If Jesus was burnt at the stake, Would you pray before a box of Matches?

reply to post by AshleyD

Nobody knows what dying for our sins means? It seems pretty simple, IMHO. Then again, if we're having a hard time grasping what a symbol is, I guess I shouldn't be too surprised if people don't understand.

Did anyone notice how the question was yet again, not answered?

Very, very typical.

Come on, now.....be honest AshleyD.

Lots of ignorance in this thread.

And you are going to solve this with....judgement?

Why not rise up and destroy the ignorance?

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by Prezbo369

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to [url= by Pedro4077[/url]

 

Ask the Catholics. I have no idea, never prayed in front of a cross before, cant help u out there, sorry.

*looks at your avatar*

Still never prayed in front of a cross, again.. ask the Catholics. I don't know what else to say about that.

Right so you don't pray infront of a cross, you just like to have them around..........a lot

You could explain why you choose to use the symbol of a cross......which is kinda the point of this thread, instead of attempting to hide behind the Catholics...

Because a lot of members are playing dumb in this thread, IMHO. It's one thing to have earnest questions but it's another to ridicule others for their belief.

For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

-Romans 6:23

When Jesus offered Himself as a sacrifice, He restored the spiritual rift that separated man from God after the fall when humans entered into a sinful state. Jesus rectified this by accepting the burden of our sins. In other words, He accepted our sentence for us and defeated death to offer us eternal life instead of spiritual death.

reply to post by AshleyD

When Jesus offered Himself as a sacrifice, He restored the spiritual rift that separated man from God after the fall when humans entered into a sinful state.

I don't see why he had to die or be sacrifised to do so. Why is his death in particular, significant?

Jesus rectified this by accepting the burden of our sins. In other words, He accepted our sentence for us and defeated death to offer us eternal life instead of spiritual death.

I thought the romans crucified him for being a potential threat to their power structure.

I again completely fail to see how the "our sins" part connects to this. Especially when it comes to our sins of today. How did he die for my current sins, 2000 years earlier?

Or are you just saying that he showed us the way to redemption? In that case I still fail to see why there is so much focus on his death.

reply to post by Stonedhenge

What does it mean anyway, "died for our sins"?

This is my understanding of that, but in all honesty that question is worthy of its own thread as it is studied extensively in Theology. Bullet points:-

(Familiarity of scripture assists in understanding here as I will NOT be quoting exact text)

*According to Scripture, Jesus was of Jewish descent (I'll come back to that but keep it in mind)
*Eve was the first sinner, then Adam - God said "Eat of that fruit and you will surely die". They ate it and they eventually died. Prior to that event they were created immortal and without "self awareness".
*Soon thereafter, Cain & Abel offered sacrifices to God as an ATONEMENT of their parents ORIGINAL sin. God was pleased with Abel's animal sacrifice, mainly because Abel sacrificed his best and most pure lineage animal(s).
*It was then common practice for all subsequent descendants of Adam and Eve to offer up to God animal sacrifices - but the animal had to be pure and without blemish (one of Gods conditions)
*God decided to "test" his creation via Abraham "take your son up to the mountain and sacrifice him to me"
*As we know, Abraham passed the test and God said "I will provide a unblemished pure sacrifical lamb". One just happened to pop out from behind a bush and that was that.

NOW............move ahead 3000 odd years

*Jesus is known as the "Lamb of God" (who takes away the sins of the world)
*Jesus was of pure uncorrupted lineage.
*My God, My God, why have you foresaken me?
*Jesus died on the cross
*The temple was ripped in half the moment he died - and the Jewish sacrifical altar destroyed.
*This was the end of "Sacrifice" ritual for many Jews BECAUSE OF FAITH IN JESUS being the Son of God - his Sacrificial Lamb.
*The followers of Jesus interpreted the temple being rent in two as a sign that God no longer requires animal sacrifice because God himself has provided the ultimate unblemished Lamb and his sacrifice will ATONE ALL of humanity from original sin and bring us to everlasting life - as God said he would when he spoke to Abraham 3000 years prior.

