them to do, would have pulled 'a Bradley Manning', which according to you seems to be inexcusably wrong.



posted on Aug, 28 2012 @ 01:12 PM
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He just released a bunch of crap none of which did anything to help anyone. A life of hard labor or execution is all he deserves.



posted on Aug, 28 2012 @ 01:55 PM
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Originally posted by jiwozejy214
As we all know, Bradley Manning stopped believing in his cause and started to obstruct our armed forces and sabotaged their doings by revealing secret information to Wikileaks.


He did nothing of the sort, and although you seem to be defending him in half of your post I am suspicious by what you are suggesting here.

He didn't obstruct anything, he didn't sabotage anything, he revealed corruption and double standards, he revealed what your own government was deliberately hiding from you. He didn't create the problem, he simply showed the problem that your own military and government had created for themselves.

When a person is caught cheating on their wife, should the person who informs the victim be punished or the person who was cheating? Don't shoot the messenger, they've done nothing wrong. They are the ones bringing immorality, injustice or criminality to light and should be thanked for it.

Your government was systematically lying to the people who elected them, and he was exposing that to the world.

He was doing what every true journalist should have been doing. In fact I would go further than that, he was doing what any true PATRIOT should have been doing.

He acted with morality and courage, and for many he will always be a hero, and the US governments treatment of him will simply bury them further.



posted on Aug, 28 2012 @ 02:01 PM
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Originally posted by macman
reply to post by jiwozejy214
 


I just threw up all over my keyboard.

A hero???? Not really. A whistle blower??Sure, I will agree to that. He still broke Military Law, and should face the punishment like a big boy, since he played big boy games. .

A statue??? AAAAARRRRRRGGGGHHHH!!!!!!!!!!
There it goes again. Just barfed everywhere at that thought.


So you think it would be more moral and noble to know that information and do nothing? You agree that he should have ignored his morality and just followed orders?

This is the fundamental problem with many serving in the military, they think that because they are given an order it absolves them from any and all responsibility or morality.

Even when you are taking orders, you are choosing to accept. You always have your own free will and your actions - even under orders - are your own responsibility.

If a senior officer orders you to execute a child, and you follow that order, no matter what the excuse, you are guilty of that act. It doesn't matter what your senior officer tells you, it is you ending that life and you are forever accountable for it even in a war zone.

The same applies here. The idea that Manning should have just followed orders and stayed silent about the abuse and criminality going on is what makes me feel sick to m stomach.

I wish all serving members had even half of the guts and morality Bradley Manning has.



posted on Aug, 28 2012 @ 02:10 PM
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Unfortunately we will never see him again. He will continue to be held who.knows where until this corrupt government tells the media mto start focusing on more BS stories and once we all finally know once and for all how many guys the kardashians have fuc*** then he will be long gone.



posted on Aug, 28 2012 @ 02:19 PM
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reply to post by jiwozejy214
 


We are not talking about Nazi war criminals. We are talking about a Military member that violated his agreement with the Military.
He made a big boy decision and needs to own up to the big boy consequences.

A statue????No. That is Absurd.



posted on Aug, 28 2012 @ 02:24 PM
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Originally posted by detachedindividual
So you think it would be more moral and noble to know that information and do nothing? You agree that he should have ignored his morality and just followed orders?

Never said that.
He, willfully, violated his oath to the Military and his position. Did he release info that was being hidden? I think a couple things were, the rest was military Intel.
He made the decision, and now must face the consequences of his actions.




Originally posted by detachedindividual
This is the fundamental problem with many serving in the military, they think that because they are given an order it absolves them from any and all responsibility or morality.

From the mouth of someone that not only has never served, but secrets loathing and hate for the military.
Nope, not in the slightest. You really have no clue.



Originally posted by detachedindividual
Even when you are taking orders, you are choosing to accept. You always have your own free will and your actions - even under orders - are your own responsibility.

No, when you enlist, you give up certain rights and freedoms. Again, no clue.



Originally posted by detachedindividual
If a senior officer orders you to execute a child, and you follow that order, no matter what the excuse, you are guilty of that act. It doesn't matter what your senior officer tells you, it is you ending that life and you are forever accountable for it even in a war zone.

Yes, you are correct. And the Senior Officer is guilty as well, even more so in most cases as per the UCMJ.



Originally posted by detachedindividual
The same applies here. The idea that Manning should have just followed orders and stayed silent about the abuse and criminality going on is what makes me feel sick to m stomach.

He released more then just a couple of videos. He released Military Intel as well. He should have informed his superior that he could not perform his duty, and gone through that process.



Originally posted by detachedindividual
I wish all serving members had even half of the guts and morality Bradley Manning has.


They do. YOu just have no clue how to relate it to other things outside your experience.



posted on Aug, 28 2012 @ 02:54 PM
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Everytime I think of some young man or women telling me here in Canada or anywhere that they are thinking of joining the military, all I can do is think of this song and how true it is anyone not familiar give it a listen. We know what goes on yet the oppertunity to work and see the world draws some in. But still the message of the song rings true to me.

In my mind he did what his conscience enabled him to do, I fear most in the military lack one, cause if they we're still able to access theirs, videos like Bradley Manning released would not be so prevelent. And I fear his info dump was only the tip of the ice berg on how much we have been lied too. A hero in some eyes a traitor to his oath but in reality should you blindly follow an oath that means next to nothing when those leading you don't live bye it.

SaneThinkning



posted on Aug, 28 2012 @ 03:12 PM
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While for me it's an internal matter for the US, I think any connection with 9/11 is rather tenuous and indirect.

From SA we know that today's "terrorists" and "traitors" can be tomorrow's "freedom fighters" and "martyrs" (at least to some), so it's interesting that opinions are divided.

What I wonder more about is why there is no Manning statue in countries opposed to, or critical of the US?

Why no Manning statue in Iran or North Korea?
Maybe they just need the resources for other statues or buildings, but I have a distinct feeling that the leaks also upset other countries (and they certainly wouldn't encourage similar behavior from their soldiers) and I've heard that in a general state of chaotic mental health he might also be gay (and we know how such countries feel about gay people).

I wouldn't be surprised however if we find a few Julian Assange statues dotted across the globe eventually - a proven "heterosexual revolutionary".
edit on 28-8-2012 by halfoldman because: (no reason given)



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