Paul Ryan Over-Vetted, Obama/Biden Free Pass?

Originally posted by RealSpoke
reply to post by Wrabbit2000

 

That's because right wing news sources leave out these bits of information. If they repeat a lie long enough people will start to believe it. They want you to think he only went to Muslim schools and that he grew up extremely un-American. Or things like "none of his classmates remember him", when that is the furthest thing from the truth. They also peddle this myth that Obama's childhood or past is not well documented, when it is. More than half of his life was spent in some form of the publics eye.

edit on 17-8-2012 by RealSpoke because: (no reason given)

C'mon, I see your posts and you're better than this. It isn't "Right Wing" anything and I'll still be calling for investigations into this man and his past YEARS after he's out of office and politics hardly matter either way. It's the mystery that has been protected and guarded by laywers, court cases and a blanket "None of your friggen business" attitude that I think people just won't tolerate out of *ANY* elected official forever, let alone the President of the United States.


Now, this showed more than I knew was openly accepted for his past. That says A LOT.....of course, I looked at the date of this report and the big News stories about his Indonesia past and the fact he was legally known as Barry.

10 days after the story I posted ran....and this whole thing was in the process of blowing up in the media for his formative and educational years being spent in Indonesia, Deepwater Horizon blew and literally erased every other headline of any importance. THAT explains how even I..as a dedicated news hound for many years...totally missed some of this.

I don't care if Obama is right. left or just a goofball that turns out to have clinical mental illness. The fact is *FAR MORE* of his past is a mystery is known.

Show me people from Columbia that recall him and have personal stories.... How about Harvard? He had students in HIS OWN CLASSES.... I'd love to hear more about how Instructor Obama taught his classes..and what his personal tone was to the Students who took them. Mystery...we'll never know. Did he get grades that showed excellence in Constitutional education or did he pull C-? We'll never know.... That's all but classified.

How did Barry get *BACK* from Indonesia? Dual citizenship to Indonesia wasn't happening in 1967 and visiting little immigrant boys from America weren't going to be attending Indonesian state schools. Funny that......

It goes on and on and on..... So... Yeah, this had a few things I didn't know and there is a bit more publicly known that I'd heard about (and I pointed out why...oh that's a hell of a cause isn't it?). We know about THIS primaruly because the SCHOOLS have insisted they will not be sidelined and want to cash in on the fame of having had the U.S. President as a student

(Officially registered as Muslim...BTW...so now we have SOLD basis for where THAT comes from)

Lets just not take one series of interesting trivia and even joke that this President has been generally open. He's been 100% open about what he's WANTED to be open about....and not so much as a 'confirm or deny' to anything he don't feel like talking about. For a President? Wrong Answer.

reply to post by RealSpoke


There are a ton of black people that hate black people. Anyone that believes in Mormonism buys into their racist theology. Romney was 30 when they were still OPENLY discriminating against brown people. He clearly agreed with it,I would never be part of any group that was racist towards another.

The church would not publicly retract their racist beliefs. They still believe that black people are a spawn of evil.

I don't really understand why anyone tries to defend this racist cult

In 1995, black church member A. David Jackson asked church leaders to issue a declaration repudiating past doctrines that treated black people as inferior. In particular, Jackson asked the church to disavow the 1949 "Negro Question" declaration from the church Presidency which stated "The attitude of the church with reference to negroes ... is not a matter of the declaration of a policy but of direct commandment from the Lord ... to the effect that negroes ... are not entitled to the priesthood...".

The church leadership did not issue a repudiation, and so in 1997 Jackson, aided by other church members including Armand Mauss, sent a second request to church leaders, which stated that white Mormons felt that the 1978 revelation resolved everything, but that black Mormons react differently when they learn the details. He said that many black Mormons become discouraged and leave the church or become inactive. "When they find out about this, they exit... You end up with the passive African Americans in the church".[52]

Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
How did Barry get *BACK* from Indonesia?