*A just man sins seven times daily.
*All have sinned and fall short of the glory of God.
*Let he who is without sin cast the first stone.
*It is confirmed that every man shall die once and thereafter the Judgement.

God sacrificed Jesus because God wants all of us with him in eternity - but because we are all sinners we need atonement - God provided atonement through Jesus's sacrifice so that EVERYONE WHO BELIEVES IN JESUS and acknowledges him as the Son of God will have everlasting life..............and that pisses Satan off big time.

Jesus was present in the beginning - he is the Alpha and the Omega - he will be there at the end. Jesus consented to this plan for our salvation.

So - thats my PERSONAL take on it.

"You can lead a horse to water but.................................

reply to post by AshleyD

Because a lot of members are playing dumb in this thread, IMHO. It's one thing to have earnest questions but it's another to ridicule others for their belief.

Okay, now that that's been said and done, let's look at the rest to see what "we" are so dumb about:

For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.



-Romans 6:23

When Jesus offered Himself as a sacrifice, He restored the spiritual rift that separated man from God after the fall when humans entered into a sinful state. Jesus rectified this by accepting the burden of our sins. In other words, He accepted our sentence for us and defeated death to offer us eternal life instead of spiritual death.

...and this is supposed to be perfectly clear? Tell me, if someone walked up and said they performed self-flagellation as a healing practice for recovering veterans (I'm keeping it modern here for simplicity), what would YOU say?

And we're "playing dumb"...

Originally posted by Stonedhenge
What does it mean anyway, "died for our sins"?

What REALLY happens when a person is born again? Jesus' blood is applied.

"In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins." -Colossians 1:14

Hebrews 9:22, "...without shedding of blood is no remission. (forgivness )"

“Behold, the Lamb of God, who takes away the sin of the world! John 1:29

"Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers; But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot."
-1st Peter 1:18,19

...and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin" (1st John 1:7).

This is why the discovery of the Ark of the Covenant has been so viciously attacked and covered-up:

"The Ark of the Covenant was found in a cave 20 feet directly below the spot where Jesus was crucified. God intended for the blood of the Lamb to fall upon the Mercy Seat..." Link

"And so it was that God the Father had rent the rocks to make a way for His Son's blood to flow down from the spear-wound, through the newly formed fissure onto the very Mercy Seat itself. Now just think about this for a moment. Jeremiah had deposited the Ark in the cave some six centuries B.C., with absolutely no knowledge of the events which were to occur on Good Friday.

The Romans who hacked out the post-holes had absolutely no knowledge of what lay beneath their feet, nor that they were positioning the CENTRAL hole in exactly the right place. And until the Lord had died, there was no way for blood to trickle down because there was no crack. But these Amazing coincidences actually happened.

Yes, they ARE coincidences, because everything had to COINCIDE exactly for it to happen, but there was never any human design - it was entirely the work of God in Heaven, who knew the end from the beginning, and arranged for it to happen in that way.

THE ARK OF THE COVENANT

Ron Wyatt paid a lab in Israel to do an analysis of the blood:

"As they began viewing the cells under the microscope, they saw cells dividing before their eyes! They could tell it was human blood, but "This blood is alive!"

"They couldn't believe what they were seeing! They continued with their tests and found the blood to be unique from any other human blood! "

"With tears in their eyes they asked, "Whose blood is this?" Mr. Wyatt replied, "It is the blood of your Messiah." Then they asked who the Messiah was, and they began wailing and shouting. No other male human being has ever had this same chromosome count! Christ's blood is alive and unique to prove His divinity to the world before He returns to this earth." Source

reply to post by Sublimecraft

"You can lead a horse to water but.................................

.....if the well is poisoned the horse will only suffer from it and no good will come from it.

Thanks for your reply, but the more that is put forward, the less sense it actually makes.

If "if" was a fifth, then we would all be drunk!

Originally posted by Stonedhenge
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

So what is the actual purpose of having that cross in your avatar?

If I may ask?

