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Bill banning parents from trying to 'cure' gay kids moves forward

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posted on Aug, 21 2012 @ 09:58 AM
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Originally posted by Xcalibur254
reply to post by macman
 


It's not about hurting someone's feelings. It's about causing livelong mental trauma. Conversion therapy, among other things, leads to a significant increase in the incidence of depression. Your freedoms end the second they start infringing on another person's freedoms. Let me ask a serious question here. Do you think it should be legal for parents to beat their children?


Oh give me a break.
Anything now days is traumatic for kids. Again, worried about feelings and all.
My kids are my kids.
Beatings are not comparable to this. Nice try though.

And to have some shrinks do a research piece into something they, the shrinks are more then likely against in the first place.....well, that speaks for itself.

Sounds like Dr. Spock is back, now pushing the brain and psyche angle instead.

Now, would I send my kids to one of these things? NO. MY CHOICE. MY KIDS.
What others do is their business.

Again, just more Govt intrusion into the rights and freedoms of parents.




posted on Aug, 21 2012 @ 10:10 AM
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reply to post by macman
 


Mental abuse is just as damaging as physical abuse. In fact one could argue it's more damaging since the the consequences as longer lasting. Abuse is abuse. It doesn't matter if it leaves physical or mental scars in the end all that matters is that it ruins lives.



posted on Aug, 21 2012 @ 10:11 AM
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reply to post by macman
 


How are beatings not comparable? If that is how someone chooses to punish their children who are you to tell them how they should do it? It's a matter of protecting children, from anyone who would try to hurt them.

Tell you what, we put your 13 year old in a 'program' and tell them that who they are on a basic level is wrong. We drill it into their heads that if they don't act and look just like everybody else they will be punished on Earth as well as have God hate them. Then we send them out into the world and when they can't change their basic mind and reactions, let's see how your kid deals with it. Would you really be okay with watching your child suffer day after day because you hired someone to tell them that who they are is wrong? Would you risk your child committing suicide?



posted on Aug, 21 2012 @ 10:21 AM
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reply to post by rickymouse
 


I would personally put the well being and happiness of my child ahead of anything else. The evidence says conversion therapy is harmful. So why would I want to do something that could hurt my child and attempt to deny them the freedom to be the person they are?



posted on Aug, 21 2012 @ 10:43 AM
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Originally posted by Xcalibur254
reply to post by macman
 


Mental abuse is just as damaging as physical abuse. In fact one could argue it's more damaging since the the consequences as longer lasting. Abuse is abuse. It doesn't matter if it leaves physical or mental scars in the end all that matters is that it ruins lives.


Mental abuse is not the same. Mental abuse is not illegal, but it is not definable.

Sticks and stones.

Everything these days is mental abuse. Tell your kids no, and it is mental abuse.
Raise your voice, and it is mental abuse.
Might as well just lock them up in a rubber room, and have the all seeing all knowing all loving Govt official take care of them.



posted on Aug, 21 2012 @ 10:48 AM
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Originally posted by EndlessFire
How are beatings not comparable? If that is how someone chooses to punish their children who are you to tell them how they should do it? It's a matter of protecting children, from anyone who would try to hurt them.

Because it is not. It is not definable. All this is, is just people getting butt hurt about how others raise their kids.
Love the Progressive train of thought. Everyone has to be excepting, except the things they don't agree with.



Originally posted by EndlessFire
Tell you what, we put your 13 year old in a 'program' and tell them that who they are on a basic level is wrong. We drill it into their heads that if they don't act and look just like everybody else they will be punished on Earth as well as have God hate them. Then we send them out into the world and when they can't change their basic mind and reactions, let's see how your kid deals with it. Would you really be okay with watching your child suffer day after day because you hired someone to tell them that who they are is wrong? Would you risk your child committing suicide?

I, again, would not put my kids in this. But, If that is what others want to teach their kids, then that is their business.
So, if you don't agree with violence, and I teach my kids to not back down to bullies and how to defend themselves and they put a beat down on the bully, then what?
I guess the argument from some shrinks can be that I mentally abused my kids, because hitting is wrong and so on.

Again, has to do with the rights of parents. The Govt is not the parent.



posted on Aug, 21 2012 @ 11:13 AM
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reply to post by Xcalibur254
 

So you are saying that kids talking to their parents is harmful?
Maybe you have been programmed by society too well. A good parent with knowledge and good perception can bring his kids up well. I see that the changes that are happening in our society are backfiring. The number of self centered people who would screw over their neighbors is increasing. The numbers of kids getting into serious trouble both financially and legally is also increasing. The new way of bringing up kids created by society has failed horrifically and should be reexamined.



posted on Aug, 21 2012 @ 11:13 AM
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reply to post by macman
 


Except it is definable. Telling a child no or yelling at them isn't going to cause severe emotional and psychological problems later on in life. Paying someone to tell your child they're an abomination and that everything they're feeling is wrong is very likely to cause problems later in life. Shouldn't the well being of a child be more important than anything else?



posted on Aug, 21 2012 @ 11:15 AM
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reply to post by macman
 


Well, I sure agree with you about this. Society has gone overboard on this.



posted on Aug, 21 2012 @ 11:17 AM
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Originally posted by Xcalibur254
Except it is definable. Telling a child no or yelling at them isn't going to cause severe emotional and psychological problems later on in life. Paying someone to tell your child they're an abomination and that everything they're feeling is wrong is very likely to cause problems later in life. Shouldn't the well being of a child be more important than anything else?