Probably flew, and as he was a US citizen he just entered the USA

Dual citizenship to Indonesia wasn't happening in 1967

which is why Obama remained a US citizen...

and visiting little immigrant boys from America weren't going to be attending Indonesian state schools. Funny that......

Care to back that stupid claim up with some proof? Any proof at all? Why do you thinkObama could not have gone to a Indonesian school?

It goes on and on and on

You certainly do, all with no basis in any truth or fact. Obama is the legal POTUS, and there is nothing you can do about that.

over-vetted ?

do we know where his parents were born yet ? lol

give me a break

just wait for the attack ads showing him taking money out of grandma's wallet and giving it to donald trump

you gonna cry ?

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


Well I don't know what type of news you're reading/watching. The only news that pretends like his past isn't known is Fox/Breibart/WND. You're being willingly ignorant on things that are already known and blaming it on Obama being "secretive".

Show me people from Columbia that recall him and have personal stories.... How about Harvard?

In the fall of 2000, as a second-year student at the University of Chicago Law School, I was one of about twenty students in a seminar called "Current Issues in Racism and the Law," taught by Professor (and then-state senator) Barack Obama.

www.dailykos.com...
www.huffingtonpost.com...
nation.foxnews.com...

Everything you believed were straight from right wing sources, like the Muslim school thing. That's been debunked for years. articles.cnn.com...OLITICS

Dual citizenship to Indonesia wasn't happening in 1967 and visiting little immigrant boys from America weren't going to be attending Indonesian state schools.

A child cannot renounce their US citizenship, nor can their parents do it for them, this is US law. So there was no way that Obama was an Indonesian citizen. His Indonesian school record even says he was born in Hawaii. There were also no laws stating that a non-citizen could not attend a Indonesian school.

A person having United States nationality, who is under the age of twenty-one and whose residence is in a foreign state with or under the legal custody of a parent who hereafter loses United States nationality under section 350 or 352 of this title, shall also lose his United States nationality if such person has or acquires the nationality of such foreign state: Provided, That, in such case, United States nationality shall not be lost as the result of loss of United States nationality by the parent unless and until the person attains the age of twenty-five years without having established his residence in the United States."

www.scribd.com...
www.unhcr.org...
www.thefogbow.com...

reply to post by spoor


I'll concede one point... In spending more time reading what is available for Indonesian law in 1967, it would appear he was legal to attend a State School. Indonesians were not legal to attend a foreign private school. A point of confusion there, and it's important.....in the terms of being precisely accurate with our wording in this debate.....to correct my implication in having said what I did regarding dual citizenship. So noted.

The "ignorant" secretive things I had in mind were things like the second message on this very thread, where a Mod places the name Barry Soetoro and the Birther issues in the same sentence and as if they are equally baseless or even related. Confused topic is the term I'd use though. This was your post on page one:

Obamas nickname was Barry and Soetero was his stepfathers last name.

He talks about being called Barry in his book, its really not a secret at all. I know that WND would have you think otherwise, but they thrive on peoples ignorance.

(Source: Post on page 1)

....when in fact it was his legal name per school records and photos from Indonesia showing just that.

Well I don't know what type of news you're reading/watching. The only news that pretends like his past isn't known is Fox/Breibart/WND. You're being willingly ignorant on things that are already known and blaming it on Obama being "secretive".

I linked to what I was going by. In detail. If you'd like, I actually built a sub-section of over 25 links in researching that reply. I can give more....including the local news sources in Indonesia and Thailand that reported more directly from the local angle and from the School's perspective in 2010.

Your videos are interesting....but links to what backstops their facts and assumptions are so much better. I can't very well see what generated the position in a video or TV report outside of interviews and determine, in my mind, how credible it is. With how often the media is wrong lately...that's sure important.

In the fall of 2000, as a second-year student at the University of Chicago Law School, I was one of about twenty students in a seminar called "Current Issues in Racism and the Law," taught by Professor (and then-state senator) Barack Obama.

Hmmm.. Sounds good and I appreciate the source I hadn't seen. There are other voicea...from other periods that insist differently, too.