What's the purpose of anyone's avatar really? Most have something that's important to them, mine isn't any different. The cross is where Christ died for me. I say it's the greatest love letter in human history. But that's me.

reply to post by Murgatroid

What REALLY happens when a person is born again? Jesus' blood is applied.

The question was why and how he died for "our sins".

I consider your comment completely off topic.

reply to post by NOTurTypical

The cross is where Christ died for me.

So previous comments directed at you earlier were completely relevant.

Originally posted by Prezbo369

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by Prezbo369

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to [url= by Pedro4077[/url]

 

Ask the Catholics. I have no idea, never prayed in front of a cross before, cant help u out there, sorry.

*looks at your avatar*

Still never prayed in front of a cross, again.. ask the Catholics. I don't know what else to say about that.

Right so you don't pray infront of a cross, you just like to have them around..........a lot

You could explain why you choose to use the symbol of a cross......which is kinda the point of this thread, instead of attempting to hide behind the Catholics...

I just did. And Im not "hiding" behind anyone, I have witnessed Catholics bowing before a cross before, sorta wby I suggested maybe asking them or something. I've never prayed before a cross so like I said a few times already I really cant offer help to you. You'll have to ask folks who pray to crosses I'd imagine.

Originally posted by Stonedhenge
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

The cross is where Christ died for me.

So previous comments directed at you earlier were completely relevant.

How so? I said I have never prayed to or prayed in front of a cross. No one had asked me why I chose the avatar I did until the 2nd to previous poster.

reply to post by NOTurTypical

I've never prayed before a cross so like I said a few times already I really cant offer help to you. You'll have to ask folks who pray to crosses I'd imagine.

You are sidestepping the point here.

The point was that Christians worship the tool used to kill Jesus.

Wether you pray to it or not, you just admitted it yourself,

The cross is where Christ died for me.

You seem to worship the cross.

reply to post by NOTurTypical


Well, this isn't a question for Catholics, it is a question for you:

Would you display a picture of a burning stake as your avatar if that is how Jesus died? Or an axe if he was beheaded? A sword if he was slain? A rope if he was hanged?

reply to post by Stonedhenge

Originally posted by Stonedhenge
I consider your comment completely off topic.

If my answer to your post was completely off topic, so is YOUR question:

Originally posted by Stonedhenge
What does it mean anyway, "died for our sins"?

So many on ATS love to ask questions which they HATE the answers to.

SOME here (OP for example) actually ARE interested in the truth, hence the reason for the post...

Christians, please help me understand...

reply to post by NOTurTypical


I think you'll find that having crosses around makes a huge difference in your practices...

Which isn't a whole lot different from the point we're making.

reply to post by Stonedhenge

Trust in the Lord with all your heart
and lean not on your own understanding;
in all your ways submit to him,
and he will make your paths straight.

Proverbs 3:5-6

See, it's not supposed to make sense. We're not supposed to THINK, we're supposed to OBEY. Funny, how a nation is founded on the ideals of freedom, yet the people are so intent on giving every one of their liberties over to a deity who's holding us at fault for the flaws he gave us...he gives us free will, and yet we get punished if we do anything but what he wants us to do...like we're supposed to use every ounce of our creativity to think about HIM instead of anything else...sound like a fair deal?

But again, we're not supposed to think about it. Makes more sense that way, I suppose.

reply to post by Stonedhenge

You seem to worship the cross.

He is using it as a symbol in his avatar. Why is everyone so obsessed with his choice as an avatar? It's what he chose. I hate the phrase 'Get Over It' because it always sounds so rude and uncaring towards the feelings of another and I don't want to come across that way but I don't know what else to say.

Huge difference between worshiping an object and using it as a symbol. The cross is a precious symbol to me, personally. Actual crucifixes I don't care for. But the cross is pretty much the main symbol for the Christian faith.

I have crosses in my home but I don't worship them. I have an American flag but I don't worship it. Etc.

Anyways, I'm outtie and on to better threads. This really does appear to be the equivalent of an aggravating attempt like if Mohammad used guns, would uzis be the symbol of Islam instead of the sword? Just way too Derpy for me. No offense.