Oh, same shrinks would argue against your statement. These people believe that even spanking will damage the child's emotional well being.

Again, this is not definable, because each person is different mentally.
To strike someone with say a bat will produce roughly the same thing. Pain, bruising and so on.
Telling a child they are wrong, or that thinking about homosexuality is wrong is not abuse.

Man, it is sad that people think crap like "Sex in the City" and "modern Family" are the norm and that teaching kids that homosexuality is wrong is some terrible mental trauma.

There is no difference between this, and you trying to teach my kids that our faith is wrong or that having guns is wrong.
Good hell, when will people stop looking to the Govt to outlaw everything that THEY don't agree with.



posted on Aug, 21 2012 @ 11:31 AM
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Originally posted by macman
There is no difference between this, and you trying to teach my kids that our faith is wrong or that having guns is wrong.


Yeah I know it's almost as bad as telling your own kids how they feel is wrong.

Why are you such a deranged individual?



posted on Aug, 21 2012 @ 11:40 AM
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reply to post by GoldenRuled
 


In that case God also said eating shellfish and trimming your beard is wrong. In other words "God's" opinions are only as good as they actually are, God also thinks you should be punished for the sins of your Father and that working on Saturdays should get you stoned to death.

As for the supposed bill, I think the idea is to protect the kid from abusive parents. Keep in mind the Bible says "spare the rod, spoil the child" and one verse actually says "rebellious" children should be put to death, either of these could easily be mishandled by some nutjob fundamentalist and end up seriously damaging a child's mental or physical health.



posted on Aug, 21 2012 @ 11:45 AM
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Originally posted by GoldenRuled
I'm Christian. I have no opinion on homosexuality except, God said it's wrong. Haven't heard anything from the last 2 millenia indicating He changed his mind.


I disagree, God never have come to earth and told anybody that he disagree with homosexuals after all, remember when god made human kind he made female and male to his image, so the only way God could do that is if it was a hermaphrodite

Now as for the law I agree, many parents depending on their religious believes take sometimes to the extreme when it comes to children with sexual orientation that doesn't comply with society and religious views.

But I disagree also that is Still a dangerous precedent when the law becomes entangle with parents right.

edit on 21-8-2012 by marg6043 because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 21 2012 @ 11:53 AM
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Originally posted by SpectreDC


Yeah I know it's almost as bad as telling your own kids how they feel is wrong.

I am the parent. I am in charge. Not the child, not the Govt and not you.


Originally posted by SpectreDC
Why are you such a deranged individual?

WOW, that just wounded my inner child so much, that I may be mentally scarred for life. I assume that you have a course for me to attend to make right the wrong that you have deemed.

See, anything can be deemed mentally hurtful.
AGAIN, people need to stop being butt hurt over everything they don't agree with.



posted on Aug, 21 2012 @ 01:20 PM
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Originally posted by rickymouse
reply to post by Xcalibur254
 


Is it wrong to want your genetic line to continue? Is it wrong for a parent to want to have grandchildren? If I had a son and he was gay and never had a kid, my genetic line would be jeopardized. My brothers son is the last leg of our male genetic line for our family, if he does not have a boy the male line dies. Don't we have a right to steer him?


Nope. You've got no right whatsoever to "steer him" towards having kids. It's his decision and his alone. In fact, if I were him and you started getting on with that BS, I'd be very quick in telling you where you can shove it. Your "bloodline" doesn't win out over someone else's rights, and it's unfortunate I've even got to explain this. What is this, the Middle Ages?



posted on Aug, 21 2012 @ 02:06 PM
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reply to post by ShadeWolf
 


When they turn 18, then they can have at it.

Until then, my house, my kids, my rules.



posted on Aug, 21 2012 @ 02:11 PM
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reply to post by GoldenRuled
 


He also said in Leviticus that cutting your hair is wrong too. Do you cut your hair? If you are a man, do you shave?



posted on Aug, 21 2012 @ 02:12 PM
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reply to post by ShadeWolf
 


Maybe he will want to have kids if he knows that he is the last one. We will make him aware anyway. I won't try to convince him because I worry about the future of my grandkids and do not wish the worry on anyone. I have no doubt at all that the quality of our lives here on this planet is going to severely degrade within the next forty years. We screwed it up pretty bad which is destroying the foodchain.



posted on Aug, 21 2012 @ 02:12 PM
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reply to post by macman
 


Abusers dismiss the feelings of their victims in order to keep carrying on the abuse.



posted on Aug, 21 2012 @ 02:24 PM
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Originally posted by nixie_nox
reply to post by macman
 


Abusers dismiss the feelings of their victims in order to keep carrying on the abuse.



Again, not abuse.
Nice to see the tolerance of others, from the group of people that claim to hold the throne of tolerance.



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