Wayne Allyn Root: I think the most dangerous thing you should know about Barack Obama is that I don't know a single person at Columbia that knows him, and they all know me. I don't have a classmate who ever knew Barack Obama at Columbia. Ever!

Source

Interestingly enough, I came by that link at Snopes...debunking the idea that no one recalls him. lol.. That wasn't questioned as a valid and accurate statement, simply countered by others who recalled differently. Obama is said to describe that lack of being remembered as living 'like a monk' and being reclusive. Mr Chong gang? a monk? Oh well... Another mystery a little thing like a school transcript would end.

Of course..if he wasn't playing Gotcha! on documents to everyone else.....not sharing such things people already question and wonder about ...the to point of interviews like this being in the media....wouldn't BE fair game. However, he is hounding others for papers and records, so let him share those college years with us. We're all real curious.

Everything you believed were straight from right wing sources, like the Muslim school thing. That's been debunked for years.

Muslim School thing? Debunked? err... You read the link you gave me, right?

Obama lived in Indonesia as a child, from 1967 to 1971, with his mother and stepfather and has acknowledged attending a Muslim school, but an aide said it was not a madrassa.

(Source: your link above)

As far as their word gaming... Whatever. That is the only disagreement I see in the article and it's weak. This administration makes a life out of playing with words and defining topics by the language. One says Madrasa and another says Muslim School. The definition is:

Definition: The word "madrassa" is Arabic for school, and is commonly used throughout the Arab and Islamic world to refer to any place of learning in the same sense that, in the United States, the word "school" refers to a primary school, a high school or a university. It can be a secular school, a vocational school, a religious school or a technical school.

I use the term Madrasa to differentiate his Muslim School time in Indonesia from his Catholic School time in Indonesia. Without being precise, MUCH about this whole thing is easy to be confused with and I think some parties have played on that fact to the maximum extent.

Dual citizenship to Indonesia wasn't happening in 1967 and visiting little immigrant boys from America weren't going to be attending Indonesian state schools.

Agreed.. My implication in a previous message was in error, as noted now again. I make mistakes...as everyone does. This was one of them. So many claiming that issue as fact has been compelling. The law in '67 didn't say that, you're right. I'll never be mentioning that aspect again. Learning new things is a big part of why I come here.

Paul Ryan Over-vetted? Really? All He has to do is stay white, not get caught having an affair and show some tax returns and he is ready to roll. Easy enough for a 12 year old to accomplish without breaking a sweat. Sure Katie might ambush him with a difficult question like what does he read, but that kind of goes with the territory. Seriously everything asked about Ryan has been directly related to his policy. And if you can't talk about his policy and political ideas then why is he running for VP to begin with?

reply to post by KeliOnyx


I believe that every controversial question or topic that the incumbents had to go through in 2008, the current candidates should be put through similar vetting and to date it has come nowhere close if you really do some honest research... or just do some search engine queries for Obama vetting, or 2008 Obama presidential vetting or any combination you will see a lot of proof that these two guys do have a pass so far, see how easily people really do forget, I would like to say so far both Ryan and Romney should be happy they are not being put through the ringer and there is no 3rd political party ripping into them , no one is digging up anything about college, their grades, their religious associations, their political views and beliefs or really making a huge deal beyond the tax thing or the Romney business dealings.

Once I saw that video of Ryan's(and a lot of notables in the conservative realm) idol Ayn Rand after he said something to the effect that her books were required reading for his staff or interns it made me do a little research to see if I could get some sort of idea of his thinking.

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


It was never his legal name in America. He was born Barack Obama, and had people call him Barry as a nickname up until college.

I can't very well see what generated the position in a video or TV report outside of interviews and determine, in my mind, how credible it is

Then you can't believe anything, ever with that mindset.

Not everyone is going to remember their classmates,but a lot of people do. I've been in classes with people only to become their friend years later and they don't remember me. It's all relative to the individual. Most people do not pay attention to their surroundings, that is why eye witness testimony is so unreliable.

There's video of him giving speeches at college.




Obama was the president in Harvard, they even wrote articles about him in 1990.

The new president of the Review is Barack Obama, a 28-year-old graduate of Columbia University who spent four years heading a community development program for poor blacks on Chicago's South Side before enrolling in law school. His late father, Barack Obama, was a finance minister in Kenya and his mother, Ann Dunham, is an American anthropologist now doing fieldwork in Indonesia. Mr. Obama was born in Hawaii.

www.nytimes.com...
dailycaller.com...
www.dailymail.co.uk...

However, he is hounding others for papers and records, so let him share those college years with us. We're all real curious.

Who cares about what classes Obama took in college or grades? Really? That is all transcripts tell you. Romney has yet to release his or his taxes.

Muslim School thing? Debunked? err... You read the link you gave me, right?

Yeah, I was saying that because you said you thought he went for the majority at a Muslim school

I make mistakes...as everyone does...Learning new things is a big part of why I come here.

Same. I didn't mean to come off as if I were talking down to you, sorry if I seemed that way.

Who cares about what classes Obama took in college or grades? Really? That is all transcripts tell you. Romney has yet to release his or his taxes.

Really? You really said this......

The intelligence, judgement, character and general integrity of the most powerful man in the United States and among the single most powerful men in the world DOES MATTER to me. It matters a great deal.

Even the point you are now conceding in a round about way in saying he simply wasn't using Barry Soetoro in the United States as opposed to never having used it at all....raises questions. Why change not only the last name but the first name as well for official documents and records, then switch both back upon return?

When I wonder about immigration and getting back to the US, that is the main question in my mind. He'd just spent years with a name that wasn't the one he was walking back into the US with. That must have been odd on a number of levels.

It all happened...I'm not suggesting it didn't. The records before, during and after his years in Indonesia are clear enough. It goes to that background question of why though. So many why's involved with him. So much could be cleared up with the papers that would full a single file box.

I'm not even questioning the Birth Cert..Not anymore. Some specific people in Hawaii Government signed their name to paperwork swearing to it existing and being as described for what Arizona required. That is good enough for me too.... They'll be prosecuted eventually if they lied on something of THAT magnitude and that alone makes me feel comfortable that it really is there.

The rest though....is still as much question as anything has ever been answered. Just some papers... it's not that much.....and wouldn't even be fair, if he wasn't asking the same from others. Glass houses and rocks to throw... Yes indeed. A big White glass House in this case. Errr.. Fair is Fair though!

Some want to know Mitt's tax's and how well he really can make money? Good... SO do I. I also want to know more about the Character and Integrity of the man who would ask to be the President a second term. I know I'm not alone.

Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
the most powerful man in the United States and among the single most powerful men in the world DOES MATTER to me. It matters a great deal.

Why didnt that information of all previous Presidents bother you? But as soon as Obama comes along you start whining you want to see all his documents - documents you never asked any previous President for - so what is different about Obama....

When I wonder about immigration and getting back to the US, that is the main question in my mind. He'd just spent years with a name that wasn't the one he was walking back into the US with. That must have been odd on a number of levels.

Not at all, when you enter the USA you are not asked what name you were called at school...

So much could be cleared up with the papers that would full a single file box.

Except birthers would claim that it was forged anyway....

Just some papers... it's not that much.....and wouldn't even be fair, if he wasn't asking the same from others.

Just where has Obama asked others for their school, medical, kindergarten etc records?

I also want to know more about the Character and Integrity of the man who would ask to be the President a second term

Just why would 25 year old records show that?

Those who tried to vet Obama:
Quarles Harris, Jr
www.americanthinker.com...
Andrew Breitbart www.foxnews.com...
Breitbart Coroner
www.westernjournalism.com...

Battlegound Swing States: Colorado en.wikipedia.org...
Wisconsin en.wikipedia.org...


www.realclearpolitics.com...

reply to post by spoor

Well, that represents a whole lot of assumptions about what I have or haven't said about past Presidents. As it happens, I did think Bush was doing well. I even voted for the man.. twice...then realized a bit late just what a mistake the man was. His last couple years were bad decisions following worse policy. Now we have even worse. It's not partisan ....it absolutely, positively, is not.

Personally, I think a law needs to be passed regarding the presenting of a Birth Certificate from every candidate at the time of filing, across the board. Period. In terms of documents, no one is in charge of even looking at what is legally required. The Parties certify and that's all that ever happens. Crazy...

For the record, John McCain was asked for his Birth Certificate and produced it without questions to address issues about his birth in the Panama Canal Zone. Dwight Eisenhower, of all people, was asked and produced his Birth Certificate in relation to technical questions on his birth records from 1890. So nothing is unprecedented here on that. Years of controversy could have been ended with no fuss at all....like those two before him had done.

25 year old...(and much more recent)...records matter because unlike most Presidents, Obama has very little history of any kind in public life. Look up his voting record in Illinois and being present wasn't even a sure thing there, let alone how a vote might be given. That makes what anyone can judge a man by, VERY limited....and Obama puts almost all the rest off limits. That's why SO MANY people have questions....and it does all matter.

Originally posted by RELDDIR
why wasn't Obama being vetted as rigorously as Ryan? .....



I predict that the left will go from FEAR to SMEAR soon, because they are running out of ideas.

Do you recall Obama is an Arab, Muslim, Homosexual, Kenyan, illegal alien, Socialist...


You right wingers are the embodiment of self unawareness.



Jesus it's pathetic

Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
For the record, John McCain was asked for his Birth Certificate and produced it without questions to address issues about his birth in the Panama Canal Zone

Why do people keep posting that lie? Care to show us the BC produced by McCain?

This is one reason birthers are treated with such contempt, they have to keep making things up.

Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
reply to post by spoor

 

Well, that represents a whole lot of assumptions about what I have or haven't said about past Presidents. As it happens, I did think Bush was doing well. I even voted for the man.. twice...then realized a bit late just what a mistake the man was. His last couple years were bad decisions following worse policy. Now we have even worse. It's not partisan ....it absolutely, positively, is not.

Obama is a way better president, sorry to say.

Bush took a strong economy and turned it into crap

Obama took the worst economy in history and turned it around.

My office building is cranking now like I haven't seen in years.

Sorry, but the history books are gonna make you feel bad.

Originally posted by spoor

Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
For the record, John McCain was asked for his Birth Certificate and produced it without questions to address issues about his birth in the Panama Canal Zone

Why do people keep posting that lie? Care to show us the BC produced by McCain?

This is one reason birthers are treated with such contempt, they have to keep making things up.

Do your own research.... You're calling people out to be liars? Back it. I'm done for the day with doing other people's research for them. Now McCain is not valid? He has no Birth Cert? Is THAT the suggestion?

Okie... Yeah.. See what I mean? A law. We need a flat, straight and simple law. The Constitution has just a handful of black and white requirements to hold the office. Every single person to file for the race should be producing the document. outright and without debate or ANY kind of hassle.

I've put time into replies to you now for the second time while you just bounce around throwing one line zingers at people and apparently taking some amusement in it. We're through until you have more to support your opinions than bumper sticker slogans and one liners.

@thepresident

See above. Same applies. I'll be happy to be in a two sided debate. I won't spend any serious time debating one liners and bumper sticker level effort out of other people.

Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
Do your own research.... You're calling people out to be liars? Back it.

You are the one claiming McCain released his BC, so show us.....

Now McCain is not valid? He has no Birth Cert?

Where did I say that - I said McCain has not produced his BC.... which he has not done.

We need a flat, straight and simple law.

Which we have.... usgovinfo.about.com...

Only native-born U.S. citizens (or those born abroad, but only to parents who were both citizens of the U.S.)

One must also be at least 35 years of age to be president.

one must live in the United States for at least 14 years to be president

Obama met all those requirements - a fact that you want to ignore!

. Every single person to file for the race should be producing the document.

What document? The constitution does not state you have to produce any document - again, something you are just making up!

. I won't spend any serious time debating one liners and bumper sticker level effort out of other people.

True, you have shown you just like to make things up!